14 dead, 50 wounded @ batman movie screening

[Gordman]

The only thing banning guns accomplishes is making sure that the only people who have them are criminals.

Its too bad there were not a few people carrying guns legaly in that crowd, they may have been able to stop him from doing so much damage.

Colorado requires nothing but a 4 hour class and $80 to get a carry permit. I'm sure multiple people in that big theater had a gun. You know why nobody ran in and saved the day? Because they're not trained police officers.

Aside from any 'fog of war' factor' that may have played out, there is only ONE reason why nobody with a weapon ran and saved the day.

They weren't allowed to carry any.

Cinemark Theaters is just one more business who (while Colorado allows concealed carry), they get the bright idea to ban concealed carry weapons on their premises. Please see the link below.

So how did that work out for them? Good thing they had those tough gun restrictions in place eh?

http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/201...earms-allowed/

[Belly Buster]

Sorry. Pretty sure gun legislation doesn't prevent this.

sorry, pretty sure many countries such as england, japan, and china that have a no gun policy have extremely low shooting rates.

Low compared to the US maybe. Guns are strictly controlled for hunting, but can be obtained. The UK has had three major gun spree incidents over the last 25 years, Dunblane, Hungerford and Cumbria. Dunblane was particulary bad as it was at an infant school. All 3 perpetrators killed themselves.

Norway has similar strict regulations but Anders Behring Breivik killed 77.

Bottom line is you can't legislate against nutters.

[Muck Ficon]

Colorado requires nothing but a 4 hour class and $80 to get a carry permit. I'm sure multiple people in that big theater had a gun. You know why nobody ran in and saved the day? Because they're not trained police officers.

Aside from any 'fog of war' factor' that may have played out, there is only ONE reason why nobody with a weapon ran and saved the day.

They weren't allowed to carry any.

Cinemark Theaters is just one more business who (while Colorado allows concealed carry), they get the bright idea to ban concealed carry weapons on their premises. Please see the link below.

So how did that work out for them? Good thing they had those tough gun restrictions in place eh?

http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/201...earms-allowed/

Yes, concealed weapons should be allowed in movie theaters. That way when Tyrone won't shut the fuck up and hang up his phone, someone with a bad temper can deal with the problem. The gunshots will only be a short lived, minor annoyance to the children trying to watch Ice Age 4.

[Gordman]

I'm not going to sit and argue United States gun policies vs other countries....or other countries crime rates vs ours...yadda yadda yadda

You can argue all you want to about how this country is more violent etc vs some other countries. The fact is, there are alot of guns in this country, and it would be impossible to reverse that.

The bottom line is whether you are for or against the 2nd amendment, you and I know it is not going anywhere anytime soon.

So what do you do?

IMO, what you don't do at this point is needle and pick away at the parts of the 2nd amendment at this point. In general, you don't try and say "oh...guns are good here, but not good there". Case in point, my previous post which pointed out that people weren't allowed to conceal carry in the theaters. I have a permit myself, so I naturally notice these ridiculous signs more often than someone else normally would. In my state they are in several businesses as well. IMO it's stupid. Either the law is there or it isn't.

If you have laws like this which are only good part of the time, they don't work as they were intended.

I am a believer if we embrace the 2nd amendment more than we are now, then everything will work itself out much better than it is right now.

As several have already stated, you cant 'legislate crazy'.

I live in Wisconsin and recently we passed concealed carry. With that, there is now only ONE state in the USA which does NOT allow concealed carry, and that is Illinois. There is a constant argument that having concealed carry, puts more guns out there. Well, that may be true, but that doesn't necessarily mean it's bad. That doesn't mean that crime is worse. We have had several idiots who claimed that when this law gets passed here, we will turn into the wild west. That hasn't happened. That hasn't happened in this state, or any others with this law. In every state that adopted concealed carry, the state saw either virtually no change, or an actual DECREASE in crime. There is no state in the USA who's crime numbers went up as a result of concealed carry!

And to add, in the small amount of time that that we have had this law in WI, several crimes have already been thwarted by the good guys.

[Muck Ficon]

I'm not going to sit and argue United States gun policies vs other countries....or other countries crime rates vs ours...yadda yadda yadda

You can argue all you want to about how this country is more violent etc vs some other countries. The fact is, there are alot of guns in this country, and it would be impossible to reverse that.

The bottom line is whether you are for or against the 2nd amendment, you and I know it is not going anywhere anytime soon.

So what do you do?

IMO, what you don't do at this point is needle and pick away at the parts of the 2nd amendment at this point. In general, you don't try and say "oh...guns are good here, but not good there". Case in point, my previous post which pointed out that people weren't allowed to conceal carry in the theaters. I have a permit myself, so I naturally notice these ridiculous signs more often than someone else normally would. In my state they are in several businesses as well. IMO it's stupid. Either the law is there or it isn't.

If you have laws like this which are only good part of the time, they don't work as they were intended.

I am a believer if we embrace the 2nd amendment more than we are now, then everything will work itself out much better than it is right now.

As several have already stated, you cant 'legislate crazy'.

I live in Wisconsin and recently we passed concealed carry. With that, there is now only ONE state in the USA which does NOT allow concealed carry, and that is Illinois. There is a constant argument that having concealed carry, puts more guns out there. Well, that may be true, but that doesn't necessarily mean it's bad. That doesn't mean that crime is worse. We have had several idiots who claimed that when this law gets passed here, we will turn into the wild west. That hasn't happened. That hasn't happened in this state, or any others with this law. In every state that adopted concealed carry, the state saw either virtually no change, or an actual DECREASE in crime. There is no state in the USA who's crime numbers went up as a result of concealed carry!

And to add, in the small amount of time that that we have had this law in WI, several crimes have already been thwarted by the good guys.

I live in Wisconsin too. I agree, the concealed carry laws have been working here. There are a lot less Tyrones in the theaters.

[Gordman]

I'm not going to sit and argue United States gun policies vs other countries....or other countries crime rates vs ours...yadda yadda yadda

You can argue all you want to about how this country is more violent etc vs some other countries. The fact is, there are alot of guns in this country, and it would be impossible to reverse that.

The bottom line is whether you are for or against the 2nd amendment, you and I know it is not going anywhere anytime soon.

So what do you do?

IMO, what you don't do at this point is needle and pick away at the parts of the 2nd amendment at this point. In general, you don't try and say "oh...guns are good here, but not good there". Case in point, my previous post which pointed out that people weren't allowed to conceal carry in the theaters. I have a permit myself, so I naturally notice these ridiculous signs more often than someone else normally would. In my state they are in several businesses as well. IMO it's stupid. Either the law is there or it isn't.

If you have laws like this which are only good part of the time, they don't work as they were intended.

I am a believer if we embrace the 2nd amendment more than we are now, then everything will work itself out much better than it is right now.

As several have already stated, you cant 'legislate crazy'.

I live in Wisconsin and recently we passed concealed carry. With that, there is now only ONE state in the USA which does NOT allow concealed carry, and that is Illinois. There is a constant argument that having concealed carry, puts more guns out there. Well, that may be true, but that doesn't necessarily mean it's bad. That doesn't mean that crime is worse. We have had several idiots who claimed that when this law gets passed here, we will turn into the wild west. That hasn't happened. That hasn't happened in this state, or any others with this law. In every state that adopted concealed carry, the state saw either virtually no change, or an actual DECREASE in crime. There is no state in the USA who's crime numbers went up as a result of concealed carry!

And to add, in the small amount of time that that we have had this law in WI, several crimes have already been thwarted by the good guys.

I live in Wisconsin too. I agree, the concealed carry laws have been working here. There are a lot less Tyrones in the theaters.

+1

[John Stamos]

my state (oklahoma) just passed a law that takes effect in november where we can just openly carry guns, we don't even need to conceal them. We can have them right on our hip. Still not sure if I am for or against that law but I imagine it might deter some people from flipping out if they see 4-5 people with guns on their hip, but who knows.

[SixToedPete]

I'm not going to sit and argue United States gun policies vs other countries....or other countries crime rates vs ours...yadda yadda yadda

You can argue all you want to about how this country is more violent etc vs some other countries. The fact is, there are alot of guns in this country, and it would be impossible to reverse that.

The bottom line is whether you are for or against the 2nd amendment, you and I know it is not going anywhere anytime soon.

So what do you do?

IMO, what you don't do at this point is needle and pick away at the parts of the 2nd amendment at this point. In general, you don't try and say "oh...guns are good here, but not good there". Case in point, my previous post which pointed out that people weren't allowed to conceal carry in the theaters. I have a permit myself, so I naturally notice these ridiculous signs more often than someone else normally would. In my state they are in several businesses as well. IMO it's stupid. Either the law is there or it isn't.

If you have laws like this which are only good part of the time, they don't work as they were intended.

I am a believer if we embrace the 2nd amendment more than we are now, then everything will work itself out much better than it is right now.

As several have already stated, you cant 'legislate crazy'.

I live in Wisconsin and recently we passed concealed carry. With that, there is now only ONE state in the USA which does NOT allow concealed carry, and that is Illinois. There is a constant argument that having concealed carry, puts more guns out there. Well, that may be true, but that doesn't necessarily mean it's bad. That doesn't mean that crime is worse. We have had several idiots who claimed that when this law gets passed here, we will turn into the wild west. That hasn't happened. That hasn't happened in this state, or any others with this law. In every state that adopted concealed carry, the state saw either virtually no change, or an actual DECREASE in crime. There is no state in the USA who's crime numbers went up as a result of concealed carry!

And to add, in the small amount of time that that we have had this law in WI, several crimes have already been thwarted by the good guys.

After reading DirtyB's ridiculous posts in this thread, it's refreshing to read a comment from someone who knows what he's talking about.

[Gordman]

my state (oklahoma) just passed a law that takes effect in november where we can just openly carry guns, we don't even need to conceal them. We can have them right on our hip. Still not sure if I am for or against that law but I imagine it might deter some people from flipping out if they see 4-5 people with guns on their hip, but who knows.

That seems weird to me because I thought there was already a law like that.

I guess I don't know for sure if it was actually federal or not, but in WI on a couple of different occasions, people tried to challenge the laws by open carrying their weapon (before CC was passed).They were actually arrested and it even made the news. The problem though was that the cops had nothing to charge them with, because they weren't breaking any laws. they were ultimately released and the cops were of course laughingstocks.

[BetCheckBet]

Jewdonk sent me this link.

[limitles]

I'm not going to sit and argue United States gun policies vs other countries....or other countries crime rates vs ours...yadda yadda yadda

You can argue all you want to about how this country is more violent etc vs some other countries. The fact is, there are alot of guns in this country, and it would be impossible to reverse that.

The bottom line is whether you are for or against the 2nd amendment, you and I know it is not going anywhere anytime soon.

So what do you do?

IMO, what you don't do at this point is needle and pick away at the parts of the 2nd amendment at this point. In general, you don't try and say "oh...guns are good here, but not good there". Case in point, my previous post which pointed out that people weren't allowed to conceal carry in the theaters. I have a permit myself, so I naturally notice these ridiculous signs more often than someone else normally would. In my state they are in several businesses as well. IMO it's stupid. Either the law is there or it isn't.

If you have laws like this which are only good part of the time, they don't work as they were intended.

I am a believer if we embrace the 2nd amendment more than we are now, then everything will work itself out much better than it is right now.

As several have already stated, you cant 'legislate crazy'.

I live in Wisconsin and recently we passed concealed carry. With that, there is now only ONE state in the USA which does NOT allow concealed carry, and that is Illinois. There is a constant argument that having concealed carry, puts more guns out there. Well, that may be true, but that doesn't necessarily mean it's bad. That doesn't mean that crime is worse. We have had several idiots who claimed that when this law gets passed here, we will turn into the wild west. That hasn't happened. That hasn't happened in this state, or any others with this law. In every state that adopted concealed carry, the state saw either virtually no change, or an actual DECREASE in crime. There is no state in the USA who's crime numbers went up as a result of concealed carry!

And to add, in the small amount of time that that we have had this law in WI, several crimes have already been thwarted by the good guys.

I don't think anyone would think reigning in all firearms in your country is a possibility. However, when Joe Nutjob goes to buy his assault rifle it wouldn't hurt if he was told, sorry they are no longer available. "What was your name and we can call you with more info.?" Who's life is upturned by not being able to buy an assault rifle over the counter or at all? Carry your own weapon if you're afraid to walk the streets of your community and shoot it out with the next guy but taking away an easy avenue that would allow someone to take out a crowd within minutes cannot be a bad thing in anyway.

"What are you going to use your assault rifle for sir?" Hunting? No it's not allowed for that. Target shooting? Not really necessary with a machine gun is it?

Also, you're in this theatre with your concealed single shot pistol. Are you the hero to stand up when you hear the spray of bullets all around you?

[shortbuspoker]

You can attempt to regulate guns all you want, but the crazies will always find a way to hurt people. If it's not a gun then maybe it's cyanide in Tylenol bottles or 2 tons of ammonia fertilizer explosives in a van. Long story short, psychos are gonna psycho.

[limitles]

You can attempt to regulate guns all you want, but the crazies will always find a way to hurt people. If it's not a gun then maybe it's cyanide in Tylenol bottles or 2 tons of ammonia fertilizer explosives in a van. Long story short, psychos are gonna psycho.

Fine.....the point is make it tough for them....no one, I repeat no one needs an assault rifle. Homeland security is more aware of purchases of explosive ingredients than ever before.

[limitles]

Retarded response........not uncommon around here however........so there's a beach known to have land mines placed. Ignore it because only a few will be affected?

If we are talking about your mother, your brother, sister, father.....whatever, your story changes very quickly.......these deaths are real and any measure taken to prevent anyone of

them is worthwhile.....Fuck your civil liberties when it comes to assault rifles....

[DRK Star]

Shooter's profile from "Adult Friend Finder" just discovered

http://www.tmz.com/2012/07/21/james-...ofile-website/

[shortbuspoker]

You can attempt to regulate guns all you want, but the crazies will always find a way to hurt people. If it's not a gun then maybe it's cyanide in Tylenol bottles or 2 tons of ammonia fertilizer explosives in a van. Long story short, psychos are gonna psycho.

Fine.....the point is make it tough for them....no one, I repeat no one needs an assault rifle. Homeland security is more aware of purchases of explosive ingredients than ever before.

While I understand where you're coming from, assault rifles are exactly what the seconds amendment was meant to protect. The second amendment is not about hunting weapons or even personal protection on an individual basis. It is about the populous through militias or some other grouping of people being able to stand up to and if necessary overthrow a corrupt or oppressive federal government. If Washington and Jefferson were alive today they would most likely own ARs or Aks among many other weapons.

[DirtyB]

Fine.....the point is make it tough for them....no one, I repeat no one needs an assault rifle. Homeland security is more aware of purchases of explosive ingredients than ever before.

While I understand where you're coming from, assault rifles are exactly what the seconds amendment was meant to protect. The second amendment is not about hunting weapons or even personal protection on an individual basis. It is about the populous through militias or some other grouping of people being able to stand up to and if necessary overthrow a corrupt or oppressive federal government. If Washington and Jefferson were alive today they would most likely own ARs or Aks among many other weapons.

That's cool that you can communicate with the dead. And isn't it a coincidence that they agree with you.

[shortbuspoker]

While I understand where you're coming from, assault rifles are exactly what the seconds amendment was meant to protect. The second amendment is not about hunting weapons or even personal protection on an individual basis. It is about the populous through militias or some other grouping of people being able to stand up to and if necessary overthrow a corrupt or oppressive federal government. If Washington and Jefferson were alive today they would most likely own ARs or Aks among many other weapons.

That's cool that you can communicate with the dead. And isn't it a coincidence that they agree with you.

Go back to Donkdown where you belong and hang out with Micon and MHW. Instead of talking shit, try to logically break down where my statement is flawed. The 2nd amendment protects the rights of citizens to be armed and the more liberal citizens have repeatedly said that it refers to militias. My supposition that Washington and Jefferson would own the most current firearms is more than plausible. Point out where is was wrong and debate it or shut the fuck up and go play Starcraft or Star wars or whatever the fuck it is that you do while your wife is out getting negro cock.

[DirtyB]

and the more liberal citizens have repeatedly said that it refers to militias.

You know why liberals say that? Because we can read and it says that right there in the one sentence of text.

Nice tilt.

[Dan Druff]

Many liberals are dismissed with any gun-control-related ideas because too many of them have a ridiculous, idealistic view that ALL guns should be confiscated from all regular citizens. That would simply never work in this country. There are so many guns in existence here that such a law would leave the guns in the hands of the criminals and embolden them to invade the homes and businesses of average citizens, knowing they are much less likely to get shot.

Anyone who argues for complete gun control in the US at this point is a fool. Even Barry owns a gun.

However, I do see the merits behind ending conceal/carry permits, as well as limiting/banning sales on high-powered weaponry.

Hundreds of years ago, it was wise to allow citizens to arm themselves with firepower equivalent to that of the military, as the political situation was not well established and people rightfully feared a takeover by tyrannical forces.

Today is much different, for several reasons. No matter what weapons you have at your disposal, there's no way you're going to be able to put together a group of citizens to successfully fight off the US government. While many people today hate the government, the chance that we become ruled by a brutal dictatorship at this point is very small (especially in our lifetimes), and the chance of fighting off such a dictatorship through a grassroots army is even smaller.

Bottom line: There is just no reason for regular citizens to own such high-powered weaponry.

I also feel uncomfortable about conceal/carry permits because they allow hotheaded-but-normally-law-abiding citizens to kill people in the heat of the moment.

Look at George Zimmerman. I don't believe that he has the heart of a killer. He was carrying a gun around, confronted what he truly believed to be a thug in his neighborhood, the kid stood up to him, and he panicked and shot the kid. We don't know all of the details with what actually happened, but it was probably pretty close to that. George Zimmerman's life was never actually in danger, even if he felt it was.

Even though conceal/carry permits allow average citizens to occasionally stop crimes in progress that would otherwise have gone unhindered, I believe they will ultimately cause more problems than they solve.

I will say that it's LOL when people compare the US to Europe when talking about gun control. These are two completely different societies. You have to be very careful when comparing any laws in Europe (health care, gun control, etc) to those in the US, because what works over there will often not work over here.