Great job, you won! Here's your money! Wait, you're a known poker player? Never mind!

[Dan Druff]

This pretty much describes how shitty it is to be an online poker player in the US right now.

Bovada (Bodog) have been longtime experts at payment processing. I'm not being mocking or sarcastic here. For all of their LOL customer service gaffes, they are freaking geniuses when it comes to the quick, efficient, and consistent processing of payouts. They have also avoided any kind of major bust or scandal in their entire 14 year history, which is also impressive, especially since they have offered sportsbetting, which is a huge no-no in the US.

They are currently the #1 US-facing site, and in fact sources have indicated to me that they don't want to grow anymore because they're afraid they are getting too big!

Anyway, Bovada currently provides both wire cashouts (to most states) and checks. These do come with some annoying fees and costs, especially for high limit players. Checks are a maximum of $3000, and you can only request one per 7 days. You get one free check per calendar month, and the rest are $50 each. Wire can be up to $9500 (sometimes less depending upon your state), but you lose a few hundred bucks in currency conversion on the US side, because the funds are sent in euros. Also, you get one free wire per calendar month, and then they charge you $50 for additional wires, which again can only be requested once every 7 days.

So it's far from a perfect situation, but on the bright side, you reliably get your money and can move large sums into your bank account fairly quickly by today's standards.

Bovada has kept this strong cashout situation with an expert-level degree of vigilance and caution when it comes to their payout department. They are always seemingly one step ahead of the DOJ.

Unfortunately, this vigilance can sometimes negatively affect players.

Recently Bovada has come up with a (possibly correct) theory that the DOJ has a list of "confirmed poker players" who are likely to receive wire transfers from illegally operating poker sites. Bovada believes that the DOJ has given a list of these "confirmed poker players" to banks across the US, with the instruction to inform them if any of these people receive a large (4 figure) wire. Then, presumably, the DOJ will trace the funds back to the processor, and bust them. This will likely be transparent to the player, who will never be contacted by the DOJ about the matter (though their bank may close their account after this).

Who is a "confirmed poker player"? It's not clear. It might be people who come up in a google search for "poker pro". It might be people seen playing poker on TV. It might be active players grabbed from the Full Tilt Poker remissions list. It's not clear, but Bovada thinks the government has a list.

And Bovada thinks I'm a confirmed poker player, which to the DOJ seems almost equivalent to a confirmed sex offender or confirmed leper.

Dear Mr. Witteles

We’re contacting you about your recent payout requests via our Bank Wire method with Reference Numbers XXXXXX in the amount of $X,XXX.00.

We received notification from our Payouts Team that we're unable to process anymore Bank Wire payouts to confirmed Poker Players. If you'd like to continue to receive payments by this method, you'll need to open a new bank account under a corporate account. Please note, the account must be under a name that is non-gaming related. In the meantime, the Bank Wire method has been disabled on your account.

If opening a new bank account isn't something you're able to do, we can proceed with sending the funds through either Check by Courier. The maximum payout for check is $3000 once every 7 days.

Please confirm how you'd like to proceed at your earliest convenience. We understand this may be an inconvenience and we extend our apologies, however, this new policy is something out of our control. If you have any questions or concerns, please let us know.

Thanks,

Bovada Player Advocacy

[ToasterOven]

The downside of the being a bracelet winner.

[JUSTIFIEDhomicide]

That sucks. If you do decide to go the check route I would push for free checks every 7 days for you instead of the normal fee. Since you shouldn't be punished by the site, but you understand being punished by the gov't(or at least get the whole list thing). State you won't allow a gaming site to take advantage of you when you're bringing in rake and juice on gambling.

[Dan Druff]

That sucks. If you do decide to go the check route I would push for free checks every 7 days for you instead of the normal fee. Since you shouldn't be punished by the site, but you understand being punished by the gov't(or at least get the whole list thing). State you won't allow a gaming site to take advantage of you when you're bringing in rake and juice on gambling.

Four years ago when I played there and won a lot of money, I pushed for waiving the check fee if it was a "split" cashout. That is, if I request $12,000, they would split it into four $3,000 checks, but wouldn't charge me the $50 for the last three, as it was considered one big cashout. When I asked for this at first, they refused, but I talked them into it. So basically I had free cashouts, with the only pain in the ass being having to deposit separate $3,000 checks once per week (which wasn't a big deal).

I tried to ask for the same this year and was ...



They claimed nobody gets this privilege anymore. They might be bullshitting me, as they have been known to do.

[Sanlmar]

UIGEA proved too much for the man,

So he's leavin' the life he's come to know

[ShadyJ]

You normally complain about shit thats really no big deal, but this is some fucked up shit. Open an account under your wifes name.

[phantom]

bovoda must have more moles in the doj than martins skype list

[mulva]

i think marton is confirmed poker pro as well.

[OSA]

You normally complain about shit thats really no big deal, but this is some fucked up shit. Open an account under your wifes name.

Wife? Lol.

[riffraff29]

Same thing just happened to me recently. I've been playing Bodog from Canada and been winning quite a lot, I successfully did 4 wire transfer withdrawals to my bank and then they cancelled the 5th one. They said it was because I'm a 'known poker player. So now I can only cashout CAD 3000 a week with Direct Bank Transfer or Cheque which is nowhere near enough. Has anyone managed to find any solutions to this? Getting wire transfer re-instated, or getting higher cashout limits on other cashout methods?

[Dan Druff]

Same thing just happened to me recently. I've been playing Bodog from Canada and been winning quite a lot, I successfully did 4 wire transfer withdrawals to my bank and then they cancelled the 5th one. They said it was because I'm a 'known poker player. So now I can only cashout CAD 3000 a week with Direct Bank Transfer or Cheque which is nowhere near enough. Has anyone managed to find any solutions to this? Getting wire transfer re-instated, or getting higher cashout limits on other cashout methods?

Yes.

Get a business bank account. Bodog will wire the money to that business account.

Not sure what the process is to get a business bank account in Canada. In the US, you need to get a tax identification number for the business, and you're good to go. It doesn't matter if the business really exists, or if it makes any money.

[MumblesBadly]

Dear Mr. Witteles

We’re contacting you about your recent payout requests via our Bank Wire method with Reference Numbers XXXXXX in the amount of $X,XXX.00.

We received notification from our Payouts Team that [b]we're unable to process anymore Bank Wire payouts to confirmed Poker Players. If you'd like to continue to receive payments by this method, you'll need to open a new bank account under a corporate account. Please note, the account must be under a name that is non-gaming related. In the meantime, the Bank Wire method has been disabled on your account.

If opening a new bank account isn't something you're able to do, we can proceed with sending the funds through either Check by Courier. The maximum payout for check is $3000 once every 7 days.

Please confirm how you'd like to proceed at your earliest convenience. We understand this may be an inconvenience and we extend our apologies, however, this new policy is something out of our control. If you have any questions or concerns, please let us know.

Thanks,

Bovada Player Advocacy

If you copy-pasted this text from the original email message, it is pretty disturbing. Because they should have used "any more" in place of "anymore" where bolded.

[thesparten]

That sucks. If you do decide to go the check route I would push for free checks every 7 days for you instead of the normal fee. Since you shouldn't be punished by the site, but you understand being punished by the gov't(or at least get the whole list thing). State you won't allow a gaming site to take advantage of you when you're bringing in rake and juice on gambling.

Why would they take away check fees.. regardless of rake your pulling doe off the site weekly...take it or leave it..

I would make the first cash out free and the second 50$ & 3rd 4th 100$....

U guys really make that much $. Where that only pulling 3k a week.in cash is frustrating?!?..wow, I am so far out the loop...

[garrett]

Meanwhile since you all are getting limited I have honestly been receiving really good bonuses lately. Freee Bonus $$$, MTT entries, surprisingly good.

Unfortunately, the 2x $16.50 MTT entries I got had a 24 hour (or 48 hour) expiration on them and only saw that email at 10:30pm and the tickets expired at Midnight. With only 2x $16.50 MTTs left before they expired had to use them while feeling less than ideal. Still really nice of them. The timing was bad but, always appreciate this especially in the day and age we live in when trying to find some poker MTTs. Bovada is great for MTT play.

Sounds to me it isn't so much you are necessarily listed as a 'poker pro', as you are people who clearly have WITHDRAWN more money than you deposited on the site. Therefore can be considered 'pro'ish' to Bovada. I don't think wants to cater to, 'pros' anymore so they are limiting them possibly more than having a 'blacklist' of pros. Could be wrong though.

Bovada love you fwiw and thanks for the bonuses. Sucks couldnt make better of them but nonetheless always appreciated. Keep that bonus game strong while snapping off the sharks imo, I think this is more to create a healthier 'ecosystem' as opposed to just, oh lets find out who the 'pros' are and ban them out of fear of the U.S Government. In my opinion it's more likely they are banning people who are advantage players, and professional in a sense that they are unhealthy to the overall well-being of Bovadas eco-system.....

=)

[thesparten]

Meanwhile since you all are getting limited I have honestly been receiving really good bonuses lately. Freee Bonus $$$, MTT entries, surprisingly good.

Unfortunately, the 2x $16.50 MTT entries I got had a 24 hour (or 48 hour) expiration on them and only saw that email at 10:30pm and the tickets expired at Midnight. With only 2x $16.50 MTTs left before they expired had to use them while feeling less than ideal. Still really nice of them. The timing was bad but, always appreciate this especially in the day and age we live in when trying to find some poker MTTs. Bovada is great for MTT play.

Sounds to me it isn't so much you are necessarily listed as a 'poker pro', as you are people who clearly have WITHDRAWN more money than you deposited on the site. Therefore can be considered 'pro'ish' to Bovada. I don't think wants to cater to, 'pros' anymore so they are limiting them possibly more than having a 'blacklist' of pros. Could be wrong though.

Bovada love you fwiw and thanks for the bonuses. Sucks couldnt make better of them but nonetheless always appreciated. Keep that bonus game strong while snapping off the sharks imo, I think this is more to create a healthier 'ecosystem' as opposed to just, oh lets find out who the 'pros' are and ban them out of fear of the U.S Government. In my opinion it's more likely they are banning people who are advantage players, and professional in a sense that they are unhealthy to the overall well-being of Bovadas eco-system.....

=)

That was beautiful....

[jsearles22]

Meanwhile since you all are getting limited I have honestly been receiving really good bonuses lately. Freee Bonus $$$, MTT entries, surprisingly good.

Unfortunately, the 2x $16.50 MTT entries I got had a 24 hour (or 48 hour) expiration on them and only saw that email at 10:30pm and the tickets expired at Midnight. With only 2x $16.50 MTTs left before they expired had to use them while feeling less than ideal. Still really nice of them. The timing was bad but, always appreciate this especially in the day and age we live in when trying to find some poker MTTs. Bovada is great for MTT play.

Sounds to me it isn't so much you are necessarily listed as a 'poker pro', as you are people who clearly have WITHDRAWN more money than you deposited on the site. Therefore can be considered 'pro'ish' to Bovada. I don't think wants to cater to, 'pros' anymore so they are limiting them possibly more than having a 'blacklist' of pros. Could be wrong though.

Bovada love you fwiw and thanks for the bonuses. Sucks couldnt make better of them but nonetheless always appreciated. Keep that bonus game strong while snapping off the sharks imo, I think this is more to create a healthier 'ecosystem' as opposed to just, oh lets find out who the 'pros' are and ban them out of fear of the U.S Government. In my opinion it's more likely they are banning people who are advantage players, and professional in a sense that they are unhealthy to the overall well-being of Bovadas eco-system.....

=)

You realize getting bonus after bonus is a fucking horrible sign right? It means you suck ass crack and they want you to deposit more. Literally you're a minnow that they are just feeding to the real guys to keep them happy.

[garrett]

Meanwhile since you all are getting limited I have honestly been receiving really good bonuses lately. Freee Bonus $$$, MTT entries, surprisingly good.

Unfortunately, the 2x $16.50 MTT entries I got had a 24 hour (or 48 hour) expiration on them and only saw that email at 10:30pm and the tickets expired at Midnight. With only 2x $16.50 MTTs left before they expired had to use them while feeling less than ideal. Still really nice of them. The timing was bad but, always appreciate this especially in the day and age we live in when trying to find some poker MTTs. Bovada is great for MTT play.

Sounds to me it isn't so much you are necessarily listed as a 'poker pro', as you are people who clearly have WITHDRAWN more money than you deposited on the site. Therefore can be considered 'pro'ish' to Bovada. I don't think wants to cater to, 'pros' anymore so they are limiting them possibly more than having a 'blacklist' of pros. Could be wrong though.

Bovada love you fwiw and thanks for the bonuses. Sucks couldnt make better of them but nonetheless always appreciated. Keep that bonus game strong while snapping off the sharks imo, I think this is more to create a healthier 'ecosystem' as opposed to just, oh lets find out who the 'pros' are and ban them out of fear of the U.S Government. In my opinion it's more likely they are banning people who are advantage players, and professional in a sense that they are unhealthy to the overall well-being of Bovadas eco-system.....

=)

You realize getting bonus after bonus is a fucking horrible sign right? It means you suck ass crack and they want you to deposit more. Literally you're a minnow that they are just feeding to the real guys to keep them happy.

If you think I am unaware someone on this site wouldnt pull this comment out of there ass you are being shortsighted and naive. In poker terms, standard play. For your information you are dead wrong.

I actually don't deposit on Bovada at all, and have probably no more than $200-$300 lifetime and my account is probably a decade old. I have withdrawn more than that although I am not by any means a big or 'advantage' player. It's clear to them probably, I dont significant resources ($$$) but do win. I literally am not losing on Bovada so even tho that logic may be true in some cases, it isn't here.

More to MY point sizzle, they are limiting sharks and better players while trying to lure back and incentivize players they actually WANT in their eco-system in my opinion. Thats funny that you of all posters here, would jump out with that asinine implication everyone reading my post probably knew was coming anyway. It's cleaning the ecosystem one they are obviously dependent on to healthy for and stable over the long-term.

Solid jab attempt tho, but again standard play searless but play better imo. I only offered an example to the contrary of Druffs point, which does indicate more that they are catering less to his type, and more to the smaller players (depod little played a lot) types.

Keep trolling tho!

[jsearles22]

You realize getting bonus after bonus is a fucking horrible sign right? It means you suck ass crack and they want you to deposit more. Literally you're a minnow that they are just feeding to the real guys to keep them happy.

while trying to lure back and incentivize players they actually WANT in their eco-system in my opinion.

Yeah, that's pretty much what I said. You just think they want you for different reasons. Anyone with a brain, since the inception of on-line gaming, realizes that repeated and consistent bonuses means you suck ass. It's always been that way, it will always be that way. But bright boy Josh thinks Bovada just really likes him, lmfao. News flash, those strippers don't really love you either dude.......

[garrett]

while trying to lure back and incentivize players they actually WANT in their eco-system in my opinion.

Yeah, that's pretty much what I said. You just think they want you for different reasons. Anyone with a brain, since the inception of on-line gaming, realizes that repeated and consistent bonuses means you suck ass. It's always been that way, it will always be that way. But bright boy Josh thinks Bovada just really likes him, lmfao. News flash, those strippers don't really love you either dude.......

Honestly, you are a punk on this forum. I am pretty sure you run your big fat mouth in real life too, while thinking you speak in fact.

A little news flash for you, being pompous and outspoken while throwing pretty standard jabs all of the time only lends to your stupidity not to any of your possible creativity. If you spent less time hating and needling maybe you wouldn't be such a prick.
Again you are wrong. They are limiting advantage players and pros, it sounds liek to me if what hes saying is more pervasive an issue than just to himself. Trying to cater to others in their 'ecosystem'. Of course you took the standard line of thought here, like you probably do with most everything. All the while thinking that you are speaking in fact.

That is what punk meatheads do, like you.

[garrett]

while trying to lure back and incentivize players they actually WANT in their eco-system in my opinion.

Yeah, that's pretty much what I said. You just think they want you for different reasons. Anyone with a brain, since the inception of on-line gaming, realizes that repeated and consistent bonuses means you suck ass. It's always been that way, it will always be that way. But bright boy Josh thinks Bovada just really likes him, lmfao. News flash, those strippers don't really love you either dude.......

And one more thing for you smartass.

While we are at it, if you follow anything 'online poker' in the last weeks, or even months you would already know literally the most common recent topic and trend is sites starting to (for 1st time) limit a player's 'advantages' with 3rd Party Software. Even the juggernaut sites are changing the way the games played, that says ALOT. I have never once downloaded and used a HU on Bovada, and yes im sure they know who is grinding out margins, using HUDs before they went anonymous, also, i'm sure they know who do on other sites if they so cared to find out.

Literally on of the biggest issues on alll online poker sites minds these days, if you even knew anything but trying to be a punk, its all about what softwares ok and not, if at all. How has it damaged the ECOSYSTEM, and going forward how do we help to benefit it and make sure that it never happens again. Its funny what's scummy becomes thought of as kosher because people get so desensitized to the scummy ways some people made money. To the point its like lol everyone's a fish, they are great end of story. I don't believe that for one second once stripped of all them tools them same players win at that same rate, period. And they dont either because if they did (software using players), they wouldn't be up in arms crying to be able to keep these really sophisticated 'tools' (Bots???)...

So point is searless when getting out of the rock headed jab and needle posting, these sites #1 priority is probably repairing the well-being of there ecosystems, its vitally important too. Don't let all that get lost onto you either why some things may be happening, and not just resort to the standard play like you did there.


Thats enough of that, but careful you don't think yourself into a box, jsearless22.