Vladimir Geshkenbein finishes 62nd in ME and scams his backers

[Dan Druff]

Meet Vladmir "Beyne" Geshkenbein.



He is a pro from PKR.com.

He had 27 events on his WSOP schedule: http://www.pkr.com/en/community/news...yne-wsop-2013/

He sold $84,000 worth of action for the WSOP on pokerstrategy.com and some other events he was playing. A few brought up objections in the staking thread there, stating his financial situation was not solid, and the idiot mods on pokerstrategy.com deleted these posts as "trolling" (LOL).

He also got banned 5 years ago from Chili Poker for multiaccounting: http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/54...d-life-217177/

He sold his Main Event at 1.6 markup, and unbelievably many snapped it up. (This is a terrible markup, no matter who is playing.)

He starts out cashing twice in his first two events, for a total of $17k, and a profit of about $14.5k.

About a month later, four days prior to Day 1C of the Main (July 4), he comes forward and admits he is broke and has chunked off all of the money (both buyins and winnings). This includes both losing and paying prior debts. He says that he will be unable to afford to play the Main.

A separate backer then offered him a one-time deal, which he accepted. This was completely separate from everyone screwed from earlier.

As he got deeper and deeper in the Main, prior stakers were getting more and more pissed. They finally reached him, and initially they reluctantly offered that they would get a piece if he made the final table. Amazingly, he refused this, and only offered people a refund of their buyins if he made the top 27 (LOL). Basically, he was offering $840 per percentage bought if he made the top 27, and $637 per percentage otherwise. Keep in mind that everyone would at best break even no matter what in this circumstance, even if he won the Main. Finally, he agreed to the final table thing, but only if all stakers agreed to it. They couldn't come to an agreement about this, so he told everyone to F off and stopped talking to people.

He finished in 62nd place, and nobody got paid. This includes the $637 per percentage bought, as last promised.

Here is the 2+2 thread:

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/29...ckers-1352088/


Here is a translated statement from him, on July 8th right before he played the Main:

Hello.

Bad news, very very bad news. Shortly (I will tonight / tomorrow to post more details): I have no more money. Broke. Zero. Today is the final starting day of the Main Event and I have $ 500 to my name.

How could this happen? I have made mistakes. I was broke and in debt at all before I came to Vegas. Before I came to Vegas, I veschienden of 3 lots of money (money that is owed to me) was assured (about 25k USD total). I've received to date $ 500. I had to rely on it to get at least a large part of it to the end of Vegas, but there has been nothing so far. After I cashed the first 3 events in a row, I have begun to pay off part of the debt (first mistake). I then started the mega-soft 500 USD ME satellites to grind and there was unfortunately nothing won. Have thereby lost several k's. (Second error). Later I played a few cash games and since lost (third mistake). My money management stinks, I am not able to manage money. I have decided this year to the change a very serious thing, no gambling, sports, good food, etc. If I succeeded, I have not once gambled in casino etc. But unfortunately it has finally brought me nothing. I am the last 20-30 tournaments practically bricking.

I myself (and you) put in a very shitty situation, which I am very sorry. I have my best game technically, but money management is and remains probably my biggest leak. I'm apparently not capable.

I tried to play the Main Event to everything yet, but in a position in which I am not willing to give me money. I have found a good friend who has bought me into the Main Event. Unfortunately this is the only possibility that remains to me. The other option is to pack your bags and fly off to get a job and start back slowly repay the money (which I'll very probably either have to do so). In any case, I remain in my current position no other choice (and believe me I've tried everything the last few days, so it is not as far) as the main event and cancel the charge for refunds. I will play the Main Event, but unfortunately I have to cancel the whole action. Otherwise, I have no chance to play the event.

[Pooh]

He looks like a gay coat hanger.

[Hockey Guy]

What a fucking moron.

[Steve-O]

I used to write a weekly column about pkr so I'm pretty familiar with this guy. Really, really good player, but an absolute degen. You could tell by his playing style, and by the way he talked, it was like he idolized peoppe who were willing to go broke on a bet

[theoptician]

I used to write a weekly column about pkr so I'm pretty familiar with this guy. Really, really good player, but an absolute degen. You could tell by his playing style, and by the way he talked, it was like he idolized peoppe who were willing to go broke on a bet

this is about right. i played pkr for around 4 yrs. beyne was killing the games there. he was the 1st player to win 1 million. you only have to check him out on pkr to see this was always going to happen.
he was in vagas a few yrs ago with the pkr team down to his last few k entered a tournie won it. went to james sudsworths (james666 on pkr) room with $250.000 in a plastic bag ffs.

[NaturalBornHustler]

A quick statement from my side:

The thread title is obv. ridicolous and false.

If i indeed wanted to scam anyone I would just not fkn communicate at all with anyone. Are you guys retarded?

I have very clearly cancelled the action for the Main Event, before it started. Obv. this was not a gentleman thing to do and i apoligized and still do apoligize. But I wanted you to understand the reasons of why I did it, thats why i posted a long post reveleaning that my financial situation is not the best etc. etc. I deeply regret doing this. Should've just cancelled it and not said why, wouldn't have been such a pain in the ass that way.

When I posted this i made very clear that the action is cancelled & everybody will get the ME Action refunded, including Markup obv. As an apology I am now refunding the whole Main Event action at double markup, but some people never get their mouths full, eh?

Some people are trying to freeroll me now and demand shares of the ME in which i luckily got to cash, which is obv. not gonna happen.

Hahaha must be on a vodka bender. Freeroll HIM???

[neveragain39]

I used to write a weekly column about pkr so I'm pretty familiar with this guy. Really, really good player, but an absolute degen. You could tell by his playing style, and by the way he talked, it was like he idolized people who were willing to go broke on a bet

This.

I first saw him when he won a 'made for TV' PKR Heads-up Tourney in 2010 I believe.

He played Juha Helpi for the championship and you could see Juha was totally pissed with Vlad acting so cocky and playing so bad but hitting every flop and dragging pots with tremendous luck.

Juha was silent but was obviously totally disgusted that he was beaten by a total Retard player.

So Vlad is broke now.
Shocking news.

[pavoe]

This.

I first saw him when he won a 'made for TV' PKR Heads-up Tourney in 2010 I believe.

He played Juha Helpi for the championship and you could see Juha was totally pissed with Vlad acting so cocky and playing so bad but hitting every flop and dragging pots with tremendous luck.

Juha was silent but was obviously totally disgusted that he was beaten by a total Retard player.

So Vlad is broke now.
Shocking news.

Ehmm, there is no question if he is a good poker player or not. You dont want him at your table. His problem is BRM and degeneracy when he is not at the poker table, not his poker skill.

He is a huge scummy retard, but not a total retard (poker) player.

[Shizzmoney]

[Dan Druff]

Apparently people e-mailed PKR about the situation, and they don't give a shit.

He's still a pro there.

Awful.

People should boycott the site until they drop him.

http://www.pkr.com/en/community/pkr-pro/

[Forum Wars]

Apparently people e-mailed PKR about the situation, and they don't give a shit.

He's still a pro there.

Awful.

People should boycott the site until they drop him.

http://www.pkr.com/en/community/pkr-pro/

PKR has just seemed like a nasty site from the beginning. 3-d...is it really that important to anyone? Then there's also this...this site sux and deserves a boycott as Druff says..

http://pokerfuse.com/news/industry/p...-change-25-07/

[Dan Druff]

Apparently people e-mailed PKR about the situation, and they don't give a shit.

He's still a pro there.

Awful.

People should boycott the site until they drop him.

http://www.pkr.com/en/community/pkr-pro/

PKR has just seemed like a nasty site from the beginning. 3-d...is it really that important to anyone? Then there's also this...this site sux and deserves a boycott as Druff say..

http://pokerfuse.com/news/industry/p...-change-25-07/

Can you explain this? It won't let me read the article without having a Pokerfuse Pro account.

[Forum Wars]

PKR has just seemed like a nasty site from the beginning. 3-d...is it really that important to anyone? Then there's also this...this site sux and deserves a boycott as Druff say..

http://pokerfuse.com/news/industry/p...-change-25-07/

Can you explain this? It won't let me read the article without having a Pokerfuse Pro account.

Well, looks like it is now behind a paywall...but I swear it wasn't yesterday. Basically, it was about this (I don't have a Pokerfuse Pro account either). Looks like if affiliate accounts are dormant as per their arbitrary "dormant account policy", they stop paying affiliates:

http://www.affiliatebible.com/progra...affiliates.php

[Steve-O]

PKR has just seemed like a nasty site from the beginning. 3-d...is it really that important to anyone? Then there's also this...this site sux and deserves a boycott as Druff say..

http://pokerfuse.com/news/industry/p...-change-25-07/

Can you explain this? It won't let me read the article without having a Pokerfuse Pro account.

Basically if you do not bring in 1 new player every 3 months your commission on previous players is dropped to 10%, if you bring in nobody for 6 months you lose your previous players. Obviously affiliates are going apeshit

[JimmyG_415]

so listening to the podcast the other night, I think china is correct.
BUT they should have officially ended it.
Figured out what the end # would be as if he lost the ME.
Then started a new stake w/ the other guy.

The problem w/Eastern Europeans, (my boss from Holland told me a long time ago) is they are comfortable dealing in that gray area.

[chinamaniac]

so listening to the podcast the other night, I think china is correct.
BUT they should have officially ended it.
Figured out what the end # would be as if he lost the ME.
Then started a new stake w/ the other guy.

The problem w/Eastern Europeans, (my boss from Holland told me a long time ago) is they are comfortable dealing in that gray area.

I agree, both sides should have agreed he owed them Main buyins + cashes once he admitted rolling them and if I was a backer I would have been fine with this.

How can they think they are owed money when he told them he is not playing on their money?

Now if he never said anything and just played the main and cashed then he is a responsible for paying out both sides (the new backer AND the old backers) and would be a fucking idiot unless his plan was to bust out and pay nobody.




this is crossposted from the radio thread

Is this for real what China is saying about this stake issue? Wow how can someone who plays poker and gets staked be so clueless about the subject. Druff is 100% correct and its not even debateable.

my response below

Nah I don't think I am the one who was clueless here and many in the chat agreed with me


As soon as the guy cancels the action for the main event it is CANCELED. He owes them cashes leading up the main + the 10k buyin.


The fact that he got staked from someone else is a BRAND NEW DEAL. I am not condoning what he did but at this point in time he is not playing with the backers money anymore. But I def agree the backers got stolen from.

Now IMO if he cashes big on the main guy should pay them back what he owes them. Which is cashes up to the main + the 10k stake. He is not playing on the original backers money anymore and he informed them that.


Here is another way to look at this. Let's say a group of people staked Phil Ivey in cash games for 10k

Phil runs the roll up to $15k. He blows all the money playing craps. He tells backers "guys I blew all your money" I will have to pay you back.

Then he finds a backer to let him play the same stakes. He runs a new 10k roll to 50k. Original backers are not in on this deal. It is the same thing for the main event.

The fact that the guy cashed made all of these backers start crying. Had he busted they prob would have said he still owes them the 10k.




Bottom line is it was super duper scummy that he did steal but once he terminates the action and moves on to a new staker they no longer have a deal.


What if this guys new backer said you can play for 2 % and I keep 98%. Should he still be responsible for paying back the backing group of of his cashes? Answer is no because they no longer are part of this deal. he rolled them and he owes them whatever.

But he is not using their money to play the main event.

[chinamaniac]

Every big staker I have spoken with has agreed with my opinion on this and have yet to find any big staking guy or staking syndicate that has disagreed with me on how this should have been handled.

Reggiman gave me permission to post our conversation we just had


[1:19:37 PM] mark: did u hear about the guy that rolled his main event stakers
[1:19:42 PM] Michael Reed: ya
[1:20:18 PM] mark: Now once he tells them he rolled them, do you agree he owes them the buyins back and they are not entitled to his new staking deal
[1:20:44 PM] mark: after he got a new backer for main'
[1:21:13 PM] Michael Reed: if he rolled them, he owes the money back
[1:21:19 PM] Michael Reed: for the buyin
[1:21:57 PM] mark: Ya thats what I thought too and many other staker guys have agreed with me here
[1:23:02 PM] Michael Reed: so basically he got the money fronted (10k or whatever for the main although it was probably a package). He loses that and gets a new backer for the main, where he cashes
[1:23:14 PM] mark: yes
[1:23:26 PM] mark: and he let them know he blew their money and got a new backer
[1:23:35 PM] Michael Reed: so he chops up the money with the new backer on the main score
[1:23:48 PM] Michael Reed: and then should pay the old backers their principal back
[1:23:53 PM] mark: I agree
[1:24:11 PM] Michael Reed: what's the argument that he owes the old backers the main event cash cut?
[1:24:36 PM] mark: I don't know if that's how he ultimately handles it but a few people seem to think he should owe the original backers more than their principal buyin
[1:25:02 PM] Michael Reed: no, but the thing is… even if he didn't cash in the main… he still owes the originals back the money
[1:25:09 PM] mark: I agree
[1:25:22 PM] Michael Reed: so a year from now when he cashes in another tournament he owes that money
[1:25:35 PM] Michael Reed: his punishment is that he's a scumbag and everyone knows
[1:25:48 PM] mark: once he terminates the deal and admits he rolled them he owes them whatever they put up or what he cashed for them previously on their money
[1:25:58 PM] mark: yup I completely agree
[1:26:14 PM] Michael Reed: but his only debt is the money that was given to him, and the penalty is the shame and now the bad reputation he's earned
[1:26:24 PM] mark: yup
[1:27:08 PM] Michael Reed: how can he possibly owe 100% if he loses and pay 100% if he wins
[1:27:17 PM] mark: Listening to the podcast at work and I just cant believe what Im hearing. China thinks that he should only have to pay them back what he owed them even though he stole their money and freerolled the whole wsop off of the backers. No offense but your extremely nieve or misguided on how staking works, and even though you seem trustworthy I wouldnt put a cent on you ever after hearing this and knowing your thoughts on the subject.
[1:27:18 PM] Michael Reed: either way if he pays he's still a a scumbag
[1:27:46 PM] mark: I'm going to paste this if thats ok
[1:28:07 PM] Michael Reed: ya whatever I don't care
[1:28:11 PM] mark: cool
[1:28:38 PM] Michael Reed: and I mean I've staked profitably over the last 7+ years and well over 1M in stakes
[1:29:02 PM] Michael Reed: so I think I qualify imo
[1:30:41 PM] Michael Reed: the moral of the story is only stake people you know are decent humans
[1:31:04 PM] mark: agree
[1:31:27 PM] Michael Reed: that's why I don't buy packages for random people on 2p2 that I don't know personally. I buy pieces of personal friends that I know aren't going to fuck me
[1:31:40 PM] mark: thats the way to do it
[1:31:48 PM] Michael Reed: if they lose they lose but nobody has ever stolen from me

[chinamaniac]

You really think your right? this is beyond comprehension. He stole their money. I tell you what you back me and I'll tell you I blew all the money, and I got my friend to back me and if im succesfull I will pay you back. Thats fuckin insane. How do we know he lost the money in the 1st place? He could have made it up to get a complete freeroll into the main event.

I think we should wager on this since you really think your right. Its laughable that you dont understand simple staking concepts. Maybe thats because your so good at poker youve never been backed, but Im not that good and I've been backed alot, and trust me your 100% wrong on this and I'm willing to wager that and ill give you odds on it because the odds wont matter this is a complete joke.

If I were to stake you and you rolled me then

#1. I lose for picking a shitty horse

#2. You would owe me whatever you owed me up until you notified u rolled me. If I have documentation on the events you played (which they did on this guy) I would say look man, you owe me my cut on the original deal and any events you didn't play you owe me my buyin back.

#3. I would ask you to pay me back when you have it and would kick myself in the ass for picking a shitty horse who stole.


4. I do understand simple staking concepts. I have probably staked out over a half million myself and have been staked at times over the past 5 years for both live and online play.

[chinamaniac]

Well I agree completly with Druff so i guess hes clueless as well. To be honest if anyone else had this view i would care less because their all poker fish on this site, but they look up to you like some poker God here thats very trustworthy, and you have no clue what your talking about.

By saying what you said you should put this disclaimer in your next bap.

If for whatever reason I steal your money and blow it on something not agreed upon, and then I happen to get a new investor and win lots of money I will not pay you any profit because I deserve it more then you. Yes I nderstand you paid me huge markup and yes I know you invested your hard earned money in me but thats to bad. In fact I wont even have to prove to you that I actually lost the money. You will just have to take my word on that. You will never know but I could be freerolling 100% off of your hard earned money that I may or may not have lost in the 1st place. I could go on but calling me the clueless one is hilarious.

I think Druff is way off on this as well.

I don't think anyone looks as me as a "poker god". But I am a profitable player and have made a decent living and made a lot of backers a good chunk of cash when I have been staked.

[Steve-O]

China, what if there really isn't a second backer? What if Beyne still has enough to play the Main Event but he decides he can freeroll these guys, and if he cashes in the Main Event he pays what he owes them from the cancelled stake, and if he bricks it he cries poorhouse and slowpays til his next score?

Also, would these guys have invested if the Main Event wasn't part of the deal? This is like taking a cruise to Puerto Rico and then as you pull into Florida they tell you it's the last stop but they'll refund the amount of the Puerto Rico portion of the trip.

Now, if these backers agree that the stake was over (knowing he was going to play the Main) then they deserve nothing more than a refund. So, I agree with China IF we know this is precisely what happened, but would anyone be surprised if he just wanted to play the Main Event as what amounts to a freeroll, at least for a few months?