Not one mention of the JFK asassination in the forums that happened 50 years ago.
Hate to call most of you idiots but you are.
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Not one mention of the JFK asassination in the forums that happened 50 years ago.
Hate to call most of you idiots but you are.
Quote:
Originally Posted by son of lockman
RIP JFK
JFK situation was a tragedy but that don't mean it had to be posted when you could see that stuff on TV a lot the past few days.
I will say it's more thread worthy (barely) then having several Obamafail threads.
"I SEE A HOF TAGS SECTION IN YOUR FUTURE"
Im almost positive I had you for a babysitter
Lockman do you realize that you are literally the ONLY one around here that was alive when this happened? It was 50 fucking years ago, hell most of the little poker wiz kids/degens around here don't have parents that old FFS.
For what it is worth I probably watched 8 hours of TV on the subject this past week.
Quote:
Originally Posted by NaturalBornHustler
research for the neighbor situation?
Sonny, is it your opinion that Oswald was the lone gunman, or do you subscribe to the conspiracy theories that there were other shooters?
Also, do you feel Ruby acted alone, or was he part of a larger conspiracy?
Sorry for being such an idiot, Lockman. From now on I'll create a new thread on the anniversary of every significant event in world history.
Hopefully this makes PokerFraudAlert.com less of a joke.
Tomorrow I'll be creating threads for the following topics:
783 – The Asturian queen Adosinda is put up in a monastery to prevent her kin from retaking the throne from Mauregatus.
1476 – Vlad the Impaler (Dracula) defeats Basarab Laiota with the help of Stephen the Great and Stephen V Bathory and becomes the ruler of Wallachia for the third time.
1703 – The Great Storm of 1703, the greatest windstorm ever recorded in the southern part of Great Britain, makes landfall. Winds gust up to 120 mph, and 9,000 people die.
1778 – In the Hawaiian Islands, Captain James Cook becomes the first European to visit Maui.
1784 – The Catholic Apostolic Prefecture of the United States established.
1789 – A national Thanksgiving Day is observed in the United States as recommended by President George Washington and approved by Congress.
1805 – Official opening of Thomas Telford's Pontcysyllte Aqueduct.
1825 – At Union College in Schenectady, New York a group of college students form Kappa Alpha Society, the first college social fraternity.
1842 – The University of Notre Dame is founded.
1863 – President Abraham Lincoln proclaims November 26 as a national Thanksgiving Day, to be celebrated annually on the final Thursday of November (since 1941, on the fourth Thursday).
1865 – Battle of Papudo: A Spanish navy Schooner is defeated by a Chilean Corvette north of Valparaiso, Chile.
1917 – The National Hockey League is formed, with the Montreal Canadiens, Montreal Wanderers, Ottawa Senators, Quebec Bulldogs, and Toronto Arenas as its first teams.
1918 – The Podgorica Assembly votes for "union of the people", declaring assimilation into the Kingdom of Serbia.
1922 – Howard Carter and Lord Carnarvon become the first people to enter the tomb of Pharaoh Tutankhamun in over 3000 years.
1922 – Toll of the Sea debuts as the first general release film to use two-tone Technicolor (The Gulf Between is the first film to do so but it is not widely distributed).
1939 – Shelling of Mainila: The Soviet Army orchestrates the incident which is used to justify the start of the Winter War with Finland four days later.
1942 – World War II: Yugoslav Partisans convene the first meeting of the Anti-Fascist Council of National Liberation of Yugoslavia at Bihać in northwestern Bosnia.
1943 – World War II: HMT Rohna sunk by the Luftwaffe in an air attack in the Mediterranean north of Béjaïa, Algeria.
1944 – World War II: A German V-2 rocket hits a Woolworth's shop on New Cross High Street, United Kingdom, killing 168 shoppers.
1944 – World War II: Germany begins V-1 and V-2 attacks on Antwerp, Belgium.
1949 – The Indian Constituent Assembly adopts India's constitution presented by Dr. B. R. Ambedkar.
1950 – Korean War: Troops from the People's Republic of China launch a massive counterattack in North Korea against South Korean and United Nations forces (Battle of the Ch'ongch'on River and Battle of Chosin Reservoir), ending any hopes of a quick end to the conflict.
1965 – In the Hammaguir launch facility in the Sahara Desert, France launches a Diamant-A rocket with its first satellite, Asterix-1 on board.
1968 – Vietnam War: United States Air Force helicopter pilot James P. Fleming rescues an Army Special Forces unit pinned down by Viet Cong fire and is later awarded the Medal of Honor.
1970 – In Basse-Terre, Guadeloupe, 1.5 inches (38.1 mm) of rain fall in a minute, the heaviest rainfall ever recorded.
1977 – An unidentified hijacker named 'Vrillon', claiming to be the representative of the 'Ashtar Galactic Command', takes over Britain's Southern Television for six minutes at 5:12 pm.
1983 – Brink's-MAT robbery: In London, 6,800 gold bars worth nearly £26 million are stolen from the Brink's-MAT vault at Heathrow Airport.
1986 – Iran-Contra scandal: U.S. President Ronald Reagan announces the members of what will become known as the Tower Commission.
1990 – The Delta II rocket makes its maiden flight.
1991 – National Assembly of Azerbaijan abolishes the autonomous status of Nagorno-Karabakh Autonomous Oblast of Azerbaijan and renames several cities back to their original names.
1998 – Tony Blair becomes the first Prime Minister of the United Kingdom to address the Republic of Ireland's parliament.
2000 – George W. Bush is certified the winner of Florida's electoral votes by Katherine Harris, going on to win the United States presidential election, despite losing in the national popular vote.
2003 – Concorde makes its final flight, over Bristol, England.
2004 – Ruzhou School massacre: a man stabs and kills eight people and seriously wounds another four in a school dormitory in Ruzhou, China.
2004 – The last Po'ouli (Black-faced honeycreeper) dies of Avian malaria in the Maui Bird Conservation Center in Olinda, Hawaii before it could breed, making the species in all probability extinct.
2008 – 2008 Mumbai attacks by Pakistan-sponsored Lashkar-e-Taiba.
2011 – 2011 NATO attack in Pakistan: NATO forces in Afghanistan attack a Pakistani checkpost in a friendly fire incident, killing 24 soldiers and wounding 13 others.
Yeah I know I was the only one around here then. Delaware was also until all you bums chased him away. Times were better then and kids brought up better. Get whipped with the belt when you did something wrong. Or have your mouth washed out with Ajax when you cussed.Quote:
Originally Posted by NaturalBornHustler
It was just a reminder that you people need tostay on top of things. With history prolly the most important.
Glad you watched the 8 hours of JFK.
:blackcockQuote:
Originally Posted by son of lockmanYeah I know I was the only onearound here then. Delaware was also until all you bums chased him away. Times were better then and kids brought up better. Get whipped with the belt when you did something wrong. Or have your mouth washed out with Ajax when you cussed.Quote:
Originally Posted by NaturalBornHustler
It was just a reminder that you people need tostay on top of things. With history prolly the most important.
Glad you watched the 8 hours of JFK.
Ok I can chuckle some about this. Atleast it will keep you busy.Quote:
Originally Posted by SrslySirius
:lol2
So why didn't you start a thread about it? You know, instead of starting a thread about nobody starting a thread about it?Quote:
Originally Posted by son of lockman
Because you like to complain and bitch about how things and people are today and shit like that. That's my guess.
vegas1369 the scope of the conspiracy is maddening as is the numerous files that have been locked in the archives for 75 years.Quote:
Originally Posted by vegas1369
The French, Mosad, The Chicago Outfit, Federal Reserve Board, and CIA were the main actors. And for the following reasons.
Algeria was about to gain independant which Kennedy supported and high brass in France opposed. So did the Mosad.
Israel was building the atomic bomb which Kennedy opposed.
Robert Kennedy double crossed The chicago Outfit who helped JFK win the election in 1960 by prosecuting many of them.
The FED was mad because JFK started printing silver certificates and was going to eventually going to get rid of them.
So was the CIA mad because JFK was going to splinter them into a thousand pieces and had said so in those words. Plus their private war in Viet Nam JFK was going to end. Hah, wish he would of as then my sorry #ss would of never been there.
The hit team was French and Ruby acted out on orders from Chicago.
But each of those different organizations played a part in it.
I lived in Chicago at the time and worked for a bookie who was an associate of The Outfit. And many times I heard well known people with connections speaking and even laughing about the whole thing and The Outfit's involvement in it while I was in the bar.
I owe you green rep. Fucking phone.Quote:
Originally Posted by BeerAndPoker
Not only did I know this would be your answer, but I also had a strong suspicion you would tie yourself in to having some "inside" info because of your Chicago connections...lolQuote:
Originally Posted by son of lockmanvegas1369 the scope of the conspiracy is maddening as is the numerous files that have been locked in the archives for 75 years.Quote:
Originally Posted by vegas1369
The French, Mosad, The Chicago Outfit, Federal Reserve Board, and CIA were the main actors. And for the following reasons.
Algeria was about to gain independant which Kennedy supported and high brass in France opposed. So did the Mosad.
Israel was building the atomic bomb which Kennedy opposed.
Robert Kennedy double crossed The chicago Outfit who helped JFK win the election in 1960 by prosecuting many of them.
The FED was mad because JFK started printing silver certificates and was going to eventually going to get rid of them.
So was the CIA mad because JFK was going to splinter them into a thousand pieces and had said so in those words. Plus their private war in Viet Nam JFK was going to end. Hah, wish he would of as then my sorry #ss would of never been there.
The hit team was French and Ruby acted out on orders from Chicago.
But each of those different organizations played a part in it.
I lived in Chicago at the time and worked for a bookie who was an associate of The Outfit. And many times I heard well known people with connections speaking and even laughing about the whole thing and The Outfit's involvement in it while I was in the bar.
Oswald acted alone, he was the lone gunman. Whether or not he was influenced by the Russians/Cubans or some other communist organization is definitely debatable, but in the end will never be proven. Unfortunately Ruby robbed the world of ever having a chance of knowing the truth on this issue. One thing is for sure, Oswald was a crackpot and no evidence whatsoever points to anyone else shooting the president.
Ruby also acted alone, and even admitted so on his deathbed. He simply wanted to be the guy that killed the guy that killed the president, and foolishly thought this would make him a hero in Americas eyes. Chicago had nothing to do with it.
Well yes I heard people speak about it day after day. So I know I heard what I heard.Quote:
Originally Posted by vegas1369Not only did I know this would be your answer, but I also had a strong suspicion you would tie yourself in to having some "inside" info because of your Chicago connections...lolQuote:
Originally Posted by son of lockman
Oswald acted alone, he was the lone gunman. Whether or not he was influenced by the Russians/Cubans or some other communist organization is definitely debatable, but in the end will never be proven. Unfortunately Ruby robbed the world of ever having a chance of knowing the truth on this issue. One thing is for sure, Oswald was a crackpot and no evidence whatsoever points to anyone else shooting the president.
Ruby also acted alone, and even admitted so on his deathbed. He simply wanted to be the guy that killed the guy that killed the president, and foolishly thought this would make him a hero in Americas eyes. Chicago had nothing to do with it.
But Howad Hunt did make deathbed confessions.
http://rense.com/general76/hunt.htm
The Mossad's role.
http://nspcanada.nfshost.com/index.php?page_id=34
Kennedy vs. FED.
http://www.opendemocracy.net/john_f_...ederal_reserve
The Red menace had nothing to do with it.
fu die of aids, u aint no Son o mine
if conspiracy theories become mainstream it is because they want them to become mainstream.
that's what they want you to think.Quote:
Originally Posted by Brittney Griner's Clit
http://www.imgnook.com/x3lSSo.gif
Couple things I've thought for a while now. The Warren commission was a failure. A new attempt to discover the truth should be made utilizing today's technology but most of the "players" are likely long dead and the money it would take to open it all up again could be spent in many more worthwhile ways.Quote:
Originally Posted by vegas1369;215883[QUOTE
I believe Lee Oswald did not act alone and that's why I think he was not the lone gunman.
Why leave such a momentous effort to one man, considering the distance involved in the shooting, the moving target etc?
Ruby may well have acted alone but he was no saint from what I've heard. If Oswald was "meant" to be caught, then getting rid of him would certainly make sense.
I'll never forget driving over to the Sands with Frank & Angie as we heard the news on my car radio.
Frank's face went pale and started mumbling something about Lucky Luciano & Momo Giancana still being upset with him for failing to deliver Kennedy to them after the election.
We still went to the bar to meet Sammy & Dean as was out habit prior to the show. But the look on their faces told me they "knew who done it".
Damn I miss my '63 Belvedere. I hate talking about the assassination because it always reminds me of that car.
Have you ever been to the site of the assassination? It's fucking tiny & way smaller than I ever imagined.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick O'Shea
I'm not even any kind of markman/hunter but I'd make that shot 10 times out of 10 as long as the gun sights were true. Seriously.
It's not like the vehicle was going very fast. The route the vehicle was on prevented that.
It's the amount of shots in the time they were shot. Oswald wasn't a good marksman based on military records and he was using a gun fit for a lefty.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockey GuyHave you ever been to the site of the assassination? It's fucking tiny & way smaller than I ever imagined.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick O'Shea
I'm not even any kind of markman/hunter but I'd make that shot 10 times out of 10 as long as the gun sights were true. Seriously.
It's not like the vehicle was going very fast. The route the vehicle was on prevented that.
from the pictures and movies they show Secret Service agents walking behind the car, this photo might have been taken close to the angle Oswald hadQuote:
Originally Posted by Hockey GuyHave you ever been to the site of the assassination? It's fucking tiny & way smaller than I ever imagined.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick O'Shea
I'm not even any kind of markman/hunter but I'd make that shot 10 times out of 10 as long as the gun sights were true. Seriously.
It's not like the vehicle was going very fast. The route the vehicle was on prevented that.
I hate getting into these 'how many angels can you fit on the head of a pin' arguments, but he had training after the military, and even if he hadn't, being a mediocre shot doesn't mean you automatically miss that shot, even when quickly reloading. Not that anyone would have lived after the first round anyway. To me a not very good marksman means he aimed for center mass and he hit him in the face.Quote:
Originally Posted by LLLIt's the amount of shots in the time they were shot. Oswald wasn't a good marksman based on military records and he was using a gun fit for a lefty.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockey Guy
My comment was really only about the distance. Anybody who tries to claim that's a tough shot(the first shot that killed him) is fucked in the head. I'm sure I'd be considered a terrible shot by military standards & don't handle rifles on a consistent basis but with a rifle with good sights I'd hit the target on my first shot every time from that distance.Quote:
Originally Posted by LLLIt's the amount of shots in the time they were shot. Oswald wasn't a good marksman based on military records and he was using a gun fit for a lefty.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockey Guy
He never really hit anything he was aiming for with the other shots, it doesn't matter because JFK was dead with the first one, so what difference does it make "in the time they were shot" or the gun was "for a lefty"? It's been proven countless times that it was easily doable to shoot that many shots in that timeframe even with a wrong handed gun. The aim will suffer but WTF difference does it make when the first shot was all that was needed?
The sequence of events and amount of shots fired in the time outlined in the Warren report illustrate flaws in the "official" story.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockey GuyMy comment was really only about the distance. Anybody who tries to claim that's a tough shot(the first shot that killed him) is fucked in the head. I'm sure I'd be considered a terrible shot by military standards & don't handle rifles on a consistent basis but with a rifle with good sights I'd hit the target on my first shot every time from that distance.Quote:
Originally Posted by LLL
He never really hit anything he was aiming for with the other shots, it doesn't matter because JFK was dead with the first one, so what difference does it make "in the time they were shot" or the gun was "for a lefty"? It's been proven countless times that it was easily doable to shoot that many shots in that timeframe even with a wrong handed gun. The aim will suffer but WTF difference does it make when the first shot was all that was needed?
FTR, I believe Oswald intended to kill the president but didn't act on his own. Any scenario where Oswald didn't act alone = conspiracy.
Oswald was a good shot and the gun was right handed. Still no man has ever dupicated those shots that day. Which should mean that several others were involved.Quote:
Originally Posted by LLLIt's the amount of shots in the time they were shot. Oswald wasn't a good marksman based on military records and he was using a gun fit for a lefty.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockey Guy
Half of Kennedy's head was blown away in the back and straight shots like Oswald was making don't do that. They leave much smaller entrance wounds and massive exit wounds. That shot came from an angle. Where the grassy knowl was. And where 60% of the people turned to look after they heard the gunfire. Kennedy's head is also seen lurking backwards. A rear shot wouldn't do that.
And the magic bullet. Never in my life have I ever retrived a fired bullet and not seen a mark on it. Something is incredible about that.
Correct me if I'm wrong but I'm pretty sure it was the third of three or more shots that killed Kennedy.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockey GuyMy comment was really only about the distance. Anybody who tries to claim that's a tough shot(the first shot that killed him) is fucked in the head. I'm sure I'd be considered a terrible shot by military standards & don't handle rifles on a consistent basis but with a rifle with good sights I'd hit the target on my first shot every time from that distance.Quote:
Originally Posted by LLL
He never really hit anything he was aiming for with the other shots, it doesn't matter because JFK was dead with the first one, so what difference does it make "in the time they were shot" or the gun was "for a lefty"? It's been proven countless times that it was easily doable to shoot that many shots in that timeframe even with a wrong handed gun. The aim will suffer but WTF difference does it make when the first shot was all that was needed?
Oswald apparently missed everything with his first shot. An air ball.
"(a) Scientific analysis
In investigating this aspect of the case, the committee relied heavily on the scientific analysis of physical evidence, and again the conclusions of the forensic pathology panel were relevant. The panel concluded that the two bullets that struck the President came from behind and that the fatal head shot was moving in a downward direction when it struck the President. (53) 7 Thus, forensic pathology provided reliable
able evidence as to the origin of the shots: The gunman who fired the shot that hit President Kennedy and Governor Connally at approximately frame 190 of the Zapruder film fired from behind, and the gunman who fired the shot that hit the President in the head at frame 312 was positioned above and to the rear of the presidential limousine. "
"The strongest element in the case against Lee Harvey Oswald was the Warren Commission's conclusion that his rifle had been found on the 6th floor of the Book Depository building. Yet Oswald never owned a 7.65 Mauser. When the FBI later reported that Oswald had purchased only a 6.5 Italian Mannlicher-Carcano, the weapon at police headquarters in Dallas miraculously changed its size, its make and its nationality. The Warren Commission concluded that a 6.5 Mannlicher-Carcano, not a 7.65 German Mauser, had been discovered by the Dallas deputies."
Huh? Lefty? with the bolt on the right side? how? the shells eject to the right side (a left handed shooter would have the ejected shells hit him)Quote:
Originally Posted by LLLIt's the amount of shots in the time they were shot. Oswald wasn't a good marksman based on military records and he was using a gun fit for a lefty.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockey Guy
http://pdhomes.net/collections/orr4sale/vidcap6.jpg
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick O'SheaCorrect me if I'm wrong but I'm pretty sure it was the third of three or more shots that killed Kennedy.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockey Guy
Oswald apparently missed everything with his first shot. An air ball.
"(a) Scientific analysis
In investigating this aspect of the case, the committee relied heavily on the scientific analysis of physical evidence, and again the conclusions of the forensic pathology panel were relevant. The panel concluded that the two bullets that struck the President came from behind and that the fatal head shot was moving in a downward direction when it struck the President. (53) 7 Thus, forensic pathology provided reliable
able evidence as to the origin of the shots: The gunman who fired the shot that hit President Kennedy and Governor Connally at approximately frame 190 of the Zapruder film fired from behind, and the gunman who fired the shot that hit the President in the head at frame 312 was positioned above and to the rear of the presidential limousine. "
"The strongest element in the case against Lee Harvey Oswald was the Warren Commission's conclusion that his rifle had been found on the 6th floor of the Book Depository building. Yet Oswald never owned a 7.65 Mauser. When the FBI later reported that Oswald had purchased only a 6.5 Italian Mannlicher-Carcano, the weapon at police headquarters in Dallas miraculously changed its size, its make and its nationality. The Warren Commission concluded that a 6.5 Mannlicher-Carcano, not a 7.65 German Mauser, had been discovered by the Dallas deputies."
the distance of the first shot was 85 yards, with a scope and a bolt action rifle providing lower recoil (as opposed to a semi-auto), an easy shot imho...also, even thought the target was moving, the target was moving away in a straight line, so little adjust/correction was needed by Oswald to keep his aim on target...again an easy shot...Oswald, as his military record indicates and was noted in the Warren Commission report, was a good shot when he was motivated In qualifying as a Marine, Oswald would have been tested at 200, 300 and 500 yards with a M-1 rifle, he qualified as sharpshooter when he knew he would get bonus pay for doing so and he had not yet decided to leave the service...the M-1, because it is a semi-auto has more recoil that an bolt action rifle--the energy from the firing is recycled back into the rifle to chamber the next round--that results in more recoil when firing and less accuracy at distance...the bolt action rifle exhausts much of the firing energy and thus is steadier (the next round is chambered by the shooter operating the bolt).
per the Discovery Channel analysis
"One shot hit the president at the base of his neck. The bullet traveled through his neck and out through the base of his throat. Another shot hit the president in the back of his head. This was the fatal bullet. The assassin had fired three shots in just a few seconds -- estimates range from around four to eight seconds"
indeed, the third shot (second to hit Kennedy) was a coup de gras fatal one, but the first shot had hit Kennedy's spinal cord woudl have caused permanent paralysis and probably would have led to death also
page 82 of the Warren Commission Report
Description of Rifle
The bolt-action, clip-fed rifle found on the sixth floor of the Depository, described more fully in appendix X, is inscribed with various markings, including "MADE ITALY," "CAL. 6.5," "1940" and the number C2766.126 (See Commission Exhibit Nos. 1303, 541(2) and 541 (3), pp. 82-83.) These markings have been explained as follows: "MADE ITALY" refers to its origin; "CAL. 6.5" refers to the rifle's caliber; "1940" refers to the year of manufacture; and the number C2766 is the serial number. This rifle is the only one of its type bearing that serial number.127 After review of standard reference works and the markings on the rifle, it was identified by the FBI as a 6.5-millimeter model 91/38 Mannlicher-Carcano rifle.128 Experts from the FBI made an independent determination of the caliber by inserting a Mannlicher-Carcano 6.5-millimeter cartridge into the weapon for fit, and by making a sulfur cast of the inside of the weapon's barrel and measuring the cast with a micrometer.129 From outward appearance, the weapon would appear to be a 7.35-millimeter rifle, but its mechanism had been rebarreled with a 6.5-millimeter barrel.130 Constable Deputy Sheriff Weitzman, who only saw the rifle at a glance and did not handle it, thought the weapon looked like a 7.65 Mauser bolt-action rifle.131 (See chapter V, p. 235.)Thus, the Commission addressed the 7.65 Mauser v 6.5 Carcano matter....
Also, within 24 hours of finding the rifle on the 6th floor, the FBI had traced it to its manufacturer/assembler in Brooklyn, it's mail order sale by Klein Sporting Goods of Chicago to A. Hidel of Texas (A Hidel, alias of Oswald)
Dude! Seriously, do you ever research anything before spewing out more nonsense? It has been duplicated successfully countless times!Quote:
Originally Posted by son of lockman
Here Sonny, do some reading...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_F....sination_rifle
CBS conducted a firing test in 1967 at the H. P. White Ballistics Laboratory located in Street, Maryland. For the test 11 marksmen from diverse backgrounds were invited to participate: 3 Maryland State Troopers, 1 weapons engineer, 1 sporting goods dealer, 1 sportsman, 1 ballistics technician, 1 ex-paratrooper, and 3 H. P. White employees. CBS provided several Carcano rifles for the test. Oswald's rifle was not used in this test. The targets were color-coded orange for head/shoulder silhouette and blue for a near miss. The results of the CBS test were as follows: 7 of 11 shooters were able to fire three rounds under 5.6 seconds (64%). Of those 7 shooters, 6 hit the orange target once (86%), and 5 hit the orange target twice (71%). Out of 60 rounds fired, 25 hit the orange (42%), 21 hit the blue portion of the target (35%), and there were 14 misses on the target (23%).
http://cdn0.sbnation.com/imported_as...-shakehead.gifQuote:
Originally Posted by son of lockman
ahhhhh, the good old days. nothing says power like making your child gargle w/ ajax as a punishment.Quote:
Originally Posted by son of lockman
The Warren Commission allowed that from first to last shot, 8.3 seconds might have passed...also the Warren Commission concluded that while 3 shots were most likely fired, is was possible only 2 shots were fired by Oswald...contributing significantly to the 3 shot conclusion were 3 spent cartridges found on the 6th floor of the Depository, although it was allowed that the first cartridge ejected could have been an empty casing kept in the chamber by Oswald for the sole purpose of keeping the chamber clean and dust free with no risk of accidental firing...thus, prior to firing Oswald may have ejected the empty cartridge many seconds before firing the first of two live cartridges and would have had up to 8.3 seconds to fire the 2nd shotQuote:
Originally Posted by vegas1369Here Sonny, do some reading...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_F....sination_rifle
CBS conducted a firing test in 1967 at the H. P. White Ballistics Laboratory located in Street, Maryland. For the test 11 marksmen from diverse backgrounds were invited to participate: 3 Maryland State Troopers, 1 weapons engineer, 1 sporting goods dealer, 1 sportsman, 1 ballistics technician, 1 ex-paratrooper, and 3 H. P. White employees. CBS provided several Carcano rifles for the test. Oswald's rifle was not used in this test. The targets were color-coded orange for head/shoulder silhouette and blue for a near miss. The results of the CBS test were as follows: 7 of 11 shooters were able to fire three rounds under 5.6 seconds (64%). Of those 7 shooters, 6 hit the orange target once (86%), and 5 hit the orange target twice (71%). Out of 60 rounds fired, 25 hit the orange (42%), 21 hit the blue portion of the target (35%), and there were 14 misses on the target (23%).
http://cdn0.sbnation.com/imported_as...-shakehead.gifQuote:
Originally Posted by son of lockman
Honestly, the Warren Commission has been regarded as a farce by most so I wouldn't bother qouting anything from it. A normally easy shot becomes a lot more difficult when you are President hunting as evidenced by Oswald missing everything with his first shot.Quote:
Originally Posted by GrenadaRogerQuote:
Originally Posted by Rick O'Shea
the distance of the first shot was 85 yards, with a scope and a bolt action rifle providing lower recoil (as opposed to a semi-auto), an easy shot imho
per the Discovery Channel analysis
"One shot hit the president at the base of his neck. The bullet traveled through his neck and out through the base of his throat. Another shot hit the president in the back of his head. This was the fatal bullet. The assassin had fired three shots in just a few seconds -- estimates range from around four to eight seconds"
indeed, the third shot (second to hit Kennedy) was a coup de gras fatal one, but the first shot had hit Kennedy's spinal cord woudl have caused permanent paralysis and probably would have led to death also
page 82 of the Warren Commission Report
Description of Rifle
The bolt-action, clip-fed rifle found on the sixth floor of the Depository, described more fully in appendix X, is inscribed with various markings, including "MADE ITALY," "CAL. 6.5," "1940" and the number C2766.126 (See Commission Exhibit Nos. 1303, 541(2) and 541 (3), pp. 82-83.) These markings have been explained as follows: "MADE ITALY" refers to its origin; "CAL. 6.5" refers to the rifle's caliber; "1940" refers to the year of manufacture; and the number C2766 is the serial number. This rifle is the only one of its type bearing that serial number.127 After review of standard reference works and the markings on the rifle, it was identified by the FBI as a 6.5-millimeter model 91/38 Mannlicher-Carcano rifle.128 Experts from the FBI made an independent determination of the caliber by inserting a Mannlicher-Carcano 6.5-millimeter cartridge into the weapon for fit, and by making a sulfur cast of the inside of the weapon's barrel and measuring the cast with a micrometer.129 From outward appearance, the weapon would appear to be a 7.35-millimeter rifle, but its mechanism had been rebarreled with a 6.5-millimeter barrel.130 Constable Deputy Sheriff Weitzman, who only saw the rifle at a glance and did not handle it, thought the weapon looked like a 7.65 Mauser bolt-action rifle.131 (See chapter V, p. 235.)Thus, the Commission addressed the 7.65 Mauser v 6.5 Carcano matter....
Also, within 24 hours of finding the rifle on the 6th floor, the FBI had traced it to its manufacturer/assembler in Brooklyn, it's mail order sale by Klein Sporting Goods of Chicago to A. Hidel of Texas (A Hidel, alias of Oswald)
I'm certainly on board with Oswald participating and maybe responsible for the fatal shot
but he was clearly off his rocker and there is so much anecdotal evidence that more than three shots were fired.
People on the scene not only heard the evidence, there were many who
smelled the evidence in the form of gunpowder and that smell isn't travelling
from the sixth floor to street level.
Nonsense. Have you been on the tour? The 6th floor of the book depository was exactly perfect for the shot, which wasn't tough for a trained marksman which Oswald was.Quote:
Originally Posted by son of lockmanOswald was a good shot and the gun was right handed. Still no man has ever dupicated those shots that day. Which should mean that several others were involved.Quote:
Originally Posted by LLL
Half of Kennedy's head was blown away in the back and straight shots like Oswald was making don't do that. They leave much smaller entrance wounds and massive exit wounds. That shot came from an angle. Where the grassy knowl was. And where 60% of the people turned to look after they heard the gunfire. Kennedy's head is also seen lurking backwards. A rear shot wouldn't do that.
And the magic bullet. Never in my life have I ever retrived a fired bullet and not seen a mark on it. Something is incredible about that.
Did many people have motivation to kill Kennedy? Of course, but motivation alone does not make it so.
A conspiracy of this magnitude would have too many moving parts, a Rube Goldberg device.
Too many people would have to have been involved which means a lot of potential loose lips.
In the end, there are just anecdotes like what you presented in your earlier post.
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Originally Posted by Rick O'SheaHonestly, the Warren Commission has been regarded as a farce by most so I wouldn't bother qouting anything from it. A normally easy shot becomes a lot more difficult when you are President hunting as evidenced by Oswald missing everything with his first shot.Quote:
Originally Posted by GrenadaRoger
I'm certainly on board with Oswald participating and maybe responsible for the fatal shot
but he was clearly off his rocker and there is so much anecdotal evidence that more than three shots were fired.
People on the scene not only heard the evidence, there were many who
smelled the evidence in the form of gunpowder and that smell isn't travelling
from the sixth floor to street level.
I've read the Warren Commission report entirely....most people haven't and i strongly suspect you haven't either...so i would not cite "most people's opinion" as a very convincing arguement (hell, a lot of people haven't read a book of any kind since leaving high school)
the report was not the product of a hand picked 10 man committee of politicians as a lot of people think...the report was put together by a large staff of professionals and the data collected by the staff was extensive and analyzed completely through by an army of investigators and attornies (over 100) who were supported by a similar number of administrative workers...that staff was hired and its work overseen by the 10 man committee who approved the final report...the crime scene analysis was very convincing imho...
as for smelling gunpowder at street level, that is often cited as evidence that Secret Service Agent George Hickey accidently fired the shot that split open Kennedy's skull...Hickey was riding in the car behind Kennedy and there are pictures of him holding an assult rifle after Kennedy was first hit...the theroy is that in picking up the assult rifle after hearing the first shot, Hickey accidentally discharged his rifle and that bullet struck Kennedy...the actions of the Secret Service afterward preventing an autopsy at Parkland Hospital and the interference with autopsy performed in Washington by two inexperienced military surgeons give rise to speculation of a cover up of Hickey being an accidental shooter...Hickey, who died about 10 years ago, always denied shooting as have the Secret Service