healthcare.gov 2.0 coming soon.........................and accepting bitcoinsQuote:
Originally Posted by BeerAndPoker
healthcare.gov 2.0 coming soon.........................and accepting bitcoinsQuote:
Originally Posted by BeerAndPoker
So let me get this straight, you whine on here night and day about government programs and handouts but you get your insurance from a company that makes all its money on government contracts.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rollo TomasiI am very lucky my wife works for United Technologies, we get the Cadillac plan every year (because I can afford it) and it goes up 5-10% every year even tho U.T. switches insurance carriers if necessary to get the best rates, cant blame that on Obamacare but I feel bad for the people that will be affected, they will take the penalty if they have to, nobody in America should be denied emergency room treatment due to lack of fundsQuote:
Originally Posted by snake_in_the_ass
Hypocrisy ain't just a river in Egypt.
she works for the Otis Elevator Div. moran, stop spewing you know nothing commieQuote:
Originally Posted by hongkongerSo let me get this straight, you whine on here night and day about government programs and handouts but you get your insurance from a company that makes all its money on government contracts.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rollo Tomasi
Hypocrisy ain't just a river in Egypt.
oh and how do you like your Canadian health system hockey fag
I was at ESPN in Bristol, CT a few years ago.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rollo Tomasishe works for the Otis Elevator Div. moran, stop spewing you know nothing commieQuote:
Originally Posted by hongkonger
oh and how do you like your Canadian health system hockey fag
Bristol is home to Aaron Hernandez & the worlds tallest elevator test tower.
Kind of a stones throw from ESPN, I remember seeing & asking what the hell a building that tall is doing with no windows. Turns out it was Otis.
They simulate all your worst elevator nightmares & train their techs. Free falls to test elevator stops, etc. I always thought it was prolly a pretty cool take.
Is your wife a tech or mechanic? That is a pretty good gig, especially if she is union in a big city.
Is there something wrong with the Canadian healthcare system? I'll have to check & get back to you.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rollo Tomasi
Just checked & it's pretty good. I can definitely live with it but thanks for asking.
lol not a tech, tech's make good money but still dangerous, Otis loses about one tech a year due to work accidents, I think the last one died falling down a shaft, literally!Quote:
Originally Posted by SanlmarI was at ESPN in Bristol, CT a few years ago.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rollo Tomasi
Bristol is home to Aaron Hernandez & the worlds tallest elevator test tower.
Kind of a stones throw from ESPN, I remember seeing & asking what the hell a building that tall is doing with no windows. Turns out it was Otis.
They simulate all your worst elevator nightmares & train their techs. Free falls to test elevator stops, etc. I always thought it was prolly a pretty cool take.
Is your wife a tech or mechanic? That is a pretty good gig, especially if she is union in a big city.
the Corp big shots in CT make big money and get nice Corp perks like leased Jags & Vetts, my wifie is just an Admin
if you get sick GL facing your Canadian death panelsQuote:
Originally Posted by Hockey GuyIs there something wrong with the Canadian healthcare system? I'll have to check & get back to you.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rollo Tomasi
Just checked & it's pretty good. I can definitely live with it but thanks for asking.
"BY CHRISTINA BLIZZARD ,QMI AGENCY
FIRST POSTED: SATURDAY, OCTOBER 06, 2012 08:00 PM EDT |
TORONTO - Sarah Palin’s prophecy is a fact of life in Ontario
Palin, the former U.S. vice-presidential candidate and governor of Alaska, conjured up the Orwellian spectre of “death panels,” — faceless groups of bureaucrats who’d make tough decisions on who gets what medical care under socialized medicine.
In this province, a patient whose application for out-of-province care is turned down can appeal to the Health Services Appeals and Review Board (HSARB).
According to lawyer Perry Brodkin, almost all those appeals are rejected.
Part of the problem, he says, is that patients try to represent themselves at the hearings — and find themselves up against a battery of high-priced OHIP and ministry lawyers.
And high legal costs mean it’s only worthwhile hiring a lawyer if the procedure is expensive.
“When we’re talking $25,000 only, the legal fees are going to be pretty close to that.
“If your appeal is granted, you get nothing. If your appeal is denied, you pay the $25,000 (for the procedure) plus all the legal fees,” he said.
Either way, you’re out of pocket.
So who makes up these panels?
Well, of HSARB’s 43-person board, 31 are lawyers. One is a chartered accountant, one is a mortgage underwriter and the rest are a mix of educators and consultants. The position pays $398 a day.
So much for the little guy.
When it comes to drugs, there are three hurdles a new medication must clear to be paid for by the provincial government.
First it must be approved for safety by Health Canada.
Then a cross-country agency in Ottawa, the Canadian Agency for Drug Technologies and Health, made up of health specialists and patient reps make a recommendation to the provinces.
Because each province is structured differently, almost every province does another review.
http://www.torontosun.com/2012/10/06...ife-in-ontario
so like jesus turning water to wine, 408rollo has taken the debunked tea party rhetoric about obamacare and found a new home for it in the canadian health care system.
lock and ship.
Results don't lie douchebag. Canadians have much better health care than Americans.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rollo Tomasilol not a tech, tech's make good money but still dangerous, Otis loses about one tech a year due to work accidents, I think the last one died falling down a shaft, literally!Quote:
Originally Posted by Sanlmar
I was at ESPN in Bristol, CT a few years ago.
Bristol is home to Aaron Hernandez & the worlds tallest elevator test tower.
Kind of a stones throw from ESPN, I remember seeing & asking what the hell a building that tall is doing with no windows. Turns out it was Otis.
They simulate all your worst elevator nightmares & train their techs. Free falls to test elevator stops, etc. I always thought it was prolly a pretty cool take.
Is your wife a tech or mechanic? That is a pretty good gig, especially if she is union in a big city.
the Corp big shots in CT make big money and get nice Corp perks like leased Jags & Vetts, my wifie is just an Admin
if you get sick GL facing your Canadian death panelsQuote:
Originally Posted by Hockey GuyIs there something wrong with the Canadian healthcare system? I'll have to check & get back to you.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rollo Tomasi
Just checked & it's pretty good. I can definitely live with it but thanks for asking.
"BY CHRISTINA BLIZZARD ,QMI AGENCY
FIRST POSTED: SATURDAY, OCTOBER 06, 2012 08:00 PM EDT |
TORONTO - Sarah Palin’s prophecy is a fact of life in Ontario
Palin, the former U.S. vice-presidential candidate and governor of Alaska, conjured up the Orwellian spectre of “death panels,” — faceless groups of bureaucrats who’d make tough decisions on who gets what medical care under socialized medicine.
In this province, a patient whose application for out-of-province care is turned down can appeal to the Health Services Appeals and Review Board (HSARB).
According to lawyer Perry Brodkin, almost all those appeals are rejected.
Part of the problem, he says, is that patients try to represent themselves at the hearings — and find themselves up against a battery of high-priced OHIP and ministry lawyers.
And high legal costs mean it’s only worthwhile hiring a lawyer if the procedure is expensive.
“When we’re talking $25,000 only, the legal fees are going to be pretty close to that.
“If your appeal is granted, you get nothing. If your appeal is denied, you pay the $25,000 (for the procedure) plus all the legal fees,” he said.
Either way, you’re out of pocket.
So who makes up these panels?
Well, of HSARB’s 43-person board, 31 are lawyers. One is a chartered accountant, one is a mortgage underwriter and the rest are a mix of educators and consultants. The position pays $398 a day.
So much for the little guy.
When it comes to drugs, there are three hurdles a new medication must clear to be paid for by the provincial government.
First it must be approved for safety by Health Canada.
Then a cross-country agency in Ottawa, the Canadian Agency for Drug Technologies and Health, made up of health specialists and patient reps make a recommendation to the provinces.
Because each province is structured differently, almost every province does another review.
http://www.torontosun.com/2012/10/06...ife-in-ontario
So she works for the one non-military division. Guess what retard, if not for big fat government contracts your wife would be getting crap insurance from an elevator company not awesome insurance from United Technologies.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rollo Tomasishe works for the Otis Elevator Div. moran, stop spewing you know nothing commieQuote:
Originally Posted by hongkonger
oh and how do you like your Canadian health system hockey fag
Rollo, I live in Canada. That opinion column is sensationalist crap meant to sell newspapers & has very little basis in reality.
Universal healthcare is nothing to be afraid of dude. I've lived here 50 years & have never heard of a "death panel" & my mother died after a 40 year battle with cancer so it's not like my family has never used the system. If you have money you can get whatever you want just like America but if you're not wealthy you will still receive a high level of service & never be turned away or go bankrupt from medical bills because someone in your family happened to get cancer or something.
It's not perfect but it's not what you're being fed by the right wing in your country.
What you wrote above looks good at first glance, until you really think about it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockey Guy
You're basically saying that, in Canada, you can choose between mediocre government-sponsored care at no cost, and really good care at very high cost. This leaves out most people who want good care at a reasonable price -- an option available to most Americans right now under our current pre-Obamacare system. Now, keep in mind that I am NOT defending our current system. It has tons of flaws, unfairly shuts some people out, and is badly in need of reform. And we're getting reform in 2014 -- just not the right kind of reform. Earlier in this thread, I laid out my objections to the main concepts of Obamacare.
Universal health care is NOT the answer, especially in America.
Simply put, America's population is too big for Universal Health Care to succeed.
Canada's population is 11% the size of America's, and it is also more dense. When I say "more dense", I don't mean per square mile, but that most of Canada's population is concentrated in major metropolitan areas. The US has population spread around a big land mass, while Canada's population is very dense in a few areas and extremely sparse (or nonexistent) in the rest of the country. That also provides an advantage for government-run universal care.
For universal health care to work, the following has to be true:
1) The population is large enough to smooth out variance in health costs between individuals. For example, it would not work for tiny island nations, as a few expensive cancer patients above expectation could wipe out the whole system.
2) The population is generally socially responsible enough not to abuse the system. Obviously I'm not saying every single citizen is expected to behave responsibly, but if there is a culture where fraud/abuse commonly takes place, the system will have a big problem.
3a) The population needs to be small enough to where it is manageable and bureaucracy can be kept to a minimum.
3b) If the population is not small, it needs to be concentrated in relatively few areas to where it is easy to monitor.
The US has #1, but fails in all of the others.
Unfortunately, fraud is a big problem in the US, and the government is simply not ready to combat the unprecedented wave of fraud that would occur with a single-payer system. As you have seen, they couldn't even manage to build a working website, so obviously fighting mass fraud would be way beyond their abilities.
The population is too large and spread out to where such a system could be effectively managed. I say this from both a fraud and operations standpoint. The problem with health care is that it's very difficult to monitor and administer, as there is no "standard' when it comes to prescribing expensive tests, frequent doctor visits, etc. Every doctor has a different standard. For example, I can go to a doctor and complain of stomach pain. He might tell me it's likely nothing and send me home with just an office visit bill. Or he might prescribe thousands of dollars worth of tests. Or he might do something in the middle. Which one is right? It's often hard to tell, and that's even when there is no fraud involved. What if the doctor is steering me to a diagnostic facility that gives him kickbacks? Is that fraud, even if he legitimately thinks I need the tests?
The problem is that the federal government will never have the resources necessary to properly monitor our health care system. Private industry does that much better, as they are not hampered by as much bureaucracy, they have a strong incentive to deter fraud/waste, and they have a lot smaller of a job to do.
It is unrealistic to believe that the government for a country the size of the US could ever provide the proper oversight for the entire health care industry.
Universal health care is something that sounds great in theory, but would be terrible in practice in this country.
Obamacare started out with a noble goal -- to make sure all Americans have access to health care -- but it was poorly implemented and fails to address other huge problems. The two biggest omissions involve the crazy costs of our system and the inability for most patients to understand the cost of their procedures until after they've been completed. Instead, it's just a shell game to where the healthy pay even more to insure the sick, and the government foots the rest of the bill for the poor. So we're not reducing our nation's health care costs, and we're not giving the health care consumer more power to decide necessity of procedures based upon cost. Instead, we're just keeping everything the same, adding some previously uninsured people to the mix, and shifting around who pays for it. Terrible.
As for Canadian health care. All you need to do is understand why Tommy Douglas was voted greatest Canadian ever and that should give you an idea of how we feel about healthcare.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Greatest_Canadian
Quote:
Originally Posted by BetCheckBet
lol Canada taking credit for Bell living with his parents in a British Colony for a year never even a Canadian citizen, are you also going to take credit for anyone that owns a fishing shantey on a Canadian lake
Gretsky & Don Cherry in the top 10, you people seriously need to get a life
gotta start brushing up on my French with millions of Canadians invading SoFla soon
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CAbEg...D02WULsZJxPfws
And you wonder why others call you 408Rollo.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rollo TomasiQuote:
Originally Posted by BetCheckBet
lol Canada taking credit for Bell living with his parents in a British Colony for a year never even a Canadian citizen, are you also going to take credit for anyone that owns a fishing shantey on a Canadian lake
Gretsky & Don Cherry in the top 10, you people seriously need to get a life
gotta start brushing up on my French with millions of Canadians invading SoFla soon
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CAbEgr1A37s&list=RD02WULsZJxPfws
if a bear is chasing you, you don't need to be faster than the bear, you need to be faster than the other guy you're withQuote:
Originally Posted by Hockey GuyAnd you wonder why others call you 408Rollo.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rollo Tomasi
oh and Druff forgot to mention:
an estimated 75 percent of Canadians live within 161 kilometers (100 miles) of the U.S. border.
http://travel.nationalgeographic.com.../canada-facts/
all hail the Queen lol
Americans bow down to no man or woman
What the fuck does all that have to do whether I'm happy with Canadian healthcare?Quote:
Originally Posted by Rollo Tomasiif a bear is chasing you, you don't need to be faster than the bear, you need to be faster than the other guy you're withQuote:
Originally Posted by Hockey Guy
oh and Druff forgot to mention:
an estimated 75 percent of Canadians live within 161 kilometers (100 miles) of the U.S. border.
http://travel.nationalgeographic.com.../canada-facts/
all hail the Queen lol
Americans bow down to no man or woman
http://www.gannett-cdn.com/-mm-/d0b9...-523420699.jpg
:facepalm3
:gay
according to your own government report most of your fellow citizens are not so happy:Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockey GuyWhat the fuck does all that have to do whether I'm happy with Canadian healthcare?Quote:
Originally Posted by Rollo Tomasi
3.2 Wait Times
Similarly negative views are evident when respondents are asked about “wait times”specifically. In 2005, for instance, when asked, “In the past two years, do you think that waiting times for elective surgery have become longer or shorter or have they remained the
same?,” 67 per cent of respondents said “longer” (Figure 48). Perhaps more strikingly, only three per cent said shorter. In 2004, 52 per cent of respondents believed that waiting times for MRIs and CAT scans had worsened, 58 per cent believed that waiting times for surgeries
had worsened, and 64 per cent believed that waiting times in hospital emergency rooms had worsened (Figure 49).
Pollara data from 2005 show respondents’ estimates of waiting times. Respondents were most likely to believe that “a 50-year-old woman with a lump in her breast that requires a biopsy” will have to wait between one and five months (Figure 50). A “65-year-old man who requires a routine hip replacement” is expected to wait six to 12 months (Figure 51), while a typical emergency-room wait is expected to last two to four hours
http://www.queensu.ca/cora/_files/PublicPerceptions.pdf
if your wife had to wait 5 months for a biopsy she could have gone from stage one to stage three cancer in that time period
We are most likely fucked. I don't see any other possibility that the quality of life in the US isn't downgraded in a major way over the next 10-15 years. Obamacare will be the straw that broke the camels back.
It's truly a shame really, religion will once again play a part in the downfall of a great nation IMO. Unfortunately the party that actually would be fiscally responsible, and have the right ideas of how to get our country out of the giant mess we are in, have a faction that is so far right that it makes it impossible for uncommitted voters like myself to throw a vote their way.
Fucked.
$94 is the fine/penalty for not having health insurance the first year...your return will include that penalty and your refund will be lower because of itQuote:
Originally Posted by SrslySiriusWell fuck me. I have a relatively big refund coming and have elected not to pay for health insurance. =/Quote:
Originally Posted by 4Dragons
btw...doesn't Bluff Magazine have an employee health plan?
Yep, summed up nicely...Quote:
Originally Posted by vegas1369
I'm literally looking at land in northern AZ and learning how to live off the grid. Figure it's going to be a lot more peaceful in the backwoods.
http://stream1.gifsoup.com/view5/473...on-marlo-o.gifQuote:
Originally Posted by Avon BarksdaleYep, summed up nicely...Quote:
Originally Posted by vegas1369
I'm literally looking at land in northern AZ and learning how to live off the grid. Figure it's going to be a lot more peaceful in the backwoods.
At this point if I thought I could maintain the type of life I want to live while being away from the general public, I'd probably be down with that too. Hopefully someday.
but the crazies on the left don't bother you, so you throw your vote for socialismQuote:
Originally Posted by vegas1369
how can you tell when Obama is lying
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wfl55GgHr5E
Half a million Californians could lose their health care under Obamacare next year
Posted on October 25, 2013
http://blog.sfgate.com/djsaunders/20...are-next-year/
imo we should throw all the bums out and have term limits
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockey GuyWhat the fuck does all that have to do whether I'm happy with Canadian healthcare?Quote:
Originally Posted by Rollo Tomasi
Nothing, and Canadian healthcare is far superior to US health care for 99.9% of the population. The only place we excel is on the extremes. All the stories of wealthy sheiks and rich Europeans coming to the US for a procedure deals with that .01% of physicians, and not a one of those guys takes even a dollar of insurance. You can have the Rolls Royce policy of policies, and they don't give a fuck. They have no reason to even bother with insurance. They could put their office in the middle of Compton, and there will still be a line of limos around the block, because if you're sick, and they're the best, you'll pay, and go wherever. They laugh at the mention of insurance. They may order a diagnostic test that any doctor would, and insurance will cover that, but as far as paying them, forget about it. And the only advantage I have in seeing that guy over a Canadian is my airfare might be a bit cheaper, and I don't have to go through customs. Nothing else.
We overrate a ton of shit in America, but nothing as much as our healthcare. There is nothing more arrogant, and mediocre, than a specialist in some Newsweek top 20 American hospital. I was at John Hopkins, MD Andersen, consulted with a guy from Mayo, and not one of those fuckers had a clue. There was like 3 experts in the US that had a clue. Those are the guys foreigners are coming to see, and insurance isn't even in the conversation.
We get our ass kicked in the hard sciences by every industrialized country in the world. Even if you filter out our black and Hispanic inner-city kids, and just go white kid American vs. white kid European, or white kid American vs. Asian, they kick our ass, and it isn't even close. Yet we think we have some exceptional health care system. Delusion at it's finest. I used to think it also. It's indoctrinated into us, and then you get sick, and realize how incredibly average our system is, and what is great, you're paying out of pocket for.
We have some great schools, and we retain some of the students from an India, or some other shithole country, but we don't retain any Euros or first world Asians. Go try to find a Japanese, or insert any EU country, specialist practicing here. Even if educated here, they go home. If you do find one, they're either the very best, or the worst. So we are supposed to believe all these kids kicking our asses in the hard sciences their entire lives are worse doctors, and American health care is great? lol
You know what the worst major city in the industrialized world is if you get into a serious car accident, or have a real serious heart attack? Las Vegas. No level-1 trauma center in the entire town. Closest is LA. In my shitty steel town of less than 100k, we have a level 1 facility. In Pittsburgh, we had 4 within 10 minutes of me. If something goes south in Vegas, you're fucked. You are way, way better off to be in Bangkok over Las Vegas assuming you don't die in transit to a cacophony of moped horns.
Saying we're the best in health care is a lot like saying American poker players are the best. It's partially true given we might have 7 of the top 10 cash game players in the world, but if you have to give your entire bankroll to a random person you know nothing about, and the only information provided is country of origin, you would be a fucking idiot if you gave your money to an American. Our window-licker to genius ratio per capita is way worse than if you handed your money to a German or Scandi. Our healthcare is much the same. We have many of the very best, but our median is below average among first world countries.
Wait times, the expense of it, the practicality of it in a country our size, etc. are all legitimate concerns. That our already mediocre health care may be on the same level as Canada's is something we could only hope for.
SNL copyright nazis killed yet another viral YouTube of their show.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rollo Tomasi
You'd think they would realize that this would only help their ratings, but the morons can't bitch to YouTube fast enough.
Here is a new version, likely to also go down very soon:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w6iEmGuuLWQ
I sort of agree, and sort of disagree.Quote:
Originally Posted by BCRQuote:
Originally Posted by Hockey Guy
Nothing, and Canadian healthcare is far superior to US health care for 99.9% of the population. The only place we excel is on the extremes. All the stories of wealthy sheiks and rich Europeans coming to the US for a procedure deals with that .01% of physicians, and not a one of those guys takes even a dollar of insurance. You can have the Rolls Royce policy of policies, and they don't give a fuck. They have no reason to even bother with insurance. They could put their office in the middle of Compton, and there will still be a line of limos around the block, because if you're sick, and they're the best, you'll pay, and go wherever. They laugh at the mention of insurance. They may order a diagnostic test that any doctor would, and insurance will cover that, but as far as paying them, forget about it. And the only advantage I have in seeing that guy over a Canadian is my airfare might be a bit cheaper, and I don't have to go through customs. Nothing else.
We overrate a ton of shit in America, but nothing as much as our healthcare. There is nothing more arrogant, and mediocre, than a specialist in some Newsweek top 20 American hospital. I was at John Hopkins, MD Andersen, consulted with a guy from Mayo, and not one of those fuckers had a clue. There was like 3 experts in the US that had a clue. Those are the guys foreigners are coming to see, and insurance isn't even in the conversation.
We get our ass kicked in the hard sciences by every industrialized country in the world. Even if you filter out our black and Hispanic inner-city kids, and just go white kid American vs. white kid European, or white kid American vs. Asian, they kick our ass, and it isn't even close. Yet we think we have some exceptional health care system. Delusion at it's finest. I used to think it also. It's indoctrinated into us, and then you get sick, and realize how incredibly average our system is, and what is great, you're paying out of pocket for.
We have some great schools, and we retain some of the students from an India, or some other shithole country, but we don't retain any Euros or first world Asians. Go try to find a Japanese, or insert any EU country, specialist practicing here. Even if educated here, they go home. If you do find one, they're either the very best, or the worst. So we are supposed to believe all these kids kicking our asses in the hard sciences their entire lives are worse doctors, and American health care is great? lol
You know what the worst major city in the industrialized world is if you get into a serious car accident, or have a real serious heart attack? Las Vegas. No level-1 trauma center in the entire town. Closest is LA. In my shitty steel town of less than 100k, we have a level 1 facility. In Pittsburgh, we had 4 within 10 minutes of me. If something goes south in Vegas, you're fucked. You are way, way better off to be in Bangkok over Las Vegas assuming you don't die in transit to a cacophony of moped horns.
Saying we're the best in health care is a lot like saying American poker players are the best. It's partially true given we might have 7 of the top 10 cash game players in the world, but if you have to give your entire bankroll to a random person you know nothing about, and the only information provided is country of origin, you would be a fucking idiot if you gave your money to an American. Our window-licker to genius ratio per capita is way worse than if you handed your money to a German or Scandi. Our healthcare is much the same. We have many of the very best, but our median is below average among first world countries.
Wait times, the expense of it, the practicality of it in a country our size, etc. are all legitimate concerns. That our already mediocre health care may be on the same level as Canada's is something we could only hope for.
Your post seems to imply that your choice in the US is between great doctors who don't take insurance and mediocre doctors that do.
That's not accurate. There is a lot of in between.
Think of it like the WSOP Main Event.
My dad once asked me why I was spending $10,000 to play against 7,000 great tournament pros.
I explained to him that the Main is different. There are some great players, some good, some okay, and some bad. "With 7,000 players in one live tournament, it's impossible for them to all be good," I explained.
Same thing with the US. It's a big country. There are a lot of doctors. Of course you are going to have a wide range of skill levels. Where I agree with you is that there's a large group of mediocre ones, but you have a choice (especially if you're on a PPO). If you visit a doctor who isn't good, you can typically go elsewhere, unless you live in a small, isolated town, or unless you are in need of an unusual specialty. My approach to health care has typically been picking one at random (reviews aren't numerous enough to judge much), seeing how I like him/her, and going elsewhere if I'm unhappy. Fortunately I've never had a major health problem or injury, so all of these decisions weren't life-changing, nor were they super-urgent.
There are still a number of really good doctors who take insurance. They can still make a lot of money through insurance, especially in fields like cardiology and oncology. While a family practice physician is never going to get really rich on a gaggle of routine office visits, you're also not likely to find the best doctors in family practice -- whether American or otherwise.
I also agree with you that some of the highly-rated and highly-touted doctors are not always the best. Sometimes they are famous for some research or pioneered treatment technique, but are poor at diagnosing problems. Other times they are just too arrogant to spend much time with patients, and instead give you rushed answers and are too overly confident to ever think they could be wrong.
I have always suspected Las Vegas' healthcare system was terrible. The few times I've used it, my experiences have not been good. I have noticed that Las Vegas tends to have a lot of "specialty mills", where most of the area specialists join together in a big office, and rush people through like cattle. When I had pink eye in 2010, I experienced this with an ophthalmologist there. I showed up to a giant office, was put in a huge waiting room, and they called me about 30 minutes after my appointment time. Then they called me in, and again I sat in an individual office for 15 minutes with nobody visiting me. Then they finally took some readings on my eyes, and again I waited about 20 minutes before the doctor finally came and saw me. Doctor came in and asked, "How are you doing today?" I responded, "Okay... a little surprised how long the wait was, though." He snapped back, "What do you expect when you call for a same-day appointment? OF COURSE you have to wait!" I didn't like that answer at all. When you have an appointment time, and they're an hour late, that's the office's fault, not the patient's. Not even an apology. I thought this was just a crappy office, but further healthcare experiences in Vegas were all lacking big time in one way or another, and I have since tried to take care of my health needs in the LA area if possible.
I don't really disagree with you either. Basically it's just I have seen no metric whatsoever that tells me that our average is better than other first world countries' average. Or that our very good are any better than their very good. I have no doubt that we have more of the very elite, but it was also my experience that they don't take any insurance often. My experience was with oncologists, and I had a great policy. Didn't matter, they took no insurance. The caveat is I did have an extremely rare cancer, but as you said, it's a big country, and if someone who is the best takes insurance, long waits will occur there also if it's a more common cancer. If someone is elite, he'll eventually have no need to deal with insurance. Considering how much better they are at hard sciences, logic would dictate they might be better in the median, and most metrics seem to point to that. It's hard to filter how many of our issues are lifestyle, and how much is worse healthcare. Either way, I think you'd agree that the increasing cost of our health care is unsustainable, and we spend more per capita than anyone in the world, with no evidence it's money well spent. Don't get me wrong, I don't doubt we very well may fuck up the implementation of this. We fuck up most stuff when it comes to bureaucracy. To me, the best argument against Obamacare is that we'll fuck it up with bureaucracy and corruption during implementation. That is believable, and maybe even likely. That we are risking some gold standard of care is a far less convincing argument imo. And that's the argument I see getting made most often, because it's easier to get emotional about your mom and death panels.
What do you expect from a website that had a no bid contract?
shameful corruptionQuote:
Originally Posted by shortbuspoker
http://www.npr.org/blogs/alltechcons...e-who-built-it
This is pretty infuriating...
http://news.yahoo.com/obama-administ...222249311.html
Quote:
While campaigning for health care reform in 2009, Obama went out of his way to make one thing perfectly clear: if you like your current health care plan, you will be able to keep it.
On June 15, 2009, Obama said this: "We will keep this promise to the American people. If you like your doctor, you will be able to keep your doctor. Period. If you like your healthcare plan, you will be able to keep your healthcare plan. Period.”
In 2012, he echoed that sentiment, saying, "“If [you] already have health insurance, you will keep your health insurance.”
However, many are finding that not to be the case. More than 300,000 cancellation notices have been sent out in Florida, according to Kaiser Health News, and another 180,000 in California. In New Jersey, the number of cancellations tops 800,000, the Star-Ledger reports.
According to NBC News, approximately 50 to 75 percent of the 14 million Americans who buy their health insurance individually should expect to receive a cancellation letter over the next year "because their existing policies don’t meet the standards mandated by the new health care law."
This could result in millions of Americans being forced to purchase different policies, potentially at higher premiums.
.
Jeez Shits just getting worse. Now comes out there was a gapping security hole in the website.. (wait till I tell ya last part which even Druff will Laugh at..)
Im copying the 1st part from a story from ABC
The Obamacare website has more than annoying bugs. A cybersecurity expert has found a way to hack into users' accounts.
Until the Department of Health fixed the security hole last week, anyone could easily reset your Healthcare.gov password without your knowledge and potentially hijack your account.
The glitch was discovered last week by Ben Simo, a software tester in Arizona. Simo found that gaining access to people's accounts was frighteningly simple:
Guess an existing user name, and the website will confirm it exists. Claim you forgot your password, and the site will reset it. View the site's unencrypted source code in any browser to find the password reset code. Plug in the user name and reset code, and the website displays a person's three security questions (your oldest niece's first name, name of favorite pet, date of wedding anniversary, etc.). Answer the security questions wrong, and the website spits out the account owner's email address -- again, unencrypted.
Armed with the account holder's email address, a person with malicious intent can easily track down their target on social media, where they're likely to discover the answers to those security questions.
It wouldn't even take a skilled hacker. Anyone with bad intentions -- and a minimal understanding of how to read a website's code -- could have figured it out. While such an attack might not yield your Social Security number or health information, it would expose your address and phone number.
Read more: http://www.abc15.com/dpp/news/nation...#ixzz2j9Ay8Q8q
The last part is major LOLS
Yesterday we find out...the latest worrisome disclosure: that the entire Obamacare website operates on a single computer server in Virginia -- without any backup, according to Congressman Rogers.
I don't know if the Republicans going on with the death panel nonsense really believe what they're saying, or if they realize that the truth of Obamacare's problems (lack of ability to bring down costs, high potential for bureaucratic nightmare) are not as attention-grabbing and easy to reduce to sound bytes.Quote:
Originally Posted by BCR
The Republicans kind of lucked out with this one so far, because after embarrassing themselves with the government shutdown (which was not their fault alone, but they got most of the "credit" for it), attention shifted to the website and the upcoming failures it represents.
So basically Republicans were doing all the wrong things to drum up public dissatisfaction with Obamacare, and then the Obama Administration created the biggest argument against it with their own ineptitude.
I think the one bright side to the website is that it might be waking up the public to the reality of the government abruptly nosing itself into a mammoth industry like healthcare. Many assumed it would be a seamless process, where the evil insurance companies would be brought under control. Instead, it's showing that the government isn't up to the simplest of tasks -- running a signup website -- and that much more complicated administrative matters will likely prove to be an even bigger failure.
I find it unbelievable that all of this is happening less than 3 months before the full launch of Obamacare. This website should have been up by March 1, allowing time to get the kinks out of the process. The fact that it's now being promised for November 30th -- when plans begin January 1st -- is unbelievable. Good luck processing all of the applicants in a month's time.
:facepalm3Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryback_feed_me_more
Hilarious and sad. This is why I absolutely hate providing sensitive personal info to sites like this. They are maintained and managed by morons, and any neckbeard with a little spare time is likely to find a way to harvest all of it. By then, it's too late.
I mean, I can't directly blame Obama for the above, as he neither implemented the site nor was involved in any of the process in creating/securing it.
However, I have said all along that this was going to be a bureaucratic failure of epic proportions, but even I underestimated how bad it would be.
This was simply too big of a task for the government to get done in the time allotted -- at least not without some strict deadline management, which apparently was completely lacking.
The whole thing was poorly conceived from the start. They took a good idea (health care reform), and they mangled it from both conceptual and implementation standpoints.
We can only wait and facepalm, as further failures lurk around the corner.
one of the sites new upgrades
well at least we now know why the Administration was so confident they would get millions of signups to ObamaCare, it was rigged from the start:
Report: Obama administration knew millions would be forced to change insurance
By Mike Krumboltz, Yahoo News | Yahoo News – Mon, Oct 28, 2013
Before the Affordable Care Act became law in 2010, President Barack Obama promised Americans they could keep their health care plans if they liked them. But already hundreds of thousands of citizens are receiving notification that their plans are being canceled because they don't comply with the new law, and, according to NBC News, the Obama administration has known for at least three years the cancellations were coming.
While campaigning for health care reform in 2009, Obama went out of his way to make one thing perfectly clear: If you like your current health care plan, you will be able to keep it.
On June 15, 2009, Obama said this: "We will keep this promise to the American people. If you like your doctor, you will be able to keep your doctor. Period. If you like your health care plan, you will be able to keep your health care plan. Period.”
In 2012, he echoed that sentiment, saying, "“If [you] already have health insurance, you will keep your health insurance.”
However, many are finding that not to be the case. More than 300,000 cancellation notices have been sent out in Florida, according to Kaiser Health News, and another 180,000 in California. In New Jersey, the number of cancellations tops 800,000, the Star-Ledger reports.
According to NBC News, approximately 50 to 75 percent of the 14 million Americans who buy their health insurance individually should expect to receive a cancellation letter over the next year "because their existing policies don’t meet the standards mandated by the new health care law."
This could result in millions of Americans being forced to purchase different policies, potentially at higher premiums.
So how did the Obama administration know the cancellations would be coming?
The Affordable Care Act states that people who had health insurance prior to March 23, 2010 — the day Obama signed the bill into law — will be able to keep those policies even if they don't meet the requirements of the new law. However, the Department of Health and Human Services tightened that provision so that "if any part of a policy was significantly changed since that date — the deductible, co-pay or benefits, for example — the policy would not be grandfathered," NBC News reports.
Because the market for individual insurance experiences significant turnover, the insinuation is the Obama administration had to have known many policies "grandfathered" in would not qualify for the Affordable Care Act. NBC News reports that the administration knew in 2010 that "more than 40 to 67 percent of those in the individual market would not be able to keep their plans, even if they liked them."
“This says that when they made the promise [that individuals could keep their plans], they knew half the people in this market outright couldn’t keep what they had and then they wrote the rules so that others couldn’t make it either,” Robert Laszewski of Health Policy and Strategy Associates told NBC News.
On Monday, former Obama adviser David Axelrod said on MSNBC's "Morning Joe" that "most people are going to keep their own plan." When asked about Axelrod's admission of "most" as opposed to all, White House spokesman Jay Carney acknowledge that some individual's plans will be canceled, but countered that the plans they switch to will be better and affordable.
"What the president said and what everybody said all along is that there are going to be changes brought about by the Affordable Care Act to create minimum standards of coverage," Carney said. "… So it's true that there are existing health care plans on the individual market that don't meet those minimum standards and therefore do not qualify for the Affordable Care Act."
Actually, what the president said back in 2009 was "[the Affordable Care Act] is for people who aren’t happy with their current plan. If you like what you’re getting, keep it. Nobody is forcing you to shift."
Only now, some who like their plans are being forced, including Laszewski. According to NBC News, he has a so-called "Cadillac plan" — "the best health insurance policy you can buy," he said — but recently received notice in the mail that it was being canceled.
http://news.yahoo.com/obama-administ...222249311.html