full disclosure haven't watched any of the NLCS and just a tad bit of the ALCS, so riddle me this one...
why did Kershaw get pulled after 5 in game 1, while verlander went out there and hossed it for a CG against the yanks? didn't realize verlander is 34, Christ that's ancient for a guy that still brings it...
if your answer to the above question is:
then I completely understand...
Originally Posted by GambleBotsChafedPenis
I really wanted to see Verlander end up with the Dodgers. For whatever reason, he kills the NL (he's like 30-5 against them lifetime, and even owned the Dodgers this year), so he would have been a great asset for the NLDS/NLCS.
Unless the Dodgers choke, they will probably get to the World Series without him, but still... I'd have rather had him than Darvish.
Kershaw, for all his greatness, has a bit of a problem with emotions. Every slight failure pisses him off, and in the playoffs, that's magnified. My theory is that he comes into the playoffs with too much intensity, and then burns himself out by 5 or 6 innings. You need a certain degree of relaxation in order to make it through 8-9 innings.
This does seem to reflect an overall trend in baseball, though. It seems that starters are being asked to bring it really hard for 5 innings, and then are pulled. So in that sense, Kershaw isn't unusual. This new pitching strategy actually favors the Dodgers because their bullpen is so good.
Justin Turner postseason stats:
Overall: .377 average, .478 OBP (!!), 6 doubles, one triple, 4 HR, 22 RBI in 92 AB. He has hit .375 or better in every series he's played except last year's NLCS (where he only hit .200). Well, he was 0-for-2 in the 2014 NLDS, but I don't count that.
2015 NLDS: .526
2016 NLDS: .400
2016 NLCS: .200
2017 NLDS: .462
2017 NLCS: .375 (so far)
This is a guy the Mets released in late 2013, telling him they couldn't afford to pay him the Major League minimum (lol).
While I could be proven wrong, I don't even think roids are the explanation here. It seems like he just made swing adjustments and was always a fairly good hitter before that. He's very good defensively, too.
Only downside is that he's almost 33, so I wonder how much longer he will last before the inevitable mid-30s decline. He wasn't a full time player until 2015, so that might help preserve him a bit longer, as his body isn't neary as worn down as a guy who has been grinding it since his early 20s.
agreed on the trend in pitching...however the guys that get 25M per year, your grienkes, scherzers, kershaws, verlanders, etc should be (and I think the expectation is) able to pitch deep into games in the postseason...they are paid that well for a reason...if they're just gonna go out there and pitch 5 shutdown innings, there are a ton of guys in baseball that can pitch almost as well/just as well as that for far less money...
I really wanted to see Verlander end up with the Dodgers. For whatever reason, he kills the NL (he's like 30-5 against them lifetime, and even owned the Dodgers this year), so he would have been a great asset for the NLDS/NLCS.
Unless the Dodgers choke, they will probably get to the World Series without him, but still... I'd have rather had him than Darvish.
Kershaw, for all his greatness, has a bit of a problem with emotions. Every slight failure pisses him off, and in the playoffs, that's magnified. My theory is that he comes into the playoffs with too much intensity, and then burns himself out by 5 or 6 innings. You need a certain degree of relaxation in order to make it through 8-9 innings.
This does seem to reflect an overall trend in baseball, though. It seems that starters are being asked to bring it really hard for 5 innings, and then are pulled. So in that sense, Kershaw isn't unusual. This new pitching strategy actually favors the Dodgers because their bullpen is so good.
Because the dodgers were losing and his at bat came up with a runner on base.
Verlander doesn't have to hit.
Seems you know about as much about baseball as Marty knows about non-alcoholic beer.
True, but in his defense, even without that, Kershaw was going at most one more inning. No way they're sending him into the dreaded 7th inning (25.30 lifetime ERA in the postseason) with 100 pitches or so under his belt.Because the dodgers were losing and his at bat came up with a runner on base.
Verlander doesn't have to hit.
Seems you know about as much about baseball as Marty knows about non-alcoholic beer.
"This was a hell of a lot easier in 2002."
The time for apologies and excuses for Kershaw's playoff performance has expired. He just isn't good in the playoffs - against the best that is. He's not necessarily even shutdown for 5.agreed on the trend in pitching...however the guys that get 25M per year, your grienkes, scherzers, kershaws, verlanders, etc should be (and I think the expectation is) able to pitch deep into games in the postseason...they are paid that well for a reason...if they're just gonna go out there and pitch 5 shutdown innings, there are a ton of guys in baseball that can pitch almost as well/just as well as that for far less money...
Kershaw was head and shoulders above his peers in high school. Just silly stats.
He played for years in the pathetic & weak NL West during regular season.
My point is was never tested and never learned how to take a beat. Druff alludes he tilts out. Maybe.
Worse, Druff states he is too intense... that he tries too hard. You see Max Scherzer snarling on the mound this year. I mean you could hear it on tv. Bunch of rubbish, Druff. Yeah, the best pitchers just throw. Can't remember last pitch. The best baseball players are absolute dopes. Dumber the better. Don't think - pitch.
The guy can't beat the best when it counts. Randy Johnson was like this too. He eventually solved it. HOF now. The bottom line is Kershaw hasn't figured out how to win post season. He's not horrible but far from great.
Does the 5 inning SP trend come at a good time? You bet. Less Kershaw is more.
re: Dodgers v Cubs tonight
the Wrigley Field winds are up, and I believe they are blowing out to right field...forecast is for 10mph winds from the southwest, which means the winds flow toward right field
thus, setting up for a higher scoring game with two right handed pitchers starting...
here is a live webcam at the front on Wrigley, notice the wind blowing the flags pretty pretty good and toward the right side of the stadium front
http://www.earthcam.com/usa/illinois...rigleyfield_hd
(so much easier to cover story if the Leisure Suit was acting as field report)
(long before there was a PFA i had my Grenade & Crossbones avatar at DD)
I said I didn't see any of the game...if you are in the 5th inning and not in a high leverage situation and trailing (ie bases loaded 0-1 outs) there's no reason to remove Kershaw due to his spot coming up with a runner on base...if he was up with a runner on first and 2 outs I think their run probability in that situation is probably going to be between 10-20%, which doesn't justify removing a guy like Kershaw from the game in the fifth inning...not like you're removing a scrub pitcher...this guy is supposed to be one of the elite, shutdown pitchers in the game...too much to lose for a 10-20% chance to score a run in the 5th inning...Because the dodgers were losing and his at bat came up with a runner on base.
Verlander doesn't have to hit.
Seems you know about as much about baseball as Marty knows about non-alcoholic beer.
the situation when Kershaw was pinch hit for was score tied, 2-2, fifth inning two out, fast runner (Puig) on 2nd, Kershaw had thrown 87 pitches and appears to be tiring...the Cubs had their 3,4,5 hitters due up next inning...Quintana was at 87 also and with the top of the Dodgers lineup cycling back through after Kershaw, Quintana figured not to be long...the Dodgers feel they have a very good & deep relief corp right now: Cigrani and Watson lefty, Maeda Morrow & Jansen righty...and the Dodgers really needed to win this one as going in they had the edge in rest & home field...so the making a seemingly urgent move by pulling Kershaw early seems reasonable as it looked like a they could get the go ahead run while protecting against a blow up the next inningI said I didn't see any of the game...if you are in the 5th inning and not in a high leverage situation and trailing (ie bases loaded 0-1 outs) there's no reason to remove Kershaw due to his spot coming up with a runner on base...if he was up with a runner on first and 2 outs I think their run probability in that situation is probably going to be between 10-20%, which doesn't justify removing a guy like Kershaw from the game in the fifth inning...not like you're removing a scrub pitcher...this guy is supposed to be one of the elite, shutdown pitchers in the game...too much to lose for a 10-20% chance to score a run in the 5th inning...
Because the dodgers were losing and his at bat came up with a runner on base.
Verlander doesn't have to hit.
Seems you know about as much about baseball as Marty knows about non-alcoholic beer.
(long before there was a PFA i had my Grenade & Crossbones avatar at DD)
totally understand why they pulled him given that situation (even though im almost positive they're still a dog to score a run in that spot)...my point is that getting paid $25+M per year, you should be in there for the long haul in the postseason even if the middle of the cubs lineup is coming up...that should be the exact situation that pitchers in that tier of income should be going out there for...and I get the dodgers have a shutdown bullpen that they should leverage so this move makes total sense...my thing is, why are you paying Kershaw $25M per year to be a 5 inning postseason pitcher? I know the dodgers have infinite money so they can afford to do so, but it just seems kinda "cheap" to me for lack of a better word not to get those dominant postseason outings from guys in that top tier...druff said it right, baseball is changing and it looks like those verlander type performances are going to start becoming more and more rare...the situation when Kershaw was pinch hit for was score tied, 2-2, fifth inning two out, fast runner (Puig) on 2nd, Kershaw had thrown 87 pitches and appears to be tiring...the Cubs had their 3,4,5 hitters due up next inning...Quintana was at 87 also and with the top of the Dodgers lineup cycling back through after Kershaw, Quintana figured not to be long...the Dodgers feel they have a very good & deep relief corp right now: Cigrani and Watson lefty, Maeda Morrow & Jansen righty...and the Dodgers really needed to win this one as going in they had the edge in rest & home field...so the making a seemingly urgent move by pulling Kershaw early seems reasonable as it looked like a they could get the go ahead run while protecting against a blow up the next inning
THIS
FUCKING
BULLPEN
Under 8.5 last night Betances blew it
Dodgers trying to blow the same for me tonight. At least I have the Dodgers for an easy split but 3 outs for the sweep would be nice
The Cubs fans during the Wade Davis at bat vs some bum Cingrani.
Relief pitcher, Davis, who hadn't had an at bat for years kept fouling and battling the Dodgers pitcher.
The crowd was hysterical and loud. In no other sport and few other stadiums do you get that kind of give and take on every player action like that.
Made me laugh
If Dodger Granderson got a bit after the phantom foul I feared for umpires safety. Well done Chicago
They are lucky it ended on a double play
Turner was due up next.
I feel like the Cubs are done tomorrow. But the Yankees have surprised me so you never know.
Kershaw implosion tomorrow.
Roberts screwed up by obsessing over lefty/righty matchups, and putting in the Granderson/Grandal/Utley automatic out combo in the 6-8 spots.
None got a hit.
I think Turner might have tied it or won it if he got up to bat. He has the 3rd highest OPS of all postseason batters with 90 AB of more. I'm talking all time.
Kershaw is 4.57 post season. Hardly great.
Home teams entire post season is about 21-7. We are talking Wrigley. Druff has introduced the notion that he is a bit of a head case. Wrigley and the struggle to prove himself post season could get to him.
Kershaw will get a quick hook though. Dodgers back end is fully rested. Cubs closer Wade Davis (47 pitches tonight) is done.
You want to bet Cubs 1st 5 with favorable wind? +165 or something? I'm ok with that.
Complete game? If I were Roberts I'd throw the kitchen sink at this game. He will never be in a better place with pitching. Lester is game 6 for Cubs
Last edited by Sanlmar; 10-18-2017 at 11:12 PM.
Glad the Toddgers lost, otherwise no baseball tomorrow. I already bet on the Cubs.
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