Quote Originally Posted by BCR View Post
Quote Originally Posted by Hockey Guy View Post

What the fuck does all that have to do whether I'm happy with Canadian healthcare?

Nothing, and Canadian healthcare is far superior to US health care for 99.9% of the population. The only place we excel is on the extremes. All the stories of wealthy sheiks and rich Europeans coming to the US for a procedure deals with that .01% of physicians, and not a one of those guys takes even a dollar of insurance. You can have the Rolls Royce policy of policies, and they don't give a fuck. They have no reason to even bother with insurance. They could put their office in the middle of Compton, and there will still be a line of limos around the block, because if you're sick, and they're the best, you'll pay, and go wherever. They laugh at the mention of insurance. They may order a diagnostic test that any doctor would, and insurance will cover that, but as far as paying them, forget about it. And the only advantage I have in seeing that guy over a Canadian is my airfare might be a bit cheaper, and I don't have to go through customs. Nothing else.

We overrate a ton of shit in America, but nothing as much as our healthcare. There is nothing more arrogant, and mediocre, than a specialist in some Newsweek top 20 American hospital. I was at John Hopkins, MD Andersen, consulted with a guy from Mayo, and not one of those fuckers had a clue. There was like 3 experts in the US that had a clue. Those are the guys foreigners are coming to see, and insurance isn't even in the conversation.

We get our ass kicked in the hard sciences by every industrialized country in the world. Even if you filter out our black and Hispanic inner-city kids, and just go white kid American vs. white kid European, or white kid American vs. Asian, they kick our ass, and it isn't even close. Yet we think we have some exceptional health care system. Delusion at it's finest. I used to think it also. It's indoctrinated into us, and then you get sick, and realize how incredibly average our system is, and what is great, you're paying out of pocket for.

We have some great schools, and we retain some of the students from an India, or some other shithole country, but we don't retain any Euros or first world Asians. Go try to find a Japanese, or insert any EU country, specialist practicing here. Even if educated here, they go home. If you do find one, they're either the very best, or the worst. So we are supposed to believe all these kids kicking our asses in the hard sciences their entire lives are worse doctors, and American health care is great? lol


You know what the worst major city in the industrialized world is if you get into a serious car accident, or have a real serious heart attack? Las Vegas. No level-1 trauma center in the entire town. Closest is LA. In my shitty steel town of less than 100k, we have a level 1 facility. In Pittsburgh, we had 4 within 10 minutes of me. If something goes south in Vegas, you're fucked. You are way, way better off to be in Bangkok over Las Vegas assuming you don't die in transit to a cacophony of moped horns.

Saying we're the best in health care is a lot like saying American poker players are the best. It's partially true given we might have 7 of the top 10 cash game players in the world, but if you have to give your entire bankroll to a random person you know nothing about, and the only information provided is country of origin, you would be a fucking idiot if you gave your money to an American. Our window-licker to genius ratio per capita is way worse than if you handed your money to a German or Scandi. Our healthcare is much the same. We have many of the very best, but our median is below average among first world countries.

Wait times, the expense of it, the practicality of it in a country our size, etc. are all legitimate concerns. That our already mediocre health care may be on the same level as Canada's is something we could only hope for.
I sort of agree, and sort of disagree.

Your post seems to imply that your choice in the US is between great doctors who don't take insurance and mediocre doctors that do.

That's not accurate. There is a lot of in between.

Think of it like the WSOP Main Event.

My dad once asked me why I was spending $10,000 to play against 7,000 great tournament pros.

I explained to him that the Main is different. There are some great players, some good, some okay, and some bad. "With 7,000 players in one live tournament, it's impossible for them to all be good," I explained.

Same thing with the US. It's a big country. There are a lot of doctors. Of course you are going to have a wide range of skill levels. Where I agree with you is that there's a large group of mediocre ones, but you have a choice (especially if you're on a PPO). If you visit a doctor who isn't good, you can typically go elsewhere, unless you live in a small, isolated town, or unless you are in need of an unusual specialty. My approach to health care has typically been picking one at random (reviews aren't numerous enough to judge much), seeing how I like him/her, and going elsewhere if I'm unhappy. Fortunately I've never had a major health problem or injury, so all of these decisions weren't life-changing, nor were they super-urgent.

There are still a number of really good doctors who take insurance. They can still make a lot of money through insurance, especially in fields like cardiology and oncology. While a family practice physician is never going to get really rich on a gaggle of routine office visits, you're also not likely to find the best doctors in family practice -- whether American or otherwise.

I also agree with you that some of the highly-rated and highly-touted doctors are not always the best. Sometimes they are famous for some research or pioneered treatment technique, but are poor at diagnosing problems. Other times they are just too arrogant to spend much time with patients, and instead give you rushed answers and are too overly confident to ever think they could be wrong.

I have always suspected Las Vegas' healthcare system was terrible. The few times I've used it, my experiences have not been good. I have noticed that Las Vegas tends to have a lot of "specialty mills", where most of the area specialists join together in a big office, and rush people through like cattle. When I had pink eye in 2010, I experienced this with an ophthalmologist there. I showed up to a giant office, was put in a huge waiting room, and they called me about 30 minutes after my appointment time. Then they called me in, and again I sat in an individual office for 15 minutes with nobody visiting me. Then they finally took some readings on my eyes, and again I waited about 20 minutes before the doctor finally came and saw me. Doctor came in and asked, "How are you doing today?" I responded, "Okay... a little surprised how long the wait was, though." He snapped back, "What do you expect when you call for a same-day appointment? OF COURSE you have to wait!" I didn't like that answer at all. When you have an appointment time, and they're an hour late, that's the office's fault, not the patient's. Not even an apology. I thought this was just a crappy office, but further healthcare experiences in Vegas were all lacking big time in one way or another, and I have since tried to take care of my health needs in the LA area if possible.