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Thread: Obama wants to classify the internet a utility

  1. #141
    Owner Dan Druff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 4Dragons View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by SrslySirius View Post
    Why is it okay for ISPs to double charge? You say that content providers are hogging data and bandwidth. Isn't that what the consumer is paying for?

    That analogy would be more apt if the theater owner was also being paid by the citizens and still refusing to meet their needs.

    Comes back to the growth issue, I suppose. When all of these services popped up and started streaming, the ISP's didn't expect that amount of traffic and now have to upgrade everything to accommodate those providing streaming content. On the obverse, the ISP's are losing revenue to Netflix because people are opting to stream instead of buying hella cable packages now. The ISP's don't make a dime off of Netflix, lose money to Netflix aaaand now have to expand to meet consumer demand all the while losing market share for the programming part of their business.

    10 years ago nobody could have predicted this as an actual thing.

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    Platinum thesparten's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SrslySirius View Post
    Maybe I am dumb. It's okay, I'm comfortable admitting that I don't know everything. Those were genuine questions, not rhetoric.
    Sorry, Greeks get hyperactive when debating..my apologies..I could learn from you. Thank you.

     
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      SrslySirius: stay humble my friends

  3. #143
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    So we're conceding the point that Netflix doesn't have any ethical obligation to pay ISPs, but that ISPs apparently need more money to accommodate users because their demand for data has risen. Is that right?

    Suppose that Netflix/YouTube did not exist, and people were consuming the same amount of data from various other websites. Better yet, what if some other technology comes along that consumes a lot of data, but has no large company as a scapegoat for creating that demand?

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    Platinum thesparten's Avatar
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    My guess on that assumption is they would charge the individual more not the corporation..Netflix was cannibalizing there cable and taking band width to boot..isp,s didn't want to charge there customers more and lose them..so they told Netflix kick in a couple of bucks or were going to play stupid on your band width,(good for them).. I rent a 3 bedroom out for 1400, but if she subsets 2 of those bedrooms to boarders and makes money off of the residential (not commercial) apartment I rented her. I'm ha c.c king up her rent..I'm not paying the taxes and water bill so she can cut me out..bad analogy but?

  5. #145
    Photoballer 4Dragons's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SrslySirius View Post
    So we're conceding the point that Netflix doesn't have any ethical obligation to pay ISPs, but that ISPs apparently need more money to accommodate users because their demand for data has risen. Is that right?

    Suppose that Netflix/YouTube did not exist, and people were consuming the same amount of data from various other websites. Better yet, what if some other technology comes along that consumes a lot of data, but has no large company as a scapegoat for creating that demand?
    That's already called Google.

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    Photoballer 4Dragons's Avatar
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    Ok, long way around..

    I have been playing Borderlands 2 and there is this insane and funny as hell girl in the game named Tiny Tina so I had to find out who did the voice figuring it would be somebody I was familiar with from something else. Ends up to be not the case so I had to dig further to find out what else she's done. This brings us to this video and something to do with Netflix.


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    Platinum thesparten's Avatar
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    Those videos are hilarious..

  8. #148
    Canadrunk limitles's Avatar
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    .

  9. #149
    Platinum DirtyB's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 4Dragons View Post
    Ok, long way around..

    I have been playing Borderlands 2 and there is this insane and funny as hell girl in the game named Tiny Tina so I had to find out who did the voice figuring it would be somebody I was familiar with from something else. Ends up to be not the case so I had to dig further to find out what else she's done. This brings us to this video and something to do with Netflix.

    I loved the Hey Ash series since they first came out, and that is my absolute favorite one. I also really liked the Red Faction game they're talking about.

    The reason she's Tiny Tina is because her brother was the main writer of Borderlands 2. So he wrote that awesome character just for her, and then she nailed the shit out of it.

    If you want a more RPGish game, check out Dragon Age: Inquisition. Bioware makes one specific kind of game (Mass Effect) but they've just gotten phenomenally good at it.

  10. #150
    Owner Dan Druff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SrslySirius View Post
    So we're conceding the point that Netflix doesn't have any ethical obligation to pay ISPs, but that ISPs apparently need more money to accommodate users because their demand for data has risen. Is that right?

    Suppose that Netflix/YouTube did not exist, and people were consuming the same amount of data from various other websites. Better yet, what if some other technology comes along that consumes a lot of data, but has no large company as a scapegoat for creating that demand?
    Obviously the bandwidth needed will increase as the years wear on.

    It's the ISPs' responsibility to keep up with that if it's just a matter of changing times, but I can understand them wanting a few large companies causing (and profiting big from) the situation to kick in their fair share.

    The money has to come from somewhere. If not the content providers, it will have to come from the customers. Now that the content providers can't be required to pay, guess where it will end up coming from?

  11. #151
    Photoballer 4Dragons's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DirtyB View Post

    I loved the Hey Ash series since they first came out, and that is my absolute favorite one. I also really liked the Red Faction game they're talking about.

    The reason she's Tiny Tina is because her brother was the main writer of Borderlands 2. So he wrote that awesome character just for her, and then she nailed the shit out of it.

    If you want a more RPGish game, check out Dragon Age: Inquisition. Bioware makes one specific kind of game (Mass Effect) but they've just gotten phenomenally good at it.

    LOL


  12. #152
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    Obviously the bandwidth needed will increase as the years wear on.

    It's the ISPs' responsibility to keep up with that if it's just a matter of changing times, but I can understand them wanting a few large companies causing (and profiting big from) the situation to kick in their fair share.

    The money has to come from somewhere. If not the content providers, it will have to come from the customers. Now that the content providers can't be required to pay, guess where it will end up coming from?
    As a consumer I don't like the idea of that cost being passed to me, but if I look at it objectively, it seems only fair. Let's set Netflix aside for a moment. I know, they're a huge company and make a lot of money. But how would you feel if Comcast sent you a letter demanding X dollars per year for hosting PokerFraudAlert? That's bullshit right? Even if it was a small amount, the principle of it is ridiculous. I'm probably responsible for Petabytes of data streamed through videos I've made. I wonder what my bill would be at the same rate they're shaking down Netflix. I wouldn't pay it, even if I have profited from creating content and could easily afford it. It's not my responsibility make their business model work.

    I am also becoming skeptical of these daunting costs they're supposedly facing. How is it that Google Fiber is able to start from scratch and offer 1,000 Mbit down and 1,000 Mbit up (!!!) for $70 a month? I pay more than that for 30 Mbit down 4 Mbit up. Is this because Google is lighting money on fire or because the ISPs are massively incompetent? Or both? I have heard about people in neighboring cities of KC and Austin getting 6x speed increases at no charge from Comcast/TWC/ATT in response to Google Fiber. How can they do that if it's so cost prohibitive?

    I hear that Google Fiber is coming to Atlanta, btw. I'm outside the city limits, but perhaps my service provider will also get scared and start giving me reasonable service.
    Last edited by SrslySirius; 02-28-2015 at 10:40 PM.

  13. #153
    Owner Dan Druff's Avatar
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    Well........ looks like Netflix lied to everyone.

    http://www.wsj.com/articles/netflixs...rma-1459550381

    Good job protecting the "people" from the evils of the ISPs, everyone.

  14. #154
    Owner Dan Druff's Avatar
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    New FCC Chairman may kill net neutrality:

    http://money.cnn.com/2017/01/24/tech...ity/index.html


     
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      FPS_Russia: Red x 1000

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    Platinum DirtyB's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    New FCC Chairman may kill net neutrality:

    http://money.cnn.com/2017/01/24/tech...ity/index.html

    You're going to be so pissed when you see how that actually turns out.

  16. #156
    Plutonium simpdog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DirtyB View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    New FCC Chairman may kill net neutrality:

    http://money.cnn.com/2017/01/24/tech...ity/index.html

    You're going to be so pissed when you see how that actually turns out.
    This.

    Regardless of what party you support how can this be a good thing?

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    Owner Dan Druff's Avatar
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    Wake me up when there is an actual problem/crisis to fix regarding this matter.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    Wake me up when there is an actual problem/crisis to fix regarding this matter.
    To all those who may be new to politics let me explain something. If you think after the cost of internet rises or censorship or any of the other nightmares (MM Climate Change)comes true that you're going to come here and get a satisfying told ya so and change of heart and mind from conservatives you're sorely mistaken.

    Evidence: Iraq war
    DICK CHENEY
    "I think they're in the last throes, if you will, of the insurgency." June 20, 2005 (Source)
    "I think things have gotten so bad inside Iraq, from the standpoint of the Iraqi people, my belief is we will, in fact, be greeted as liberators. . . . I think it will go relatively quickly, . . . (in) weeks rather than months." March 16, 2003 (Source)
    “Simply stated, there is no doubt that Saddam Hussein now has weapons of mass destruction. There is no doubt he is amassing them to use against our friends, against our allies, and against us.” (Source)
    "If we had to do it over again we would do exactly the same thing.” September 13, 2006 (Source)
    “What we did in Iraq was exactly the right thing to do. If I had it to recommend all over again, I would recommend exactly the same course of action.” October 5, 2004 (Source)

    BILL KRISTOL
    “Very few wars in American history were prepared better or more thoroughly than this one by this president.” July 15, 2007 (Source)
    "This is going to be a two month war, not an eight year war." March 28, 2003 (Source)
    "There has been a certain amount of pop sociology... that the Shi'a can't get along with the Sunni... there's almost no evidence of that at all.” April 4, 2003 (Fox News w/ Bill O’Reilly)
    "“The first two battles of this new era are now over. The battles of Afghanistan and Iraq have been won decisively and honorably.” April 28, 2003 (Source)
    “… there are hopeful signs that Iraqis of differing religious, ethnic, and political persuasions can work together. This is a far cry from the predictions made before the war by many, both here and in Europe, that a liberated Iraq would fracture into feuding clans and unleash a bloodbath.” March 22, 2004 (Source)
    “… the continuing debates over the terms of a final constitution, have in fact demonstrated something remarkable in Iraq: a willingness on the part of the diverse ethnic and religious groups to disagree--peacefully--and then to compromise.” March 22, 2004 (Source)

    PAUL WOLFOWITZ
    “There's a lot of money to pay for this. It doesn't have to be U.S. taxpayer money. We are dealing with a country that can really finance its own reconstruction, and relatively soon.” March 27, 2003 (Source)
    On weapons of mass destruction: “There's no question in my mind that there was something there. There are just too many pieces of evidence and we'll get to the bottom of it.” August 1, 2003 (Source)
    “Some of the higher-end predictions that we have been hearing recently, such as the notion that it will take several hundred thousand U.S. troops to provide stability in post-Saddam (Hussein) Iraq, are wildly off the mark.” February 27, 2003 (Source)
    "It's hard to conceive that it would take more forces to provide stability in post-Saddam Iraq than it would take to conduct the war itself and to secure the surrender of Saddam’s security forces and his army. Hard to imagine." Feb. 27, 2003 (Source)
    "Peacekeeping requirements in Iraq might be much lower than historical experience in the Balkans suggests. There's been none of the record in Iraq of ethnic militias fighting one another that produced so much bloodshed and permanent scars in Bosnia along with the requirement for large policing forces to separate those militias.” Feb. 27, 2003 (Source)
    “These are Arabs, 23 million of the most educated people in the Arab world, who are going to welcome us as liberators.” Feb. 27, 2003 (Source)
    "The Iraqi people understand what this crisis is about. Like the people of France in the 1940s, they view us as their hoped-for liberator.” March 11, 2003 (Source)
    "The truth is that for reasons that have a lot to do with the U.S. government bureaucracy, we settled on the one issue that everyone could agree on, which was weapons of mass destruction, as the core reason." May 28, 2003 (Source)

    BERNIE SANDERS
    "We should make no mistake about it, today is a tragic day for humanity, for the people of Iraq, for the people of the United States, and for the United Nations as an institution. It is also a tragic day for the future of our planet and for the children, 30,000 of whom in the Third World will starve to death today as we spend billions to wage this war – and 25 percent of whom in our own country live in poverty in our country because we apparently lack the funds to provide them with a minimal standard of living. ...

    "Despite the fact that we are now aligned with such Middle Eastern dictatorships such as Syria, a terrorist dictatorship, Saudi Arabia and Kuwait, feudalistic dictatorships, and Egypt, a one-party state that receives seven billion dollars in debt forgiveness to wage this war with us, I believe that in the long run, the action unleashed last night will go strongly against our interests in the Middle East. Clearly the United States and allies will win this war, but the death and destruction caused, will in my opinion, not be forgotten by the poor people of the Third World and the people of the Middle East in particular. ...

    "I fear that one day we will regret that decision and that we are in fact laying the ground work for more and more wars for years to come."
    In a civilized world Druff, Cheney and all these guys would offer heart felt apologies for being so wrong and support Bernie during the election. Nope they're still running around like they know what they're talking about and the liberals are overreacting and delusional.

  19. #159
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by SrslySirius View Post
    So we're conceding the point that Netflix doesn't have any ethical obligation to pay ISPs, but that ISPs apparently need more money to accommodate users because their demand for data has risen. Is that right?

    Suppose that Netflix/YouTube did not exist, and people were consuming the same amount of data from various other websites. Better yet, what if some other technology comes along that consumes a lot of data, but has no large company as a scapegoat for creating that demand?
    Obviously the bandwidth needed will increase as the years wear on.

    It's the ISPs' responsibility to keep up with that if it's just a matter of changing times, but I can understand them wanting a few large companies causing (and profiting big from) the situation to kick in their fair share.

    The money has to come from somewhere. If not the content providers, it will have to come from the customers. Now that the content providers can't be required to pay, guess where it will end up coming from?
    You guys are so funny. I'd rather just see the ISPs charge more for a higher tier service. What you are doing is letting them start a precedent where they can strongarm money out of sites from here forward and not do *ANYTHING* for the end consumer except have the executives find themselves amongst nice raises.

    "kick in their fair share". ISPs have done quite a good job at avoiding proper infrastructure. Now they want to pass on a price increase to consumers with 0 liability by having Netflix etc charge more.

  20. #160
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    Wake me up when there is an actual problem/crisis to fix regarding this matter.
    FCC blocks 9 companies from providing low-income internet access
    http://money.cnn.com/2017/02/03/tech...rnet-lifeline/
    https://www.reddit.com/r/news/commen...ing_lowincome/
    Read the comments, this is a problem.
    Rob the poor fund unnecessary war. GOP USA
    Last edited by FPS_Russia; 02-05-2017 at 06:50 PM.

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