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Thread: Illegal World Cup betting ring busted at Caesar's

  1. #1
    Owner Dan Druff's Avatar
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    Illegal World Cup betting ring busted at Caesar's

    http://m.reviewjournal.com/business/...busted-caesars

    It involved Chinese nationals, including Paul Phua.

  2. #2
    Gold LLL's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    http://m.reviewjournal.com/business/...busted-caesars

    It involved Chinese nationals, including Paul Phua.
    Sounds like he's phucked.
    "You run into an asshole in the morning, you ran into an asshole; you run into assholes all day, you're the asshole."

  3. #3
    your face is phucked

     
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  4. #4
    When I played in there last week I saw Tom Dwan+Vivek playing a big game with Chinese businessmen (who were allowed to smoke. I guess you can when you are playing 1000-2000 lol).

  5. #5
    Diamond Walter Sobchak's Avatar
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    If only there were some nearby place where they could sports bet legally.

     
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    SOBCHAK SECURITY 213-799-7798

    PRESIDENT-ELECT JOSEPH R. BIDEN JR.

  6. #6
    First thought. What sick action those guys were moving. Just dwarfs any gambling operation I've ever heard of

    Second thought. Dude just doesn't look like some high ranking 14k Triad kingpin. Not that I'd have the slightest idea what one should look like, but central casting would provide a much more menacing Triad kingpin. I'm thinking a Chinese version of the Japanese dude who cut his finger off in Black Rain. This guy must be like the Malaysian Lefty Rosenthal numbers guru of the Triads.

  7. #7
    Chesnoff said members of the poker community, including Andrew Robl, were gathering assets to help with Phua's bail. Robl was prepared to put up $1.5 million, Chesnoff said.

    Frayn, without citing names, said a number of Phua's poker associates may have been involved in illegal activity uncovered by the FBI investigation.
    Phua may not be the only one getting phucked.

    However, this group was stupid, you don't use Caesars technicians to setup computers to run a gambling operation.

    Dumb Phucks.



  8. #8
    They must of had some US customers; hard to see how this was illegal otherwise

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sidewinder View Post
    They must of had some US customers; hard to see how this was illegal otherwise
    They were allegedly running an Asian sportsbetting site out of the villas via VPN and remote software programs such as GoToMyPC. Phua and at least some of the others were arrested in Macau in late June, and after being released flew within 24 hours to Las Vegas, where they rented the three villas and obtained all the high-tech computer equipment, seemingly trying to do more of whatever got them into trouble in Macau.

    They also did get some of Phua's gambling ledgers, so there's that, too.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by haleylh View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Sidewinder View Post
    They must of had some US customers; hard to see how this was illegal otherwise
    They were allegedly running an Asian sportsbetting site out of the villas via VPN and remote software programs such as GoToMyPC. Phua and at least some of the others were arrested in Macau in late June, and after being released flew within 24 hours to Las Vegas, where they rented the three villas and obtained all the high-tech computer equipment, seemingly trying to do more of whatever got them into trouble in Macau.

    They also did get some of Phua's gambling ledgers, so there's that, too.
    How brazen and stupid. I remember there were two Malaysian "businessmen" in one drop a few years ago and it looks like he was one of them. Villas, major tourneys, pretty high profile for Hong kong triad crime stuff. Makes for a good read though.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Charham View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by haleylh View Post

    They were allegedly running an Asian sportsbetting site out of the villas via VPN and remote software programs such as GoToMyPC. Phua and at least some of the others were arrested in Macau in late June, and after being released flew within 24 hours to Las Vegas, where they rented the three villas and obtained all the high-tech computer equipment, seemingly trying to do more of whatever got them into trouble in Macau.

    They also did get some of Phua's gambling ledgers, so there's that, too.
    How brazen and stupid. I remember there were two Malaysian "businessmen" in one drop a few years ago and it looks like he was one of them. Villas, major tourneys, pretty high profile for Hong kong triad crime stuff. Makes for a good read though.
    It was actually TeamViewer, not GoToMyPC; same diff, of course. Also, statements being made that no bets were being accepted by Americans (including some on social media by peeps who really ought to know better) are incorrect. The complaint doesn't have to put all of that stuff in right now, but it did include one example, a cell phone text exchange between Paul's son Darren (another of those arrested) and someone using a cell phone registered in North Las Vegas, for $13K on one of the WC games. The NLV number is listed in the complaint but I'm not publishing it.

    The feds even captured a text showing what may have been the total IBCBET handle for the WC action, which was over $2 billion HKD, or just under $400 milly USD.

     
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  12. #12
    i hope he rolls andrew robl (although he could be using phua's money)

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by haleylh View Post
    It was actually TeamViewer, not GoToMyPC; same diff, of course. Also, statements being made that no bets were being accepted by Americans (including some on social media by peeps who really ought to know better) are incorrect. The complaint doesn't have to put all of that stuff in right now, but it did include one example, a cell phone text exchange between Paul's son Darren (another of those arrested) and someone using a cell phone registered in North Las Vegas, for $13K on one of the WC games. The NLV number is listed in the complaint but I'm not publishing it.

    The feds even captured a text showing what may have been the total IBCBET handle for the WC action, which was over $2 billion HKD, or just under $400 milly USD.
    I doubt very much that cell phone texts will be enough evidence to prove illegal bookmaking.
    Anyone could be sending or receiving texts.

    According to the complaint, FBI agents delivered a brand new windows 8 laptop to one of the Villas.
    What was on that laptop? Malware? Trojan horse software?
    I bet the feds forgot to mention that in the legal paperwork.

    This case may get thrown out of court because Caesars and the FBI acted in an illegal manner.



  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheXFactor View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by haleylh View Post
    It was actually TeamViewer, not GoToMyPC; same diff, of course. Also, statements being made that no bets were being accepted by Americans (including some on social media by peeps who really ought to know better) are incorrect. The complaint doesn't have to put all of that stuff in right now, but it did include one example, a cell phone text exchange between Paul's son Darren (another of those arrested) and someone using a cell phone registered in North Las Vegas, for $13K on one of the WC games. The NLV number is listed in the complaint but I'm not publishing it.

    The feds even captured a text showing what may have been the total IBCBET handle for the WC action, which was over $2 billion HKD, or just under $400 milly USD.
    I doubt very much that cell phone texts will be enough evidence to prove illegal bookmaking.
    Anyone could be sending or receiving texts.

    According to the complaint, FBI agents delivered a brand new windows 8 laptop to one of the Villas.
    What was on that laptop? Malware? Trojan horse software?
    I bet the feds forgot to mention that in the legal paperwork.

    This case may get thrown out of court because Caesars and the FBI acted in an illegal manner.


    Nope. Caesars provided the laptop, not the FBI. Software I mentioned was installed separately by Phua's peeps after the new laptop arrived, installation records and everything. FBI got involved after a few days because of the strange behavior and what might have been physical threats made toward one of the employees. Cell phone texts were just a small part of it -- they got 15 workstations full of gambling records and software and client ledgers.

    Some of the anger I see on forums and social media is a bit baffling. I mean, I don't think sportsbetting should be illegal, but if it is, you have to account for that risk. The reason Caesars and the feds got involved is because it very likely was taking some action away from legal Nevada books. There are news reports out there that state that action on all other sports was off by several percent while the World Cup was going on.

    It seems pretty clear that Phua moved his operation to these villas after he was deported from Macau for doing the same thing. You'd have thought he'd have an inkling that authorities across the globe might be watching him, but it didn't seem to slow him down any. The timeline displays a virtual urgency on Phua's part in getting from Macau back to LV to get the operation back online.

    One other factor regarding Caesars that's just a hunch. Paul Phua was a major whale in the Macau casinos moreso than the US ones, and the Macau casinos are largely Sheldon Adelson and Steve Wynn properties. Adelson has made no bones about one of the reasons for his crusade against online poker being that he can also use it to cripple Caesars' interests, a major competitor. It wouldn't surprise me a bit to learn that Caesars evaluated this and decided a little tit-for-tat was called for, and that Sheldon should lose a major whale.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by haleylh View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by TheXFactor View Post

    I doubt very much that cell phone texts will be enough evidence to prove illegal bookmaking.
    Anyone could be sending or receiving texts.

    According to the complaint, FBI agents delivered a brand new windows 8 laptop to one of the Villas.
    What was on that laptop? Malware? Trojan horse software?
    I bet the feds forgot to mention that in the legal paperwork.

    This case may get thrown out of court because Caesars and the FBI acted in an illegal manner.


    Nope. Caesars provided the laptop, not the FBI. Software I mentioned was installed separately by Phua's peeps after the new laptop arrived, installation records and everything. FBI got involved after a few days because of the strange behavior and what might have been physical threats made toward one of the employees. Cell phone texts were just a small part of it -- they got 15 workstations full of gambling records and software and client ledgers.

    Some of the anger I see on forums and social media is a bit baffling. I mean, I don't think sportsbetting should be illegal, but if it is, you have to account for that risk. The reason Caesars and the feds got involved is because it very likely was taking some action away from legal Nevada books. There are news reports out there that state that action on all other sports was off by several percent while the World Cup was going on.

    It seems pretty clear that Phua moved his operation to these villas after he was deported from Macau for doing the same thing. You'd have thought he'd have an inkling that authorities across the globe might be watching him, but it didn't seem to slow him down any. The timeline displays a virtual urgency on Phua's part in getting from Macau back to LV to get the operation back online.

    One other factor regarding Caesars that's just a hunch. Paul Phua was a major whale in the Macau casinos moreso than the US ones, and the Macau casinos are largely Sheldon Adelson and Steve Wynn properties. Adelson has made no bones about one of the reasons for his crusade against online poker being that he can also use it to cripple Caesars' interests, a major competitor. It wouldn't surprise me a bit to learn that Caesars evaluated this and decided a little tit-for-tat was called for, and that Sheldon should lose a major whale.
    All those phone lines installed is really nuts... Thanks for the info from the complaint.

    Can you tell me or give links to those defending on social media?

    If these guys were taking bets from those in the US (which sounds nuts bc they were so wide open about it), then they were def breaking the law.

    Of course they wouldn't of arrested them without enough evidence to convict - the government doesn't really drop charges or lose at the federal level. Those deferred prosecution deals are about the best the innocent can hope for short of winning at trial.

    Thanks for the info Haley... hope you can provide more

  16. #16
    Photoballer 4Dragons's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WillieMcFML View Post
    i hope he rolls andrew robl (although he could be using phua's money)
    More likely that robl will use his own money and when Phua flees and robl loses his stack, Phua pays him back later. The airplane for collateral is the doozey.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sidewinder View Post
    All those phone lines installed is really nuts... Thanks for the info from the complaint.

    Can you tell me or give links to those defending on social media?

    If these guys were taking bets from those in the US (which sounds nuts bc they were so wide open about it), then they were def breaking the law.

    Of course they wouldn't of arrested them without enough evidence to convict - the government doesn't really drop charges or lose at the federal level. Those deferred prosecution deals are about the best the innocent can hope for short of winning at trial.

    Thanks for the info Haley... hope you can provide more
    Lots of posts and Tweets claiming the busts were illegal and/or that Phua is going to walk, or saying Caesars is stupid, most offered without any clue as to what the indictment contains. I don't want to call out people in particular, but check the 4 thread for the height of it. But seriously, when the feds have got machines full of messages like this one, which appears to be a report of the total IBCNET handle for the WC being sent to the "boss", Paul (paulpws), they've got legit evidence. Figures were testified to be believed in Hong Kong dollars, which is where they got the estimate of just under $400 million US:

    "Hi boss, this world cup until 5th July our 4 Main products Virtual win/loss as below, Handicap 1,102,638,597 Lose-610,868 -0.06% OU 1,001,581,144 5,458,620 0.55% HT- OU 150,033,961 459,419, 0.31% Grand Total including all other products 2,748,422,434 11,107,594, 0.40% This is only LIVE and is VIRTUAL."

    A lot of what I lumped together as text messages when I first described them also included stuff taken from VOIP logs and recordings on the computers, which the feds also got. That included the multiple exchanges between Darren Phua and the North Las Vegas bettor placing as much as $25K on Argentina on July 9th.

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by 4Dragons View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by WillieMcFML View Post
    i hope he rolls andrew robl (although he could be using phua's money)
    More likely that robl will use his own money and when Phua flees and robl loses his stack, Phua pays him back later. The airplane for collateral is the doozey.
    it seems like this will most likely kill the macau game

    regardless i just don't see andrew robl being a priority for this guy right now, or ever

    i mean unless robl's so burried in makeup (or otherwise in debt) to this guy i don't see how it could be +ev to put such a significant chunk of his networth up as bail

  19. #19
    Photoballer 4Dragons's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WillieMcFML View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by 4Dragons View Post

    More likely that robl will use his own money and when Phua flees and robl loses his stack, Phua pays him back later. The airplane for collateral is the doozey.
    it seems like this will most likely kill the macau game

    regardless i just don't see andrew robl being a priority for this guy right now, or ever

    i mean unless robl's so burried in makeup (or otherwise in debt) to this guy i don't see how it could be +ev to put such a significant chunk of his networth up as bail
    I'd go at least 70% that Phua has Robl by the balls and that's why he is even a part of this equation.

  20. #20
    High stakes poker needs more international gangsters.

    Good read

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