Great Poker story must read for all

[vegas1369]

Wow... I usually agree with you Druff on most issues, but I will never agree that spilling the beans on this guys poker play to his mom, when he obviously already accomplished his mission of getting his money back was a ethical move. To me it just reeks of pussy. I can understand if it was his only option left in getting the money back, but it wasn't.

I don't know, something about ratting someone out like that to their mom just rubs me the wrong way.

[Anal_Hershiser]

"Running to Mommy" implies bringing someone's parents into a situation where they otherwise have nothing to do with it.

How on earth does that statement not apply to this situation? His mom has ZERO to do with what transpired. If you accidentally send me money, and I refuse to return it, are you gonna go tell my mom? The fact that she is a joint account holder is irrelevant, especially if he went there to confront "Chris" as he said he did. He was targeting the mom from the minute he knocked on that door. Lol @ how the "poker world" treats debts.

More importantly, it probably meant that there was a loving mother somewhere who would be willing to listen to me

Pathetic.

[Dan Druff]

Wow... I usually agree with you Druff on most issues, but I will never agree that spilling the beans on this guys poker play to his mom, when he obviously already accomplished his mission of getting his money back was a ethical move. To me it just reeks of pussy. I can understand if it was his only option left in getting the money back, but it wasn't.

I don't know, something about ratting someone out like that to their mom just rubs me the wrong way.

He wasn't ratting. He was already there. The parents had just cooperated and assumed a debt that wasn't theirs.

Should he have thanked the parents by refusing to tell them details about their asshole, thieving son?

[Dan Druff]

How on earth does that statement not apply to this situation? His mom has ZERO to do with what transpired. If you accidentally send me money, and I refuse to return it, are you gonna go tell my mom? The fact that she is a joint account holder is irrelevant, especially if he went there to confront "Chris" as he said he did. He was targeting the mom from the minute he knocked on that door. Lol @ how the "poker world" treats debts.

The kid lived with his parents. They supported him.

His mom's name was even on his bank accounts.

So, yes, it was their business when little Chris stole over $10,000 from an innocent person.

This is different than contacting the otherwise uninvolved parents of a grown. independent adult.

[Anal_Hershiser]

Druff, you have threatened to carpet bomb flyers over shit less than this. I can only imagine what you would do if someone went to your parents house and demanded $, then also talked about your poker dealings. You would flip the fuck out.

[Anal_Hershiser]

How on earth does that statement not apply to this situation? His mom has ZERO to do with what transpired. If you accidentally send me money, and I refuse to return it, are you gonna go tell my mom? The fact that she is a joint account holder is irrelevant, especially if he went there to confront "Chris" as he said he did. He was targeting the mom from the minute he knocked on that door. Lol @ how the "poker world" treats debts.

The kid lived with his parents. They supported him.

His mom's name was even on his bank accounts.

So, yes, it was their business when little Chris stole over $10,000 from an innocent person.

This is different than contacting the otherwise uninvolved parents of a grown. independent adult.

So because his mom cosigned on the account(which probably happened years ago), she is liable for all his dealings? Gotcha.

[vegas1369]

Wow... I usually agree with you Druff on most issues, but I will never agree that spilling the beans on this guys poker play to his mom, when he obviously already accomplished his mission of getting his money back was a ethical move. To me it just reeks of pussy. I can understand if it was his only option left in getting the money back, but it wasn't.

I don't know, something about ratting someone out like that to their mom just rubs me the wrong way.

He wasn't ratting. He was already there. The parents had just cooperated and assumed a debt that wasn't theirs.

Should he have thanked the parents by refusing to tell them details about their asshole, thieving son?

IMO yes. The only reason the parents agreed to take care of this was to avoid legal action for their asshole, thieving son. Look, I'm not saying it was the worst thing he could do by cooperating, but IMO it's just one of those things that cross the line of ways I would try to get revenge on this guy for fucking with me. Getting parents involved is not part of the game. Man's got to have a code.

[Anal_Hershiser]

Man's got to have a code.

Apparently most poker players don't qualify as men. It really is a completely different culture. People get away with shit that would never fly in most other places. Great place for thieves imo.

[RichardBrodiesCombover.]

A little derail, but that house is beautiful. Always loved the way a brick house looks.


Also, I might have missed it, but how old was this Chris Lee?

[Dan Druff]

Man's got to have a code.

Apparently most poker players don't qualify as men. It really is a completely different culture. People get away with shit that would never fly in most other places. Great place for thieves imo.

How are you using this as an example of letting someone "get away with it"?

This story is the opposite of that:

- Victim got stolen from by Chris Lee

- Victim finds Chris Lee's address -- which turns out to also be Chris' parents' house -- and goes down to confront him

- Victim gets money back

- Victim gets some added revenge by exposing Chris' poker play to his disapproving Korean parents, who will probably force Chris to come home from Korea.

Sounds like Chris got what he deserved here -- not got away with it because he stole from a "pussy".

If someone fucks you over, there are many ways to hurt them far worse by never throwing a punch.

[Dan Druff]

I will agree that there ARE many pussies in poker who let themselves get walked all over and do nothing about it.

But this isn't one of those stories.

[Dan Druff]

A little derail, but that house is beautiful. Always loved the way a brick house looks.


Also, I might have missed it, but how old was this Chris Lee?

That wasn't disclosed, but it appears he is college-aged and lives with his parents (who were almost surely paying for both his schooling and his move to Korea).

[RichardBrodiesCombover.]

A little derail, but that house is beautiful. Always loved the way a brick house looks.


Also, I might have missed it, but how old was this Chris Lee?

That wasn't disclosed, but it appears he is college-aged and lives with his parents (who were almost surely paying for both his schooling and his move to Korea).

Thanks Druff

[Anal_Hershiser]

Apparently most poker players don't qualify as men. It really is a completely different culture. People get away with shit that would never fly in most other places. Great place for thieves imo.

How are you using this as an example of letting someone "get away with it"?

This story is the opposite of that:

- Victim got stolen from by Chris Lee Yes.

- Victim finds Chris Lee's address -- which turns out to also be Chris' parents' house -- and goes down to confront him No. He went there to confront the mother. Had he gone to confront Chris, he should have left when he wasn't there. Not tattle to mommy.

- Victim gets money back By tattling to the guys mommy.

- Victim gets some added revenge by exposing Chris' poker play to his disapproving Korean parents, who will probably force Chris to come home from Korea. Again, tattling like a bitch.

Sounds like Chris got what he deserved here -- not got away with it because he stole from a "pussy". The guy got off with far less than he deserved.
If someone fucks you over, there are many ways to hurt them far worse by never throwing a punch.Again, I never once said throw a punch. Others have assumed that's what I meant. All I said were there were alternatives to SrslyPussy's two options of telling his mom or taking it in the ass.

I understand what you are saying. We just don't agree and never will.

[Baron Von Strucker]

How are you using this as an example of letting someone "get away with it"?

This story is the opposite of that:

- Victim got stolen from by Chris Lee Yes.

- Victim finds Chris Lee's address -- which turns out to also be Chris' parents' house -- and goes down to confront him No. He went there to confront the mother. Had he gone to confront Chris, he should have left when he wasn't there. Not tattle to mommy.

- Victim gets money back By tattling to the guys mommy.

- Victim gets some added revenge by exposing Chris' poker play to his disapproving Korean parents, who will probably force Chris to come home from Korea. Again, tattling like a bitch.

Sounds like Chris got what he deserved here -- not got away with it because he stole from a "pussy". The guy got off with far less than he deserved.
If someone fucks you over, there are many ways to hurt them far worse by never throwing a punch.Again, I never once said throw a punch. Others have assumed that's what I meant. All I said were there were alternatives to SrslyPussy's two options of telling his mom or taking it in the ass.

I understand what you are saying. We just don't agree and never will.

I have to agree with AC here, some body fucks with you personally or financially is fair game for what ever.....
Moms house, slashing tires, beating etc etc. IMO this guy would qualify as the lowest form of human, buddy got off lucky, I would have taken a pic of a can of gass on the lawn of his parents house and sent him that!
Bunch of pussy's

[anonamoose]

I understand what you are saying. We just don't agree and never will.

I have to agree with AC here, some body fucks with you personally or financially is fair game for what ever.....
Moms house, slashing tires, beating etc etc. IMO this guy would qualify as the lowest form of human, buddy got off lucky, I would have taken a pic of a can of gass on the lawn of his parents house and sent him that!
Bunch of pussy's

Troll vs. Troll

Round 1: FIGHT

[BetCheckBet]

The kid lived with his parents. They supported him.

His mom's name was even on his bank accounts.

So, yes, it was their business when little Chris stole over $10,000 from an innocent person.

This is different than contacting the otherwise uninvolved parents of a grown. independent adult.

So because his mom cosigned on the account(which probably happened years ago), she is liable for all his dealings? Gotcha.

Yes joint account holders can be prosecuted as well. Surprised you don;t know this (spouses of criminals run into this problem alot). Given that it is a joint accoutn the second she chooses not to cooperate when the guy asks for his money she can be held liable.

[Anal_Hershiser]

So because his mom cosigned on the account(which probably happened years ago), she is liable for all his dealings? Gotcha.

Yes joint account holders can be prosecuted as well. Surprised you don;t know this (spouses of criminals run into this problem alot). Given that it is a joint accoutn the second she chooses not to cooperate when the guy asks for his money she can be held liable.

I understand LEGALLY she is responsible for anything and everything that has to do with that account. That isn't what i was referring too. It was a rhetorical question. Obviously a joint account holder is just as responsible for the account. It was said in jest to Druff when he said the guy's mom was fair game just because the kid still lived at home. The mom was involved in this dispute in name only. She has nothing to do with the dispute at all.

[mulva]

i've never seen anal take it in the ass like this before. he''s usually lol money. why he keeps trying to drive home some senseless case point is beyond me.

any kid 18/22 isn't much of an adult, imo

[ShadyJ]

I just read the whole story and the entire thread commenting on it.

I am actually very surprised that Anal Hershiser and vegas1369 are chiding the victim here for being a "rat" or "running to Mommy".

Neither are true in this situation.

Being a rat implies that you ran and told on someone about a matter that wasn't your business, simply because you didn't like the person. For example, if Chris Lee was rude to me at a poker table, and then I heard his parents weren't supposed to know he was playing poker, and I called them to tell him he was still playing, that would be a shitty move, and would make me a rat.

"Running to Mommy" implies bringing someone's parents into a situation where they otherwise have nothing to do with it. For example, if Anal Hershiser relentlessly trolled me here, and I tracked down his mother and gave her a link to PFA to see what he was doing, that would be running to Mommy.

But neither of these situations were true.

Chris Lee stole well over $10,000 from this guy. It doesn't matter that the victim accidentally sent the funds through his own incompetence. That would be like me leaving an accidentally envelope of $10,000 at your house, coming right back over to get it back, and then you refusing to answer the door or acknowledge that this happened. That is stealing. It might be harder to prove or prosecute than traditional stealing/scamming, but it is DEFINITELY stealing. You can't just dismiss this as a case of "finders-keepers". Chris Lee is definitely a scumbag thief (if this story is true, which it likely is), and deserves anything negative that comes from attempts to collect the money back.

I actually believe that the victim did come to confront Chris himself. Even if he didn't, he was still justified to do it. Not only was the mother a joint account-holder, but Chris still lived with his parents and was apparently still supported by them (as are many college students). Chris was not an independent adult, and the victim was not harassing otherwise uninvolved parents. As you could tell from the story, Chris promised his family not to play poker anymore (indicating they still had power over his life), and he lived with them. You know the whole thing of, "As long as you're living under my roof, you live under my rules" regarding parents and their over-18 children? Same thing goes here. So if the victim went to talk to the parties "responsible" for Chris -- even if he was a legal adult -- there's nothing wrong with that.

Now, once the victim got the commitment from the parents for the refund, should he have showed them all about Chris' poker play?

Of course.

The parents were the cooperative ones. They were the ones who did the right thing and assumed the 5-figure debt of their scumbag son. They didn't have to do this. They did it because they were good and honorable people.

Chris was the piece of shit. He was a thief. He intentionally blocked communication with the victim after receiving money that wasn't his, and lied to third parties about the situation. Chris clearly was sending the message, "Ha ha, your money landed in my lap. Guess what, asshole? I'm keeping it, and there's nothing you can do!"

So which party should the victim have been loyal to? The good people who committed to pay off the debt of their son, or the piece of shit thief who cheated him in the first place?

I am of the belief that there is no code of ethics when dealing with thieves and scammers. If someone intentionally steals from you, pretty much anything you can do to get them back is ethical (within reason, of course).

If you can get them fired from their job, great.

If you can ruin friendships of theirs, great.

If you can destroy their reputation. great.

I don't condone extreme physical violence or murder of scammers, but as far as disrupting their lives, they deserve it and then some.

To say, "The victim should have told the parents, 'I'm sorry, but his poker play is not my business and I can't discuss this with you'" is laughable. What code of honor/ethics is being displayed here? That even when someone steals from you and blatantly shuts you out from communication, you still keep his secrets?

You know what would qualify as "being a pussy"?

Refusing to answer his parents' questions about the poker play, because you don't want to get him in trouble.

By definition, being a pussy means being afraid to take action to hurt someone in return who has harmed you.

This guy not only wasn't afraid to take action, but he did all he could to fuck this guy over once he was at the guy's house.

Good for him.

This is the intelligent version of how I feel.