What is wrong with IDing voters?

[Dan Druff]

I always thought it was ludicrous that you could vote without showing ID.

You can barely do anything in this country without showing ID, yet for some reason you are allowed to vote without it.

This is despite the fact that voter fraud continues to exist, and in fact was the deciding factor in the Nixon/Kennedy election.

Democrats say that it's racist to require ID to vote, because a lot of minorities don't have ID, and it would deny them their right to vote.

What?!

It is not expensive at all to get an ID, nor is it particularly difficult. If certain people refuse to do this -- regardless of their race -- they should not be able to vote. Anyone who wants to vote can easily rectify the matter by getting an ID.

The reason for requiring ID to vote is obvious -- to prevent voter fraud. How can anyone honestly oppose this, aside from Democratic strategists who realize it will cost them votes?

[LLL]

It really is amazing that the only thing required is a signature. My signature looks much different now than it did the first time I voted. The old ladies give me a hard time about having such a terrible signature but that is it.

A friend of mine could vote twice if he wanted to. Somehow he is listed twice with a variation in his name. He tried to correct it and no one cared.

For such a major decision I'm really shocked that we haven't overhauled the process. Why just allow voting on a Tuesday? Why not all week or if not that a Saturday or a Sunday?

And why is there no standard for how we vote?

[jsearles22]

I could be completely retarded, but isnt it in fact a law that you must be able to present identification upon request by law enforcement?

[General Bonkers]

A friend of mine works at the welfare department and he told me when he walks into work the union people are handing out flyers where to get an i.d. and registration papers to vote lol. Fuckin stupid if you ask me

[Corrigan]

[Crowe Diddly]

This is despite the fact that voter fraud continues to exist, and in fact was the deciding factor in the Nixon/Kennedy election.

Quite misleading. The voter fraud done in Kennedy's favor had nothing to do with people voting without ids. All the voter fraud happened on the system side of the box, not the voter side.

There's really no evidence at all, that I've seen or read about, of voter fraud occuring on any scale that would be prevented by ID'ing voters. The ID issue sounds good, but its "fixing" a problem that doesn't exist, and would likely prevent millions from being able to vote.

Voter fraud happens once the ballot boxes are closed, or when the electronic voting machines are programmed or hacked. Show me some evidence of the type of voter fraud this IDing law would prevent, and then you'll have some sort of case. Otherwise, you'll end up prevent people from voting to fix a non-existant problem.

And as for "It is not expensive at all to get an ID, nor is it particularly difficult. If certain people refuse to do this -- regardless of their race -- they should not be able to vote," there's a reason poll taxes are illegal, and its to stop people from denying the poor the right to vote. As hard as it may be for you to believe, 50 bucks for an ID might be a huge amount of money to some people, which is the difference between feeding their family or getting the proper ID to vote. They're not gonna pick the ID, obv, so they've effectively been disqualified from voting for having to make that choice. And that's a poll tax.

[Crowe Diddly]

I could be completely retarded

I'm with you so far.

...but isnt it in fact a law that you must be able to present identification upon request by law enforcement?

Not in Massachusetts. In fact, our law says the cops must carry ID in case WE ask to see it.

[gut]

From my experience, people that do not have an ID also are not exactly rushing to the polls on election day. Unless, of course, you have someone promising them a free meal to come on down and vote for "this guy".

[gut]

I'm with you so far.

...but isnt it in fact a law that you must be able to present identification upon request by law enforcement?

Not in Massachusetts. In fact, our law says the cops must carry ID in case WE ask to see it.

Yeah I think it may be one of those "some states have a backwards old law that hasn't been changed" type deal. It's certainly not enforced anywhere. How many joggers carry ID on them? If it was a "law" that, say, carried a fine for non-compliance, cops would be all over that shit making money for the city busting joggers.

[Steve-O]

Crowe owns this thread.

Not only can it cost $50, but there is also the issue of getting the day off from work to sit at the RMV (if you can get the day off and then the cost of losing a day's pay), or even worse trying to track down your birth certificate-- in my case, I was born out of wedlock in the 1970's which means that I have to go to the town of my birth, in person, to get my birth certificate, all because I'm a bastard and bastards from the 1970's can't get their birth certificate without a photo ID!

If the person was born out of wedlock, only those individuals named on the record may obtain them and positive identification will be required, such as your driver's license. Also, these cannot be mailed to a post office box address.

That would really suck for someone trying to get a photo ID to vote who needed their birth certificate to get a photo ID!

Now imagine you were born in the segrated south and any record of your birth is all f'ed up or lost to history. What about people born in Italy who imigrated in the early 1900's and are now citizens, but are so lod they don't crive or never drove. What do these people do?

Basically it's about making people jump through hoops (some unable to jump and some unwilling) to suppress votes. I'm all for voter ID IF AND WHEN the government gives every resident a free National ID card, and not a piece of paper with a name and 9 numbers on it.

***EDIT*** I had no idea Crowe was a resident of the Commonwealth

[ftpjesus]

I could be completely retarded, but isnt it in fact a law that you must be able to present identification upon request by law enforcement?

In fact almost everything we do requires an ID even to cash a check and what not. The reality is the Dumbocrats cry racism and other shit when in fact they are the ones behind most voter fraud having dead people voting as well as those not eligible and worse people voting in 2 different locations (this is especially true with college students who apparently are allowed to vote either based on home address or school address in some states and there have been cases apparently where they did vote 2x). As the saying goes "Me thinks thou protesth too much" when it comes to those crying foul over requiring proper ID to vote. Its required for nearly everythingelse in this country and they seem to have no problem having an ID to go buy liquor, beer and smokes or get their narcotic RX filled (new Federal Regs now require photo ID for all Class II and most Class III Rxs to be picked up from a pharmacy, not to mention the requirements to even buy sudafed nationwide require photo ID). So what gives other then crying foul because then dead people cant vote and to stop people from voting multiple times as different people..

Hmm love how supporting this is voter intimidation, but the New Black Panthers standing outside polls in Philly with weapons wasnt. (DOUBLE STANDARD).

[ftpjesus]

This is despite the fact that voter fraud continues to exist, and in fact was the deciding factor in the Nixon/Kennedy election.

Quite misleading. The voter fraud done in Kennedy's favor had nothing to do with people voting without ids. All the voter fraud happened on the system side of the box, not the voter side.

There's really no evidence at all, that I've seen or read about, of voter fraud occuring on any scale that would be prevented by ID'ing voters. The ID issue sounds good, but its "fixing" a problem that doesn't exist, and would likely prevent millions from being able to vote.

Voter fraud happens once the ballot boxes are closed, or when the electronic voting machines are programmed or hacked. Show me some evidence of the type of voter fraud this IDing law would prevent, and then you'll have some sort of case. Otherwise, you'll end up prevent people from voting to fix a non-existant problem.

And as for "It is not expensive at all to get an ID, nor is it particularly difficult. If certain people refuse to do this -- regardless of their race -- they should not be able to vote," there's a reason poll taxes are illegal, and its to stop people from denying the poor the right to vote. As hard as it may be for you to believe, 50 bucks for an ID might be a huge amount of money to some people, which is the difference between feeding their family or getting the proper ID to vote. They're not gonna pick the ID, obv, so they've effectively been disqualified from voting for having to make that choice. And that's a poll tax.

Hmm how is it that 105% of eligible voters voted in the recall election of Scott Walker in Wisconsin.. Majorly headscratching to say the least. Amazing how people apparently rose from the dead to vote even.

[shortbuspoker]

This is despite the fact that voter fraud continues to exist, and in fact was the deciding factor in the Nixon/Kennedy election.

Quite misleading. The voter fraud done in Kennedy's favor had nothing to do with people voting without ids. All the voter fraud happened on the system side of the box, not the voter side.

There's really no evidence at all, that I've seen or read about, of voter fraud occuring on any scale that would be prevented by ID'ing voters. The ID issue sounds good, but its "fixing" a problem that doesn't exist, and would likely prevent millions from being able to vote.

Voter fraud happens once the ballot boxes are closed, or when the electronic voting machines are programmed or hacked. Show me some evidence of the type of voter fraud this IDing law would prevent, and then you'll have some sort of case. Otherwise, you'll end up prevent people from voting to fix a non-existant problem.

And as for "It is not expensive at all to get an ID, nor is it particularly difficult. If certain people refuse to do this -- regardless of their race -- they should not be able to vote," there's a reason poll taxes are illegal, and its to stop people from denying the poor the right to vote. As hard as it may be for you to believe, 50 bucks for an ID might be a huge amount of money to some people, which is the difference between feeding their family or getting the proper ID to vote. They're not gonna pick the ID, obv, so they've effectively been disqualified from voting for having to make that choice. And that's a poll tax.

To be fair, we all know that the federal government could offer to go door to door and issue id cards for free and the race baiters like Sharpton and Jackson would still protest and say that it is slanted against black people somehow. It makes perfectly good sense that something as important as a presidential election would require one to show a photo id just as the less consequential things in life such as tobacco, beer, and cashing checks require.

[Steve-O]

I could be completely retarded, but isnt it in fact a law that you must be able to present identification upon request by law enforcement?

In fact almost everything we do requires an ID even to cash a check and what not. The reality is the Dumbocrats cry racism and other shit when in fact they are the ones behind most voter fraud having dead people voting as well as those not eligible and worse people voting in 2 different locations (this is especially true with college students who apparently are allowed to vote either based on home address or school address in some states and there have been cases apparently where they did vote 2x). As the saying goes "Me thinks thou protesth too much" when it comes to those crying foul over requiring proper ID to vote. Its required for nearly everythingelse in this country and they seem to have no problem having an ID to go buy liquor, beer and smokes or get their narcotic RX filled (new Federal Regs now require photo ID for all Class II and most Class III Rxs to be picked up from a pharmacy, not to mention the requirements to even buy sudafed nationwide require photo ID). So what gives other then crying foul because then dead people cant vote and to stop people from voting multiple times as different people..

Hmm love how supporting this is voter intimidation, but the New Black Panthers standing outside polls in Philly with weapons wasnt. (DOUBLE STANDARD).

Then please explain why so many people don't have ID's?

Not everyone flies, not everyone cashes checks (direct deposit or if you have a bank account you only need your ID if you are cahsing a check not depositing) I can't recall the last time I busted out my ID other than a CORI check at my kid's school and to fly. I think it would be pretty simple to get by without an ID in a major metropolitan city.

Hmm how is it that 105% of eligible voters voted in the recall election of Scott Walker in Wisconsin.. Majorly headscratching to say the least. Amazing how people apparently rose from the dead to vote even.

[Crowe Diddly]

Hmm how is it that 105% of eligible voters voted in the recall election of Scott Walker in Wisconsin.. Majorly headscratching to say the least. Amazing how people apparently rose from the dead to vote even.

That sounds horrendous. And yet, I can't find it in a search. Link me to an article on anything even remotely close to what you said.

Also, how are dead people eligible voters?

[Steve-O]

Hmm how is it that 105% of eligible voters voted in the recall election of Scott Walker in Wisconsin.. Majorly headscratching to say the least. Amazing how people apparently rose from the dead to vote even.

That sounds horrendous. And yet, I can't find it in a search. Link me to an article on anything even remotely close to what you said.

Especially when no county listed voter turnout above 74% and most were in the 50's

[Crowe Diddly]

It makes perfectly good sense that something as important as a presidential election would require one to show a photo id just as the less consequential things in life such as tobacco, beer, and cashing checks require.

One of the things you mentioned is a right that is to be protected above all else, as outlined in a bunch of Constitutional Amendments. The others are acts of commerce (though alcohol still found its way into an amendment or 2 as well). Not exactly the same category.

[shortbuspoker]

It makes perfectly good sense that something as important as a presidential election would require one to show a photo id just as the less consequential things in life such as tobacco, beer, and cashing checks require.

One of the things you mentioned is a right that is to be protected above all else, as outlined in a bunch of Constitutional Amendments. The others are acts of commerce (though alcohol still found its way into an amendment or 2 as well). Not exactly the same category.

It wasn't a comparison of the merits of requiring an id for the activities as much as a comparison of the level of importance linked to those activities. Either way it will never be perfect. It's like the architect explaining to Neo that the original Matrix was perfect in every way and the human brain refused to accept it.

[Crowe Diddly]

One of the things you mentioned is a right that is to be protected above all else, as outlined in a bunch of Constitutional Amendments. The others are acts of commerce (though alcohol still found its way into an amendment or 2 as well). Not exactly the same category.

It wasn't a comparison of the merits of requiring an id for the activities as much as a comparison of the level of importance linked to those activities. Either way it will never be perfect. It's like the architect explaining to Neo that the original Matrix was perfect in every way and the human brain refused to accept it.

You know what ID law bothers the FUCK out of me? The one that says I can only buy X amount of sudafed each month so I don't bring the world down with my meth kitchen. I'm on a steady diet of 2 12-hour (120 mg) jobs a day, and when I lived with kunt, I ended up often buying for both of us, cuz he had the same issue. Well, a supply for two people is too much, according to the government. There's nothing worse than being told by the nice pharmacy lady "Oh, I'm sorry, you can't purchase this until Thursday." I can buy beer by the keg and butts by the carton, but can't buy my FUCKING Sudafed because I might make it into a drug of abuse. Fucking bunch of cunts.

[shortbuspoker]

It wasn't a comparison of the merits of requiring an id for the activities as much as a comparison of the level of importance linked to those activities. Either way it will never be perfect. It's like the architect explaining to Neo that the original Matrix was perfect in every way and the human brain refused to accept it.

You know what ID law bothers the FUCK out of me? The one that says I can only buy X amount of sudafed each month so I don't bring the world down with my meth kitchen. I'm on a steady diet of 2 12-hour (120 mg) jobs a day, and when I lived with kunt, I ended up often buying for both of us, cuz he had the same issue. Well, a supply for two people is too much, according to the government. There's nothing worse than being told by the nice pharmacy lady "Oh, I'm sorry, you can't purchase this until Thursday." I can buy beer by the keg and butts by the carton, but can't buy my FUCKING Sudafed because I might make it into a drug of abuse. Fucking bunch of cunts.

same way down here with the Primatene and the Bronkaid for ECA stacks