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Thread: Time To Go On A Cruise?

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    Diamond TheXFactor's Avatar
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    Time To Go On A Cruise?

    Cruise ship with 700 passengers and crew diverts to the Bahamas to avoid warrant over $1.2M in unpaid fuel bills: Crystal Symphony skirts docking in Miami where US law enforcement could impound ship at the end of 14-day Caribbean trip

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...t-warrant.html

    Parent company Genting Hong Kong faces liquidation and has suspended all cruises
    The Genting Group is bankrupt.

    Will this affect it's casinos?

    Like the new $4.3 Billion Resorts World in Las Vegas that opened last year?



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    Gold Forum Wars's Avatar
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    Genting Group is NOT bankrupt. Genting Hong Kong is.

    On January 19, 2022 Genting Hong Kong, parent company of Crystal Cruises and some other cruises, as well as Genting Resorts Manila, filled for liquidation.

    As far as I can tell, that old subsidiary Genting Hong Kong was fully sold to Golden Hope Limited in 2016.

    Genting Group: no one talking about bankruptcy. Yet.

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    Hurricane Expert tgull's Avatar
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    Had a friend and his wife go on a cruise a couple weeks ago. Of the 4 ports, 3 would not let them disembark. He said the cruise was kind enough to refund their unused excursions and gave everyone a $100 ship credit. Keep in mind, his final bill including the room was over $5K. Half the staff was quarantined, they also canceled half the entertainment and room service was canceled. Funny thing was though the bars were always fully staffed pouring $10 drinks. They made a killing. You have to be insane to go on a cruise any time in the near future.

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    Owner Dan Druff's Avatar
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    Here's an article from CNN about how much cruising sucks right now: https://www.cnn.com/travel/article/c...ron/index.html

    Basically Omicron is so contagious that it's very hard to avoid getting it, and once you do, you'll be confined to your tiny stateroom like a prisoner. Lord help you if you were dumb enough to book an inside cabin.

    Plus, as bottomset mentioned, tons of port stops are getting cancelled anyway.

    No thanks.

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    Plutonium Sanlmar's Avatar
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    I think we decided we weren’t doing cruises before Covid anyway. Tip stealing hustlers.


    The tips being included in your final bill as well as more empty envelopes was just symptomatic of the new age of endless hustle for incremental revenue no doubt brought about by internet travel price competition.

    Just bill me appropriately and leave me the hell alone as I walk around the ship.

    I have done many cruises and enjoyed many of them but the decline is a hard pass now. The whole experience has finally been reduced to the least common denominator. It’s a carnival on the water for the unwashed masses now.

    In the age of VRBO etc I’m sure you could hook up some yacht charter for an interesting number.

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    Owner Dan Druff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sanlmar View Post
    I think we decided we weren’t doing cruises before Covid anyway. Tip stealing hustlers.


    The tips being included in your final bill as well as more empty envelopes was just symptomatic of the new age of endless hustle for incremental revenue no doubt brought about by internet travel price competition.

    Just bill me appropriately and leave me the hell alone as I walk around the ship.

    I have done many cruises and enjoyed many of them but the decline is a hard pass now. The whole experience has finally been reduced to the least common denominator. It’s a carnival on the water for the unwashed masses now.

    In the age of VRBO etc I’m sure you could hook up some yacht charter for an interesting number.
    I think you have something confused. The envelopes vanished a long time ago. It became a situation where, except at the bars where you could leave an additional tip, your daily mandatory "gratuities" were said to cover everything.

    Except, as I mentioned in a different thread, it was a lie. The gratuities were not actually tips. The cruise line pocketed most of it. I deduced this by several factors, and I'm pretty certain of this. And it's industry-wise, not just on one line.

    The rest of what you said is mostly correct. It pretty much is a "carnival on the water for the unwashed masses", which is why I don't make cruising into a social experience. I get a balcony room, eat in the specialty restaurants, do my own private shore excursions (or drive myself if that's a viable option), and spend almost the entire time with just the family.

    It's nice for that, because you go to several destinations within a week, don't have to pack/unpack, eat fairly nice meals every night, and often get to places which are otherwise a pain in the ass (or impossible) to visit. And it's pretty cheap if you do it right.

    Unfortunately, that's all out the window now with the COVID situation. No fucking way am I signing up to be held like a prisoner if I come down with Omicron.

  7. #7
    Plutonium Sanlmar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Sanlmar View Post
    I think we decided we weren’t doing cruises before Covid anyway. Tip stealing hustlers.


    The tips being included in your final bill as well as more empty envelopes was just symptomatic of the new age of endless hustle for incremental revenue no doubt brought about by internet travel price competition.

    Just bill me appropriately and leave me the hell alone as I walk around the ship.

    I have done many cruises and enjoyed many of them but the decline is a hard pass now. The whole experience has finally been reduced to the least common denominator. It’s a carnival on the water for the unwashed masses now.

    In the age of VRBO etc I’m sure you could hook up some yacht charter for an interesting number.
    I think you have something confused. The envelopes vanished a long time ago. It became a situation where, except at the bars where you could leave an additional tip, your daily mandatory "gratuities" were said to cover everything.
    I don’t know why you think I am mistaken. I am probably the last guy you have contact with to depart a cruise ship before the Cov-19 lockdown.

    I made this post about yachts I saw being delivered via a cargo ship in St Thomas on Dec 17th 2019.

    I can’t remember the ship name or line. Prolly Royal Carribean and it was a new mega ship with the surfing and rock walls and diving pool and outside theater at the stern etc

    They definitely included gratuity envelopes with the final bill the final morning of the cruise. I was exasperated and posted about it too.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sanlmar View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    . So what's happening here? The mandatory "tips" are actually now acting more as a resort fee, where it makes the cruise look cheaper (since you pay the tips at the end, not when you book)
    I just did a cruise. On the last day you receive a statement indicating they have automatically charged an arbitrary service gratuity. I don’t even remember how much. Not small.

    This is the best part.... simultaneously they give you a couple envelopes for tipping the cabin person, wait staff extra. Huh?

    In one hand I’m holding the auto-tipping bill and in the the other I’m holding envelopes. They can fuck off. I’m done cruising. The incessant hustle is off-putting.

    Druff, has anyone gone to Guest Services and had the charge successfully removed?



    Quote Originally Posted by Sanlmar View Post

    Saw this cargo ship loaded with yachts in St Thomas. Ship had its own cranes ready to pick and place your yacht in the water.

    Damnedest sight that begged a lot of questions.

    Few more Druff unders and we can pick one out and call it our own.

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    Plutonium simpdog's Avatar
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    Some of these items may overlap with others...but cruises were great for:

    -visiting a few destinations within a week instead of picking just one
    -Kids club. Anywhere from toddlers-> teenagers, all kids love the kids club. And then as parents you were free to go lose their education fund at the casino or bang or go eat food in peace.
    -meeting new people. While Druff hid out in his room, seniors or socialites were hanging out at the pools, bars, basketball court, etc.
    -price was right. As mentioned you could find deals on cruises
    -service was typically very good especially considering the cost. My memory often fails me, but I don't recall Druff posting 10s of threads about the cruises he was on. I feel like it was a good combo of cheap workers (ie. Non-English speaking less than minimum wage earners) + toss in some 19-26 year olds who haven't figured out what to do yet and it resulted in good service for the cost.

    edits
    -entertainment. While their comedy or magic shows wasn't the best, they were still mildly entertaining.
    -casino. Who doesn't like sending their wife/kids to the pool while you play 1/2 NL holdem with a max $15/hand rake against drunks or people who don't even know how to play?
    -buffets --> While I don't normally like buffets, it did give a good mixture of food items so everyone in the family got what they wanted. Kids could fill up on desserts before heading to the kids club (imagine how many kids puked there running around after hitting the sundae bar)
    -specialty restaurants -> Really enjoyed eating at the "Fancier" restaurants on the ship. Normally only rich plumbers (bottomset) can eat at higher end restaurants daily but on a cruise ship us low lifes can at least fake it on the cheap.
    Last edited by simpdog; 01-24-2022 at 08:40 AM.

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    Plutonium Sanlmar's Avatar
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    I’m told I was on Royal Caribbean Oasis of the Seas

    wonder what they did with the buffet area at the top of the ship. Convert to paddle ball?

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    Hurricane Expert tgull's Avatar
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    I've been on a lot of cruises, touched every major cruise line. They are great, as Druff said, because you are on it for 7 or 8 days and only have to unpack and pack once, never have to rent a car, all your entertainment and food is paid for (unless you go to the on ship steakhouse, which is like $30 upcharge). Drinks if you get the daily package are like $40 a day for what I remember is like 12-15 drinks per day, all the good brands, no well brands. Excursions are a scam, stay away do your own thing in port.

    Tipping is optional, Druff is correct the cruise line hoards the daily housekeeping fee what usually is $11 pp. I always find out the steward taking care of my room first day and give him $20, it goes a long way as my room is always cleaned first and always have my ice bucket filled up twice a day. I always tip the bartenders $1 a drink even though tip in included, here again on a crowded bar I always get my drink before everyone else.

    Casinos terrible odds. But I did win like $8000 one time, it was interesting getting through customs that trip.

    Going on a cruise any time soon is insane. Most have to cancel room service because they have to feed the people isolated in their room. According to my friend, if you are isolated you get 3 meals a day, and a very limited menu. He was not sure the menu since he was not isolated, but on the trays outside the room he saw a lot of chicken nuggets, burger meat and pasta sauce. I could not think of anything worse than being locked in a room for a week eating generic food with one bathroom with multiple people.

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    Gold Cerveza Fria's Avatar
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    I used to take many cruises. Living within a 15 minute drive from Port of Miami and Port Everglades made it real easy to do. Often, we would decide the night before and show up at the Port for a weekend cruise at a huge discounted rate. But, with COVID, I won't even think about it. Not because of being afraid of getting COVID, but because the ports won't let you ge3t off the ship and what's the fun in that?
    En boca cerrada, no entran moscas

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    Owner Dan Druff's Avatar
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    Sanlmar, I believe you, but your experience was very non-standard. Which line was this?

    The whole point of the (fake) auto-tip was to make people not have to feel obligated to tip the staff. The cruise line wanted that money, and they got it. The reason people don't bitch about the auto-tip is because it's sold as a tip "to cover gratuities for all ship employees, not just the customer-facing ones", so people feel good that the dishwashers in the back are being taken care of.

    Except they're not. The cruise lines are mostly pocketing it.

    Anyway, I'd be interested to hear which line pulled this shit with giving you tip envelopes anyway.

    You used to be able to opt out of the auto-tip on NCL by just going to the front desk and asking them to do so. However, they changed it to where you had to mail a lol paper form to their Miami office once you get back. Big time negative check off scam, amirite?

    Believe it or not, I never opted out, despite knowing it was being pocketed by the cruise line. That's because I wasn't exactly the type of customer they wanted in the first place. I was cruising for almost nothing, and hogging up two rooms, thanks to a combination of my Seven Stars perk and some Jew price-hunting tactics I learned by analyzing their reservations system. I didn't do any of the upcharge stuff they offer on board, except those higher end meals, which I bought in a package. I felt I got everything so cheap that I didn't want to be an asshole and opt out of those "tips", so I left them. However, if I were paying normally, I would 100% have opted out.

     
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      Sanlmar: Royal Caribbean

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    Owner Dan Druff's Avatar
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    I really did become an NCL expert though. Too bad I probably won't be able to use it again for a very long time.

    You think I know Caeasrs shit well? I know even more about NCL.

    There was a fail onboard with one of the dining packages I bought, where I kept getting charged for the meal instead of it being zero due to the package. The barely-English-speaking front desk employees were useless. The restaurant staff members understood the problem, but failed to solve it. The restaurant managers couldn't even solve it.

    Finally, they brought over the Food & Beverage Manager to talk to me -- one of the few officers on the ship. I told her what was happening, and then explained why I felt the system was failing to process it correctly. I told her the code they should probably enter into their system to solve it, as well as the manner they needed to reprogram the system to prevent this issue going forward.

    She tried it, and it worked. She was shocked, and said, "I've never seen a passenger know so much about this stuff. Did you ever work here?" I told her that I never did, to which she replied, "Well, you probably should!"

    It's actually pretty amazing how much Caesars and NCL have in common, at least operationally. Very fitting partnership.

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    Diamond TheXFactor's Avatar
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    If I was considering going on a cruise.

    Richard Branson's Virgin Voyages cruise line looks awesome.

    No fucking kids is a HUGE PLUS.

    Last edited by TheXFactor; 01-24-2022 at 11:47 AM.

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    Platinum ftpjesus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Forum Wars View Post
    Genting Group is NOT bankrupt. Genting Hong Kong is.

    On January 19, 2022 Genting Hong Kong, parent company of Crystal Cruises and some other cruises, as well as Genting Resorts Manila, filled for liquidation.

    As far as I can tell, that old subsidiary Genting Hong Kong was fully sold to Golden Hope Limited in 2016.

    Genting Group: no one talking about bankruptcy. Yet.
    As far as being sold thats incorrect. I came across the story and did some digging.. Genting HK is still a subsidiary of Genting Parent Company.. The CEO of GHK is the same as the CEO of Genting itself who btw resigned from his position as CEO of GHK end of last week.. Im not so sure this is a nothing burger as some think it is.

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    Welcher jsearles22's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    Sanlmar, I believe you, but your experience was very non-standard. Which line was this?
    The last cruise I took in probably 2015 was exactly as Sanlmar described. Carnival cruise lines on their brand new mega ship. Daily fee of like $15-20/person on the bill. And then envelopes for tips left the last evening. I had previously went to the pursers desk and had the automatic gratuity removed. They did it no questions asked. Then I hand the cabin guy a crisp Benjamin and call It a day.

    I’ve been on 4 cruises and 3 of them I paid for in full playing poker. Cruise ship patrons are so bad the rake doesn’t even matter.
    It's hilarious that we as a society think everyone can be a dr, a lawyer, an engineer. Some people are just fucking stupid. Why can't we just accept that?

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    Owner Dan Druff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jsearles22 View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    Sanlmar, I believe you, but your experience was very non-standard. Which line was this?
    The last cruise I took in probably 2015 was exactly as Sanlmar described. Carnival cruise lines on their brand new mega ship. Daily fee of like $15-20/person on the bill. And then envelopes for tips left the last evening. I had previously went to the pursers desk and had the automatic gratuity removed. They did it no questions asked. Then I hand the cabin guy a crisp Benjamin and call It a day.

    I’ve been on 4 cruises and 3 of them I paid for in full playing poker. Cruise ship patrons are so bad the rake doesn’t even matter.
    Interesting. Somehow I didn't hear about this. My last cruise was in 2017, on NCL. There were no envelopes -- only that forced tip. From what I had heard, the other lines were all doing it the exact same way. I was on a Princess Cruise in 2011, which also had that idiotic auto-tip, and again no envelopes. Carnival and Princess are the same company, and have been since 2002. I wonder when they added the envelopes, or if maybe they just did it on the Carnival branded ships?

    Royal Caribbean is a separate company from both Carnival and NCL, and apparently they did it to Sanlmar in 2019.

    How do they justify the envelopes AND the daily service charge? Are they claiming the service charge is like a resort fee or something?

    My parents were on the Princess cruise with me in 2011 when they had that auto-tip shit, and my dad opted out. He was more experienced with cruising at the time than I was, so I followed his lead and did so, too. We tipped people individually who served us, such as the room steward, waiters, etc.

    Well, when I went on my first NCL cruise in 2013 and read their justification for the tip, I felt bad for opting out. NCL's literature made it sound like they designed the auto-tip so everyone gets taken care of, and how it's otherwise not fair to the poor guys in the back who never interact with customers. I pictured some third-world guy in a steamy room washing dishes all day, and not gettng any tips. I thought NCL was doing the right thing, and told my dad what I had read.

    "I don't care, I'm still opting out", he said. "That's not how tipping works. You tip the people who serve you, not every employee who works for the company."

    He had a good point, but I still felt kinda bad. That encouraged me to delve further into it, and I discovered that cruise lines weren't being honest about the auto-tip. These weren't tips. Basically the maritime minimum wage (much less than US minimum wage) allows for tips to be a subtitute for wages, as long as the employees get the minimum wage or better at the end of the day. So this allowed them, in some cases, to reduce base pay to zero point zero, and then use the "tip" money to fully pay their salaries and some limited healthcare benefits. So all these tips were doing was paying for the wages & benefits for the cruise emlpoyees, in place of the minimum wage. This, of course, was carefully hidden from the customer with very dodgy language.

    Some European countries, such as the UK, have disallowed auto-tips and cruise lines can't charge them. However, UK pricing is differnet, so they probably make it up that way.

    The bottom line is that the whole cruise industry isn't too different from the casino industry. There's a lot of ways to game it for great value, but it's designed to fleece the ploppies without them even realizing it's happening.

    Regarding the poker rake, I just won't do it. Max rake was 10% up to $25 on the ships I played. I agree the players were horrendous (far worse than 1/2 players at land-based casinos), but the rake was just too damn high.

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    Platinum garrett's Avatar
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    Just went on my first Cruise last month with my parents, it was amazing, def great for getting a quick experience in one Country or place and then being on your way, I loved it. We went to the Costa Rica. Panama Canal, Costa Maya (Mexico) and for me first ever, and was amazing i have a few pictures from it I will post below. Now I was not on a trip where we are drinking or partying, i was with my parents and we had a nice mellow Cruise. I did see how Wacohol and Gambling is how one could easily dig a hole on a Cruise but if you can or do monitor those well, or buy a pre cruise all you can drink package which most who drank did from what I saw maybe it was not that bad.

    Also we were Covid Tested before the Cruise for an extra $100 I got Tested right there at the port, while walking on the boat, 20 mins later results come back, you pass you're good, and you have a great Cruise, its nothing so easy actually. And I mean come one, is that really that hard to then go ahead and have an amazing vacation and trip, I dont get that logic maybe. And if done right Cruising is amazing I realize now, and you can and do actually get to real fast, go to a few different places, and if you really like or love one, then just go there sometime in the future. I loved Cruising being my first time going on one, and now already am looking at Solo Cruises for my next one lol, Norwegian apparently has Studio Cabins and so you can go cruising Solo so then not priced for two, I though great look at this, works perfect for me lol, anyway

    so much fun and now I do plan on going again for sure now.

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    Platinum garrett's Avatar
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    Platinum garrett's Avatar
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    Cruising was amazing. And honestly do not get how people like, some of you maybe here, Sit home scared. I'm gone and actually am already looking for the next one.. Prices are down right now too so lots of extra if done right, a great time to Cruise on a budget. But yeah you just stay home scared and I'll go have that fun for you if I can now

    Anyway it is a great time to go on a Cruise actually I'm learning, more affordable since COVID. Prices are cheap at the moment apparently too..
    Last edited by garrett; 01-25-2022 at 03:40 AM.

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