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Thread: Andy Stacks calls out fellow Live at the Bike player Jenny "Savage" Leong for owing him money, then deletes video

  1. #41
    So funny, when the commentator knows that I am about to say something, he blocked me immediately in live chat. Why are they so scared? I haven't even started saying anything. I just say I know more that they want to hear. Then I was blocked.
    Quote Originally Posted by JeffDime View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by vicky1234 View Post
    I m sure Garrett has no proof that he is being cheated or scammed. He just use social media as a threat to get his money back. Almost all players who have played on stream has been recruited by Andy Stacks to the home game. I have been recruited by him before too. Running illegal home game is a criminal offense, I m sure that if they decide to press charges it just means there is enough evidence to move forward. Someone has to take the blame right? People are going to sell each other out to protect themselves. Again it's only my personal opinion.
    Might as well throw the kitchen sink at this point.

     
    Comments
      
      JeffDime: They are many other ways to be heard.

  2. #42
    Then I think Garrett should also pay back the 150k that he believes that he got cheated, because he didn't bring it up during the game but after. Why didn't he bring it up during the game but after? I think he is also using cheating as excuse to get his money or not pay then. I have never heard of a home game that will give you back the money.

    Quote Originally Posted by PositiveVariance View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by vicky1234 View Post
    Why no one call Garrett scammer ?

    2. She has lost over 50k of her own money in 2 days. Andy did not mention that. If a player has lost thst much money in a home game, taking 30 days to repay a debt is not something unacceptable. I have another friend who runs home game says usually they give players 3 months to repay a debt especially they have been losing money.
    As other have said, it’s really hard to give a good answer until Jenny gives her side of the story...

    Based on what you are saying it appears that she believes she was cheated at the home game. When you agree to play in a home game, especially one where you are not very familiar with the people hosting it, your odds of getting cheated vs. playing in a regulated casino/card room, the chances of being cheated in that home game go up 100 fold or more. It’s a massive increase. The person hosting the game 100% controls the environment. There are so many devices out there that can effectively cheat players and can be every difficult to spot. Playing in a home game is a risk you take. For the average player it’s hard enough to beat the rake, add cheating to that and your doomed.

    Here is the thing with a home game, you may know in your mind you were cheated but have no way to prove it. If you notice cheating you have to call it out right then an there. At whatever point she suspected cheating, why didn’t she stop then? Why wait until you have lost everything? Unfortunately saying “ I was cheated, I’m not paying” is not good enough for the public to buy it. They want PROOF. Which I get it, most cases it’s virtually impossible to supply proof. Like Mike Postle, we all know he cheated but don’t have a smoking gun outside of being statistically improbable to the sum of 1 in 10 million lifetimes.

    It was mentioned before that she told Andy, she had someone send a wire transfer from China. If she actually told him this, then at a later date said, “I’m not paying, I was cheated”, It doesn’t look good.

    As far as the quote above (item #2), normally when you loan someone money at the casino, it should be because they didn’t bring a large enough bank roll, so they need to be spotted just for that session. Normally if someone is just “friendly” with someone they are not going to loan them money if they “Need time to pay”. They may do this for a close friend but not someone they are occasionally friendly with. As far as giving someone 90 days to pay is excessive to me. The timeframe of them paying you back shouldn’t have anything to do with whether they won or lost.

    The bottom line is if she simply comes out and says I’m not paying the 16k because I was cheated, she is going to have a really hard time convincing people that cheating took place without evidence. Unfortunately this is a risk you take at a home game. Then from there it’s up to Andy how he wants to proceed. My advice is stay away from home games unless you know exactly who you are playing with. It looks like in this situation if she cares what people think about her, it’s going to cost her 16k.






    Remember the more money there is to be made the more advanced these cheating schemes become. There are cheating schemes that begin long before a player even gets to the home game. They are out at card rooms/ casinos looking for a “mark”. They become friendly with them. They may dedicate months to a single person to where they feel comfortable going to a home game where they may get the mark for 6 figures overtime before they realized they were duped.


    I posted these awhile back, but they show the lengths people will go to cheat at home games...







    [/QUOTE]

  3. #43
    I know. what i m saying is that they are so scared about it being heard which sounds so sketchy to me

    Quote Originally Posted by vicky1234 View Post
    So funny, when the commentator knows that I am about to say something, he blocked me immediately in live chat. Why are they so scared? I haven't even started saying anything. I just say I know more that they want to hear. Then I was blocked.
    Quote Originally Posted by JeffDime View Post

    Might as well throw the kitchen sink at this point.

  4. #44
    "she had someone send a wire transfer from China." this is a provable lie
    “ I was cheated, I’m not paying” this is also a provable lie . Everyone who plays on stream knows that the loan is not just16k , it was more than that but Andy just said its 16k to make people think that she just doesn't want to pay a penny.
    "completely platonic" in Andy's video is another provable lie.
    What I mean provable lie is that there is evidence to back it up of what Andy said is not true .
    I think its fair to call Andy a liar if she has to be called a scammer for a debt that she hasn't finished paying back, right?
    I have said all i know that is 100% false which can also be proven. The rest of it I cannot comment because I do not know enough to tell if its true or false.




    Quote Originally Posted by vicky1234 View Post
    Then I think Garrett should also pay back the 150k that he believes that he got cheated, because he didn't bring it up during the game but after. Why didn't he bring it up during the game but after? I think he is also using cheating as excuse to get his money or not pay then. I have never heard of a home game that will give you back the money.

    As other have said, it’s really hard to give a good answer until Jenny gives her side of the story...

    Based on what you are saying it appears that she believes she was cheated at the home game. When you agree to play in a home game, especially one where you are not very familiar with the people hosting it, your odds of getting cheated vs. playing in a regulated casino/card room, the chances of being cheated in that home game go up 100 fold or more. It’s a massive increase. The person hosting the game 100% controls the environment. There are so many devices out there that can effectively cheat players and can be every difficult to spot. Playing in a home game is a risk you take. For the average player it’s hard enough to beat the rake, add cheating to that and your doomed.

    Here is the thing with a home game, you may know in your mind you were cheated but have no way to prove it. If you notice cheating you have to call it out right then an there. At whatever point she suspected cheating, why didn’t she stop then? Why wait until you have lost everything? Unfortunately saying “ I was cheated, I’m not paying” is not good enough for the public to buy it. They want PROOF. Which I get it, most cases it’s virtually impossible to supply proof. Like Mike Postle, we all know he cheated but don’t have a smoking gun outside of being statistically improbable to the sum of 1 in 10 million lifetimes.

    It was mentioned before that she told Andy, she had someone send a wire transfer from China. If she actually told him this, then at a later date said, “I’m not paying, I was cheated”, It doesn’t look good.

    As far as the quote above (item #2), normally when you loan someone money at the casino, it should be because they didn’t bring a large enough bank roll, so they need to be spotted just for that session. Normally if someone is just “friendly” with someone they are not going to loan them money if they “Need time to pay”. They may do this for a close friend but not someone they are occasionally friendly with. As far as giving someone 90 days to pay is excessive to me. The timeframe of them paying you back shouldn’t have anything to do with whether they won or lost.

    The bottom line is if she simply comes out and says I’m not paying the 16k because I was cheated, she is going to have a really hard time convincing people that cheating took place without evidence. Unfortunately this is a risk you take at a home game. Then from there it’s up to Andy how he wants to proceed. My advice is stay away from home games unless you know exactly who you are playing with. It looks like in this situation if she cares what people think about her, it’s going to cost her 16k.






    Remember the more money there is to be made the more advanced these cheating schemes become. There are cheating schemes that begin long before a player even gets to the home game. They are out at card rooms/ casinos looking for a “mark”. They become friendly with them. They may dedicate months to a single person to where they feel comfortable going to a home game where they may get the mark for 6 figures overtime before they realized they were duped.


    I posted these awhile back, but they show the lengths people will go to cheat at home games...







    [/QUOTE]
    Last edited by vicky1234; 09-23-2021 at 05:36 PM.

  5. #45
    Gold JeffDime's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by vicky1234 View Post
    Then I think Garrett should also pay back the 150k that he believes that he got cheated, because he didn't bring it up during the game but after. Why didn't he bring it up during the game but after? I think he is also using cheating as excuse to get his money or not pay then. I have never heard of a home game that will give you back the money.
    Vicky I am really not trying to give you a hard time. I have been cheated for sure but that doesn’t mean it’s analogous to any scenario of possible cheating. Garrett was talking about some random game in the distance past with some scary type people. He was able to deduce that he was cheated immediately and it was remedied. You are conflating this issue and doing it a disservice by making any kind of connection between the story Garrett told on a podcast to this current situation. It is of absolutely no relevance. Please let’s move on from this point.

     
    Comments
      
      PositiveVariance: Agreed. Two completely separate situations. Sometimes life isn’t fair.

  6. #46
    Quote Originally Posted by vicky1234 View Post
    "completely platonic" in Andy's video is another provable lie.
    What I mean provable lie is that there is evidence to back it up.


    So it wasn’t platonic?

    Is it safe to say she looked at this as a gift?

    Sugar baby/Sugar daddy type of relationship?

  7. #47
    OK then what about if at the end it was proven that Andy has lie about the above things that I mentioned in his video, is the scenario going to change?

    Quote Originally Posted by JeffDime View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by vicky1234 View Post
    Then I think Garrett should also pay back the 150k that he believes that he got cheated, because he didn't bring it up during the game but after. Why didn't he bring it up during the game but after? I think he is also using cheating as excuse to get his money or not pay then. I have never heard of a home game that will give you back the money.
    Vicky I am really not trying to give you a hard time. I have been cheated for sure but that doesn’t mean it’s analogous to any scenario of possible cheating. Garrett was talking about some random game in the distance past with some scary type people. He was able to deduce that he was cheated immediately and it was remedied. You are conflating this issue and doing it a disservice by making any kind of connection between the story Garrett told on a podcast to this current situation. It is of absolutely no relevance. Please let’s move on from this point.

  8. #48
    No. I am not sure how people define the word platonic, but according to dictionary , a friendship that involves the desire to pursue romance or sexual intimacy, whether you share those feelings or not, isn’t platonic. Of course she doesn't look at it as a gift because the loan is not just 16k , and now the remaining is only 16k. If its a Sugar baby/Sugar daddy type of relationship, Andy is definitely the sugar Baby and she is the sugar mommy.

    Quote Originally Posted by PositiveVariance View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by vicky1234 View Post
    "completely platonic" in Andy's video is another provable lie.
    What I mean provable lie is that there is evidence to back it up.



    So it wasn’t platonic?

    Is it safe to say she looked at this as a gift?

    Sugar baby/Sugar daddy type of relationship?

  9. #49
    Quote Originally Posted by vicky1234 View Post
    No. I am not sure how people define the word platonic, but according to dictionary , a friendship that involves the desire to pursue romance or sexual intimacy, whether you share those feelings or not, isn’t platonic. Of course she doesn't look at it as a gift because the loan is not just 16k , and now the remaining is only 16k. If its a Sugar baby/Sugar daddy type of relationship, Andy is definitely the sugar Baby and she is the sugar mommy.



    So your saying the Balance is 16k?

    How much was the original loan?

    So she has paid him something?

  10. #50
    I heard the original loan was double of 16k . 16k is definitely not the original amount she borrowed. but yeah 16k is around the current balance now

    Quote Originally Posted by PositiveVariance View Post
    So your saying the Balance is 16k?

    How much was the original loan?

    So she has paid him something?

  11. #51

    Vicky..Hi, I am sorry I confused you with Jennys other friend sitting there..

    Excuse me for asking you for yr friends "Tit shot".
    It is totally out of line to say that to you...

    I shall not be a 100% liar and say I do Not want to see such photos, but I did ask you in a crude way... for that excuse me....

    IMO, Andy sounds heartbroken and is only doing this to get her attn...

    Vicky,Jenny, girls, I am laid up, could use a smile, You can PM me here...

    Good luck...Get yr $ ...don't be bullied...
    State yr case on Radio Here at PokerFraudAlert tomorrow....Again, excuse me being crude... Totally not me....ShoeshineBox...

     
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      JeffDime: Box what’s going on brother? I can’t keep track of this shit.
      
      Ryan Eisenhower:

  12. #52
    Gold JeffDime's Avatar
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    This thread has become a goddam mess. Time to bring in the Wolf….



     
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      shoeshine box: Harveyyyyyyyy.....

  13. #53
    Gold JeffDime's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by vicky1234 View Post
    OK then what about if at the end it was proven that Andy has lie about the above things that I mentioned in his video, is the scenario going to change?
    People can lie about all types of things it doesn’t mean that if they are owed money they don’t get paid. I am not interested in any personal relationship details between them.

    Also, I wouldn’t consider someone a “scammer” because of a single incident like this. I would reserve that for people who have shown a pattern of borrowing and not paying back. At this point there is just the one allegation.

  14. #54
    If you lie about a lot of thing, your credibility is in question. why he need to lie about the China wire transfer and also the amount of the loan? There is a difference between paying back half and not paying back at all. I think when people heard about China wire transfer people associate it with scam. paying back something vs never pay anything also makes a difference in my perspective. I don't remember what exactly he said but I m pretty he said he never get paid anything. I will not believe in a liar for anything they say. Correct me if I m wrong.
    Is it really necessary to shame someone in public like the way he did when the person is on the way of paying back?. What can you accomplish by shaming someone on internet like that other than getting yourself into a lawsuit?? It is obvious that he is angry at her for other reasons. Or maybe he want to use this to drive traffic to his Channel because that video has so much more views and comments than any of the videos he posted.
    And I m still trying to figure out why he wants the money to be donated to live at the bike instead of keeping it himself.

    Quote Originally Posted by JeffDime View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by vicky1234 View Post
    OK then what about if at the end it was proven that Andy has lie about the above things that I mentioned in his video, is the scenario going to change?
    People can lie about all types of things it doesn’t mean that if they are owed money they don’t get paid. I am not interested in any personal relationship details between them.

    Also, I wouldn’t consider someone a “scammer” because of a single incident like this. I would reserve that for people who have shown a pattern of borrowing and not paying back. At this point there is just the one allegation.

     
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      donkeykilla: Okay, Jenny
    Last edited by vicky1234; 09-23-2021 at 08:24 PM.

  15. #55
    Quote Originally Posted by vicky1234 View Post
    If you lie about a lot of thing, your credibility is in question. why he need to lie about the China wire transfer and also the amount of the loan? There is a difference between paying back half and not paying back at all. I think when people heard about China wire transfer people associate it with scam. paying back something vs never pay anything also makes a difference in my perspective. I don't remember what exactly he said but I m pretty he said he never get paid anything. I will not believe in a liar for anything they say.
    Correct me if I m wrong.
    And I m still trying to figure out why he wants the money to be donated to live at the bike instead of keeping it himself.

    Quote Originally Posted by JeffDime View Post

    People can lie about all types of things it doesn’t mean that if they are owed money they don’t get paid. I am not interested in any personal relationship details between them.

    Also, I wouldn’t consider someone a “scammer” because of a single incident like this. I would reserve that for people who have shown a pattern of borrowing and not paying back. At this point there is just the one allegation.

    Vicky, the owner of this forum Todd, he goes by the user name "Dan Druff" has a radio program once per week usually on Friday nights, sometimes Saturdays. It's called "Poker Fraud Alert Radio". It's essentially like a podcast. He discusses many topics, especially Poker related. On the last episode the Andy/Jenny money issue was discussed. I think if you could convince Jenny to post her side here asap he may be willing to get it on Fridays program. He is a big proponent of letting both sides get a chance to tell their side of things as well as make any corrections to public info that is not accurate. I think it would be a good way for Jenny to tell her side and clear the air if needed.




    Listen here:
    This is the Andy/Jenny segment. After you click the link below, In post #2, you will see the MP3 file. Click on the play button to listen:

    https://pokerfraudalert.com/forum/sh...ty-Years-Later


    If you go to the 3:06:56 you can hear it the Andy/Jenny segment. (3 hour : 6 minute - 56 second mark)
    Last edited by PositiveVariance; 09-23-2021 at 08:46 PM.

  16. #56
    Thanks for the suggestion. The girl told me she is working with her attorney now about the statement that she is going to publish. I don't think she can make it by tomorrow but most likely next Friday. You know attorney is busy and need a week to work on complicated stuff like that, to make sure it wont cost her a defamation lawsuit. I didn't even know Andy's image was that good until I heard the podcast.

    Quote Originally Posted by PositiveVariance View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by vicky1234 View Post
    If you lie about a lot of thing, your credibility is in question. why he need to lie about the China wire transfer and also the amount of the loan? There is a difference between paying back half and not paying back at all. I think when people heard about China wire transfer people associate it with scam. paying back something vs never pay anything also makes a difference in my perspective. I don't remember what exactly he said but I m pretty he said he never get paid anything. I will not believe in a liar for anything they say.
    Correct me if I m wrong.
    And I m still trying to figure out why he wants the money to be donated to live at the bike instead of keeping it himself.

    Vicky, the owner of this forum Todd, he goes by the user name "Dan Druff" has a radio program once per week usually on Friday nights, sometimes Saturdays. It's called "Poker Fraud Alert Radio". It's essentially like a podcast. He discusses many topics, especially Poker related. On the last episode the Andy/Jenny money issue was discussed. I think if you could convince Jenny to post her side here asap he may be willing to get it on Fridays program. He is a big proponent of letting both sides get a chance to tell their side of things as well as make any corrections to public info that is not accurate. I think it would be a good way for Jenny to tell her side and clear the air if needed.




    Listen here:
    This is the Andy/Jenny segment. After you click the link below, In post #2, you will see the MP3 file. Click on the play button to listen:

    https://pokerfraudalert.com/forum/sh...ty-Years-Later


    If you go to the 3:06:56 you can hear it the Andy/Jenny segment. (3 hour : 6 minute - 56 second mark)

     
    Comments
      
      donkeykilla: Okay, Savage
    Last edited by vicky1234; 09-23-2021 at 09:12 PM.

  17. #57

    Cool

    "It is obvious that he is angry at her for other reasons. " ~ Vicky


    This is where the TRUTH Lies..^^^^^..IMO......

    Again Vicky excuse my boorish behavior....
    Please call into the show as it is much easier to understand and hear the TRUTH thru speech than texts...

    If She was paying him back and he done this to shame her for other reasons. it is awful...
    Andy lost me when he try to take her Toy Pets away... heating me up to recall it...

    More and more I believe this has 0.0% to do with a lousy 16k... Story has a romantic spurned lover feel to it...

  18. #58
    How do u know the the take away toys and pets part? Take away her toy and pets happen after the stream and only the players there witness that.. you must know someone there I assume. Andy already lost a lot of respect from the players he used to play with on stream because most players know the entire story. I don't want to say it on her behalf on a podcast in case I misunderstand something. I know most of it from her best friend but i think its the best for her to post it here herself.

    Quote Originally Posted by shoeshine box View Post
    "It is obvious that he is angry at her for other reasons. " ~ Vicky


    This is where the TRUTH Lies..^^^^^..IMO......

    Again Vicky excuse my boorish behavior....
    Please call into the show as it is much easier to understand and hear the TRUTH thru speech than texts...

    If She was paying him back and he done this to shame her for other reasons. it is awful...
    Andy lost me when he try to take her Toy Pets away... heating me up to recall it...

    More and more I believe this has 0.0% to do with a lousy 16k... Story has a romantic spurned lover feel to it...

     
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      PositiveVariance: Vicky, Andy taking away Jenny’s stuffed animal was written by a user that said he had inside knowledge. Page 1 or 2 of this thread it’s mentioned and on the radio program as well.
    Last edited by vicky1234; 09-23-2021 at 09:42 PM.

  19. #59
    Owner Dan Druff's Avatar
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    Vicky, I am doing my radio show tonight (Friday). We're on very late.

    Would you like to come on and make a statement about the situation? Would Jenny?

  20. #60
    I have sent you a private message


    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    Vicky, I am doing my radio show tonight (Friday). We're on very late.

    Would you like to come on and make a statement about the situation? Would Jenny?

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