No Need for Vaccine Jab #3? Some Peeps seem to think so

[Cerveza Fria]

Full Article Here: https://www.msn.com/en-us/health/med...AOodi2?ocid=se

Cliffs:
1) Vaccines are effective enough at preventing severe Covid-19 that there is no current need for the general population to be given third doses, according to a report in The Lancet published Monday.
2) The authors, who reviewed observational studies and clinical trials, found that vaccines remain highly effective against severe symptoms of Covid-19, across all the main virus variants including Delta, although they had lower success in preventing asymptomatic disease.
3) The Lancet study concluded that the current variants had not developed sufficiently to escape the immune response provided by vaccines currently in use.
4) The authors argue that if new virus mutations did emerge that were able to evade this response, it would be better to deliver specially modified vaccine boosters aimed at newer variants, than those based on the existing vaccines.

[Dan Druff]

Full Article Here: https://www.msn.com/en-us/health/med...AOodi2?ocid=se

Cliffs:
1) Vaccines are effective enough at preventing severe Covid-19 that there is no current need for the general population to be given third doses, according to a report in The Lancet published Monday.
2) The authors, who reviewed observational studies and clinical trials, found that vaccines remain highly effective against severe symptoms of Covid-19, across all the main virus variants including Delta, although they had lower success in preventing asymptomatic disease.
3) The Lancet study concluded that the current variants had not developed sufficiently to escape the immune response provided by vaccines currently in use.
4) The authors argue that if new virus mutations did emerge that were able to evade this response, it would be better to deliver specially modified vaccine boosters aimed at newer variants, than those based on the existing vaccines.

Yeah honestly I'm so torn about these boosters. On one hand, it looks like Pfizer (which I received) does indeed degrade big time in efficacy starting after the 4 month mark or so, falls under 50% before 6 months hit.

However, if all I'm gaining from a booster shot is warding off asymptomatic disease, then perhaps the days of bad side effects (and potential small short and long term risk) just isn't worth the trouble.

The first 2 shots were obvious. I was unvaccianted, COVID is nasty, and COVID both kills and long-term-harms people my age. Also, between weight, blood pressure, blood type, and some other factors, I seem to be in a higher risk category -- not elderly-people-high, but combined with my age, this all scared me. It was a no brainer to take a small risk with the vaccine -- and endure the shitty side effects -- for the very large benefit.

However, this third shot seems to be much less of a game changer for me, and perhaps not one at all. Part of me just wants to wait and be semi-cautious for awhile, until all of this is better understood.

[dwai]

Full Article Here: https://www.msn.com/en-us/health/med...AOodi2?ocid=se

Cliffs:
1) Vaccines are effective enough at preventing severe Covid-19 that there is no current need for the general population to be given third doses, according to a report in The Lancet published Monday.
2) The authors, who reviewed observational studies and clinical trials, found that vaccines remain highly effective against severe symptoms of Covid-19, across all the main virus variants including Delta, although they had lower success in preventing asymptomatic disease.
3) The Lancet study concluded that the current variants had not developed sufficiently to escape the immune response provided by vaccines currently in use.
4) The authors argue that if new virus mutations did emerge that were able to evade this response, it would be better to deliver specially modified vaccine boosters aimed at newer variants, than those based on the existing vaccines.

Yeah honestly I'm so torn about these boosters. On one hand, it looks like Pfizer (which I received) does indeed degrade big time in efficacy starting after the 4 month mark or so, falls under 50% before 6 months hit.

However, if all I'm gaining from a booster shot is warding off asymptomatic disease, then perhaps the days of bad side effects (and potential small short and long term risk) just isn't worth the trouble.

The first 2 shots were obvious. I was unvaccianted, COVID is nasty, and COVID both kills and long-term-harms people my age. Also, between weight, blood pressure, blood type, and some other factors, I seem to be in a higher risk category -- not elderly-people-high, but combined with my age, this all scared me. It was a no brainer to take a small risk with the vaccine -- and endure the shitty side effects -- for the very large benefit.

However, this third shot seems to be much less of a game changer for me, and perhaps not one at all. Part of me just wants to wait and be semi-cautious for awhile, until all of this is better understood.

I tend to agree with you, I'm pretty sure if you're just worried about dying(which apparently is the only thing this vaccine does prevent) I don't even see the logic in a booster.

this whole past two years has made very little sense, they literally threw science and everything we knew about coronaviruses out the window and brainwashed people into being scared of the common cold.

fascinating to watch the left go from fuck big pharma to their biggest fans

[Cerveza Fria]

Full Article Here: https://www.msn.com/en-us/health/med...AOodi2?ocid=se

Cliffs:
1) Vaccines are effective enough at preventing severe Covid-19 that there is no current need for the general population to be given third doses, according to a report in The Lancet published Monday.
2) The authors, who reviewed observational studies and clinical trials, found that vaccines remain highly effective against severe symptoms of Covid-19, across all the main virus variants including Delta, although they had lower success in preventing asymptomatic disease.
3) The Lancet study concluded that the current variants had not developed sufficiently to escape the immune response provided by vaccines currently in use.
4) The authors argue that if new virus mutations did emerge that were able to evade this response, it would be better to deliver specially modified vaccine boosters aimed at newer variants, than those based on the existing vaccines.

Yeah honestly I'm so torn about these boosters. On one hand, it looks like Pfizer (which I received) does indeed degrade big time in efficacy starting after the 4 month mark or so, falls under 50% before 6 months hit.

However, if all I'm gaining from a booster shot is warding off asymptomatic disease, then perhaps the days of bad side effects (and potential small short and long term risk) just isn't worth the trouble.

The first 2 shots were obvious. I was unvaccianted, COVID is nasty, and COVID both kills and long-term-harms people my age. Also, between weight, blood pressure, blood type, and some other factors, I seem to be in a higher risk category -- not elderly-people-high, but combined with my age, this all scared me. It was a no brainer to take a small risk with the vaccine -- and endure the shitty side effects -- for the very large benefit.

However, this third shot seems to be much less of a game changer for me, and perhaps not one at all. Part of me just wants to wait and be semi-cautious for awhile, until all of this is better understood.

I agree with the wait and see approach. I had 2 shots of Moderna. But, I think that a booster is NOT the correct thing for me to do right now. Moderna is arguing with the FDA about boosters. They (Moderna) only want to do a half dose for a booster, saying a full third dose is not necessary and overkill, whereas the Biden Administration is pushing for a full 3rd dose - So much for "follow the science." Also 2 FDA officials quit over the Biden Administration pushing boosters, because they don't think they are necessary. And the final thing is Cliff point #4 in my original post. I think that a specifically formulated booster to deal with variants would be more beneficial. I'm relatively healthy and have a healthy immune system. So, I'm going to wait and see what the data suggests as we get more information.

[sonatine]

im having trouble separating the actual virologists from the joe rogan guest virologists on this issue and its frustrating.

personally ill take as many shots as the FDA clears, providing theres no risk of somehow increasing the mutation rate of the virus in doing so (eg: over-prescribed antibiotics situations).

two big reasons why:

1) the early vaccines were a good first start but we have something like a solid year of R&D to improve on them (but apparently this isnt happening which is real fuckin confusing)

2) the virus is changing, it seems logical that we will need vaccines custom tailored to those emerging threats, which is also kind of a nod to #1

but i also get that it may be counter productive to push new vaccines and new tech when the sheer volume of unvaccinated petri-dishes out there insure that it would be wasted effort (see #2).

virology is hard.

[dwai]

im having trouble separating the actual virologists from the joe rogan guest virologists on this issue and its frustrating.

personally ill take as many shots as the FDA clears, providing theres no risk of somehow increasing the mutation rate of the virus in doing so (eg: over-prescribed antibiotics situations).

two big reasons why:

1) the early vaccines were a good first start but we have something like a solid year of R&D to improve on them (but apparently this isnt happening which is real fuckin confusing)

2) the virus is changing, it seems logical that we will need vaccines custom tailored to those emerging threats, which is also kind of a nod to #1

but i also get that it may be counter productive to push new vaccines and new tech when the sheer volume of unvaccinated petri-dishes out there insure that it would be wasted effort (see #2).

virology is hard.

I agree a lot of black people are uneducated

[country978]

Hasn't it been proven now that the best defense to the virus is actually getting the virus and surviving?

[BCR]

Full Article Here: https://www.msn.com/en-us/health/med...AOodi2?ocid=se

Cliffs:
1) Vaccines are effective enough at preventing severe Covid-19 that there is no current need for the general population to be given third doses, according to a report in The Lancet published Monday.
2) The authors, who reviewed observational studies and clinical trials, found that vaccines remain highly effective against severe symptoms of Covid-19, across all the main virus variants including Delta, although they had lower success in preventing asymptomatic disease.
3) The Lancet study concluded that the current variants had not developed sufficiently to escape the immune response provided by vaccines currently in use.
4) The authors argue that if new virus mutations did emerge that were able to evade this response, it would be better to deliver specially modified vaccine boosters aimed at newer variants, than those based on the existing vaccines.

Yeah honestly I'm so torn about these boosters. On one hand, it looks like Pfizer (which I received) does indeed degrade big time in efficacy starting after the 4 month mark or so, falls under 50% before 6 months hit.

However, if all I'm gaining from a booster shot is warding off asymptomatic disease, then perhaps the days of bad side effects (and potential small short and long term risk) just isn't worth the trouble.

The first 2 shots were obvious. I was unvaccianted, COVID is nasty, and COVID both kills and long-term-harms people my age. Also, between weight, blood pressure, blood type, and some other factors, I seem to be in a higher risk category -- not elderly-people-high, but combined with my age, this all scared me. It was a no brainer to take a small risk with the vaccine -- and endure the shitty side effects -- for the very large benefit.

However, this third shot seems to be much less of a game changer for me, and perhaps not one at all. Part of me just wants to wait and be semi-cautious for awhile, until all of this is better understood.

I think it’s a bit early to tell. It didn’t go into detail enough to gather much. Just the WHO observed studies and clinical trials. I’d prefer something along the lines of we watched this group of people vaccinated first week in Feb and have saw no marked increase in serious infection. We observed this group from mid Feb and saw x.

Any study is just a snapshot in time and from that article, not particularly specific. I go by what percentage of death, ICU, and ventilators are vaccinated v unvaccinated. Last month it was like 95% and higher above all 3 categories. Now I hear more high 80s, maybe 90ish. I mean it’s super safe to be part of 10% of something that is only 1% fatal in our age group, but if it turned downward month by month to only 70% are unvaxxed, I’ll go from feeling 100% confident to starting to think about shit again and that’s been the best part of the vaccines success so far.

Obviously we are above 60% vaccinated now, so that will play a role also and add a few percent to overall death among vaccinated as it’s a larger % of population.

There is a lot of outside pressure for us to also donate ours to the third world. We should if the studies are sound, but I’m not seeing enough detail. I like to see things with date ranges and how it is trending more specifically.

I predicted we might never need another after the first, or it might be a long time, but I’m not convinced I was right yet. If anything I moved back a little the other way. I know the Lancet is respected, but that’s not the real world pure percentage of bodies in beds stuff I gravitate towards when making a decision.

[Cerveza Fria]

Hasn't it been proven now that the best defense to the virus is actually getting the virus and surviving?

There is an Israeli study that suggest that Natural Immunity gained by getting and surviving COVID is stranger than Vaccine protection. However, COVID will reveal and exploit any weaknesses your body has and you may not survive to find out.

Here is an article on it: https://www.news-medical.net/news/20...ccination.aspx

Also, my original post was specifically about boosters.

[sonatine]

Hasn't it been proven now that the best defense to the virus is actually getting the virus and surviving?

as this situation evolves, its unwise to stay married to old data / axioms. a lot of those initial assumptions were based on considerably less dire scenarios than the one we currently find ourselves in.

more math to consider;

odds of mortality with excellent care: .5% or something

odds of mortality once hospital beds start filling up: 1%

if you catch a break through infection once initial immunity wanes: 2 x 1% = 2%

you get the idea; basically as this wears on, it goes from 'my odds of dying are a fraction of a percent' to 'i have to fade 2 outs on the river'.

[sonatine]

Hasn't it been proven now that the best defense to the virus is actually getting the virus and surviving?

There is an Israeli study that suggest that Natural Immunity gained by getting and surviving COVID is stranger than Vaccine protection. However, COVID will reveal and exploit any weaknesses your body has and you may not survive to find out.

Here is an article on it: https://www.news-medical.net/news/20...ccination.aspx

Also, my original post was specifically about boosters.

grain of salt anything coming out of israel, they are notorious for press releases announcing the end of cancer for example. like literally theres a new one every month.

[country978]

Hasn't it been proven now that the best defense to the virus is actually getting the virus and surviving?

as this situation evolves, its unwise to stay married to old data / axioms. a lot of those initial assumptions were based on considerably less dire scenarios than the one we currently find ourselves in.

more math to consider;

odds of mortality with excellent care: .5% or something

odds of mortality once hospital beds start filling up: 1%

if you catch a break through infection once initial immunity wanes: 2 x 1% = 2%

you get the idea; basically as this wears on, it goes from 'my odds of dying are a fraction of a percent' to 'i have to fade 2 outs on the river'.

this is a classic sonnatine!!