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Thread: did donald trump orchestrate a guaranteed disaster in afghanistan to propel the christian right into power for the next decade?

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    Too many distraction tactics with blaming former Presidents. Lots of debate can be had about our Afghanistan strategy, but that's another discussion for another time.

    The bullshit needs to be ignored, and the big questions need to be answered:

    1) Why was it so important to abruptly withdraw like this, rather than taking a little more time and doing it right?

    2) Why did Biden ignore advice from his own intelligence sources?

    3) Were there reailstic ways this could have been done different, and produced a much better short term result?

    The answer to #3 is definitely yes.

    The answers to #1 and #2 are only known by Biden and his people, but I can't imagine they are very sensible.

    The rest is just noise meant to distract us from Biden's failings here. The "all the Presidents since Bush fucked it up" narrative is great for conspiritards and contrarians who want to posture about how "right" they were the whole time about how we shouldn't have been in Afghanistan.
    Peter Ducey broke Biden yesterday per at least one tweet.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by sonatine View Post
    im just asking questions!

    probably a nothingburger.

    trump is orchestrated in a scenario like this moron

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    Quote Originally Posted by sonatine View Post
    honestly its a shame that since no one in this or the previous administration is breaking ranks to explain what happened and who negotiated what, literally every explanation that makes any sense at all is by definition a conspiracy theory.
    It sure is a shame, Sonatine. There was a retaliatory strike earlier. There hasn't been much of an explanation about that either aside from issuing a warning at the airport to say more ISIS attacks are expected. I'm very displeased about how natural it comes to the government to cover up and lie to the people they're elected to represent. Seems we only get worse from here. Mr Biden is at max a 1 term president. I have not heard one person from the administration who inspires any confidence. Biden's legacy is going to be worse than Carter's if he doesn't turn things around and fast.

  4. #24
    Plutonium sonatine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by country978 View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by sonatine View Post
    honestly its a shame that since no one in this or the previous administration is breaking ranks to explain what happened and who negotiated what, literally every explanation that makes any sense at all is by definition a conspiracy theory.
    It sure is a shame, Sonatine. There was a retaliatory strike earlier. There hasn't been much of an explanation about that either aside from issuing a warning at the airport to say more ISIS attacks are expected. I'm very displeased about how natural it comes to the government to cover up and lie to the people they're elected to represent. Seems we only get worse from here. Mr Biden is at max a 1 term president. I have not heard one person from the administration who inspires any confidence. Biden's legacy is going to be worse than Carter's if he doesn't turn things around and fast.

    the opposing thesis is that in 6 weeks no ones going to give a shit but the same people who pretended that bengazi definitely absolutely 100% going to end the liberal menace.

    also i dont think anyone elected biden expecting a second term tbh.

     
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      country978:
    "Birds born in a cage think flying is an illness." - Alejandro Jodorowsky

    "America is not so much a nightmare as a non-dream. The American non-dream is precisely a move to wipe the dream out of existence. The dream is a spontaneous happening and therefore dangerous to a control system set up by the non-dreamers." -- William S. Burroughs

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    Quote Originally Posted by sonatine View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by country978 View Post

    It sure is a shame, Sonatine. There was a retaliatory strike earlier. There hasn't been much of an explanation about that either aside from issuing a warning at the airport to say more ISIS attacks are expected. I'm very displeased about how natural it comes to the government to cover up and lie to the people they're elected to represent. Seems we only get worse from here. Mr Biden is at max a 1 term president. I have not heard one person from the administration who inspires any confidence. Biden's legacy is going to be worse than Carter's if he doesn't turn things around and fast.

    the opposing thesis is that in 6 weeks no ones going to give a shit but the same people who pretended that bengazi definitely absolutely 100% going to end the liberal menace.

    also i dont think anyone elected biden expecting a second term tbh.
    I hope you're wrong about people not giving a shit in 6 weeks. I've been hoping that just as soon as September the 1st rolls around we will all turn our focus to demanding a change of course in Iraq. This country has done so many fucked up things its hard to mention them all. But invading a country by false pretense and then staying there since 2003 has to be pretty high up on the list. You're probably right though; nobody is going to care. And after the debacle unfolding now there seems to be little chance Biden would risk another one by deciding to leave Iraq also.

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    Plutonium sonatine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by country978 View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by sonatine View Post


    the opposing thesis is that in 6 weeks no ones going to give a shit but the same people who pretended that bengazi definitely absolutely 100% going to end the liberal menace.

    also i dont think anyone elected biden expecting a second term tbh.
    I hope you're wrong about people not giving a shit in 6 weeks. I've been hoping that just as soon as September the 1st rolls around we will all turn our focus to demanding a change of course in Iraq. This country has done so many fucked up things its hard to mention them all. But invading a country by false pretense and then staying there since 2003 has to be pretty high up on the list. You're probably right though; nobody is going to care. And after the debacle unfolding now there seems to be little chance Biden would risk another one by deciding to leave Iraq also.

    ive had to swallow some pretty wild bitter pills lately about the media's absolute love affair with forever wars and the lengths they will go to to normalize and support them.

    the next DNC nominee will be a hologram of mccain demanding we invade iran and it will likely be enough to get it elected.
    "Birds born in a cage think flying is an illness." - Alejandro Jodorowsky

    "America is not so much a nightmare as a non-dream. The American non-dream is precisely a move to wipe the dream out of existence. The dream is a spontaneous happening and therefore dangerous to a control system set up by the non-dreamers." -- William S. Burroughs

  7. #27
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    I ignore the fake media and listen only to Trump's words.



    DJT: So I set up a conversation with him, and people said oh, you shouldn’t be talking. Well, I set up a conversation with Kim Jong Un of North Korea. We didn’t have a nuclear war. Had I not, then Obama would have been right. We would have had a nuclear war. President Obama said to me we’re going to have a nuclear war with North Korea. I said have you ever spoken to him. He said no. And I said don’t you think that might be a good idea. But anyway, I know he wanted to speak to him, but he never got to speak to him, and I think the other side didn’t want to talk to Obama. So what happened is I spoke to the head of the, the known head, because it’s…

    DJT: Yeah, but I spoke to, and sort of the known head, but nobody was sure, but now I’m sure, and I was sure then when I was speaking to him. And I knew as soon as I spoke to him. And even the introduction, I say hello, and he screamed something very tough. And I then started with him. I said listen, before we start the longtime conversation and conversations that we’re going to have, I have to say one thing, and I’ll never have to say it again to you. And here’s what I say. If you do anything bad to the United States of America, if you do anything bad to any of our civilians, to any American citizen, or if you do anything out of the normal, you know, they’ve been fighting for a 1,000 years, but out of the normal, because you’ve had your wars, and if you do anything out of the normal, but anything bad to America or any American citizens, I will hit you harder than anybody has ever been hit in world history. You will be hit harder than any country and any person has ever been hit in world history. And we will start with the exact location and the exact town, and it’s right here. And I believe I repeated the name of his town. That will be the first place that we start. And I won’t be able to speak to you anymore after that, and isn’t that a very sad thing? But that is the story. And then he asked me one question, and I’d rather not repeat that question, because it’s a very scary question. But he asked me one question, and I gave him the answer yes. And then after it was all done, I said okay, now I’ve said what I’m going to say. Let’s have a conversation. And I said we’re going to be leaving after 21 years. And when we leave, you’re going to leave us alone, and we’re going to leave with great dignity and great honor. And we are going to take care of this situation. We’re going to take our time. We had a date of May 1st, but they missed a couple of conditions. We had some very strong conditions, Hugh. But they missed a couple of conditions. I wanted to be out by May 1st. I had spoken to him quite a bit before May 1st, but we had a condition of May 1st. But they missed conditions, and so therefore, I bombed and we hit them very hard. And then we said we will agree to those conditions. I said no, you’ve already agreed to them. Don’t play games. We had them so good. They weren’t in Kabul. You take a look at when they started taking over Afghanistan. It’s when I left. When I left, that’s when it started, they started going wild, because they were dealing with another president. And I never realized, and of course I realized the importance and power of the presidency, but I never realized how important the office of the president is until this happened, because when I watched what happened over the last week and a half with some horrible, stupid decisions that were made, number one being allowing our military to leave before the civilians and before we get all of our equipment back, $83 billion dollars. And not, nobody can even comprehend that much equipment. Thousands of vehicles, thousands, you saw the list of vehicles.

    DJT: He could have the used, he could have the greatest car sale and truck sale in the history of the world. And these are all armor-plated, these are millions and millions of dollars each, each, for each vehicle. It cost millions of dollars, and that’s where we were. And we were getting ready to leave, and then the election was rigged. And shockingly, I lost. Even though I got 12 million more votes than I got the first time, even though I ran a better campaign than I ran the first time, the election was lost. The ballots were rigged. They used COVID in order to cheat, because they cheat fantastically. If they could fight wars like they cheat an election, we would have had that war one in one day. But…

    There you have it.

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