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Thread: "Dealer Services" extended auto warranty scam

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    Owner Dan Druff's Avatar
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    "Dealer Services" extended auto warranty scam

    Today I got a call from a spoofed phone number, from a guy claiming he worked for "Dealer Services".

    It was not a foreign based call. The caller was American.

    He started off with a prepared script telling me that their "records show" my BMW warranty is about to expire, and was trying to sell me an extended one. I actually own two BMWs, one of which will have an expired warranty in about 5 months, and one of which had its warranty expire over a year ago.

    I didn't bother asking which one he was calling about. Clearly some list of BMW owners must have been stolen from somewhere, because he knew I owned one.

    I interrupted his sales spiel immediately and asked, "What is Dealer Services?"

    I knew it was a scam call from jump street, but I was curious to hear the guy's bullshit answers.

    He paused, then decided to ignore me and continued reading the script.

    I didn't let him off the hook.

    "What is Dealer Services?", I asked again.

    Once again, he paused, then continued with the script.

    I repeated louder, "Hey, I need to know... what is Dealer Services?"

    I said it one more time, and he finally stopped reading.

    "What?", he responded.

    "I need you to tell me what Dealer Services is," I replied.

    "Uhh... it's the name of my company. We provide the most extended warranties in the country and work with almost every auto manufacturer," was his bullshit response.

    "So if I check with BMW if they work with Dealer Services to sell warranties, they'll say yes?"

    He decided to ignore that and started reading from the script again.

    I repeated the question, this time louder.

    He grumbled and hung up on me.

    I know this scam has been going on for a long time. In fact, another Dealer Services company saw its founder sentenced to 8 years in prison back in 2012.


    But this company is currently active, and apparently most of their spoofed caller IDs come from California numbers, including the one calling me.

    Here's the BBB page about it: https://www.bbb.org/new-jersey/busin...st-nj-11001474 (I know the BBB itself sucks, but the customer comments section is interesting)

    Anyone else gotten this call?

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    Diamond Tellafriend's Avatar
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    I’ve gotten it a dozen times. I Used to hang up, now I just don’t answer unknown calls.

     
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      MumblesBadly: Is that why you aren’t taking my calls?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    Here's the BBB page about it: https://www.bbb.org/new-jersey/busin...st-nj-11001474 (I know the BBB itself sucks, but the customer comments section is interesting)
    Speaking of BBB: https://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/busin...ry?id=12123843

    To prove the point, a group of Los Angeles business owners paid $425 to the Better Business Bureau and were able to obtain an A minus grade for a non-existent company called Hamas, named after the Middle Eastern terror group.

    "Right now, this rating system is really unworthy of consumer trust or confidence," said Connecticut attorney general Richard Blumenthal in an interview to be broadcast as part of an ABC News investigation airing tonight on 20/20.

     
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      Tellafriend: It has always been a pay to play
      
      MumblesBadly: I think Blumenthal is a Democrat... Yup... Can he be trusted?

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    Silver Draymond's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tellafriend View Post
    I’ve gotten it a dozen times. I Used to hang up, now I just don’t answer unknown calls.
    I get calls for investment seminars all the time. It's obvious I have a previous home number of a someone that got roped into something. I was invited over the phone to a money making seminar but had to pay a $250 registration fee first. I played along and said I did not have a credit card only cash and if I could pay at the door. I was told I needed to go to my closest Walgreens or CVS and buy and green dot card and give him the number and I would get an invite coupon emailed me. I played along for about 20 minutes acting like I was in my car and walking through the store, I even closed my car door and started the engine just to get the guy excited

    At the end of the call when I was supposed to give him my green dot number I politely told him to fuck off, he realized he was played and told me to fuck off and hung up. I wish in retrospect I had carried it out another 20 minutes and then asked him why he was trying to scam people. But I did the fuck off routine. There was no payoff for me so I basically wasted my time. It was not fun.

     
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      Muck Ficon: Have another drink champ

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    Diamond hongkonger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Draymond View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Tellafriend View Post
    I’ve gotten it a dozen times. I Used to hang up, now I just don’t answer unknown calls.
    I get calls for investment seminars all the time. It's obvious I have a previous home number of a someone that got roped into something. I was invited over the phone to a money making seminar but had to pay a $250 registration fee first. I played along and said I did not have a credit card only cash and if I could pay at the door. I was told I needed to go to my closest Walgreens or CVS and buy and green dot card and give him the number and I would get an invite coupon emailed me. I played along for about 20 minutes acting like I was in my car and walking through the store, I even closed my car door and started the engine just to get the guy excited

    At the end of the call when I was supposed to give him my green dot number I politely told him to fuck off, he realized he was played and told me to fuck off and hung up. I wish in retrospect I had carried it out another 20 minutes and then asked him why he was trying to scam people. But I did the fuck off routine. There was no payoff for me so I basically wasted my time. It was not fun.
    So you have the previous home number of someone who actually had money?

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    Gold Suicide King's Avatar
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    Todd can you call Honda service for me? My screen in the car stopped working. They denied coverage because the tech said it looks like someone kicked it. The service guy told me to call honda and complain.

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    Gold Gookieheimowitz's Avatar
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    Smile

    I like reverse scamming :

    My favorite is calling the Vaginal Mesh lawsuit lawyers from the commercial and telling them I was injured by it. Of course they don't like that I'm a man.

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    Platinum nunbeater's Avatar
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    look at these rich fucking doctors falling for BMW scams

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    100% Organic MumblesBadly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nunbeater View Post
    look at these rich fucking doctors falling for BMW scams
    When I worked in real estate syndication, one of company’s favorite marketing targets where doctors. They loved deals that “seemed too good” to invest all of their extra cash, which after the first few years of the company’s operations, most of their offerings were.
    _____________________________________________
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    I actually hope this [second impeachment] succeeds, because I want Trump put down politically like a sick, 14-year-old dog. ... I don't want him complicating the 2024 primary season. I just want him done.
    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    Were Republicans cowardly or unethical not to go along with [convicting Trump in the second impeachment Senate trial]? No. The smart move was to reject it.

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    Owner Dan Druff's Avatar
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    Some people like to blow a whistle or put an air horn up to the phone, thinking it will blow out the scammer's ear.

    It won't.

    Just because something is loud on your end doesn't mean that it will transfer over the phone network loudly.

    But if you're looking to put something on which will really blow them out, call this number on 3-way:

    (818) 347-0002

    It's the loudest tone that can transmit through a phone. Try it yourself. Put it on speaker at maximum volume and call it.

    I might use this next time.

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    Platinum BetCheckBet's Avatar
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    Druff you missed a big opportunity Kitboga been making good bank from these scammers. You could have easily been making 6 figures doing this but also would have resulted in giving up poker.

    https://www.engadget.com/2018/07/30/...port-scammers/

     
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      MumblesBadly: Druff only likes doing most things running at small loss.

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    Platinum BetCheckBet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Draymond View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Tellafriend View Post
    I’ve gotten it a dozen times. I Used to hang up, now I just don’t answer unknown calls.
    I get calls for investment seminars all the time. It's obvious I have a previous home number of a someone that got roped into something. I was invited over the phone to a money making seminar but had to pay a $250 registration fee first. I played along and said I did not have a credit card only cash and if I could pay at the door. I was told I needed to go to my closest Walgreens or CVS and buy and green dot card and give him the number and I would get an invite coupon emailed me. I played along for about 20 minutes acting like I was in my car and walking through the store, I even closed my car door and started the engine just to get the guy excited

    At the end of the call when I was supposed to give him my green dot number I politely told him to fuck off, he realized he was played and told me to fuck off and hung up. I wish in retrospect I had carried it out another 20 minutes and then asked him why he was trying to scam people. But I did the fuck off routine. There was no payoff for me so I basically wasted my time. It was not fun.
    Your bank is likely selling information about you 200k checking account to them hence why they are seeking you out. They don;t bother targeting small fish with this scam. They pretty much only contact people with high liquidity.

     
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      MumblesBadly: Speaks to a benefit of hoarding gold ingots in safe deposit box versus cash in the back.

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    Druff, your car info was probably sold by the state you registered it in. They know how long a BMW manufacturer warranty is then start hitting you up. Not a scam but shady.

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    Diamond hongkonger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Texter View Post
    Druff, your car info was probably sold by the state you registered it in. They know how long a BMW manufacturer warranty is then start hitting you up. Not a scam but shady.
    It's a scam when they sell you something and then don't provide the service, which is what these assholes do. They never compensate the dealers so the dealers stop taking them then they fold up the company and open a new one and do the same thing over and over.

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    Owner Dan Druff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hongkonger View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Texter View Post
    Druff, your car info was probably sold by the state you registered it in. They know how long a BMW manufacturer warranty is then start hitting you up. Not a scam but shady.
    It's a scam when they sell you something and then don't provide the service, which is what these assholes do. They never compensate the dealers so the dealers stop taking them then they fold up the company and open a new one and do the same thing over and over.
    These extended warranty cold calls range from outright scams to semi-scams.

    The scam ones are, as you said, fake warranties which take your money and never pay to cover any actual damages (or fold up quickly without any plans to pay anyone).

    There are also tons of semi-scam warranties which purport to be as good or better than your dealer warranty, but in reality the coverage is crappy. So you do get covered in the case that you need it, but you are getting a horrible deal.

    There are even other semi-scam warranties where, in addition to being crappy, they purport to be affiliated with your dealer, such as the call I got (though the call I got might have also just been an outright scam).

    Now that I think of it, I remember getting inundated with postcards at my old Vegas PO Box from extended warranty companies, when my car's warranty was running out in 2008. I threw them all away, but interestingly enough, ended up getting sort of ripped off by an actual BMW dealer in Vegas regarding a warranty. I'll explain in the next post.

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    Diamond Pro Zap_the_Fractions_Giraffe's Avatar
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    why buy a BMW when you could buy a Kia Stinger

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    Owner Dan Druff's Avatar
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    So as I said, my BMW was about to be out of warranty back in 08, and I started looking around regarding extended warranties. I was calling around between BMW dealers (they can have a wide variance in price for the same warranty, depending upon how much profit they're willing to give up), and even researched some of the more respectable third party extended warranty companies. I also considered simply gambling and having no warranty (which is what I'm doing right now for one of my cars, and so far it's worked out).

    I happened to have my car in for service at a BMW dealer in Vegas, shortly before the warranty was over, and I asked them about their extended warranty.

    "Well, I can offer you two options", said the service adviser. "I can sell you the BMW warranty, or I can sell you this third-party warranty which is just as good, but cheaper."

    I was shocked to hear this. An authorized BMW dealer competing with BMW's own warranties? Interesting. I figured I could trust this one because there was no way a huge dealer would sell me an outright scam warranty, especially because BWM of North America punishes dealers for corporate complaints about them.

    Still, something felt off. The price difference was very large. Why would anyone buy the BMW warranty for so much extra money, when this third-party warranty was just as good? Even more perplexing, the third-party warranty had an additional strength -- you could take it to any mechanic to fix your car. The BMW warranty required an authorized BMW mechanic to work on it. So the third party warranty was more flexible, too.

    I kept repeatedly asking the guy, "So you're sure this is the same as the BMW one, right? Everything covered in the BMW one is covered here, right?"

    The service adviser repeatedly said yes.

    And this wasn't some sort of scam where the guy was selling these on the side without his bosses knowing. I bought the third party warranty, but had to interface with the guy's manager to do it, and I filled out paperwork indicating that the sale came through this BMW place.

    Of course, I repeatedly read the long contract which specified all the coverage and exclusions. Seemed totally legit. All the stuff you'd expect to be covered was covered, and the only exclusions were obvious items such as tires, paint, glass, windshield wipers, damage to the vehicle caused by accident or vandalism, etc.

    I walked out feeling like a Jew who might have just gotten the best of both worlds (an extended warranty not marked way up by BMW, but at the same time, has the credibility of a major BMW dealership selling it), but also feeling like maybe I was just a huge chump.

    The warranty was good for 3 years, meaning it lasted through mid-2011.

    In 2010, while visiting my parents, my car started acting extremely weird, and was barely driveable. I brought it to the nearest BMW place, and they gave me a loaner car (free) for the duration of the repair. I felt comfortable that this would be covered by the extended warranty, and if it wasn't, I was going to call the Vegas BMW place and raise hell.

    Then I got the bad news. My worst fears came true: It wasn't covered. Why? Because my car had a problem with the throttle body, and the throttle body was excluded by my extended warranty.

    Throttle body? What is that?

    A throttle body is a butterfly valve located between the air intake filter and the intake manifold. It regulates how much air can go into the engine, based on driver input through the gas pedal. As more air flows into the engine, it injects more fuel, thus allowing for more power.
    But how could the throttle body have been excluded? I had remembered checking the contract very carefully to make sure that all mechanical elements were covered.

    I asked the service adviser to point me to the section of the extended warranty which excluded it, and he told me where to look.

    Under "exclusions", I did find something like this:

    "... windshield wipers, headlight bulbs, floor mats, glass, throttle body, paint, tires, hood ornaments ..."

    How dirty!

    They purposely buried "throttle body" (mechanical) in between a bunch of super obvious cosmetic stuff which clearly would never be covered by a warranty, hoping you'd glance at it, and your eyes would skip by, as you'd think to yourself, "Yeah, of course that stuff isn't covered!"

    And it worked! I never saw "throttle body" when I read it prior to purchase. My eyes did skip right over it, as it blended in with all of the cosmetic stuff.

    This was completely intentional.

    Why was throttle body excluded? No idea. Strangely, it was the ONLY mechanical item excluded, and I ran so bad that my car's only mechanical problem for the duration of the warranty was with the throttle body.

    I then asked the service adviser if the standard BMW warranty would have covered it.

    "Yes, it would have," he replied.

    I was furious! The "it's the same thing" spiel I was given simply wasn't true!

    However, I also figured that perhaps the guy selling it to me was also fooled by this throttle body trick, and he also believed he was really selling me the same coverage. Still, that wasn't my problem. An authorized BMW dealer in Vegas repeatedly promised me the coverage was the same, and I verified it with him multiple times prior to purchasing it.

    I called the BMW place in Vegas. Unfortunately, in the two years that had passed, that service adviser had either left the company or was fired. Instead, I was given his manager.

    The manager did admit that they sold these third party warranties in 2008, and he even conceded, "We don't sell those any more. There were too many problems with them."

    So I was off to a good start. If the warranty he sold me was no longer sold by them due to "problems", clearly they had some kind of obligation to help me here. (And by "obligation", I mean how they'd look to BMW North America if they didn't help me.)

    Unfortunately, the guy initially refused to help, telling me that it was my responsibility to have read the contract and coverages prior to purchasing it.

    "As far as I can see here, the item being excluded is listed as an exclusion in the contract you signed, so I'm not sure what your problem is", he told me.

    Okay, fair point.

    However, at the same time, I was promised by the sales employee of his dealership that the two warranties were the same, which they weren't. That would supersede the contract itself from a legal standpoint, but the problem is that I had no proof of that. For all this manager knew, I could be lying about it because I simply ran into bad luck that the one mechanical exclusion was what I needed covered.

    Still, I knew I was telling the truth, and furthermore, the contract was written in a really dirty fashion, attempting to bury the "throttle body" exclusion in a place where it would be missed. So I definitely had a moral right to demand some kind of compensation here, and perhaps a legal one, too.

    We went back and forth a lot. There was actually some other mechanical work related to this problem which WAS covered, and the warranty did pay promptly. So it wasn't an outright scam. But the throttle body portion was something like $1000, and the local BMW place didn't want to release my car until I forked over that money. I also didn't want to fork over that money until this matter was settled, figuring that my negotiation position would be weaker if I paid first and asked for reimbursement later (even though these were two different dealerships with two different owners). Basically, I was hoping the dealership by my parents would help pressure the Vegas one into doing the right thing.

    Believe it or not, a month passed with this whole stalemate going on. Credit to the dealership by my parents -- they were incredibly patient with the whole thing, and their only issue was that I was driving their loaner car for a month. Finally they told me I couldn't have the loaner for free anymore -- that I'd need to return it or start paying for it, which was obviously a reasonable demand at this point, as it had been a month, and this wasn't their problem. At this point, I called the Vegas BMW place and threw down the gauntlet. I told them I would need a decision in the next 24 hours, or I would be filing both a complaint to BMW North America and a lawsuit regarding this matter. I also made the general manager aware of this.

    Later that same day, they told me they decided they would pay $500 toward the $1000 or so outstanding bill. I was told that they determined that the $500 was the "fair" resolution because:

    1) I signed a contract agreeing to this exclusion
    and
    2) They had no proof of what I was actually promised, and the employee in question had been gone for a long time

    So they felt a half/half approach was the fair resolution at that point. I wasn't thrilled with it, but I accepted it, especially knowing that a little of the responsibility was mine for not catching that throttle body exclusion in the contract.

    So that was done, I paid the other $500, and I got my car back.

    And that was the first and last time I ever purchased a third party extended warranty.

     
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      Zap_the_Fractions_Giraffe: get a japanese or american car and you don't need warranties

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    Gold Gookieheimowitz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    So as I said, my BMW was about to be out of warranty back in 08, and I started looking around regarding extended warranties. I was calling around between BMW dealers (they can have a wide variance in price for the same warranty, depending upon how much profit they're willing to give up), and even researched some of the more respectable third party extended warranty companies. I also considered simply gambling and having no warranty (which is what I'm doing right now for one of my cars, and so far it's worked out).

    I happened to have my car in for service at a BMW dealer in Vegas, shortly before the warranty was over, and I asked them about their extended warranty.

    "Well, I can offer you two options", said the service adviser. "I can sell you the BMW warranty, or I can sell you this third-party warranty which is just as good, but cheaper."

    I was shocked to hear this. An authorized BMW dealer competing with BMW's own warranties? Interesting. I figured I could trust this one because there was no way a huge dealer would sell me an outright scam warranty, especially because BWM of North America punishes dealers for corporate complaints about them.

    Still, something felt off. The price difference was very large. Why would anyone buy the BMW warranty for so much extra money, when this third-party warranty was just as good? Even more perplexing, the third-party warranty had an additional strength -- you could take it to any mechanic to fix your car. The BMW warranty required an authorized BMW mechanic to work on it. So the third party warranty was more flexible, too.

    I kept repeatedly asking the guy, "So you're sure this is the same as the BMW one, right? Everything covered in the BMW one is covered here, right?"

    The service adviser repeatedly said yes.

    And this wasn't some sort of scam where the guy was selling these on the side without his bosses knowing. I bought the third party warranty, but had to interface with the guy's manager to do it, and I filled out paperwork indicating that the sale came through this BMW place.

    Of course, I repeatedly read the long contract which specified all the coverage and exclusions. Seemed totally legit. All the stuff you'd expect to be covered was covered, and the only exclusions were obvious items such as tires, paint, glass, windshield wipers, damage to the vehicle caused by accident or vandalism, etc.

    I walked out feeling like a Jew who might have just gotten the best of both worlds (an extended warranty not marked way up by BMW, but at the same time, has the credibility of a major BMW dealership selling it), but also feeling like maybe I was just a huge chump.

    The warranty was good for 3 years, meaning it lasted through mid-2011.

    In 2010, while visiting my parents, my car started acting extremely weird, and was barely driveable. I brought it to the nearest BMW place, and they gave me a loaner car (free) for the duration of the repair. I felt comfortable that this would be covered by the extended warranty, and if it wasn't, I was going to call the Vegas BMW place and raise hell.

    Then I got the bad news. My worst fears came true: It wasn't covered. Why? Because my car had a problem with the throttle body, and the throttle body was excluded by my extended warranty.

    Throttle body? What is that?

    A throttle body is a butterfly valve located between the air intake filter and the intake manifold. It regulates how much air can go into the engine, based on driver input through the gas pedal. As more air flows into the engine, it injects more fuel, thus allowing for more power.
    But how could the throttle body have been excluded? I had remembered checking the contract very carefully to make sure that all mechanical elements were covered.

    I asked the service adviser to point me to the section of the extended warranty which excluded it, and he told me where to look.

    Under "exclusions", I did find something like this:

    "... windshield wipers, headlight bulbs, floor mats, glass, throttle body, paint, tires, hood ornaments ..."

    How dirty!

    They purposely buried "throttle body" (mechanical) in between a bunch of super obvious cosmetic stuff which clearly would never be covered by a warranty, hoping you'd glance at it, and your eyes would skip by, as you'd think to yourself, "Yeah, of course that stuff isn't covered!"

    And it worked! I never saw "throttle body" when I read it prior to purchase. My eyes did skip right over it, as it blended in with all of the cosmetic stuff.

    This was completely intentional.

    Why was throttle body excluded? No idea. Strangely, it was the ONLY mechanical item excluded, and I ran so bad that my car's only mechanical problem for the duration of the warranty was with the throttle body.

    I then asked the service adviser if the standard BMW warranty would have covered it.

    "Yes, it would have," he replied.

    I was furious! The "it's the same thing" spiel I was given simply wasn't true!

    However, I also figured that perhaps the guy selling it to me was also fooled by this throttle body trick, and he also believed he was really selling me the same coverage. Still, that wasn't my problem. An authorized BMW dealer in Vegas repeatedly promised me the coverage was the same, and I verified it with him multiple times prior to purchasing it.

    I called the BMW place in Vegas. Unfortunately, in the two years that had passed, that service adviser had either left the company or was fired. Instead, I was given his manager.

    The manager did admit that they sold these third party warranties in 2008, and he even conceded, "We don't sell those any more. There were too many problems with them."

    So I was off to a good start. If the warranty he sold me was no longer sold by them due to "problems", clearly they had some kind of obligation to help me here. (And by "obligation", I mean how they'd look to BMW North America if they didn't help me.)

    Unfortunately, the guy initially refused to help, telling me that it was my responsibility to have read the contract and coverages prior to purchasing it.

    "As far as I can see here, the item being excluded is listed as an exclusion in the contract you signed, so I'm not sure what your problem is", he told me.

    Okay, fair point.

    However, at the same time, I was promised by the sales employee of his dealership that the two warranties were the same, which they weren't. That would supersede the contract itself from a legal standpoint, but the problem is that I had no proof of that. For all this manager knew, I could be lying about it because I simply ran into bad luck that the one mechanical exclusion was what I needed covered.

    Still, I knew I was telling the truth, and furthermore, the contract was written in a really dirty fashion, attempting to bury the "throttle body" exclusion in a place where it would be missed. So I definitely had a moral right to demand some kind of compensation here, and perhaps a legal one, too.

    We went back and forth a lot. There was actually some other mechanical work related to this problem which WAS covered, and the warranty did pay promptly. So it wasn't an outright scam. But the throttle body portion was something like $1000, and the local BMW place didn't want to release my car until I forked over that money. I also didn't want to fork over that money until this matter was settled, figuring that my negotiation position would be weaker if I paid first and asked for reimbursement later (even though these were two different dealerships with two different owners). Basically, I was hoping the dealership by my parents would help pressure the Vegas one into doing the right thing.

    Believe it or not, a month passed with this whole stalemate going on. Credit to the dealership by my parents -- they were incredibly patient with the whole thing, and their only issue was that I was driving their loaner car for a month. Finally they told me I couldn't have the loaner for free anymore -- that I'd need to return it or start paying for it, which was obviously a reasonable demand at this point, as it had been a month, and this wasn't their problem. At this point, I called the Vegas BMW place and threw down the gauntlet. I told them I would need a decision in the next 24 hours, or I would be filing both a complaint to BMW North America and a lawsuit regarding this matter. I also made the general manager aware of this.

    Later that same day, they told me they decided they would pay $500 toward the $1000 or so outstanding bill. I was told that they determined that the $500 was the "fair" resolution because:

    1) I signed a contract agreeing to this exclusion
    and
    2) They had no proof of what I was actually promised, and the employee in question had been gone for a long time

    So they felt a half/half approach was the fair resolution at that point. I wasn't thrilled with it, but I accepted it, especially knowing that a little of the responsibility was mine for not catching that throttle body exclusion in the contract.

    So that was done, I paid the other $500, and I got my car back.

    And that was the first and last time I ever purchased a third party extended warranty.


    Didn't read that novel!

    You're all idiots anyways . Everybody who drives a new car should be leasing . You lease a car for the period of the warranty. Then turn it in and lease another. For fucks sake if you are constantly trading cars in a year after you pay it off you never owned it in the first place .

    When you lease you get twice the car for the same payment if you owned . If you lease you are only paying for what you use. Oh but gookie the miles are restricted. Yep so buy more at the front end of the lease. But gookie leases are ripoffs. Wrong smart people who like to have a car every 2-4 years lease. End of story . No extended warranty required.

     
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      Zap_the_Fractions_Giraffe: chuck berry just bought a new car every year, you calling chuck berry stupid?

  19. #19
    Gold Gookieheimowitz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gookieheimowitz View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    So as I said, my BMW was about to be out of warranty back in 08, and I started looking around regarding extended warranties. I was calling around between BMW dealers (they can have a wide variance in price for the same warranty, depending upon how much profit they're willing to give up), and even researched some of the more respectable third party extended warranty companies. I also considered simply gambling and having no warranty (which is what I'm doing right now for one of my cars, and so far it's worked out).

    I happened to have my car in for service at a BMW dealer in Vegas, shortly before the warranty was over, and I asked them about their extended warranty.

    "Well, I can offer you two options", said the service adviser. "I can sell you the BMW warranty, or I can sell you this third-party warranty which is just as good, but cheaper."

    I was shocked to hear this. An authorized BMW dealer competing with BMW's own warranties? Interesting. I figured I could trust this one because there was no way a huge dealer would sell me an outright scam warranty, especially because BWM of North America punishes dealers for corporate complaints about them.

    Still, something felt off. The price difference was very large. Why would anyone buy the BMW warranty for so much extra money, when this third-party warranty was just as good? Even more perplexing, the third-party warranty had an additional strength -- you could take it to any mechanic to fix your car. The BMW warranty required an authorized BMW mechanic to work on it. So the third party warranty was more flexible, too.

    I kept repeatedly asking the guy, "So you're sure this is the same as the BMW one, right? Everything covered in the BMW one is covered here, right?"

    The service adviser repeatedly said yes.

    And this wasn't some sort of scam where the guy was selling these on the side without his bosses knowing. I bought the third party warranty, but had to interface with the guy's manager to do it, and I filled out paperwork indicating that the sale came through this BMW place.

    Of course, I repeatedly read the long contract which specified all the coverage and exclusions. Seemed totally legit. All the stuff you'd expect to be covered was covered, and the only exclusions were obvious items such as tires, paint, glass, windshield wipers, damage to the vehicle caused by accident or vandalism, etc.

    I walked out feeling like a Jew who might have just gotten the best of both worlds (an extended warranty not marked way up by BMW, but at the same time, has the credibility of a major BMW dealership selling it), but also feeling like maybe I was just a huge chump.

    The warranty was good for 3 years, meaning it lasted through mid-2011.

    In 2010, while visiting my parents, my car started acting extremely weird, and was barely driveable. I brought it to the nearest BMW place, and they gave me a loaner car (free) for the duration of the repair. I felt comfortable that this would be covered by the extended warranty, and if it wasn't, I was going to call the Vegas BMW place and raise hell.

    Then I got the bad news. My worst fears came true: It wasn't covered. Why? Because my car had a problem with the throttle body, and the throttle body was excluded by my extended warranty.

    Throttle body? What is that?



    But how could the throttle body have been excluded? I had remembered checking the contract very carefully to make sure that all mechanical elements were covered.

    I asked the service adviser to point me to the section of the extended warranty which excluded it, and he told me where to look.

    Under "exclusions", I did find something like this:

    "... windshield wipers, headlight bulbs, floor mats, glass, throttle body, paint, tires, hood ornaments ..."

    How dirty!

    They purposely buried "throttle body" (mechanical) in between a bunch of super obvious cosmetic stuff which clearly would never be covered by a warranty, hoping you'd glance at it, and your eyes would skip by, as you'd think to yourself, "Yeah, of course that stuff isn't covered!"

    And it worked! I never saw "throttle body" when I read it prior to purchase. My eyes did skip right over it, as it blended in with all of the cosmetic stuff.

    This was completely intentional.

    Why was throttle body excluded? No idea. Strangely, it was the ONLY mechanical item excluded, and I ran so bad that my car's only mechanical problem for the duration of the warranty was with the throttle body.

    I then asked the service adviser if the standard BMW warranty would have covered it.

    "Yes, it would have," he replied.

    I was furious! The "it's the same thing" spiel I was given simply wasn't true!

    However, I also figured that perhaps the guy selling it to me was also fooled by this throttle body trick, and he also believed he was really selling me the same coverage. Still, that wasn't my problem. An authorized BMW dealer in Vegas repeatedly promised me the coverage was the same, and I verified it with him multiple times prior to purchasing it.

    I called the BMW place in Vegas. Unfortunately, in the two years that had passed, that service adviser had either left the company or was fired. Instead, I was given his manager.

    The manager did admit that they sold these third party warranties in 2008, and he even conceded, "We don't sell those any more. There were too many problems with them."

    So I was off to a good start. If the warranty he sold me was no longer sold by them due to "problems", clearly they had some kind of obligation to help me here. (And by "obligation", I mean how they'd look to BMW North America if they didn't help me.)

    Unfortunately, the guy initially refused to help, telling me that it was my responsibility to have read the contract and coverages prior to purchasing it.

    "As far as I can see here, the item being excluded is listed as an exclusion in the contract you signed, so I'm not sure what your problem is", he told me.

    Okay, fair point.

    However, at the same time, I was promised by the sales employee of his dealership that the two warranties were the same, which they weren't. That would supersede the contract itself from a legal standpoint, but the problem is that I had no proof of that. For all this manager knew, I could be lying about it because I simply ran into bad luck that the one mechanical exclusion was what I needed covered.

    Still, I knew I was telling the truth, and furthermore, the contract was written in a really dirty fashion, attempting to bury the "throttle body" exclusion in a place where it would be missed. So I definitely had a moral right to demand some kind of compensation here, and perhaps a legal one, too.

    We went back and forth a lot. There was actually some other mechanical work related to this problem which WAS covered, and the warranty did pay promptly. So it wasn't an outright scam. But the throttle body portion was something like $1000, and the local BMW place didn't want to release my car until I forked over that money. I also didn't want to fork over that money until this matter was settled, figuring that my negotiation position would be weaker if I paid first and asked for reimbursement later (even though these were two different dealerships with two different owners). Basically, I was hoping the dealership by my parents would help pressure the Vegas one into doing the right thing.

    Believe it or not, a month passed with this whole stalemate going on. Credit to the dealership by my parents -- they were incredibly patient with the whole thing, and their only issue was that I was driving their loaner car for a month. Finally they told me I couldn't have the loaner for free anymore -- that I'd need to return it or start paying for it, which was obviously a reasonable demand at this point, as it had been a month, and this wasn't their problem. At this point, I called the Vegas BMW place and threw down the gauntlet. I told them I would need a decision in the next 24 hours, or I would be filing both a complaint to BMW North America and a lawsuit regarding this matter. I also made the general manager aware of this.

    Later that same day, they told me they decided they would pay $500 toward the $1000 or so outstanding bill. I was told that they determined that the $500 was the "fair" resolution because:

    1) I signed a contract agreeing to this exclusion
    and
    2) They had no proof of what I was actually promised, and the employee in question had been gone for a long time

    So they felt a half/half approach was the fair resolution at that point. I wasn't thrilled with it, but I accepted it, especially knowing that a little of the responsibility was mine for not catching that throttle body exclusion in the contract.

    So that was done, I paid the other $500, and I got my car back.

    And that was the first and last time I ever purchased a third party extended warranty.


    Didn't read that novel!

    You're all idiots anyways . Everybody who drives a new car should be leasing . You lease a car for the period of the warranty. Then turn it in and lease another. For fucks sake if you are constantly trading cars in a year after you pay it off you never owned it in the first place .

    When you lease you get twice the car for the same payment if you owned . If you lease you are only paying for what you use. Oh but gookie the miles are restricted. Yep so buy more at the front end of the lease. But gookie leases are ripoffs. Wrong smart people who like to have a car every 2-4 years lease. End of story . No extended warranty required.

    When you buy a car YOU are paying for the depriciation . When you lease the manufacturer is paying for it. Some people will never lease they feel they must own it.

    Yes Chuck Berry was stupid but was so wealthy he didn't care about it

     
    Comments
      
      Zap_the_Fractions_Giraffe: you gotta admit the Toilet Cameras were a pretty good idea though

  20. #20
    Diamond Pro Zap_the_Fractions_Giraffe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gookieheimowitz View Post
    Everybody who drives a new car should be leasing
    everybody who drives a new car should be not giving financial advice, because they are retards

    edit: that sounds mean, MOST people driving new cars are retards. like my friend who at 19 put zero down on a stripper Cavalier Coupe and ended up getting buttfucked month after month during the best years of his life for a shitty, gay car when he could have bought something 5-10 years old outright and stacked money
    Last edited by Zap_the_Fractions_Giraffe; 08-04-2018 at 01:10 PM.

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