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Thread: European Football (soccer) Super League turns into tremendous fail, teams pulling out

  1. #1
    Owner Dan Druff's Avatar
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    European Football (soccer) Super League turns into tremendous fail, teams pulling out

    I've always said that new owners of a company need to understand what people like about their product or service, or they end up ruining it.

    This is occurring in European soccer, where the American owners' attempt to create a money-generating "Super League" has backfired tremendously, and turned into a gigantic fail.

    https://www.usatoday.com/story/sport...pe/7310165002/

    The high-profile soccer teams Arsenal, Manchester United (Colonel Fabersham's favorite), and Liverpool are all owned by Americans, including Rams owner Stan Kroenke.

    They created a "Super League" -- an in-season tournament where twelve high-profile teams automatically had a place. This has been roundly rejected, and it's rapidly falling apart.




    It's now likely that Super League won't come to be, and in just two days, these American owners came to realize that their can't-lose, no-brainer idea was actually ill-advised. How do they not at least spend a little money on market research with things like this?

    Pretty incredible blunder, and it's just bringing out more resentment that these teams are owned by Americans.

  2. #2
    Gold JeffDime's Avatar
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    This is the best explanation of why this was so hated I have seen.



  3. #3
    I didnít follow this story too much, but I love watching and betting the Champions League. Had a big score
    On Bayern winning last year, was fun to follow during the down time of early Corona! I prefer them keeping the CL together, Super League idea is ďkind ofĒ cool, nice to see top teams face off but also fun to see teams like Ajax and Lyon make a run in the CL, like Porto this year. Itís a good tournament no need to scree it up. I guess I didnít realize how much Euros care about this, my goodness read a YouTube comment section on this they were up in arms!

  4. #4
    Pretty amazing how quickly and thoroughly this was universally shit on.

    I've been visiting family and haven't followed closely, but listened to a pair of 'emergency' out of cycle pods about this.

    It would eliminate the promotion/relegation nature of most leagues, where the bottom three gets relegated each year to the lower division and the top three from the lower division get bumped up. The twelve teams (six biggest English sides, three biggest Spanish sides, and three biggest Italian side) would have competed against one another in perpetuity.

    FIFA and UEFA, both shitty corrupt orgs themselves, threatened to ban players on Super League teams from playing in the World Cup and booting current sides (including my favorite team, Chelsea) from the current Champions League.

    One team, Arsenal, is owned by the same group that moved the Rams from Saint Louis to Los Angeles a few years back. They've been perpetually average (finishing 7th to 10th out of 20 teams for years now) and are decidedly not 'super'.

    Absolutely epic fail that has already led to resignations, with massive calls for other heads. Many forget that these teams are like 100x bigger globally than most football/NBA teams.

    I don't watch nearly as much as I used to, probably due for an avatar change, but a huge story and amazing that none of this was predictable to money hungry owners.
    Last edited by Sloppy Joe; 04-23-2021 at 01:07 PM.
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    Gold MrTickle's Avatar
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    The main issue for me was the elimination of promotion/relegation. The opportunity to move from the 4th league and work your way up to playing in the Premier League is an important part of the game. And some of the best teams from a few decades ago no longer play in the Premier League. Something Americans in their closed leagues with no punishment for failure will never understand.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Sloppy Joe View Post
    One team, Arsenal, is owned by the same group that moved the Rams from Saint Louis to Los Angeles a few years back. They've been perpetually average (finishing 7th to 10th out of 20 teams for years now) and are decidedly not 'super'.
    arsenal still a massive club and one of the most successful english clubs over the past few decades so can see why they would be invited, spurs on the other hand is just lol
    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    BTW JACKDANIELS is the first one banned from the thread. He is accusing me of being "duped by a middle aged man who dresses like John Cena"

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by MrTickle View Post
    The main issue for me was the elimination of promotion/relegation
    making it a closed shop meant idea was dead on arrival plus they are missing the point that playing the likes of madrid / barca / juve / etc every few seasons is what makes european football special
    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    BTW JACKDANIELS is the first one banned from the thread. He is accusing me of being "duped by a middle aged man who dresses like John Cena"

  8. #8
    also you are a couple days late todger this has already completely fell apart all the english clubs have left already
    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    BTW JACKDANIELS is the first one banned from the thread. He is accusing me of being "duped by a middle aged man who dresses like John Cena"

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by JACKDANIELS View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Sloppy Joe View Post
    One team, Arsenal, is owned by the same group that moved the Rams from Saint Louis to Los Angeles a few years back. They've been perpetually average (finishing 7th to 10th out of 20 teams for years now) and are decidedly not 'super'.
    arsenal still a massive club and one of the most successful english clubs over the past few decades so can see why they would be invited, spurs on the other hand is just lol
    Correct, Tottenham was the ridiculous one. Just a throw in.

    But Kroenke Sports & Entertainment is probably the most flagrant example of an American conglomerate swooping in and killing a club. At least Liverpool and Manchester United spend money.

    Here's Liverpool's (and the Red Sox) majority owner:

    PokerFraudAlert...will never censor your claims, even if they're against one of our sponsors. In addition to providing you an open forum report fraud within the poker community, we will also analyze your claims with a clear head an unbiased point of view. And, of course, the accused will always have the floor to defend themselves.-Dan Druff

  10. #10
    liverpool is my team so yeah ive seen that, fair play not often you see billionaires making youtube apology videos lol
    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    BTW JACKDANIELS is the first one banned from the thread. He is accusing me of being "duped by a middle aged man who dresses like John Cena"

  11. #11
    fsg have been pretty good owners for us overall they invested in the team, the stadium and the training ground so while this has obv all been a total shitshow im not on the fsg out bandwagon

     
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      Sloppy Joe: They've been great, interested to see next few years of moves
    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    BTW JACKDANIELS is the first one banned from the thread. He is accusing me of being "duped by a middle aged man who dresses like John Cena"

  12. #12
    Canadrunk limitles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JACKDANIELS View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Sloppy Joe View Post
    One team, Arsenal, is owned by the same group that moved the Rams from Saint Louis to Los Angeles a few years back. They've been perpetually average (finishing 7th to 10th out of 20 teams for years now) and are decidedly not 'super'.
    arsenal still a massive club and one of the most successful english clubs over the past few decades so can see why they would be invited, spurs on the other hand is just lol
    Casual fan says Tottenham Hotspurs get in based on best team name. Just the opposite for Arsenal....
    unbounded
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  13. #13
    i was pretty amazed that bayern and PSG were like 'fuck this shit' from the get go...

  14. #14
    A little insight from someone in the UK and some of the reasons why this was such a clusterfuck

    Promotion and relegation : We have this in all sports and it is integral. it means that with hard work/ luck/ cash injection etc etc teams can progress and make the top tier which is exciting . Even going back as little as 20 years you would see an entirely different landscape in terms of the top teams compared to now and it was only a few years back that Leicester City won the premiership. to put this into perspective before the season began you would get 5000/1 on them winning it.

    Franchises : In America clubs often uproot and change location , I think a good example would be the Oakland Raiders , this seldom happens in football ( soccer ) and when ideas like this are proposed they are often terminated. The only recent example was a new club forming called MK Dons which branched out from Wimbledon but this is 100% the exception as opposed to the norm. When you support a club it is for life and geographically ( especially smaller clubs ) this plays a huge factor. My own club was established in 1885.

    ' Football is dead' was a proclamation from the 'leader' of this treacherous pact by Real Madrid. Translated this means during the pandemic there has been less revenue and now power clubs like Barcelona and Real cannot afford to buy superstars and keep putting themselves in perpetual debt as had been the norm. What tends to happen is as revenues increase ( typically through TV ) then transfers increase, player salaries and agents. Obviously there is a simple solution, pay less in transfers, less in salaries and less in agents fees. If you are earning 150k / week then i'm sure you are pretty happy already !

    This was 100% driven by money and money only

    Out of the 12 clubs listed only a handful were actually 'super' and many relied basically on their historical achievements and notably their financial power, all 12 would be immune to relegation which for a Brit or European is a preposterous idea

    German clubs were not involved because they have 51% of the club owned by 'fans' therefore this would not have worked for them . PSG have no historical evidence to suggest they are a superclub other than the progress they have made in the last decade. They have NEVER won the CL or been successful in Europe, however, their financial clout probably made them qualify for selection and as such it was very noble to refuse, they have gone up in my estimations.

    Legacy : Some clubs have a huge legacy in the UK, we invented the sport and it is the national sport. As an example Sunderland who operate in Division 1 ( Premier, Championship, Division 1, Division 2 ) are a massive club and still get on average 30000 crowds / home game. Could you imagine a team in the U.S in the third tier getting such crowds ?

    Derby Games/ Rivalries : This is an important factor when determining the importance of a game. I can guarentee that Liverpool vs Everton, Man City vs Man Utd or even Sunderland vs Newcatle etc etc is FAR more important to supporters than playing against Barcelona, Real et al.. Whilst these games are a spectacle and of course interesting playing against the best, they are nowhere near as important.

    Atmosphere : All games have a distinct atmosphere based on crowd size, opponents and position in the table. Watching a game like Chelsea vs Aston Villa is far different compared to watching for example Millwall vs West Ham . One will be a good game with a full house and probably jovial atmosphere / environment whereas the other would be hostile beyond belief

    I hope this insight was useful

     
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    Last edited by nutty007; 04-23-2021 at 04:05 PM. Reason: adding some more info

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by nutty007 View Post
    A little insight from someone in the UK and some of the reasons why this was such a clusterfuck

    Promotion and relegation : We have this in all sports and it is integral. it means that with hard work/ luck/ cash injection etc etc teams can progress and make the top tier which is exciting . Even going back as little as 20 years you would see an entirely different landscape in terms of the top teams compared to now and it was only a few years back that Leicester City won the premiership. to put this into perspective before the season began you would get 5000/1 on them winning it.

    Franchises : In America clubs often uproot and change location , I think a good example would be the Oakland Raiders , this seldom happens in football ( soccer ) and when ideas like this are proposed they are often terminated. The only recent example was a new club forming called MK Dons which branched out from Wimbledon but this is 100% the exception as opposed to the norm. When you support a club it is for life and geographically ( especially smaller clubs ) this plays a huge factor. My own club was established in 1885.

    ' Football is dead' was a proclamation from the 'leader' of this treacherous pact by Real Madrid. Translated this means during the pandemic there has been less revenue and now power clubs like Barcelona and Real cannot afford to buy superstars and keep putting themselves in perpetual debt as had been the norm. What tends to happen is as revenues increase ( typically through TV ) then transfers increase, player salaries and agents. Obviously there is a simple solution, pay less in transfers, less in salaries and less in agents fees. If you are earning 150k / week then i'm sure you are pretty happy already !

    This was 100% driven by money and money only

    Out of the 12 clubs listed only a handful were actually 'super' and many relied basically on their historical achievements and notably their financial power, all 12 would be immune to relegation which for a Brit or European is a preposterous idea

    German clubs were not involved because they have 51% of the club owned by 'fans' therefore this would not have worked for them . PSG have no historical evidence to suggest they are a superclub other than the progress they have made in the last decade. They have NEVER won the CL or been successful in Europe, however, their financial clout probably made them qualify for selection and as such it was very noble to refuse, they have gone up in my estimations.

    Legacy : Some clubs have a huge legacy in the UK, we invented the sport and it is the national sport. As an example Sunderland who operate in Division 1 ( Premier, Championship, Division 1, Division 2 ) are a massive club and still get on average 30000 crowds / home game. Could you imagine a team in the U.S in the third tier getting such crowds ?

    Derby Games/ Rivalries : This is an important factor when determining the importance of a game. I can guarentee that Liverpool vs Everton, Man City vs Man Utd or even Sunderland vs Newcatle etc etc is FAR more important to supporters than playing against Barcelona, Real et al.. Whilst these games are a spectacle and of course interesting playing against the best, they are nowhere near as important.

    Atmosphere : All games have a distinct atmosphere based on crowd size, opponents and position in the table. Watching a game like Chelsea vs Aston Villa is far different compared to watching for example Millwall vs West Ham . One will be a good game with a full house and probably jovial atmosphere / environment whereas the other would be hostile beyond belief

    I hope this insight was useful
    It sounds like college football actually has a dynamic more similar to English soccer than any US professional sport. Teams never move location, rivalries are very important, lots of local flavor (less now that a lot of the flavor has been deemed "racist" and getting pushed out) and even mediocre teams can have very storied traditions and large and rabid fan followings (eg. Tennessee Volunteers have sucked for a long time and still draw an average of 90K fans for home games pre pandemic).

     
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  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Kalam View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by nutty007 View Post
    A little insight from someone in the UK and some of the reasons why this was such a clusterfuck

    Promotion and relegation : We have this in all sports and it is integral. it means that with hard work/ luck/ cash injection etc etc teams can progress and make the top tier which is exciting . Even going back as little as 20 years you would see an entirely different landscape in terms of the top teams compared to now and it was only a few years back that Leicester City won the premiership. to put this into perspective before the season began you would get 5000/1 on them winning it.

    Franchises : In America clubs often uproot and change location , I think a good example would be the Oakland Raiders , this seldom happens in football ( soccer ) and when ideas like this are proposed they are often terminated. The only recent example was a new club forming called MK Dons which branched out from Wimbledon but this is 100% the exception as opposed to the norm. When you support a club it is for life and geographically ( especially smaller clubs ) this plays a huge factor. My own club was established in 1885.

    ' Football is dead' was a proclamation from the 'leader' of this treacherous pact by Real Madrid. Translated this means during the pandemic there has been less revenue and now power clubs like Barcelona and Real cannot afford to buy superstars and keep putting themselves in perpetual debt as had been the norm. What tends to happen is as revenues increase ( typically through TV ) then transfers increase, player salaries and agents. Obviously there is a simple solution, pay less in transfers, less in salaries and less in agents fees. If you are earning 150k / week then i'm sure you are pretty happy already !

    This was 100% driven by money and money only

    Out of the 12 clubs listed only a handful were actually 'super' and many relied basically on their historical achievements and notably their financial power, all 12 would be immune to relegation which for a Brit or European is a preposterous idea

    German clubs were not involved because they have 51% of the club owned by 'fans' therefore this would not have worked for them . PSG have no historical evidence to suggest they are a superclub other than the progress they have made in the last decade. They have NEVER won the CL or been successful in Europe, however, their financial clout probably made them qualify for selection and as such it was very noble to refuse, they have gone up in my estimations.

    Legacy : Some clubs have a huge legacy in the UK, we invented the sport and it is the national sport. As an example Sunderland who operate in Division 1 ( Premier, Championship, Division 1, Division 2 ) are a massive club and still get on average 30000 crowds / home game. Could you imagine a team in the U.S in the third tier getting such crowds ?

    Derby Games/ Rivalries : This is an important factor when determining the importance of a game. I can guarentee that Liverpool vs Everton, Man City vs Man Utd or even Sunderland vs Newcatle etc etc is FAR more important to supporters than playing against Barcelona, Real et al.. Whilst these games are a spectacle and of course interesting playing against the best, they are nowhere near as important.

    Atmosphere : All games have a distinct atmosphere based on crowd size, opponents and position in the table. Watching a game like Chelsea vs Aston Villa is far different compared to watching for example Millwall vs West Ham . One will be a good game with a full house and probably jovial atmosphere / environment whereas the other would be hostile beyond belief

    I hope this insight was useful
    It sounds like college football actually has a dynamic more similar to English soccer than any US professional sport. Teams never move location, rivalries are very important, lots of local flavor (less now that a lot of the flavor has been deemed "racist" and getting pushed out) and even mediocre teams can have very storied traditions and large and rabid fan followings (eg. Tennessee Volunteers have sucked for a long time and still draw an average of 90K fans for home games pre pandemic).
    Yes you are correct, I would suggest it is more akin to college football than professional. Football is a tribal/ cultural thing that is pretty much a rite of passage for most kids growing up that stays with you for life through the ups and downs. A typical match day may involve getting up early, going to the pub and off course lots of chanting and singing for your team and then celebrations or commiserations after the game also invariably at the pub. What you wont see is BBQ's set up with both sets of fans enjoying each others company , that just does not happen as the rivalry is often too strong, this rivalry also breaks out into the 'hooligan ' element which is also still quite strong in the UK with pretty much all teams having their 'hooligan element' many fans will talk about not just their club but their 'firm' like the ICF, Headhunters, MIG's, Away Day Raiders, Bushwackers etc etc which forms a sub culture within. The main distinction between the fans and the hooligan element is often clothing and attire with fans typically wearing 'colours' whereas hooligans dress in Stone Island, Aquascutum, Fred Perry etc etc. Anyway I digressed but the point i am making is that culture is also a huge factor.

  17. #17
    The atmosphere is such a crucial aspect to a soccer match.

    I enjoy going to MLS games for this very reason and have brought people who swore up and down that soccer was lame, boring only for them to emerge as fans.

    Truly exhilarating.
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  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by nutty007 View Post

    German clubs were not involved because they have 51% of the club owned by 'fans' therefore this would not have worked for them . PSG have no historical evidence to suggest they are a superclub other than the progress they have made in the last decade. They have NEVER won the CL or been successful in Europe, however, their financial clout probably made them qualify for selection and as such it was very noble to refuse, they have gone up in my estimations.
    great post...thanks for clarifying...havent been watching the CL for much more than a decade...knew PSG hadn't done much, but figured from a marketing standpoint with nemar and mbappe they'd have to be included as the member of the french delegation or the whole super league idea wouldn't fly...

    let's face it...mericans came up and tried to fuck up the beauty that is european football because they aren't used to the whole idea of pay for performance (shocking given what this country is supposed to stand for) and relegation and just think that the hundreds of millions/billions are owed to them just because they own a team...

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by GambleBotsChafedPenis View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by nutty007 View Post

    German clubs were not involved because they have 51% of the club owned by 'fans' therefore this would not have worked for them . PSG have no historical evidence to suggest they are a superclub other than the progress they have made in the last decade. They have NEVER won the CL or been successful in Europe, however, their financial clout probably made them qualify for selection and as such it was very noble to refuse, they have gone up in my estimations.
    great post...thanks for clarifying...havent been watching the CL for much more than a decade...knew PSG hadn't done much, but figured from a marketing standpoint with nemar and mbappe they'd have to be included as the member of the french delegation or the whole super league idea wouldn't fly...

    let's face it...mericans came up and tried to fuck up the beauty that is european football because they aren't used to the whole idea of pay for performance (shocking given what this country is supposed to stand for) and relegation and just think that the hundreds of millions/billions are owed to them just because they own a team...
    No worries, PSG have a very good chance of winning the CL for the first time this year and you mentioned yourself the reasons why, they have Neymer and Mpabbe which is arguably the best two combination forwards in world football at present, they are still a little leaky in defence and now we are at the semi final stage who knows. The fact they are playing Manchester City in the semi finals you will probably see the best 2 teams play and either could win on their day.

    With regards U.S football as a whole it has come on leaps and bounds and I wouldn't be surprised to see the U.S actually challenging for a World Cup by the year 2035-40. they have some really good players now playing in Europe for some of the biggest clubs and based on the increasing popularity and overall population I personally think it is just a matter of time.. They have never produced a real superstar ( although this was predicted with Freddy Adu but didnt work out ) but again I think in the next decade this will happen.

  20. #20
    Gold MrTickle's Avatar
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    And if you wanna know how big of a deal this was for us Brits, take a look who chimed in: Prime Minister Boris Johnson and Prince William




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