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Thread: *** OFFICIAL *** MLB 2021 Thread

  1. #41
    That’s a great deal for the Padres outside some catastrophic injury.

    I have been unable to figure this out. How did the Padres go from the have nots to the haves? For my entire life they operated in a similar fashion to a small market team, which I think is fairly accurate. They never drew particularly well and weren’t overly popular.

    When I research their ownership group, they are wealthy of course, but don’t appear overly wealthy by franchise ownership standards.

    What am I missing? How did the Padres go from being the poor team to spending like they have over the last few seasons?

    Were they always profitable and the owners simply greedy? Did they get some huge cable deal being the only professional sports team left in San Diego?

    It’s just strange to me. The only times I’ve seen small market teams all of a sudden start spending is if they get an extraordinarily wealthy owner or a new ballpark. They are still playing in Petco and I’m struggling to see why this team that always had $40 million payrolls to being one of the over $200 million teams?

    I’m watching them spend all this money during Covid when they could never retain talent before, let alone go out and buy players and wondering what I’m missing? Are they washing money for the Tijuana cartel?

  2. #42
    All Sorts of Sports gut's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BCR View Post
    That’s a great deal for the Padres outside some catastrophic injury.

    I have been unable to figure this out. How did the Padres go from the have nots to the haves? For my entire life they operated in a similar fashion to a small market team, which I think is fairly accurate. They never drew particularly well and weren’t overly popular.

    When I research their ownership group, they are wealthy of course, but don’t appear overly wealthy by franchise ownership standards.

    What am I missing? How did the Padres go from being the poor team to spending like they have over the last few seasons?

    Were they always profitable and the owners simply greedy? Did they get some huge cable deal being the only professional sports team left in San Diego?

    It’s just strange to me. The only times I’ve seen small market teams all of a sudden start spending is if they get an extraordinarily wealthy owner or a new ballpark. They are still playing in Petco and I’m struggling to see why this team that always had $40 million payrolls to being one of the over $200 million teams?

    I’m watching them spend all this money during Covid when they could never retain talent before, let alone go out and buy players and wondering what I’m missing? Are they washing money for the Tijuana cartel?
    I think it was a mix of being generally cheap/greedy, and trying to shortcut ways to a championship. AKA copy the Marlins strategy. They forgot though that apparently only Miami is lucky enough to make that bullshit work, and they made it work twice.

    2015 was the last time the Friars went all-in, when they thought they could win the division. They went out and acquired Matt Kemp, James Shields, Justin Upton, and Craig Kimbrel, among others. It didn't work, they finished below .500, and then immediately sold off most of those guys after the year.

    Bringing the story full-circle, the return for trading Shields to the White Sox included.....Tatis Jr!
    Last edited by gut; 02-18-2021 at 01:17 PM.

  3. #43
    It will be interesting if anyone in San Diego will give any fucks about their team. I think the rest of the country will care more than SoCal.

    If anyone can light that fuse it will be Tatis. Can’t wait

  4. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by Sanlmar View Post
    It will be interesting if anyone in San Diego will give any fucks about their team. I think the rest of the country will care more than SoCal.

    If anyone can light that fuse it will be Tatis. Can’t wait
    well, the Padres are the only pro franchise in the major sports (no football, baseketball, hockey) and SDSU is the only top college football program in town...little competition in spectator sports market...the deal should have a market

     
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      garrett: Marshall Faulk rep =)...
    (long before there was a PFA i had my Grenade & Crossbones avatar at DD)

  5. #45
    Owner Dan Druff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BCR View Post
    That’s a great deal for the Padres outside some catastrophic injury.

    I have been unable to figure this out. How did the Padres go from the have nots to the haves? For my entire life they operated in a similar fashion to a small market team, which I think is fairly accurate. They never drew particularly well and weren’t overly popular.

    When I research their ownership group, they are wealthy of course, but don’t appear overly wealthy by franchise ownership standards.

    What am I missing? How did the Padres go from being the poor team to spending like they have over the last few seasons?

    Were they always profitable and the owners simply greedy? Did they get some huge cable deal being the only professional sports team left in San Diego?

    It’s just strange to me. The only times I’ve seen small market teams all of a sudden start spending is if they get an extraordinarily wealthy owner or a new ballpark. They are still playing in Petco and I’m struggling to see why this team that always had $40 million payrolls to being one of the over $200 million teams?

    I’m watching them spend all this money during Covid when they could never retain talent before, let alone go out and buy players and wondering what I’m missing? Are they washing money for the Tijuana cartel?
    I don't completely understand this either.

    It doesn't help that a lot of people in the area are Dodgers fans, which is why sometimes Dodgers road games in San Diego sound like home games.

    I took a tour of Petco in 2010. It was a much better deal than the tour I took of Fenway. I think the Fenway tour cost $14 in 2007, and was your standard stadium tour. You also got nothing at the end. The Petco tour was $9, and you got taken all over the stadium, including the clubhouse. We even ran into Chase Headley, who had just turned a corner and was startled to see a big group of people in his face!

    At the end of the tour, they gave everyone a free Padres cap -- one which would cost far more than $9 if bought separately! Wow!

    During the tour, we happened to walk by a Padres season tickets sales pitch to a group of people there for that purpose. The guy doing the pitch stopped our group and said, "Oh, if anyone in the tour wants to come to the dinner we're having tonight, let me know, and all of you will be welcome!" The college version of me would have jumped at that, but at age 38 I wasn't going to jack a free dinner from the Padres. Maybe from the Giants, but not the Padres.

  6. #46
    Owner Dan Druff's Avatar
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    Regarding Tatis, there are three real risks to it:

    1) The obvious injury situation. However, they will definitely have an insurance policy on this, so the risk isn't as big as it appears to be.

    2) The risk of him falling into the toilet, BJ Upton style. As gut already mentioned, Tatis is more talented than BJ Upton. However, it should also be noted that Tatis' dad fell off pretty badly after a great season at age 24. While Junior is better than Daddy, it's still something to note. There's also the realistic chance that an injury changes the trajectory of his career, even if he's only out a year or so.

    3) The free agent price steeply declining over the next decade. It doesn't seem like it now, given that Bauer is getting $40m to pitch this year, but there has been a general push away from monster free agent contracts, and this will be hastened by the expiration of those horrible cable TV deals around the country, as time passes. It's also unknown what COVID will do to baseball long term. For example, stadiums may have to operate at less capacity for many years to come. It's very possible that we will see a regression in baseball salaries, making Tatis eventually stand out as an outlier in pay.

    Also, Tatis is only 2 seasons in, so he could have been had cheaply for the next 4 seasons. That also has to be figured into the "deal" he got.


    I do wonder if we're going to start seeing more of the following in baseball contracts:

    1) Bauer-type deals -- more money per year, shorter duration.

    2) Tatis-type deals -- locking up superstars under team control early, for contracts which extend all or most of their career.

    3) The end of lucrative 3-4 year contracts for mid-level players, to where they are forced to take less money and/or less time.


    In general, I feel that middling players are overpaid right now, and superstars are actually worth the big money -- but only while they're young enough to be superstars. I think that the analytics nerds are realizing this, as well.

  7. #47
    Strangely I heard the former Marlins GM David Samson, who is a colorful and arrogant guy, but also kind of blunt talk about this after this thread yesterday.

    The owner is rather new according to him. He said he’s trying to avoid what he had to deal with and other teams have to deal with with stars. He got asked for 3 years about what are you going to do with Stanton? Any GM of a struggling team will get bombarded with this for years. He was against the move as he stressed the fact he has only played 143 games, and whatever he projects at, you can’t know.

    He said there is a concerted push to make Tatis Jr the face of baseball as he’s a guy who is willing to sign autographs and do the fan stuff. Baseball doesn’t have any marketable guys.

    In general, he didn’t like the move. Said this isn’t the NBA where having $600 million wrapped up in Machado and Tatis Jr guarantees anything. You need to also be able to surround them with talent. He’s a blowhard and was Loria’s lapdog down there in Miami, but always an entertaining listen. It was the local hour of the Lebatard podcast.

    The Indians have did this buy the arb years thing and give guys a little more earlier move since the 90s. Those John Hart teams that we had. He may have started that movement? It’s generally almost always worked for us, and it’s the only reason why we have Jose Ramirez right now until 2024. Lindor had a better agent and declined when approached years ago.

    The thing is, Cleveland has always gotten a better deal out of it, and have been generally right with their choices on who to pay, and we paid Jose $6.25 million last year, and have him at $9 million this year, and $12 and $14 the following two. Clearly that’s insane value.

    When you average in 4 years of arb for Tatis Jr, you are probably averaging this contract upwards of $30 million. That strikes me as likely cheap and a great deal barring a change in the entire landscape of MLB, as he looks as sure thing as anyone can get, but you never know.

    As an Indians fan, it’s painful to lose guys as our scouts, farm system, and player development has done so well the past 15 years that many have walked. I’d prefer to keep them, but not at the cost of losing the team. As long as this owner is in charge, I will never be comfortable that they wouldn’t move if they fucked up for $300 million. I wish Gilbert would have bought them as he’s top 20 in the world rich at this point.

  8. #48
    All Sorts of Sports gut's Avatar
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    John Fisher owns the Oakland A's, bought originally for $150m and now valued at $1.1b. He also is one of the grifter owners who pumps nothing back into his asset. Covid has made this even worse, as now it appears the A's (as a stand-alone business) are cash-poor!

    Deferred payments aren't exactly new in MLB, but it usually only shows up with monster deals, and tends to benefit both the player and team. "Hey Bryce Harper, you don't really need $28m a year right? We'll give you 24 and pay out the rest until you're 50 years old like a retirement account!" Then of course there was the strange Bobby Bonilla situation, where he still gets a million a year between 2011- 2035 from a buyout in 2001.

    Oakland this offseason is making all free agent offers 1 year offers with deferred payments! They offered their FA SS Semien 1/12.5, with it deferred for x amount of years. He probably wiped his ass with the offer while signing with Toronto for 1/18. They pivoted off that and used that money to sign closer Trevor Rosenthal for 1 year $11m. Except they will pay him 3m this year, 3m in 2022, and 5m in 2023! Thats just sad.

    Fisher's overall personal net worth is 2.9b by the way.

    EDIT: apparently the Nats did the same thing with Brad Hand. Not really surprising, as speaking of my hypothetical Bryce Harper example, when they tried to keep him they were offering A LOT of the money in deferrals.
    Last edited by gut; 02-19-2021 at 11:49 AM.

  9. #49
    Quote Originally Posted by Daly View Post
    What this ownership group is doing to my beloved Red Sox is a travesty. You are the Boston Red Sox with a history of supposed history of racism and you trade away the best young black player of the last 20 years in the name of reseting the luxury tax..... when you getting $1 a month from every house in New a England via your NESN deal. Now to follow up you start by trading away Benitendi for a ham sandwich. Your rotation is garbage.

    Seriously fuck this team. If I still owned my season tickets I’d give them up.
    Which Dodger World Series Championship do you think is Druff’s favorite ?

  10. #50
    Fun read for us seamheads

    Fernando Tatis Jr. Owes Investment Fund Estimated $27.2M After Padres Contract
    https://bleacherreport.com/articles/...adres-contract

    College baseball has already started. Can’t wait

  11. #51
    All Sorts of Sports gut's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sanlmar View Post
    Fun read for us seamheads

    Fernando Tatis Jr. Owes Investment Fund Estimated $27.2M After Padres Contract
    https://bleacherreport.com/articles/...adres-contract

    College baseball has already started. Can’t wait
    Yeah I had read another couple articles about that. Interesting business model. I see a lot of mouth-breathers on the net trashing them as a payday loan type scam, but thats not true. The company also likes to blow its own horn about how much they help the kids, but that is also not true, as theyre not just giving money to everybody. Joe Blow the 35th round draft pick relief pitcher who can't throw 90 aint getting a sniff of money from them. For those that do get offered a deal, it is a pretty decent hedge.

    I am more interested in why Tatis specifically took the money. His dad made $25m in his career contract wise. Jr also got $700k himself when he signed as an international free agent at age 16, ("Brown Privilege" as whiteys who are subjected to the draft in America call it). I guess 700k doesnt go as far as it used to.

    Tatis himself is right when he says basically that what he owes back is still a drop in the bucket overall. But for a kid who presumably smashed through 700k in just two years, I am starting to think he might need every million he makes. Kid has future Adrian Peterson vibes going right now.

     
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      Sanlmar: I knew the rule but never heard it called brown privilege.

  12. #52
    Children of rich parents make bad decisions too. Maybe more so as consequences are foreign in their world.

    Regardless, Tatis is going to smash endorsements in a way Betts and Trout can’t or won’t. He might become his generation’s Payton Manning for all I know. It appears everyone including the MLB want this to be so. So yeah, $27m is just an ante into the game.

    As an aside .... I lived through the Manning vs Brady “who is better argument” for a decade. I was Brady yet I think Manning is funny and effective. Masterful. My kids watch him and cannot fathom why I’m laughing. Tatis is their boy.

    Then again, every 10 year old had a Michael Vick jersey too and that was Adrian Peterson-esque.

    NHL’s Evander Kane is the broke athlete you want to dive into. YouTube has a good piece or two. Over a decade of earnings and over $70m vaporized as he is in bankruptcy owing casinos and who knows what all.

    What fascinates me is that

    a.) no one had a whiff of what was going on
    b.) watching him play today at an elite level as if everything is groovy. I mean he likes to fight on ice and that’s a nice release but impressive nevertheless.

     
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      gut: had no idea about Kane, will check it out
    Last edited by Sanlmar; 02-22-2021 at 10:15 AM.

  13. #53
    All Sorts of Sports gut's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sanlmar View Post

    As an aside .... I lived through the Manning vs Brady “who is better argument” for a decade. I was Brady yet I think Manning is funny and effective. Masterful. My kids watch him and cannot fathom why I’m laughing. Tatis is their boy.
    Peyton got some great coaching off the field as well. His schtick is perfect. Self-deprecating doofus. I love Peyton's places, especially the one with Letterman.

    Also his SNL episode is top 10 all-time. This skit I seriously consider to be close to GOAT status:


     
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      Sanlmar: Laughing involves muscles that I haven’t used lately. HOF

  14. #54
    Self deprecating doesn’t play to the kids.

    Right? On the field it’s bat flips and show boating. I kinda gravitate that way tbh. I like hitting batters and confrontation. That’s been missing for too long.

    Off the field I don’t like the gold teeth and the me me me hip hop stuff. I clearly understand I’m not the audience. I’m okay with that. I see the Tatis beverage ad and I get it but it’s a pass for me.

    Peyton dodged the whole misogyny scandal successfully. Miraculous actually.

  15. #55
    Fatty Guerrero JR has lost 42lbs for upcoming season.

    As he’s said before, he was embarrassed by the shape he came into camp the last couple years and says he has a lot to prove.



    LFG

  16. #56
    Owner Dan Druff's Avatar
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    Weird story about a minor league team "ghosted" by the Giants.

    In December, MLB restructured the way minor league teams are affiliated with Major League teams. This caused some teams to be dropped. However, the Giants did this in a particularly callous way, failing to notify any of the teams which were dropped.

    To this day, the Salem-Keizer Volcanoes, a single-A affiliate of the Giants, has not been contacted by the Giants regarding being dropped. They found out in a tweet on December 9, like everyone else:

    https://twitter.com/#!/x/status/1336747950958026752


    Here's an interesting article about the situation, where the 23-year-old CEO of the team (!!) is wondering what to do next:

    https://www.sfgate.com/giants/articl...s-15990389.php

  17. #57
    Lovable nut job Bauer. Dodgers developing some character after years of under achievement



    Dodgers RHP prospect Ryan Pepiot is just plain filthy too.

    They are getting really interesting.

  18. #58
    Gold Jayjami's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sanlmar View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Daly View Post
    What this ownership group is doing to my beloved Red Sox is a travesty. You are the Boston Red Sox with a history of supposed history of racism and you trade away the best young black player of the last 20 years in the name of reseting the luxury tax..... when you getting $1 a month from every house in New a England via your NESN deal. Now to follow up you start by trading away Benitendi for a ham sandwich. Your rotation is garbage.

    Seriously fuck this team. If I still owned my season tickets I’d give them up.
    Which Dodger World Series Championship do you think is Druff’s favorite ?
    A lot of people pick the 88 team, but for me it was 81. All the players I grew up watching finally won a title and they beat the Yankees to boot.

  19. #59
    Quote Originally Posted by Jayjami View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Sanlmar View Post

    Which Dodger World Series Championship do you think is Druff’s favorite ?
    A lot of people pick the 88 team, but for me it was 81. All the players I grew up watching finally won a title and they beat the Yankees to boot.
    Transistor radio in Phoenix as a kid listening to Vin Scully every night. The scriptures teach us ‘81 is correct. No asterisk.

  20. #60
    Quote Originally Posted by Sanlmar View Post
    Lovable nut job Bauer. Dodgers developing some character after years of under achievement



    Dodgers RHP prospect Ryan Pepiot is just plain filthy too.

    They are getting really interesting.
    Kershaw can’t even get out a guy talking on the phone:

    https://www.kansascity.com/sports/sp...sWJJ9BWosQhbSA

     
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      Sanlmar: the sweet release of death.
      
      gut: not as funny as mic'd up Mookie, but still quality
    It's hilarious that we as a society think everyone can be a dr, a lawyer, an engineer. Some people are just fucking stupid. Why can't we just accept that?

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