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Thread: Interesting article about major banks allowing large criminal organizations to easily move money around

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    Owner Dan Druff's Avatar
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    Interesting article about major banks allowing large criminal organizations to easily move money around

    https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article...minal-networks

    This paragraph sums it up nicely:

    Laws that were meant to stop financial crime have instead allowed it to flourish. So long as a bank files a notice that it may be facilitating criminal activity, it all but immunizes itself and its executives from criminal prosecution. The suspicious activity alert effectively gives them a free pass to keep moving the money and collecting the fees.

    So basically what happens is that the banks are fully aware that major criminals are using their services, but by filing the SARs (suspicious activity reports), they've completed their legal obligations, and then they can knowingly serve these criminals without worry about any regulatory issues.

    In the meantime, these SARs backlog and aren't properly investigated by the government, so nothing gets done.




    What's also infuriating to people like me is that banks ARE shutting down accounts for online gambling transactions. Also, almost every bank in the US now forbids depositing cash into third party accounts -- something which was widely allowed just 5 years ago.

    They're making it tough on the non-criminal individuals who just want to gamble or make 4-figure cash deposits to each other, and they're welcoming huge criminal organizations.

    Unbelievable.

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    100% Organic MumblesBadly's Avatar
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    More evidence that the US government only cares about money laundering when it’s related to a line of business that is politically expediant to go after.

     
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      Shizzmoney: this
    _____________________________________________
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    I actually hope this [second impeachment] succeeds, because I want Trump put down politically like a sick, 14-year-old dog. ... I don't want him complicating the 2024 primary season. I just want him done.
    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    Were Republicans cowardly or unethical not to go along with [convicting Trump in the second impeachment Senate trial]? No. The smart move was to reject it.

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    At the end of today buy a us financial services etf.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MumblesBadly View Post
    More evidence that the US government only cares about money laundering when it’s related to a line of business that is politically expediant to go after.

    Do it like Pruitt and buy some.


    ———good buddy

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    Gold Wiganer's Avatar
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    Reports come at same time as more revelations about Russian donations to UK Conservative party, who have confirmed that they are a bunch of traitorous shysters.
    Quote Originally Posted by Tyde View Post
    I stay to myself and keep out of trouble and/or potentially problematic scenarios

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    Diamond TheXFactor's Avatar
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    I'm sure it's just the tip of the iceberg.

    Banks can file an SAR for transactions as little as $2,000.

    Buy a money order or cashiers check from a bank for cash over $3,000? That sets off an automatic CTR (currency transaction report)

    Banks will not be held accountable.

    HSBC has been caught many times for money laudering for terrorists and drug cartels.

    At worst they will be hit with a fine equal to a few days of revenue.


    Last edited by TheXFactor; 09-21-2020 at 09:31 AM.

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    Owner Dan Druff's Avatar
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    A few years ago, I went to go make an $8500 cash withdrawal from a local Wells Fargo. It wasn't the one I had typically visited, but it was about 15 miles away from where I lived.

    About a week earlier I had made a deposit of a $27k check. The website showed the funds available.

    I went to go withdraw that $8500, intended to be used on a gambling trip (I didn't reveal the reason for withdrawal, though).

    They acted really funny. The teller walked away, then came back and told me the funds weren't available. Here's how the conversation went:

    Her: "Sir, we can't process the withdrawal. The funds aren't available."

    Me: "That's incorrect. The website said they were available."

    Her: "You have to understand. A large check was deposited. The funds can take some time to be available."

    Me: "Right. Which is why I waited until the website said they were available before coming to get them."

    We debated back and forth and got nowhere. I asked for the manager, who was just as stupid.

    Manager: "Sir, the check that was deposited was large enough to where we need a little more time before the funds are available for withdrawal."

    Me: "I'm not understanding what's going on here. Are you saying your own website was wrong when it said the funds were available? If it was, how is the customer supposed to tell?"

    Manager: "I know the website said that. It's not wrong."

    Me: "Okay, if it's not wrong, then let me have my $8500, because that means it's available."

    Manager: "Just because it says the funds are available doesn't mean the funds are really available."

    Me: "What?? That's absurd! They're either available or they're not. If it says available and they're actually not, that means your website IS wrong when it displays that. So is that what you're saying?"

    Manager: "No. We make it available as a courtesy to the customer, but it's not fully available yet."

    Me: "How is it a courtesy to me if you're displaying my money is available, and you won't let me get even 1/3 of it?"

    Manager: "It would really be best if you just waited a few more days, and..."

    Me: "Nope. Not doing that. Your website says available, you agree it's not an error, therefore you are legally required to give me my funds now. I'm not walking out of here until you either give me my $8500, or you give me proof that the website displayed 'available' in error."

    Manager: "If you could just please work with us, and wait just..."

    Me: "As I said, no. Should we maybe call the district manager? I can tell you that unless you can prove that the website was in error, which it seems you're not even claiming, nothing you say will convince me to back down on this."


    They went back to talk for a few minutes, then the manager authorized the teller to give me the $8500 as a "one time courtesy".

    LOL

    I submitted a corporate complaint, but of course never heard back.

    My guess is that some kind of bullshit risk warning popped up on their screen, and they were trying to stall me to wait a bit longer, even though their central system had declared the funds available. So strange.

     
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      MumblesBadly: Fuck Wells Fargo! They are THE worst!!!

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    Cubic Zirconia
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    My dad did that years ago,he asked for a 10k withdraw, they said he had to wait, he said " Fine close the account and give me my money in cash".

    And they did, almost 35k.

    Never figured that one out.



    Sent from my LM-V600 using Tapatalk

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    Owner Dan Druff's Avatar
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    HSBC is an ever bigger joke than Wells.

    Despite the above hassle with Wells, along with other fails I've encountered with them, and despite the fact that they fraudulently opened a credit card for my mom during that whole scandal period, I still use them.

    HSBC displayed stunning levels of incompetence when I dealt with them.

    When I first opened an account there about 5 or so years ago, everything seemed great. I was assigned a "relationship banker" to directly deal with me, and everyone basically kissed my ass and acted like they'd be really helpful. I was impressed.

    It was all a huge facade.

    My problems occurred from something relatively simple: I opened up a credit card they recommended. I wasn't even looking to open a credit card. My "relationship banker" suggested it at the end of one of our conversations, and said there was a $250 bonus for spending $4000, or something like that. It was of marginal value to me (I usually want at least $300 to bother with this), but I said fuck it and gave him permission to open it for me.

    I got the credit card, spent the $4000 or whatever was required, and waited for my $250 to post.

    Nothing.

    I was then told that I had to use some totally unprofessional-looking "rewards site" run by a third party in order to claim my $250. Oooooookay. Totally non-standard. Usually the money or points just automatically post. I was told that the credit card was a "new product" and they hadn't developed it as well as banks like Chase or Citi. Well, thanks for telling me now, asshole.

    But whatever. I went through the motions to get my $250. Still nothing.

    Then I got a weird looking e-mail which looked like phishing, telling me that my "purchase couldn't be delivered", and to either click a link or call an 800 number. I was sure this was a scam, but I called the 800 number for lulz. Then I was told something about HSBC, and I was like, "Ohhhhhhhhh.... it's about the $250!" Nothing in the e-mail had said anything about HSBC -- only a "purchase" that got declined. LOL!

    Anwyay, the rep on the phone said this was indeed about my $250, and that some failure occurred and it couldn't be given to me. She couldn't explain why, and said she worked for a third party company that "just processes orders". What?!

    I called my relationship banker, who started getting rude to me. "I told you to go on the website to do it," he barked. When I told him it didn't work, and the weird e-mail I got, he replied, "You just have to be patient. Just submit it again!" He was treating me like I was being a jerk for wanting $250 in points I had earned -- on a credit card he sold me! Also, he was providing no solutions, just telling me to repeatedly submit it and pray.

    I submitted it a second time, and about 2 weeks later, got the same rejection.

    This time I called the branch manager, who sounded like Colonel Nigel Fabersham. I had spoken to him when I opened the account. At the time, he sounded like a proper and professional British banker, and was extremely friendly.

    This time he started off seemingly nice and helpful, but when he realized there was no solution here, he got progressively ruder with me. He eventually hung up on me when I repeated that I needed him to help me fix the problem!

    Keep in mind that I would have LOVED not to have involved these assholes, but the national HSBC number, which also handed credit card matters, told me that my "local branch" had to fix this issue, and that the $250 comes from their promo budget, or some weird shit like that.

    This idiot manager even broke the law by calling my mom to complain about me (not kidding), because she also had an account there. Keep in mind this was like 5 years ago, not when I wasn't anywhere near a minor. (He later gave the excuse that he thought it was a joint account, which it wasn't. LOL!!) My mom told him that he was breaking the law by calling her about my account, and he angrily hung up on her, too.

    Anyway, lots more outrageous shit happened, but I won't bother contuining.

    I eventually figured out that HSBC neuters the local branches. The relationship banker pretends to be able to help you, but is granted zero power. The branch manger is the same. Once anything needs some non-standard intervention, these "bankers" are powerless to help you, but they also are instructed to maintain the facade of having it all under control. Therefore, if you need and demand action, they start to lose their phony helpful demeanor and start getting aggressively angry.

    Eventually I got this resolved via the district manager, who admitted the above to me. She wasn't even empowered to fix it. She had to go like 3 levels up to get the $250 granted to me, which she admitted the whole way wouldn't have been fixed by anything the local branch was instructing me to do. At the same time, she didn't seem interested in the stories of the rudeness and unprofessional behavior, despite having witnessed one of them when the Brit manager was screaming at me on the phone when she happened to visit the branch. (She claimed it was "inappropriate" and she "coached him at the time", but wasn't even interested in hearing the details of what happened.) She admitted he made a "mistake" regarding calling my mom, but claimed it was just a simple error in thinking it was a joint account, rather than a manager of a bank branch trying to cry to a grown man's mommy about an account dispute. I felt like I was in the fucking Twilight Zone having this conversation.

    Anyway, once the $250 hit, I withdrew all my money and closed my credit card.

    Fuck HSBC.

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    Gold MrTickle's Avatar
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    There's a gambling link in these papers. Remember New Frontier Hotel and Casino? It was owned by El-Ad Group, an Israeli settler group. They own a lot of property in Palestine. Anyway, these SARs have shown the biggest donater to El-Ad was Roman Abramovich.

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    Plutonium Sanlmar's Avatar
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    HSBC & Wells will be the Lord & Taylor and Macy’s of banking sooner than you know.

    Retail banking as we knew it is in its last throes. The meteor is homing in on these dinosaurs.

    Car dealerships will outlast them by a few hours but that’s another story.

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    Platinum ftpjesus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CrackPipes and Kakfights View Post
    At the end of today buy a us financial services etf.
    Some serious Puts being posted on Options market for $XLF. The Nov monthly calls at 26 are down to 40cts and the index is sitting at $24.10 2 months from contract date. That doesn’t bode well.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    A few years ago, I went to go make an $8500 cash withdrawal from a local Wells Fargo. It wasn't the one I had typically visited, but it was about 15 miles away from where I lived.

    About a week earlier I had made a deposit of a $27k check. The website showed the funds available.

    I went to go withdraw that $8500, intended to be used on a gambling trip (I didn't reveal the reason for withdrawal, though).

    They acted really funny. The teller walked away, then came back and told me the funds weren't available. Here's how the conversation went:

    Her: "Sir, we can't process the withdrawal. The funds aren't available."

    Me: "That's incorrect. The website said they were available."

    Her: "You have to understand. A large check was deposited. The funds can take some time to be available."

    Me: "Right. Which is why I waited until the website said they were available before coming to get them."

    We debated back and forth and got nowhere. I asked for the manager, who was just as stupid.

    Manager: "Sir, the check that was deposited was large enough to where we need a little more time before the funds are available for withdrawal."

    Me: "I'm not understanding what's going on here. Are you saying your own website was wrong when it said the funds were available? If it was, how is the customer supposed to tell?"

    Manager: "I know the website said that. It's not wrong."

    Me: "Okay, if it's not wrong, then let me have my $8500, because that means it's available."

    Manager: "Just because it says the funds are available doesn't mean the funds are really available."

    Me: "What?? That's absurd! They're either available or they're not. If it says available and they're actually not, that means your website IS wrong when it displays that. So is that what you're saying?"

    Manager: "No. We make it available as a courtesy to the customer, but it's not fully available yet."

    Me: "How is it a courtesy to me if you're displaying my money is available, and you won't let me get even 1/3 of it?"

    Manager: "It would really be best if you just waited a few more days, and..."

    Me: "Nope. Not doing that. Your website says available, you agree it's not an error, therefore you are legally required to give me my funds now. I'm not walking out of here until you either give me my $8500, or you give me proof that the website displayed 'available' in error."

    Manager: "If you could just please work with us, and wait just..."

    Me: "As I said, no. Should we maybe call the district manager? I can tell you that unless you can prove that the website was in error, which it seems you're not even claiming, nothing you say will convince me to back down on this."


    They went back to talk for a few minutes, then the manager authorized the teller to give me the $8500 as a "one time courtesy".

    LOL

    I submitted a corporate complaint, but of course never heard back.

    My guess is that some kind of bullshit risk warning popped up on their screen, and they were trying to stall me to wait a bit longer, even though their central system had declared the funds available. So strange.
    More like the fractional lending bullshyt all the banks are into. They want your money to make money on it but dare to ask for some of it back and they shit a brick.

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    Silver JohnCommode's Avatar
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    The banks, for obvious reasons, seem to be stricter with people with more modest transactions rather than with the big guys.

    For instance, American digital nomads working remotely in Europe or Asia will often have their accounts in their American banks closed for some trivial reason like "too many foreign logins". These smaller accounts are simply not worth the trouble of potential regulatory scrutiny.

    Since it can be difficult for American digital nomads to open modest bank accounts in Europe as non-residents and non-citizens, they might open accounts in funky places like the Seychelles or the Cook Islands and find out that the banks of their clients will refuse to wire money to these accounts and so they can't get paid for their work.

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    100% Organic MumblesBadly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    Despite the above hassle with Wells, along with other fails I've encountered with them, and despite the fact that they fraudulently opened a credit card for my mom during that whole scandal period, I still use them.
    Could you elaborate why to continue to give these fucking criminal cheaters your business?
    _____________________________________________
    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    I actually hope this [second impeachment] succeeds, because I want Trump put down politically like a sick, 14-year-old dog. ... I don't want him complicating the 2024 primary season. I just want him done.
    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    Were Republicans cowardly or unethical not to go along with [convicting Trump in the second impeachment Senate trial]? No. The smart move was to reject it.

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    100% Organic MumblesBadly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sanlmar View Post
    HSBC & Wells will be the Lord & Taylor and Macy’s of banking sooner than you know.

    Retail banking as we knew it is in its last throes. The meteor is homing in on these dinosaurs.

    Car dealerships will outlast them by a few hours but that’s another story.
    Even Carvana? I am seeing more and more of those facilities around the country.
    _____________________________________________
    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    I actually hope this [second impeachment] succeeds, because I want Trump put down politically like a sick, 14-year-old dog. ... I don't want him complicating the 2024 primary season. I just want him done.
    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    Were Republicans cowardly or unethical not to go along with [convicting Trump in the second impeachment Senate trial]? No. The smart move was to reject it.

  17. #17
    Plutonium Sanlmar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MumblesBadly View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Sanlmar View Post
    HSBC & Wells will be the Lord & Taylor and Macy’s of banking sooner than you know.

    Retail banking as we knew it is in its last throes. The meteor is homing in on these dinosaurs.

    Car dealerships will outlast them by a few hours but that’s another story.
    Even Carvana? I am seeing more and more of those facilities around the country.
    They are an Amazon of Autos. They literally started delivering cars to your driveway with a click of the mouse during COVID. They won’t stop.

    I’m referring to the family run Buick dealership in Michigan.

    You never see the Capital One ads. “We reinvented banking”. Some metrosexual walks thru a renovated branch talking about how it looks like a coffee bar now. I don’t need pastry and free WiFi. Retail banking is lost and flailing around.

    Every single kid I talk to who is all juiced about real estate is using Rocket Mortgage. Every single one.
    Last edited by Sanlmar; 09-22-2020 at 09:26 AM.

  18. #18
    100% Organic MumblesBadly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sanlmar View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by MumblesBadly View Post

    Even Carvana? I am seeing more and more of those facilities around the country.
    They are an Amazon of Autos. They literally started [/]delivering cars to your driveway with a click of the mouse[/b] during COVID. They won’t stop.

    I’m referring to the family run Buick dealership in Michigan.
    Damn COVID. Taking some of the fun out of buying a new car.

    _____________________________________________
    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    I actually hope this [second impeachment] succeeds, because I want Trump put down politically like a sick, 14-year-old dog. ... I don't want him complicating the 2024 primary season. I just want him done.
    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    Were Republicans cowardly or unethical not to go along with [convicting Trump in the second impeachment Senate trial]? No. The smart move was to reject it.

  19. #19
    Owner Dan Druff's Avatar
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    Interesting comparison to car dealerships, Sanlmar.

    You're probably right. I've seen the car dealership model change over the years, and even when I made my last auto purchase in 2015, I was informed by the sales manager that "we'll probably be at a fixed price model by the time you come back to buy your next car."

    He wasn't trying to sell me anything further. Just making conversation.

    The end of the car dealership era isn't a good thing for the smart Jew consumer. Much like a dream coming true comes at the expense of other dreams having been shattered, a good deal comes at the expense of someone else getting a bad deal before/after you.

    Fixed price models punish the good negotiator, and help the bad negotiator.

    But it's beyond the pricing model. I agree that the dealership model is antiquated. It came into existence when you couldn't go online, and when there was no way to price shop without physically visiting each dealership. Nowadays, it's needless overhead -- the expensive showroom, the mostly-useless salesmen on commission, the bureaucracy between the dealership and the manufacturer...

    A lot of that can be cut out. In fact, that's what I've done the last few times I've bought a car, by simply calling in and speaking to the sales manager, and refusing to visit until the deal is done.

    Eventually the dealerships will all be branches of the manufacturer, and there will be no commissioned sales jobs. There will be -- and already are -- more sales done online, where the buyer never even visits the dealership.

    It's coming.

  20. #20
    Master of Props Daly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    Interesting comparison to car dealerships, Sanlmar.

    You're probably right. I've seen the car dealership model change over the years, and even when I made my last auto purchase in 2015, I was informed by the sales manager that "we'll probably be at a fixed price model by the time you come back to buy your next car."

    He wasn't trying to sell me anything further. Just making conversation.

    The end of the car dealership era isn't a good thing for the smart Jew consumer. Much like a dream coming true comes at the expense of other dreams having been shattered, a good deal comes at the expense of someone else getting a bad deal before/after you.

    Fixed price models punish the good negotiator, and help the bad negotiator.

    But it's beyond the pricing model. I agree that the dealership model is antiquated. It came into existence when you couldn't go online, and when there was no way to price shop without physically visiting each dealership. Nowadays, it's needless overhead -- the expensive showroom, the mostly-useless salesmen on commission, the bureaucracy between the dealership and the manufacturer...

    A lot of that can be cut out. In fact, that's what I've done the last few times I've bought a car, by simply calling in and speaking to the sales manager, and refusing to visit until the deal is done.

    Eventually the dealerships will all be branches of the manufacturer, and there will be no commissioned sales jobs. There will be -- and already area -- more sales done online, where the buyer never even visits the dealership.

    It's coming.

    Yup - it’s called Tesla

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