So coronavirus is definitely going to kill a few of us.

[gut]

Show me the science. Show me the intelligence.

I read all those Nature articles. There is no science at all in them. They are just completely uneducated opinion pieces at best, and at worst they are deliberate misinformation.

just bullshit right
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41591-020-0820-9

I'm guessing you didn't read that.

[gut]

just bullshit right
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41591-020-0820-9

Did you read the article. Their "science" is that the virus is most similar to those found in bats thousands of miles away, but the binding region of the spike protein is most similar to something found in pangolins, which is thousands of miles away in a different direction.

And guess what, the way biology works the fact the virus is 96% similar to those found in bats in SW China actually heavily implies this virus originally came from bats in SW China. And guess what, there is no reasonable way for bat coronaviruses from SW China to end up in Wuhan, even through intermediate hosts, without them being deliberately transferred alive, such as for biological research.

How the fuck do any of these facts support transfer from a local zoonotic source via wet markets (that dont sell bats, and certainly dont sell bats from caves in SW China)?

Your science supports my theory, not yours.

Shit you beat me to it lol.

[sonatine]

trump claiming hes seen evidence it came from wuhan lab.

could be true. could be 'lol it came from wuhan lab' written in crayon and emailed to him from an israeli ip.

[adamantium]

just bullshit right
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41591-020-0820-9

I'm guessing you didn't read that.

I did, point me to where it says it is likely man made

[ErickAA]

"All SARS-CoV-2 genomes sequenced so far have the genomic features described above and are thus derived from a common ancestor that had them too. The presence in pangolins of an RBD very similar to that of SARS-CoV-2 means that we can infer this was also probably in the virus that jumped to humans. This leaves the insertion of polybasic cleavage site to occur during human-to-human transmission."

Here is a paragraph from that article I am claiming complete bullshit on. What is the overall genetic similarity of this Pangolin virus to SARS-COV2. Why didn't they provide that information? I'll tell you why, because if they did it would be obvious the virus as a whole isn't related at all and this theory is complete bullshit.

It is much more likely this virus descended from a common progenitor of a virus that is 96% identical, and the similarity of the RBD is due to convergent evolution or maybe some sort of weird gene transfer; which again how in the world is there natural gene transfer between a bat cave species in SW China and some weird mammal that comes from Indonesia, but has some populations in SE China, again thousands of miles away. And even if this somehow happened, how the fuck did it end up in Wuhan first, again thousands of miles away in a different direction.

SARS originated in SE China, where the pangolins are and where people actually sell and eat live bats (unlike in Wuhan), which is why that theory is at least plausible. How the fuck did SARS2 originate in Wuhan? I call bullshit on the whole pangolin theory. Tell me what the overall genetic similarity to the pangolin virus with the RBD is to SARS2. If it is 98% then that theory is plausible (Note: It isn't, or we would know).

Edit: I guess if you read the paragraph very carefully you could interpret it as not claiming the virus came from pangolins, but I am also sure that most people are going to read it and think that is the claim they are making. So, if the authors wrote that, but didn't mean to infer the virus from pangolins, I am going to call them out for being intentionally deceptive.

[ErickAA]

I'm guessing you didn't read that.

I did, point me to where it says it is likely man made

That is your straw man. No one is claiming it is likely man made. It doesn't even have to be.

They could actually have bioengineered it just through natural selection without doing any artificial gene transfer, like breeding dogs or plants. Just stick a bunch of virus with some human cells over and over and over, until one (out of billions and billions) mutates naturally so it can invade the cells with high fidelity. Bingo.

[adamantium]

"All SARS-CoV-2 genomes sequenced so far have the genomic features described above and are thus derived from a common ancestor that had them too. The presence in pangolins of an RBD very similar to that of SARS-CoV-2 means that we can infer this was also probably in the virus that jumped to humans. This leaves the insertion of polybasic cleavage site to occur during human-to-human transmission."

Here is a paragraph from that article I am claiming complete bullshit on. What is the overall genetic similarity of this Pangolin virus to SARS-COV2. Why didn't they provide that information? I'll tell you why, because if they did it would be obvious the virus as a whole isn't related at all and this theory is complete bullshit.

It is much more likely this virus descended from a common progenitor of a virus that is 96% identical, and the similarity of the RBD is due to convergent evolution or maybe some sort of weird gene transfer; which again how in the world is there natural gene transfer between a bat cave species in SW China and some weird mammal that comes from Indonesia, but has some populations in SE China, again thousands of miles away. And even if this somehow happened, how the fuck did it end up in Wuhan first, again thousands of miles away in a different direction.

SARS originated in SE China, where the pangolins are, which is why that theory is at least plausible. How the fuck did SARS2 originate in Wuhan? I call bullshit on the whole pangolin theory. Tell me what the overall genetic similarity to the pangolin virus with the RBD is to SARS2. If it is 98% then that theory is plausible (Note: It isn't, or we would know).

Im guessing you didnt read the article

[BCR]

There has been confusion in this thread, and pretty much everywhere for months. Some people think from the lab means engineered in some dark manner instead of they grabbed bats to fuck around with and experiment with vaccines and then shoddy lab practices caused a massive error.


Them grabbing corona bats and having bad safety protocols has been well documented. What exactly happens is guesswork. They’ve also had people sell lab animals to the wet market, which would be a lab fuckup. I see this argument everywhere where people think from the lab means the virus didn’t occur organically. Im not claiming to know fuckall about it, but from everything I’ve read, most from the lab theories don’t involve sinister bioweapons. They involve Chinese underpaid scientists lab fuckery if I understand it correctly.

[gut]

There has been confusion in this thread, and pretty much everywhere for months. Some people think from the lab means engineered in some dark manner instead of they grabbed bats to fuck around with and experiment with vaccines and then shoddy lab practices caused a massive error.


Them grabbing corona bats and having bad safety protocols has been well documented. What exactly happens is guesswork. They’ve also had people sell lab animals to the wet market, which would be a lab fuckup. I see this argument everywhere where people think from the lab means the virus didn’t occur organically. Im not claiming to know fuckall about it, but from everything I’ve read, most from the lab theories don’t involve sinister bioweapons. They involve Chinese underpaid scientists lab fuckery if I understand it correctly.

Yeah I'm just talking about human incompetence.

Adamantium and Walter seem to think we're talking about a fucking Bond villain at work here.

[adamantium]

There has been confusion in this thread, and pretty much everywhere for months. Some people think from the lab means engineered in some dark manner instead of they grabbed bats to fuck around with and experiment with vaccines and then shoddy lab practices caused a massive error.


Them grabbing corona bats and having bad safety protocols has been well documented. What exactly happens is guesswork. They’ve also had people sell lab animals to the wet market, which would be a lab fuckup. I see this argument everywhere where people think from the lab means the virus didn’t occur organically. Im not claiming to know fuckall about it, but from everything I’ve read, most from the lab theories don’t involve sinister bioweapons. They involve Chinese underpaid scientists lab fuckery if I understand it correctly.

Yeah I'm just talking about human incompetence.

Adamantium and Walter seem to think we're talking about a fucking Bond villain at work here.

Are you high?

[OSA]

Yeah I'm just talking about human incompetence.

Adamantium and Walter seem to think we're talking about a fucking Bond villain at work here.

Are you high?

Speaking of, if anyone needs edibles, vapes or marijuana in sealed cans hit me up.


You would be helping a small business in these crucial times.

[FRANKRIZZO]

30 million since corona jobless

[sonatine]

verminaard said 'straw man' in a post, everyone drink.

[JACKDANIELS]

There is quite a bit of circumstantial evidence it came from the Wuhan lab, some of it is covered here.

[JACKDANIELS]

Ignore the goofy thumbnail and sensationalist video title there is actually a good breakdown of the timeline in that video.

[JACKDANIELS]

At first I didn't buy into the Wuhan Lab origin but as more info comes out I am leaning towards it now.

[TheXFactor]

Coronavirus: US intelligence debunks theory it was 'manmade'

https://www.bbc.com/news/amp/world-us-canada-52496098

The US intelligence community has determined Covid-19 "was not manmade or genetically modified", though it is still investigating the virus' origins.

The National Intelligence chief's office said agencies are looking into whether the outbreak began from animal contact or a laboratory accident.

President Donald Trump later suggested he had seen evidence the virus came out of a Chinese laboratory.

China has rejected the theory and criticised the US response to Covid-19.

What did the intelligence chief say?

The Office of the Director of National Intelligence, which oversees US spy agencies, said on Thursday it concurs with the "wide scientific consensus" regarding Covid-19's natural origins.

"The [intelligence community] will continue to rigorously examine emerging information and intelligence to determine whether the outbreak began through contact with infected animals or if it was the result of an accident at a laboratory in Wuhan."

The virus was first detected in Wuhan, China. There are now over 3.2 million cases worldwide and more than 231,000 deaths.

Thursday's statement is the first clear response from US agencies debunking conspiracy theories - both from the US and China - about the virus as a purported bioweapon.

The idea that the coronavirus could have inadvertently leaked from a laboratory has not yet been disproven.

What did President Trump say?

At the White House on Thursday, Mr Trump was asked by a reporter: "Have you seen anything at this point that gives you a high degree of confidence that the Wuhan Institute of Virology was the origin of this virus?"

The president replied: "Yes, I have. Yes, I have. And I think the World Health Organization should be ashamed of themselves because they're like the public relations agency for China."

He added: "Whether they [China] made a mistake, or whether it started off as a mistake and then they made another one, or did somebody do something on purpose?

"I don't understand how traffic, how people weren't allowed into the rest of China, but they were allowed into the rest of the world. That's a bad, that's a hard question for them to answer."

The New York Times reported on Thursday that senior White House officials have asked the US intelligence community to investigate whether the virus came from a Wuhan research laboratory.

Intelligence agencies have also been tasked with determining if China and the WHO withheld information about the virus early on, unnamed officials told NBC News on Wednesday.

What's the background?

Mr Trump has recently been escalating his war of words with China over the pandemic after what officials within the US president's administration had described as a truce with Beijing.

On Wednesday, he suggested China wanted him to lose his re-election bid in November.

Mr Trump has often blamed China at briefings, accusing its officials of covering up the virus early on and saying they could have stopped the disease from spreading.

He has similarly criticised the WHO and withdrawn US funding for the global body.

China's Foreign Ministry, meanwhile, has accused the Trump administration of trying to distract from its own problems tackling the crisis.

A ministry spokesman has also repeatedly promoted the idea - without evidence - that Covid-19 might have originated in the US.

According to the Washington Post , the Trump administration is looking into ways to punish China financially. Discussions reportedly include allowing the US government to sue China for damages or cancelling debt obligations.

The US-China propaganda war

This is the first definitive statement on the matter from US intelligence agencies. It rejects the most extreme of the conspiracy theories about the pandemic's origins - that the Chinese developed and un-leashed the coronavirus as a bioweapon.

But it doesn't rule out the possibility that the virus was accidentally leaked from a Wuhan laboratory studying infectious diseases.

US Secretary of State Mike Pompeo in particular has talked up that scenario, urging China to let outside experts into the facility, and raising questions about lab safety in other parts of the country. The Chinese government says any such allegations are unfounded and fabricated out of nothing.

Claims and counterclaims about the origins of the virus are part of a propaganda war over China's handling of the coronavirus crisis.

But they also reflect US frustration with the Chinese for not sharing more data about how the pandemic developed.

Chinese Communist Party is still responsible for lying and trying to cover up the number of infected and dead in China.

[tgull]

Looking like COVID-19 is going to start to fade in June for the US, and go on hiatus for a few months. Obviously this gives us a break for a while. 72,433 deaths. This chart is the gold standard:

https://covid19.healthdata.org/united-states-of-america

Druff you might want to reconsider than 1,000,000 US death scenario from the other night.

[ErickAA]

Whom in the US intelligence agency is the BBC speaking for exactly? They weren't really clear on that. Am I supposed to believe that CIA agents are giving BBC and NYT real classified intelligence information on ongoing issues of such import? I mean, that sounds like actual treason if that is the case.

I think someone in some agency probably told a BBC reporter what they wanted the BBC reporter to write. But beyond that I don't see how you could take anything at face value that is coming from unclaimed sources from intelligence agencies.

I mean, I personally believe that the virus being leaked in Wuhan the way it was was definitely accidental. But BBC reporting intelligence agency "sources" isn't part of why I think that, and it shouldn't be influencing anyone else's opinion either.

[JimmyG_415]

This is how they covered black people "armed" w/cardboard signs. (Sidestep these quotations are because they weren't armed, like fox "news" isn't news.)

But the white people actually armed in Michigan, today, they aren't terrorizing Michigan, they are "activists"
(Sidestep no quotations marks for armed, BECAUSE THEY ARE REALLY ARMED, activists is in quotes because Fox called them activists)

Racist or hypocritical? The answer is both.


Hey, Black Lives Matter, stop terrorizing our cities
https://www.foxnews.com/opinion/hey-...ing-our-cities

Black Lives Matter protesters laid siege to a number of cities over the weekend including my hometown: Memphis, Tennessee.