Jordan Peterson's family life is a mess

[Dan Druff]

I guess I can have a look at all of this again. Funny about how the book is fake. I took that claim at face value, especially because I saw an Amazon link to it. But okay, it probably is fake.

Regarding the VICE interview, I actually found it on my own, and didn't just see snippets of it from left-wing media trying to trash Peterson. I remember finding those comments to be off-putting when I heard them. Maybe that was a rare bad moment or case of misspeaking, and doesn't really represent how he feels.

Unfortunately I can't remember all of the details of what I saw of Peterson which bothered me, because I saw a lot of this during what was an attempt to distract myself from my own severe anxiety and depression issues. My brain has blocked out a lot of that period from last year, and I don't remember details well. (It's probably better that way.)

I am aware that the left wants to attack him, just as they've attempted lame attacks on Ben Shapiro, Steven Crowder, and other prominent right wing YouTube figures. I don't want to join the left wing lynch mob regarding stuff like this, but I also don't want to be blind to the faults of some of these guys whom the right puts on a pedestal.

Even Crowder, my favorite YouTube personality by a wide margin, strikes me as a guy who is probably an asshole in real life, and difficult to work with. Certain stories I've heard would seem to support this. I still love his show, though.

[MrTickle]

What a surprise that a prominent right winger is an asshole

[TheXFactor]

People are stupid as shit and will believe anything.

[MumblesBadly]

To be frank, I’d like to see someone with professional mental health clinical experience comment on the matters discussed in this thread. Yo! I’m talking about you, Gimmick and TheShrink. What are you takes on this matter?

[ErickAA]

What a surprise that a prominent right winger is an asshole

Jordan Peterson married his high school sweetheart, and there is 0 stories of any infidelity or marital drama. Including up to the last year when his wife got cancer and he had the aforementioned mental breakdown. He also spent his whole career in academia in a field (psychology) that is dominated by women, and he has said most of his students and grad students that did research under him were female, and again there is 0 stories of any personal impropriety or bad behavior.

For Peterson, there is no indication that he is an asshole at all, and all the attacks seems to be about his politics, or more accurately the mostly false perception of his politics based on dishonest portrayals by the media.

[MrTickle]

What a surprise that a prominent right winger is an asshole

Jordan Peterson married his high school sweetheart, and there is 0 stories of any infidelity or marital drama. Including up to the last year when his wife got cancer and he had the aforementioned mental breakdown. He also spent his whole career in academia in a field (psychology) that is dominated by women, and he has said most of his students and grad students that did research under him were female, and again there is 0 stories of any personal impropriety or bad behavior.

For Peterson, there is no indication that he is an asshole at all, and all the attacks seems to be about his politics, or more accurately the mostly false perception of his politics based on dishonest portrayals by the media.

Who mentioned infidelity?

[The Shrink]

To be frank, I’d like to see someone with professional mental health clinical experience comment on the matters discussed in this thread. Yo! I’m talking about you, Gimmick and TheShrink. What are you takes on this matter?

Okay, I'll bite. I actually made the first post on this forum about Jordan Peterson: https://pokerfraudalert.com/forum/sh...ordan+peterson

This was the moment when he went viral. He was a barely known psychology prof before this occurred.

I'll preface this response by admitting I'm biased because, as someone who is left-leaning, I'm naturally inclined to dislike anyone who has been glorified by far-right shit-heads. But I'll try to be fair.

First, I was and still am on board with the general sentiment of JP's general stance on gender neutral pronouns. It's getting out of hand. I have no problem using a gender-neutral "they/them/their" pronoun to address people who don't identify as man or woman. I'm not on board with the growing list of invented pronouns nor am I okay with the recent practice of introducing yourself with "your pronouns." JP sensationalized the issue by claiming Bill C17 would make it so that if you didn't use someone's preferred pronouns you would be arrested (you wouldn't) but that's not the point. His concern is around compelled speech and that this is another move by far left SJWs to nudge the goalposts towards their version of a commie-transgendered utopia. One thing I'm concerned about the current political climate is that the most vocal people on the far left freak out if you don't toe their ideological line. I think it's pushing liberal-minded people like myself towards the right.

That out of the way, here’s my take on Jordan Peterson. I actually work alongside someone (let's call him Pete) who knows JP fairly well - they went to grad school together at McGill. Pete is the one who alerted me to JP in the first place. In the beginning he was quite in awe that his old friend was gaining international acclaim. They've had dinner together since JP became famous. Pete's assessment is that JP was always very smart and accomplished but that JP's rise to fame was completely unplanned and unexpected and that he's taking advantage of the opportunities he has been afforded (which I think most reasonable people would do). I agree that JP's fame was somewhat accidental. His videos about C17 went viral and suddenly he had a huge audience. He already had hours of lecture material on Youtube and the mostly conservative-minded people who agreed with his takes on free speech started watching his psychology lectures with great interest. And as with many things, if you are a fan of someone you tend to appreciate and find meaning in almost anything they produce (while not really critically evaluating the quality of their output). And that's what happened with JP's stuff. Everything word he uttered was lapped up by his new audience of disenfranchised incel white young men and he was being heralded as a genius self-help guru. "Clean your room, bucko!" Oh my god. Profound!

I've watched a fair bit of his stuff and these are my impressions: 1) he's very smart, 2) he's extraordinarily well read, 3) he's an articulate speaker, 4) his talks are mostly filled with nonsensical pseudoscience and abstruse philosophical ramblings that I'm 100% sure most of his audience doesn't understand but they like to say they understand so that they feel smart. The thing that puzzles me the most is his affinity for Jungian theory. Carl Jung was a quack and his theories are mostly unfalsifiable nonsense that can't be scientifically tested.

There’s a reason why modern psychotherapy has moved away from psychoanalytical approaches that are based on the theories of Jung and Freud. Psychoanalysis has very little scientific support. The only people who still practice psychoanalysis are private practice therapists who have duped a stable of clientele to indefinitely shell out $200 twice a week for the privilege of lying on a couch and talking about their neurotic mothers. Contemporary cognitive-behavioural therapy is the gold standard because it works and it’s cost-effective.

So when I see JP go on Joe Rogan and blather abstractly for two hours about the collective unconscious, Jungian archetypes, and how a Disney cartoon is an allegory for unresolved self-destructive id impulses, and Joe says, “Woah, that blew my mind!” I can’t help but roll my eyes.

I had more written but I went to submit this diatribe and I lost it because I got logged out. Other topics to discuss:
-the Intellectual Dark Web and how it’s the lamest thing ever
-Right Wing Grifters and the people who love them
-a college professor I know who became an obsessive Jordan Peterson fanboy, tried to become the next JP and failed in hilarious fashion

In conclusion, benzos are a hell of a drug and I hope Jordan Peterson gets well so he can go back to eating beef and being a dour, humourless icon of the conservative right.

[Dan Druff]

What a surprise that a prominent right winger is an asshole

Jordan Peterson married his high school sweetheart, and there is 0 stories of any infidelity or marital drama. Including up to the last year when his wife got cancer and he had the aforementioned mental breakdown. He also spent his whole career in academia in a field (psychology) that is dominated by women, and he has said most of his students and grad students that did research under him were female, and again there is 0 stories of any personal impropriety or bad behavior.

For Peterson, there is no indication that he is an asshole at all, and all the attacks seems to be about his politics, or more accurately the mostly false perception of his politics based on dishonest portrayals by the media.

I don't think Peterson is an asshole. I never said he was. I said Crowder kind of seems like an asshole, but the truth is that being somewhat of an asshole is what drives Crowder to crack the whip and produce a good show.

I would 100% believe that Jordan Peterson doesn't cheat on his wife, truly loves her, and has never sexually harassed any females working under him.

[Dan Druff]

BTW Shrink (and anyone else), if the system logs you out, you can start posting in the same thread, and click on a button labeled "Restore Auto-Saved Content" which is located under the text box on the left. That will restore much of what you've written.

Also, checking the option "Remember Me" near the login box allows you to stay logged in whenever your browser is active on PFA.

[nunbeater]

I don't really understand why Peterson is seen as strongly right wing. He's not shown any tendency to be racist or misogynist or homophobic. His economic views aren't particuarly "right wing" - you could probably call them centre-right/classic liberal. It seems that his main political motivators are the promotion of individual freedoms (and responsibilities). I very strongly disagree with his views on political correctness, idpol and climate change but I don't think that makes him alt-right or far-right. And that's coming from someone who definitely has radical left-wing views.

But guess what - no surprise that the right wingers would decided to kick him to the curb because he has medical problems. Compassionless scum.

and you know I'm not exactly a feminist.

[Dan Druff]

BUMP

He's completely deteriorated over the last few months and may never be the same again.

He also went to Russia for treatment due to a mistrust of North American medicine, which in general is a



https://nationalpost.com/news/jordan...izer-addiction



He is kind of a cautionary tale regarding the health rabbit hole one can go down via over-treatment, misuse, or poor tolerance of certain meds.

Benzos are especially dangerous this way. I used mine over-cautiously and sparingly, and they helped me get better long term. But it's really easy to fuck that up, even completely following doctors' orders.

I feel for the guy. Seems like total hell.

[nightmarefish]

BUMP

He's completely deteriorated over the last few months and may never be the same again.

He also went to Russia for treatment due to a mistrust of North American medicine, which in general is a



https://nationalpost.com/news/jordan...izer-addiction



He is kind of a cautionary tale regarding the health rabbit hole one can go down via over-treatment, misuse, or poor tolerance of certain meds.

Benzos are especially dangerous this way. I used mine over-cautiously and sparingly, and they helped me get better long term. But it's really easy to fuck that up, even completely following doctors' orders.

I feel for the guy. Seems like total hell.

Did he go to the carnivore diet before or after he initially got sick? Would be interesting if his major health problems started after going strictly meat.

[Dan Druff]

Not sure on the timing but I believe this was all related to both unintentional benzo abuse and some adverse side effects to the benzos, probably complicated by both medical malpractice and Peterson's mishandling of the situation.

It didn't help that he wasn't thinking straight because his beloved wife had cancer.

Very unfortunate story, but I can totally see how it happened. This is why I urge everyone to approach all medications and treatments with caution, and sanity check everything told to you by your doctor.

[Zap_the_Fractions_Giraffe]

psychiatric medicine should be avoided unless you're actually schizophrenic or some kind of real crazy. his daughter would get it

[Dan Druff]

psychiatric medicine should be avoided unless you're actually schizophrenic or some kind of real crazy. his daughter would get it

Depends on the person and the situation.

Xanax helped me get better in 2018. Now I take it very rarely as I don't need it anymore on a regular basis. I'm a great Xanax success story, but as I said, it's very easy to screw up, especially given that some doctors advocate doing it daily.

My problems in 2018 were somewhat brought on by an unexpected side effect to a common non-psych medication (Nexium), so by a combo of quitting the Nexium (my idea), restoring the caffeine in my diet (against doctors orders), and taking Xanax once every 5 days (my own idea), I got rapidly better.

Bottom line is that each person's brain works differently and the solution to psychiatric problems slike depression varies greatly among individuals. I basically solved my own problem, but had I simply blindly followed exactly what was told to me, I could be in a very different spot today.

[Sidewinder]

Not sure on the timing but I believe this was all related to both unintentional benzo abuse and some adverse side effects to the benzos, probably complicated by both medical malpractice and Peterson's mishandling of the situation.

It didn't help that he wasn't thinking straight because his beloved wife had cancer.

Very unfortunate story, but I can totally see how it happened. This is why I urge everyone to approach all medications and treatments with caution, and sanity check everything told to you by your doctor.

Dr. Drew has been talking about benzo addiction for years yet this family act as if they are the first to ever experience it.

I am not diminishing their struggles/challenges but he isn't the first or the last to get a benzo addiction and I seriously doubt going to Russia was the only "cure".

I see a family’s terrible situation, Cancer, made worse by a pill addiction and multiplied by infinity with their self-inflicted melodrama - but that’s just my read.

[nunbeater]

I don't really understand why Peterson is seen as strongly right wing. He's not shown any tendency to be racist or misogynist or homophobic. His economic views aren't particuarly "right wing" - you could probably call them centre-right/classic liberal. It seems that his main political motivators are the promotion of individual freedoms (and responsibilities). I very strongly disagree with his views on political correctness, idpol and climate change but I don't think that makes him alt-right or far-right. And that's coming from someone who definitely has radical left-wing views.

But guess what - no surprise that the right wingers would decided to kick him to the curb because he has medical problems. Compassionless scum.

I haven't seen any racism or homophobia out of him, but I have seen a lot of really, really archaic views on women which even left me scratching my head, and you know I'm not exactly a feminist.

fellas I agree. This guy is definitely not racist or anti-gay enough to be a right winger.

[BCR]

I really don’t get the whole paradoxical reaction angle and it feels like nonsense, but I’d like to see the shrink comment.

You can get addicted rather quickly to benzodiazepines, but not THAT quickly. Obviously I’ve talked a lot about them through the years. I was prescribed them initially because I had a series of episodes that they concluded were panic attacks after extensive medical testing.

When the situation seemed to pass and I remained unconvinced they were ever panic attacks in the first place, I was certainly addicted by that point, and went through an 18 day medical detox with barbiturates. A year later, they diagnosed my cancer and said there is only one thing that helps with the serotonin my cancer was flooding my system with, and that was benzodiazepines. So despite it feeling nonsensical to go back on something that had taken me 18 days to medically detox off of, I had no choice. Went back on and have been on ever since.

The detox is hell. I didn’t sleep a moment for 6 days, had a seizure, and would never go though it again . I’ve been on a slow wean off now for years and I’m down to about the last step before completely quitting. I’m prepared to do that soon and will basically set aside weeks where I expect to struggle to sleep and will be somewhat miserable.

So I’m not doubting the hellish nature of the detox. Twenty years ago when they first started me, I’d take them for a brief time. Go off for times. It wasn’t until I had taken them for a prolonged amount of time on a regular schedule that I felt physically dependent on them. Everyone is different, but I can’t imagine someone getting addicted so quickly that they were addicted before side effects would manifest. I once knew a girl who had taken 1mg of Ativan 3x a day for seven years and decided she was gov to quit. I told her she was going to have a seizure and be miserable and she just went off and was completely fine, so everyone is different, but his getting addicted that quickly feels wrong.

I’ve never heard of someone having a paradoxical reaction, which essentially sounds like a side effect that’s opposite a mediations I tended effect, that didn’t occur very rapidly. You need to be taking these for a long time to be addicted. It doesn’t make sense. And as horrible as detox off of them is, it’s a rather routine protocol. Barbiturates and medical supervision. I assume almost any doctor could oversee it, and it’s not some cutting edge science. Going to Russia? That feels weird and like something else is at play. I find it hard to believe it’s as simple as he’s addicted fo benzos and has adverse reactions and there isn’t anyone in the US who can deal with that. That feels absurd.

[DonaldTrumpsHairPiece]

While I agreed with his stance on forced speech and some practical stuff he seemed to get a little too far of base for me otherwise.

Good with the bad I guess.

[sonatine]

he's a crazy person who got teased in high school so now he does things like espouse a 'beef only diet' while castigating emotionally intelligent, well adjusted adults.