Robert Kraft, New England Patriots owner, charged in prostitution sting

[gimmick]

I don't know anything about this, but it would seem risky to use traffic girls this publicly. There's also some suspicion that police is on to massage parlors being at times used for sex work.

Oh and only thing i was wondering that if you're worth 6.6 billion there has to be ways to handle your business more discreetly. But maybe Kraft doing this is an additional thrill.

[Sidewinder]

When my wife did OB in east LA she said a lot of girls would come in who were obvious prostitutes who were probably trafficked. Some were underage. They always came in “accompanied” by male chaperones/pimps who were probably involved in organized crime, who never left the women alone and spoke for them. None of these women would ever talk even if they were given the opportunity, so there was really nothing to do but give them the best medical care possible and hope for the best.

Needless to say none of these girls were working out of Asian rub and tugs in strip malls.

If it's such a real problem, why give us this fictional narrative?

Reminds me of that Jussie guy - if violent white racism is so prevalent why did this dickhead have to fabricate?

Shouldn't the endless occurrences of violent racism and human trafficking drown us in disgust and horror, negating the reason to make shit up?

[Sidewinder]

I don't know anything about this, but it would seem risky to use traffic girls this publicly. There's also some suspicion that police is on to massage parlors being at times used for sex work.

Oh and only thing i was wondering that if you're worth 6.6 billion there has to be ways to handle your business more discreetly. But maybe Kraft doing this is an additional thrill.

Because it was close to his house, no appointment necessary, and he thought it was anonymous?

[ErickAA]

When my wife did OB in east LA she said a lot of girls would come in who were obvious prostitutes who were probably trafficked. Some were underage. They always came in “accompanied” by male chaperones/pimps who were probably involved in organized crime, who never left the women alone and spoke for them. None of these women would ever talk even if they were given the opportunity, so there was really nothing to do but give them the best medical care possible and hope for the best.

Needless to say none of these girls were working out of Asian rub and tugs in strip malls.

If it's such a real problem, why give us this fictional narrative?

Reminds me of that Jussie guy - if violent white racism is so prevalent why did this dickhead have to fabricate?

Shouldn't the endless occurrences of violent racism and human trafficking drown us in disgust and horror, negating the reason to make shit up?

If you think that story was fictional then I envy you your naivety and innocence.

For those of us on planet reality, imagine I told you the city of Los Angeles had millions of poor, mostly illegal, immigrants from Latin America who lived in highly concentrated, ethnic ghettos; and in these ghettos there existed a thriving multinational, underground economy of human and illegal drug smuggling controlled by violent cartels. Then I told you that in such a scenario there was NOT prostitution of trafficked girls, and you should rightly tell me I was delusional.

Anyways, to address your question, the idea that exploitation and suffering of vulnerable populations isn't an inevitable part of society is a very novel one. For pretty much all societies through all time it was accepted as the way it is.

The Western world in the last couple centuries is pretty much the first time in the history of humanity a society has attempted to eliminate and alleviate such suffering on any meaningful scale, with very uneven success so far. For good or bad, the status quo seems to be that such behavior is shunned in the native population, but permitted in ethnic communities as long as the abuse is kept "in house." The recent British Pakistani grooming gang scandals for example probably only received the attention and scrutiny that it has because they trafficked in native English women. If they had kept it in house and only trafficked in brown women, the gangs probably would have been able to continue without drawing scrutiny.

[ErickAA]

All that being said, I don't think that is mostly what is going on in strip mall Asian rub n' tugs. I think that is mostly adult laborers from a more pragmatic culture than our own, that accepts the banalities of life, willingly tugging off fat old men for money. And when they are done for the day they wash their hands well with soap (and clean out any orifices that may have been used) and go about their lives pretty normally.

[Sidewinder]

All that being said, I don't think that is mostly what is going on in strip mall Asian rub n' tugs. I think that is mostly adult laborers from a more pragmatic culture than our own, that accepts the banalities of life, willingly tugging off fat old men for money. And when they are done for the day they wash their hands well with soap (and clean out any orifices that may have been used) and go about their lives pretty normally.

It's definitely not what's going on.

As for the rest of it, who knows. I don't trust liars, thieves and manipulators and that's who keeps talking about it. They (the govt.) dont lie about everything but the will lie about anything. Good luck figuring out what the truth is.

[BeerAndPoker]

It will be interesting to see how this all plays out and what all Kraft new about this lil operation.

That Robert Kraft is krafty he gets around he's krafty he's always down.

[gimmick]

I don't know anything about this, but it would seem risky to use traffic girls this publicly. There's also some suspicion that police is on to massage parlors being at times used for sex work.

Oh and only thing i was wondering that if you're worth 6.6 billion there has to be ways to handle your business more discreetly. But maybe Kraft doing this is an additional thrill.

Because it was close to his house, no appointment necessary, and he thought it was anonymous?

I was thinking there must be some equivalent to how drugs are handled after a certain level of wealth.

Like having someone else get them, hold them, shop doctors till you get scripts you want and then topping off at having your personal doctor like MJ. And for drugs the Kraft version would be that Canadian mayor that got caught smoking crack on tape.

[Daly]

This is going to end up being one heck of a story.

In the end there are 10 Spas that we’re under investigation. These 10 fall into three different counties in Florida St Luice, Martin and Palm Beach. From what I’m told they have been looking into these ten places for a few months. They gathered statements. They gathered license plates and photos of people coming and going. They sent some cops in to see what goes on. They went for a wire and got video survalience set up after probable cause was established and from what I’ve been told in total they got about 200 guys on video between the 3-5 days they were up at the 10 locations. They also have many low level managers they are going to “roll up” to get the “real” targets who get the money and import export the girls. That’s the end game on this as it should be, the $$ and the trafficing.

What’s interesting is each county has its own DA. The Palm Beach DA wanted to make a giant spectacle out of this and get political gains. That’s why they have had press conference after press conference and interview after interview. In the big conference on Monday he said (paraphrasing) “in palm beach county everyone is treated the same” and “I can’t say when the rest will be released”. There have also been statements that other counties may not press charges. There has been a few names here and there from the other counties. From what I’m told there is a state political figure who is caught up in this. what’s causing some real issues for the other DA’s is there is supposedly a high number of Cops and Firefighters on the list. The locals can’t get them out of the trap and they are basically asking the DA’s to just not press charges and let the John’s off. Now these are just the 200 who are on video survalince. The other interesting part is they ended up pulling you over afterwards and scanning your drivers license. This is how they were able to write probable cause for the arrests - they know the person on the video was the person in the drivers license. This is why Bob Kraft is completely fucked as far as getting out from this. It’s him 1000%

The other part of this is they have many hundreds if not a thousand+ of others who they more or less know were going for a tug based on the recon work and running license plates but they can’t get them on charges because they don’t have Full PC....... but there are rumors of some very well known people that cops will be trading stories about. The other thing was the powers that be were horrified with the sheer number and volume of these places and how many were using them. Could have left the cameras on for weeks and expanded out to several hundred other places..... could have busted thousands of people doing this. Scary big - and if I had to guess they aren’t done down here. There will be books/movies on this.

[Mintjewlips]

Wow.

What the fuck.

If true, daly, that sounds like the most egregious, unconstitutional way to go about busting prostitution rings. Almost sounds as if they were collecting blackmail evidence.

Interesting to see how this plays out in 2020....

[ErickAA]

This is going to end up being one heck of a story.

In the end there are 10 Spas that we’re under investigation. These 10 fall into three different counties in Florida St Luice, Martin and Palm Beach. From what I’m told they have been looking into these ten places for a few months. They gathered statements. They gathered license plates and photos of people coming and going. They sent some cops in to see what goes on. They went for a wire and got video survalience set up after probable cause was established and from what I’ve been told in total they got about 200 guys on video between the 3-5 days they were up at the 10 locations. They also have many low level managers they are going to “roll up” to get the “real” targets who get the money and import export the girls. That’s the end game on this as it should be, the $$ and the trafficing.

What’s interesting is each county has its own DA. The Palm Beach DA wanted to make a giant spectacle out of this and get political gains. That’s why they have had press conference after press conference and interview after interview. In the big conference on Monday he said (paraphrasing) “in palm beach county everyone is treated the same” and “I can’t say when the rest will be released”. There have also been statements that other counties may not press charges. There has been a few names here and there from the other counties. From what I’m told there is a state political figure who is caught up in this. what’s causing some real issues for the other DA’s is there is supposedly a high number of Cops and Firefighters on the list. The locals can’t get them out of the trap and they are basically asking the DA’s to just not press charges and let the John’s off. Now these are just the 200 who are on video survalince. The other interesting part is they ended up pulling you over afterwards and scanning your drivers license. This is how they were able to write probable cause for the arrests - they know the person on the video was the person in the drivers license. This is why Bob Kraft is completely fucked as far as getting out from this. It’s him 1000%

The other part of this is they have many hundreds if not a thousand+ of others who they more or less know were going for a tug based on the recon work and running license plates but they can’t get them on charges because they don’t have Full PC....... but there are rumors of some very well known people that cops will be trading stories about. The other thing was the powers that be were horrified with the sheer number and volume of these places and how many were using them. Could have left the cameras on for weeks and expanded out to several hundred other places..... could have busted thousands of people doing this. Scary big - and if I had to guess they aren’t done down here. There will be books/movies on this.

When I lived in Los Angeles there was probably 20 of these places within reasonable walking distance from my house. Most big cities are like this. It doesn't take very advanced arithmetic to figure out the immense scope of this industry.

[Mintjewlips]

All my knowledge about cops busting prostitutes and John's comes from watching cops, with that said, I never saw any cops wait until the sex acts were performed to make the arrests.......maybe things are different in Florida......it is the dong of America after all....no offense Florida....

[Daly]

Wow.

What the fuck.

If true, daly, that sounds like the most egregious, unconstitutional way to go about busting prostitution rings. Almost sounds as if they were collecting blackmail evidence.

Interesting to see how this plays out in 2020....

I don’t think there is a political thing going here. I don’t think they were targeting anyone specific. I also don’t think anything unconstitutional happened either.

Personaly I have a bit of an issue with the grandstanding and moral high ground routine at the moment. The message is “we are getting serious about trafficing”. These poor poor women and children were victimized by old rich men. In the meantime this went on for months. They setup cameras with a 3-5 day window and then kept them going to whole time. If this was really about the poor women and children they would have filmed the first two encounters and then sent in the swat team to go get them. It took them three plus weeks to turn in the paperwork and go in and shut these places down.

They closed down the illegal drug store and are busting some unlucky people who bought a joint.

If it’s just the 200 John’s picking up third degree misdemeanors and 5 or do middle management gangster types that go down there should be outrage and that’s what they are saying they got.

[JohnCommode]

This is going to end up being one heck of a story.

In the end there are 10 Spas that we’re under investigation. These 10 fall into three different counties in Florida St Luice, Martin and Palm Beach. From what I’m told they have been looking into these ten places for a few months. They gathered statements. They gathered license plates and photos of people coming and going. They sent some cops in to see what goes on. They went for a wire and got video survalience set up after probable cause was established and from what I’ve been told in total they got about 200 guys on video between the 3-5 days they were up at the 10 locations. They also have many low level managers they are going to “roll up” to get the “real” targets who get the money and import export the girls. That’s the end game on this as it should be, the $$ and the trafficing.

What’s interesting is each county has its own DA. The Palm Beach DA wanted to make a giant spectacle out of this and get political gains. That’s why they have had press conference after press conference and interview after interview. In the big conference on Monday he said (paraphrasing) “in palm beach county everyone is treated the same” and “I can’t say when the rest will be released”. There have also been statements that other counties may not press charges. There has been a few names here and there from the other counties. From what I’m told there is a state political figure who is caught up in this. what’s causing some real issues for the other DA’s is there is supposedly a high number of Cops and Firefighters on the list. The locals can’t get them out of the trap and they are basically asking the DA’s to just not press charges and let the John’s off. Now these are just the 200 who are on video survalince. The other interesting part is they ended up pulling you over afterwards and scanning your drivers license. This is how they were able to write probable cause for the arrests - they know the person on the video was the person in the drivers license. This is why Bob Kraft is completely fucked as far as getting out from this. It’s him 1000%

The other part of this is they have many hundreds if not a thousand+ of others who they more or less know were going for a tug based on the recon work and running license plates but they can’t get them on charges because they don’t have Full PC....... but there are rumors of some very well known people that cops will be trading stories about. The other thing was the powers that be were horrified with the sheer number and volume of these places and how many were using them. Could have left the cameras on for weeks and expanded out to several hundred other places..... could have busted thousands of people doing this. Scary big - and if I had to guess they aren’t done down here. There will be books/movies on this.

Nice post with lots of good information.

Even though decriminalizing prostitution would be a good thing, the fact is that under the present laws, patronizing these joints contributes to increased trafficking.

If law enforcement and firefighter johns get to skate completely without indictment, that kind of double standard would be totally unacceptable. If law enforcement flashed badges to get free services, does that constitute corruption and/or extortion? I'm not a lawyer, however.

Kraft was never going to get off on the video evidence. His only hope would be that all the procedural T's weren't crossed and the I's dotted during the sting.

Kraft hired Jack Goldberger who represented scumbag serial pedophile Jeffrey Epstein and got him a great deal.

Having said that, Kraft is probably eligible for accelerated rehabilitation and if he just admits guilt, takes the trafficking/prostitution class, and pays the fines and court costs, he will have no criminal record.

Guilty or innocent in the courts will have no effect on his NFL punishment. He's looking at 4+ games plus a hefty fine. I think that draft pick losses are highly unlikely.

[wrenchjockey]

[Daly]

This is going to end up being one heck of a story.

In the end there are 10 Spas that we’re under investigation. These 10 fall into three different counties in Florida St Luice, Martin and Palm Beach. From what I’m told they have been looking into these ten places for a few months. They gathered statements. They gathered license plates and photos of people coming and going. They sent some cops in to see what goes on. They went for a wire and got video survalience set up after probable cause was established and from what I’ve been told in total they got about 200 guys on video between the 3-5 days they were up at the 10 locations. They also have many low level managers they are going to “roll up” to get the “real” targets who get the money and import export the girls. That’s the end game on this as it should be, the $$ and the trafficing.

What’s interesting is each county has its own DA. The Palm Beach DA wanted to make a giant spectacle out of this and get political gains. That’s why they have had press conference after press conference and interview after interview. In the big conference on Monday he said (paraphrasing) “in palm beach county everyone is treated the same” and “I can’t say when the rest will be released”. There have also been statements that other counties may not press charges. There has been a few names here and there from the other counties. From what I’m told there is a state political figure who is caught up in this. what’s causing some real issues for the other DA’s is there is supposedly a high number of Cops and Firefighters on the list. The locals can’t get them out of the trap and they are basically asking the DA’s to just not press charges and let the John’s off. Now these are just the 200 who are on video survalince. The other interesting part is they ended up pulling you over afterwards and scanning your drivers license. This is how they were able to write probable cause for the arrests - they know the person on the video was the person in the drivers license. This is why Bob Kraft is completely fucked as far as getting out from this. It’s him 1000%

The other part of this is they have many hundreds if not a thousand+ of others who they more or less know were going for a tug based on the recon work and running license plates but they can’t get them on charges because they don’t have Full PC....... but there are rumors of some very well known people that cops will be trading stories about. The other thing was the powers that be were horrified with the sheer number and volume of these places and how many were using them. Could have left the cameras on for weeks and expanded out to several hundred other places..... could have busted thousands of people doing this. Scary big - and if I had to guess they aren’t done down here. There will be books/movies on this.

Nice post with lots of good information.

Even though decriminalizing prostitution would be a good thing, the fact is that under the present laws, patronizing these joints contributes to increased trafficking.

If law enforcement and firefighter johns get to skate completely without indictment, that kind of double standard would be totally unacceptable. If law enforcement flashed badges to get free services, does that constitute corruption and/or extortion? I'm not a lawyer, however.

Kraft was never going to get off on the video evidence. His only hope would be that all the procedural T's weren't crossed and the I's dotted during the sting.

Kraft hired Jack Goldberger who represented scumbag serial pedophile Jeffrey Epstein and got him a great deal.

Having said that, Kraft is probably eligible for accelerated rehabilitation and if he just admits guilt, takes the trafficking/prostitution class, and pays the fines and court costs, he will have no criminal record.

Guilty or innocent in the courts will have no effect on his NFL punishment. He's looking at 4+ games plus a hefty fine. I think that draft pick losses are highly unlikely.

Kraft is fucked in the court of public opinion and thus the NFL. There is no getting out ot this for him. But to be clear he is “only” being accused of solicitation and it’s the lowest of the low. People are talking like kraft is going to do jail time over this. He isn’t getting anywhere near a jail cell and if Palm Beach county thinks that is happening he just won’t ever step foot in Florida again. Kraft is going to end up sending in season ticket money for 2 seats in his 70K seat stadium and taking 10 hours of a class. Let us also remember he’s already donated hundreds of thousands of dollars in the area.... he’s going to have all sorts of political help on this.

Take the word trafficking out of this as it pertains to Kraft. He’s nowhere near it and anyone saying he is has no idea what they are talking about. He’s “guilty” of something, but this isn’t it.

The unfortunate thing here is the focus should be on getting the management types to roll over on the power brokers where the $$ was going to. Instead it’s a spectacle of nothing.

[ErickAA]

Nice post with lots of good information.

Even though decriminalizing prostitution would be a good thing, the fact is that under the present laws, patronizing these joints contributes to increased trafficking.

If law enforcement and firefighter johns get to skate completely without indictment, that kind of double standard would be totally unacceptable. If law enforcement flashed badges to get free services, does that constitute corruption and/or extortion? I'm not a lawyer, however.

Kraft was never going to get off on the video evidence. His only hope would be that all the procedural T's weren't crossed and the I's dotted during the sting.

Kraft hired Jack Goldberger who represented scumbag serial pedophile Jeffrey Epstein and got him a great deal.

Having said that, Kraft is probably eligible for accelerated rehabilitation and if he just admits guilt, takes the trafficking/prostitution class, and pays the fines and court costs, he will have no criminal record.

Guilty or innocent in the courts will have no effect on his NFL punishment. He's looking at 4+ games plus a hefty fine. I think that draft pick losses are highly unlikely.

Kraft is fucked in the court of public opinion and thus the NFL. There is no getting out ot this for him. But to be clear he is “only” being accused of solicitation and it’s the lowest of the low. People are talking like kraft is going to do jail time over this. He isn’t getting anywhere near a jail cell and if Palm Beach county thinks that is happening he just won’t ever step foot in Florida again. Kraft is going to end up sending in season ticket money for 2 seats in his 70K seat stadium and taking 10 hours of a class. Let us also remember he’s already donated hundreds of thousands of dollars in the area.... he’s going to have all sorts of political help on this.

Take the word trafficking out of this as it pertains to Kraft. He’s nowhere near it and anyone saying he is has no idea what they are talking about. He’s “guilty” of something, but this isn’t it.

The unfortunate thing here is the focus should be on getting the management types to roll over on the power brokers where the $$ was going to. Instead it’s a spectacle of nothing.

Nah. I dont know a single sane person that thinks the whole "trafficking" angle is anything but LOL dishonest media and local govt. On this site the only one buying that narrative is Mumbles, so enough said. The NFL may come down hard on him because that is something they like to do with the Patriots, but I think this entire thing is a nothing burger in the court of public opinion. If by "public opinion" you mean CNN and twitter, than yeah, but once you realize the MSM and twitter actually represents a fringe, minority opinion on most matters, than you are can see reality.

[MumblesBadly]

Kraft is fucked in the court of public opinion and thus the NFL. There is no getting out ot this for him. But to be clear he is “only” being accused of solicitation and it’s the lowest of the low. People are talking like kraft is going to do jail time over this. He isn’t getting anywhere near a jail cell and if Palm Beach county thinks that is happening he just won’t ever step foot in Florida again. Kraft is going to end up sending in season ticket money for 2 seats in his 70K seat stadium and taking 10 hours of a class. Let us also remember he’s already donated hundreds of thousands of dollars in the area.... he’s going to have all sorts of political help on this.

Take the word trafficking out of this as it pertains to Kraft. He’s nowhere near it and anyone saying he is has no idea what they are talking about. He’s “guilty” of something, but this isn’t it.

The unfortunate thing here is the focus should be on getting the management types to roll over on the power brokers where the $$ was going to. Instead it’s a spectacle of nothing.

Nah. I dont know a single sane person that thinks the whole "trafficking" angle is anything but LOL dishonest media and local govt. On this site the only one buying that narrative is Mumbles, so enough said. The NFL may come down hard on him because that is something they like to do with the Patriots, but I think this entire thing is a nothing burger in the court of public opinion. If by "public opinion" you mean CNN and twitter, than yeah, but once you realize the MSM and twitter actually represents a fringe, minority opinion on most matters, than you are can see reality.

I never said that Kraft was involved with trafficking, dumbass. He’s just a customer of the jerk shop biz. But you are deluding yourself that women aren’t trafficked by these businesses. And Druff also mentioned trafficking. It’s an issue that is agreed upon by all sides in the media, from Fox News to MSNBC among mainstream outlets.

[ErickAA]

The media isn’t in too big a hurry to report this, because it doesn’t fit the “trafficking” narrative, but apparently the women that serviced Kraft were all 40+, which is pretty typical for those kind of places.

[MumblesBadly]

The media isn’t in too big a hurry to report this, because it doesn’t fit the “trafficking” narrative, but apparently the women that serviced Kraft were all 40+, which is pretty typical for those kind of places.

The news report mentions that the older women running the shop serviced Kraft, but that doesn’t mean that they also don’t traffick younger women who also service customers, which experts from various agencies, both in law enforcement and non-profit aid and intervention agencies, have publicly reported. So, where are you getting your information to make the general statement that I have bolded?