Did Druff get 86d from a Vegas Casino and kept it silent???

[BCR]

Druff was quite possibly the most pro-Adelson online poker player in the universe. In a thread where everyone just wished he would die, there was Druff saying it’s really just a crisis of conscious that he hates online gambling. Nothing to do with business

At the end his place did you like that. And you’re innocent. That had to sting.

You offering up $5k for info about a slot machine? That’s really their story?

They have the really wrong Jew on that one. You aren’t giving anyone $5k unless they solved some slot riddle and you already had cashed out $50k and then you’d pay them for the info. In that case they would have just banned you for a slot scam.

Offering someone $5k blind? That a bad read on you. I don’t believe their story. Or you know more. Like you were there with Chainsaw or some group of sharp advantage slot players and they just banned the whole group. You had this reluctance in your voice when you told the story. Like you might have an inkling or who you were associated with. Not just some random guy sat at your machine after you.

If you were that unlucky, you can almost see why they wouldn’t believe you. An advantage player who has spent a lot of energy and time amassing casino comps and looking for the proper machine and any legal advantage. You got extraordinarily unlucky if that’s the case. Like 10k-1. So unlucky it makes straightening it out almost impossible given the person is likely someone you know, was in your group, will have some loose association with.

Were you in a pissing match with Sklansky or Malmuth at the time that occurred? Seems they might whisper into the right ear if they happened to see you strolling through the lobby that day.. Might even know Adelson being old right-wing Jews from old Vegas. If there isn’t more to your story, someone got you who didn’t like you. It wasn’t random. Random slot shit they see every day isn’t in some restricted file where everyone who looks at the computer says, “ wow, I’ve never seen this before.” That’s typical shit casinos see every day. Someone trying to hustle a slot guy.

[Dan Druff]

As I said on radio, when it comes close to reopening time, I will contact upper management and see if they have any sympathy for my situation. Probably not, but I'll try. I have a number of things already planned to tell them.

It might help a little bit that I do have a some history of recreational -EV play there prior to the ban (though honestly I didn't visit the property a whole lot). Might also help that I have the PFA forum and the radio show. However, at the same time, the Venetian has shown they don't give two shits what the poker community thinks.

The weirdest part to me is that they locked my file up so tight to where certain employees were legit surprised they couldn't access the info about my ban (and they sounded sincere). And the fact that the investigator who called me then lied to a co-worker about our conversation. Again, she sounded sincere when she told me what he said.

Hands down the strangest casino ban I've ever heard of.

[tgull]

I really don't want to listen to radio, and I honestly cannot decipher the posts. In one two sentence paragraph can you let us know why you were banned?

[BCR]

Banned for allegedly trying to bribe a slot worker for information about a slot machine with $5k. He denies it. I believe him.

[blake]

did druff have any explanation? if you give me a timestamp for radio, i'll check it out

[tgull]

Banned for allegedly trying to bribe a slot worker for information about a slot machine with $5k. He denies it. I believe him.

5 grand? Something is not adding up here. I guess it really does not matter anymore since all casinos are closed.

[Dan Druff]

Radio always has a timestamp these days.

https://pokerfraudalert.com/forum/sh...-Bribe-of-2018

2:09:17 is when it starts

But yes, I was banned in July 2018 without my knowledge. I found out in October 2018 when I attempted to make a reservation. I was shocked because I had zero negative incidents there with anyone -- employees or customers. Not a single argument or problem with anyone. There was a restriction on my account which disallowed anyone without a high level of access to see the ban, which is apparently unusual.

Eventually found out I was being accused of trying to bribe a slot manager $5000 for info, which 100% I didn't do. The person I was accused of bribing I have never met before.

[Walter Sobchak]

Radio always has a timestamp these days.

https://pokerfraudalert.com/forum/sh...-Bribe-of-2018

2:09:17 is when it starts

But yes, I was banned in July 2018 without my knowledge. I found out in October 2018 when I attempted to make a reservation. I was shocked because I had zero negative incidents there with anyone -- employees or customers. Not a single argument or problem with anyone. There was a restriction on my account which disallowed anyone without a high level of access to see the ban, which is apparently unusual.

Eventually found out I was being accused of trying to bribe a slot manager $5000 for info, which 100% I didn't do. The person I was accused of bribing I have never met before.

Someone with a personal vendetta?

[shoeshine box]

Druff go back to a few weeks before ban.. Was this before the scam tourny they had? seems like it was personal. imo.. gd lk.

[Dan Druff]

Radio always has a timestamp these days.

https://pokerfraudalert.com/forum/sh...-Bribe-of-2018

2:09:17 is when it starts

But yes, I was banned in July 2018 without my knowledge. I found out in October 2018 when I attempted to make a reservation. I was shocked because I had zero negative incidents there with anyone -- employees or customers. Not a single argument or problem with anyone. There was a restriction on my account which disallowed anyone without a high level of access to see the ban, which is apparently unusual.

Eventually found out I was being accused of trying to bribe a slot manager $5000 for info, which 100% I didn't do. The person I was accused of bribing I have never met before.

Someone with a personal vendetta?

I had a few possible theories:

1) Fake identity. Someone offered this bribe and gave my name, either on purpose to get me banned, or just because they chose not to give their own name.

2) Mistaken identity. Someone did this unrelated to me, and when Venetian attempted to look up who it was, they found I had been playing near where it occurred around the same time, and sloppily concluded I did it.

3) Guilt by association. Someone else did this, and they thought I was associated with that person for whatever reason. The bribe thing was listed for everyone who was banned who was deemed associated with that guy, and they didn't bother to note who actually did it. When I spoke to the investigator months later, he forgot (or didn't know) that I wasn't actually accused of being the one who did it.

4) Frame. Someone who disliked me left a voicemail pretending to offer a bribe, in order to get me banned or in trouble.

5) Venetian is lying. This never happened, and they are banning me for some other reason they're not being honest about.

In order of likelihood:

#3
#2
#5
#1
#4

[BCR]

Did you explain number 3 that fully on the radio? If so, I missed it. You mentioned guilt by association, but I didn’t hear you frame it that way. More like you were standing around someone you didn’t know at all or someone played the same machine later. The way you framed it seems by far the most likely assuming you were there with friend/friends from gambling world, and not by yourself or girl. I’m not asking, but if so, that’s very likely it.

I thought when it started it might end up being someone you crank called at some point. With all the movement between the casinos, that someone you made look stupid eventually ended up at Venetian wouldn’t be crazy. Way unlikely once you said what for and that it was actual security management.

[blake]

Someone with a personal vendetta?

I had a few possible theories:

1) Fake identity. Someone offered this bribe and gave my name, either on purpose to get me banned, or just because they chose not to give their own name.

2) Mistaken identity. Someone did this unrelated to me, and when Venetian attempted to look up who it was, they found I had been playing near where it occurred around the same time, and sloppily concluded I did it.

3) Guilt by association. Someone else did this, and they thought I was associated with that person for whatever reason. The bribe thing was listed for everyone who was banned who was deemed associated with that guy, and they didn't bother to note who actually did it. When I spoke to the investigator months later, he forgot (or didn't know) that I wasn't actually accused of being the one who did it.

4) Frame. Someone who disliked me left a voicemail pretending to offer a bribe, in order to get me banned or in trouble.

5) Venetian is lying. This never happened, and they are banning me for some other reason they're not being honest about.

In order of likelihood:

#3
#2
#5
#1
#4

guilt by association doesn't make any sense considering the voicemail.

telling you that they think you tried to bribe a venetian employee by voicemail is so bizarre that i'm inclined to believe that the the employee you spoke to thinks it really happened. what number would you even call to do this?

if someone really left that voicemail, how could it be guilt by association?

[tgull]

I had a few possible theories:

1) Fake identity. Someone offered this bribe and gave my name, either on purpose to get me banned, or just because they chose not to give their own name.

2) Mistaken identity. Someone did this unrelated to me, and when Venetian attempted to look up who it was, they found I had been playing near where it occurred around the same time, and sloppily concluded I did it.

3) Guilt by association. Someone else did this, and they thought I was associated with that person for whatever reason. The bribe thing was listed for everyone who was banned who was deemed associated with that guy, and they didn't bother to note who actually did it. When I spoke to the investigator months later, he forgot (or didn't know) that I wasn't actually accused of being the one who did it.

4) Frame. Someone who disliked me left a voicemail pretending to offer a bribe, in order to get me banned or in trouble.

5) Venetian is lying. This never happened, and they are banning me for some other reason they're not being honest about.

In order of likelihood:

#3
#2
#5
#1
#4

guilt by association doesn't make any sense considering the voicemail.

telling you that they think you tried to bribe a venetian employee by voicemail is so bizarre that i'm inclined to believe that the the employee you spoke to thinks it really happened. what number would you even call to do this?

if someone really left that voicemail, how could it be guilt by association?

Something seems sketchy here Druff. Casinos just don't randomly start banning players for no reason. There has to be something, and it really is implausible the theory of mistaken identity. Not saying you did anything illegal, but there might have been angle shooting and you got clipped. I dunno, but it's literally 100-1 against you are just some innocent bystander in all this. Does not matter since all the casinos are now closed.

[Dan Druff]

I had a few possible theories:

1) Fake identity. Someone offered this bribe and gave my name, either on purpose to get me banned, or just because they chose not to give their own name.

2) Mistaken identity. Someone did this unrelated to me, and when Venetian attempted to look up who it was, they found I had been playing near where it occurred around the same time, and sloppily concluded I did it.

3) Guilt by association. Someone else did this, and they thought I was associated with that person for whatever reason. The bribe thing was listed for everyone who was banned who was deemed associated with that guy, and they didn't bother to note who actually did it. When I spoke to the investigator months later, he forgot (or didn't know) that I wasn't actually accused of being the one who did it.

4) Frame. Someone who disliked me left a voicemail pretending to offer a bribe, in order to get me banned or in trouble.

5) Venetian is lying. This never happened, and they are banning me for some other reason they're not being honest about.

In order of likelihood:

#3
#2
#5
#1
#4

guilt by association doesn't make any sense considering the voicemail.

telling you that they think you tried to bribe a venetian employee by voicemail is so bizarre that i'm inclined to believe that the the employee you spoke to thinks it really happened. what number would you even call to do this?

if someone really left that voicemail, how could it be guilt by association?

I was half asleep during the conversation (as I mentioned on radio) so sadly I wasn't able to verbalize the question, "Wait, are you saying that the bribery attempt was via voicemail, or in person?" Because the investigator first claimed I tried to do it in person, and then claimed it was by voicemail. Instead, half-asleep me just focused upon exonerating myself, repeatedly telling him to "check the camera" and "listen to the voicemail", and to compare both to my voice and appearance. I also told him that I'm a lot taller than average, so if the guy on the camera isn't tall, it's also clearly not me (in case the camera's resolution isn't that great, and the guy happens to fit my general look otherwise).

The investigator acted legit surprised that I was insisting it wasn't me and that I wanted this investigated. He called me seemingly believing that once he revealed to me that this was for the bribe, I would realize I was fucked and just give up. Unless he was a great actor, it seemed like I really did surprise him with my emphatic claims that it wasn't me, and to check the camera & voice mail.

The "guilt by association" thing would occur if this really did happen, but someone else did it, and they just banned a whole group of people they believed were associated with that guy. They may have put that "bribe" reason in the notes for everyone they banned for that, and maybe the guy calling me didn't realize that, and thought he was really calling the briber.

I can tell you with certainty that I really was blindsided by this, and have no idea what really happened. It's not like my buddy tried to bribe them, and I'm crying foul because I was the one who got banned. I really don't know what they're talking about.

[tgull]

guilt by association doesn't make any sense considering the voicemail.

telling you that they think you tried to bribe a venetian employee by voicemail is so bizarre that i'm inclined to believe that the the employee you spoke to thinks it really happened. what number would you even call to do this?

if someone really left that voicemail, how could it be guilt by association?

I was half asleep during the conversation (as I mentioned on radio) so sadly I wasn't able to verbalize the question, "Wait, are you saying that the bribery attempt was via voicemail, or in person?" Because the investigator first claimed I tried to do it in person, and then claimed it was by voicemail. Instead, half-asleep me just focused upon exonerating myself, repeatedly telling him to "check the camera" and "listen to the voicemail", and to compare both to my voice and appearance. I also told him that I'm a lot taller than average, so if the guy on the camera isn't tall, it's also clearly not me (in case the camera's resolution isn't that great, and the guy happens to fit my general look otherwise).

The investigator acted legit surprised that I was insisting it wasn't me and that I wanted this investigated. He called me seemingly believing that once he revealed to me that this was for the bribe, I would realize I was fucked and just give up. Unless he was a great actor, it seemed like I really did surprise him with my emphatic claims that it wasn't me, and to check the camera & voice mail.

The "guilt by association" thing would occur if this really did happen, but someone else did it, and they just banned a whole group of people they believed were associated with that guy. They may have put that "bribe" reason in the notes for everyone they banned for that, and maybe the guy calling me didn't realize that, and thought he was really calling the briber.

I can tell you with certainty that I really was blindsided by this, and have no idea what really happened. It's not like my buddy tried to bribe them, and I'm crying foul because I was the one who got banned. I really don't know what they're talking about.

You got caught by an angle shoot by likely your own doing. It really does not matter any more since all casinos are now closed and when they re-open you will certainly be welcomed since they need the action. Half asleep, is that a joke? Whom on this form are you trying to fool? Someone retarded?

[Walter Sobchak]

I was half asleep during the conversation (as I mentioned on radio) so sadly I wasn't able to verbalize the question, "Wait, are you saying that the bribery attempt was via voicemail, or in person?" Because the investigator first claimed I tried to do it in person, and then claimed it was by voicemail. Instead, half-asleep me just focused upon exonerating myself, repeatedly telling him to "check the camera" and "listen to the voicemail", and to compare both to my voice and appearance. I also told him that I'm a lot taller than average, so if the guy on the camera isn't tall, it's also clearly not me (in case the camera's resolution isn't that great, and the guy happens to fit my general look otherwise).

The investigator acted legit surprised that I was insisting it wasn't me and that I wanted this investigated. He called me seemingly believing that once he revealed to me that this was for the bribe, I would realize I was fucked and just give up. Unless he was a great actor, it seemed like I really did surprise him with my emphatic claims that it wasn't me, and to check the camera & voice mail.

The "guilt by association" thing would occur if this really did happen, but someone else did it, and they just banned a whole group of people they believed were associated with that guy. They may have put that "bribe" reason in the notes for everyone they banned for that, and maybe the guy calling me didn't realize that, and thought he was really calling the briber.

I can tell you with certainty that I really was blindsided by this, and have no idea what really happened. It's not like my buddy tried to bribe them, and I'm crying foul because I was the one who got banned. I really don't know what they're talking about.

You got caught by an angle shoot by likely your own doing. It really does not matter any more since all casinos are now closed and when they re-open you will certainly be welcomed since they need the action. Half asleep, is that a joke? Whom on this form are you trying to fool? Someone retarded?

Well you're retarded so that's a start.

[Dan Druff]

I was half asleep during the conversation (as I mentioned on radio) so sadly I wasn't able to verbalize the question, "Wait, are you saying that the bribery attempt was via voicemail, or in person?" Because the investigator first claimed I tried to do it in person, and then claimed it was by voicemail. Instead, half-asleep me just focused upon exonerating myself, repeatedly telling him to "check the camera" and "listen to the voicemail", and to compare both to my voice and appearance. I also told him that I'm a lot taller than average, so if the guy on the camera isn't tall, it's also clearly not me (in case the camera's resolution isn't that great, and the guy happens to fit my general look otherwise).

The investigator acted legit surprised that I was insisting it wasn't me and that I wanted this investigated. He called me seemingly believing that once he revealed to me that this was for the bribe, I would realize I was fucked and just give up. Unless he was a great actor, it seemed like I really did surprise him with my emphatic claims that it wasn't me, and to check the camera & voice mail.

The "guilt by association" thing would occur if this really did happen, but someone else did it, and they just banned a whole group of people they believed were associated with that guy. They may have put that "bribe" reason in the notes for everyone they banned for that, and maybe the guy calling me didn't realize that, and thought he was really calling the briber.

I can tell you with certainty that I really was blindsided by this, and have no idea what really happened. It's not like my buddy tried to bribe them, and I'm crying foul because I was the one who got banned. I really don't know what they're talking about.

You got caught by an angle shoot by likely your own doing. It really does not matter any more since all casinos are now closed and when they re-open you will certainly be welcomed since they need the action. Half asleep, is that a joke? Whom on this form are you trying to fool? Someone retarded?

Stick to commenting on toilets and hurricanes.

[splitthis]

You may never know who set you up, but it will be fun watching you smoking them out.