NFL ruling on kneeling for national anthem

[splitthis]

Or have OSA stand in front of them with his pants down.

[El Gallo]

el gallo: you do know that blacks commit a disproportionate amount of violent crimes in this country, right? the reason more black people end up on the wrong side of a gun is they are out there doing hoodrat shit. the most dangerous neighborhoods in this country are black neighborhoods. we all know this. nobody here wants to live in one. nobody here is going to walk through one at night. but these cops are tasked with trying to keep the poor people that do live in them safe, and it's a dangerous fucking job and I take their side over whichever gangbanger n-word they shot this week

I know that it’s poor people that commit the crimes.

[Dan Druff]

You are putting words in my mouth and then arguing with those words.

I don't understand it.

I'm not arguing this from the standpoint of patriotism.

My one statement about patriotism was that the form of protest was a fuck you to patriotic Americans (notice I said patriotic, not conservative). And it is.

Not because it's coming from the left, but because it's protesting the anthem of the country.

Protesting Trump isn't unpatriotic. Protesting a war isn't unpatriotic. Protesting a policy isn't unpatriotic.

Protesting the entire country itself -- which is what they're doing by kneeling during the anthem -- is indeed unpatriotic and a slap in the face to all NFL fans who love this country.

Anyway, even if you disagree with the above, that's just a side statement of mine. I don't like the message they're putting out -- basically "Fuck America".

My main point is that the NFL has a right to tell them to stop, and that it isn't a case of "forced patriotism" or suppression of the black protest when the NFL does this.

This is the part of your argument that is 100% authoritarian bullshit. Because they aren’t protesting “the entire country”, only the unconstitutional abuse of power by LEOs and the people in authority who don’t hold them accountable for doing so.

What does the national anthem have to do with law enforcement and alleged racism within?

It's not like they're kneeling during a law enforcement anthem.

They are kneeling because they don't wish to stand during the NATIONAL ANTHEM which is played to honor the country and show pride in it. They're basically saying, "Law enforcement in America has done us wrong, so fuck America."

Not only is an NFL game the wrong time and place for such a protest by players, but the entire message of the protest is directed at shaming the entire country.

[Dan Druff]

Why does it matter how much they're paid?

Maybe they are just resting during the song. Is sitting ok? Kneeling? Raising a fist while standing? Is that "protesting"?

What if on the back of NFL tickets it requires fans to stand or be ejected from the stadium? Is that cool now?

Yes, paying fans are totally under the same expectation as highly paid NFL employees. Makes sense. Or is this just your dumb way of trolling this thread?

I know a guy who works in America for a German owned company. If they decided that each morning he must stand and salute the German flag while the German anthem plays, does everyone still think that's kosher? Or else he is fined $10,000. That's their right as an employer? GTFO

The NFL didn't decide everyone has to stand and salute anything. All of the players are welcome to stay in the locker room.

Also, if you took the job while fully aware that one of the requirements of the job was to salute the German flag each morning, it would be your fault if you took the job anyway and then played victim when you were asked to do it.

I'd be glad to salute the German flag every day if I got paid what NFL players make.

[MumblesBadly]

Maybe they are just resting during the song. Is sitting ok? Kneeling? Raising a fist while standing? Is that "protesting"?

What if on the back of NFL tickets it requires fans to stand or be ejected from the stadium? Is that cool now?

Yes, paying fans are totally under the same expectation as highly paid NFL employees. Makes sense. Or is this just your dumb way of trolling this thread?

I know a guy who works in America for a German owned company. If they decided that each morning he must stand and salute the German flag while the German anthem plays, does everyone still think that's kosher? Or else he is fined $10,000. That's their right as an employer? GTFO

The NFL didn't decide everyone has to stand and salute anything. All of the players are welcome to stay in the locker room.

Also, if you took the job while fully aware that one of the requirements of the job was to salute the German flag each morning, it would be your fault if you took the job anyway and then played victim when you were asked to do it.

I'd be glad to salute the German flag every day if I got paid what NFL players make.

Would you have been glad to do so while in Germany in 1937?

[MrTickle]

The strangest thing about this situation is apparently some people think patriotism is good.

[blake]

Maybe they are just resting during the song. Is sitting ok? Kneeling? Raising a fist while standing? Is that "protesting"?

What if on the back of NFL tickets it requires fans to stand or be ejected from the stadium? Is that cool now?

Yes, paying fans are totally under the same expectation as highly paid NFL employees. Makes sense. Or is this just your dumb way of trolling this thread?

I know a guy who works in America for a German owned company. If they decided that each morning he must stand and salute the German flag while the German anthem plays, does everyone still think that's kosher? Or else he is fined $10,000. That's their right as an employer? GTFO

The NFL didn't decide everyone has to stand and salute anything. All of the players are welcome to stay in the locker room.

what do you think of the nba's rule, where they require their players to be out there and standing for the anthem?

[Tellafriend]

The strangest thing about this situation is apparently some people think patriotism is good.

So says the Russian lulz

[MrTickle]

The strangest thing about this situation is apparently some people think patriotism is good.

So says the Russian lulz

I’m not Russian, I’m British.

[ErickAA]

The strangest thing about this situation is apparently some people think patriotism is good.

Well, whether a culture (any culture) is actually good is a different question for a different day. But whether good or bad, if too many people of a culture despise themselves, then that culture is doomed.

I predict that the west, especially England, will continue to fade because of this self loathing, and cultures that where most people within it are patriotic (even if reality doesn't justify this) will take charge. I see this happening with China and the Muslim world today.

Whatever the faults of these cultures, not a lot of soul searching and self loathing. They are just going to claw themselves to the top and be proud of themselves for it.

[Dan Druff]

Yes, paying fans are totally under the same expectation as highly paid NFL employees. Makes sense. Or is this just your dumb way of trolling this thread?

I know a guy who works in America for a German owned company. If they decided that each morning he must stand and salute the German flag while the German anthem plays, does everyone still think that's kosher? Or else he is fined $10,000. That's their right as an employer? GTFO

The NFL didn't decide everyone has to stand and salute anything. All of the players are welcome to stay in the locker room.

Also, if you took the job while fully aware that one of the requirements of the job was to salute the German flag each morning, it would be your fault if you took the job anyway and then played victim when you were asked to do it.

I'd be glad to salute the German flag every day if I got paid what NFL players make.

Would you have been glad to do so while in Germany in 1937?

That's a dumb question.

We are discussing today, not 1937.

If I were a Jew in Germany in the late 1930s, I would have much bigger problems than having to salute a flag.

[SPIT this]

Yes, paying fans are totally under the same expectation as highly paid NFL employees. Makes sense. Or is this just your dumb way of trolling this thread?



The NFL didn't decide everyone has to stand and salute anything. All of the players are welcome to stay in the locker room.

Also, if you took the job while fully aware that one of the requirements of the job was to salute the German flag each morning, it would be your fault if you took the job anyway and then played victim when you were asked to do it.

I'd be glad to salute the German flag every day if I got paid what NFL players make.

Would you have been glad to do so while in Germany in 1937?

That's a dumb question.

We are discussing today, not 1937.

If I were a Jew in Germany in the late 1930s, I would have much bigger problems than having to salute a flag.

Like what?

[Dan Druff]

Yes, paying fans are totally under the same expectation as highly paid NFL employees. Makes sense. Or is this just your dumb way of trolling this thread?

I know a guy who works in America for a German owned company. If they decided that each morning he must stand and salute the German flag while the German anthem plays, does everyone still think that's kosher? Or else he is fined $10,000. That's their right as an employer? GTFO

The NFL didn't decide everyone has to stand and salute anything. All of the players are welcome to stay in the locker room.

what do you think of the nba's rule, where they require their players to be out there and standing for the anthem?

I think the new NFL rule is better, where players can opt-out and stay in the locker room. This eliminates the forced patriotism, while not creating a political protest spectacle during the game.

However, I don't think requiring standing during the anthem is bad, provided that players are aware of this when they sign a contract with an NBA team.

You're standing for the anthem of your own country. That isn't an endorsement of the President or a statement that you agree with all of the country's policies. It just means you have respect for your country itself.

Given how much these players get paid, they can tolerate standing for the anthem even if they don't honestly believe in doing so.

The NBA is an entertainment product, and they need to give the fans what they want. If the fans want to see all players out there standing for the anthem, I don't see the harm in it. Getting paid millions of dollars per year should be enough incentive for these players to do it and keep their mouths shut. And if they really find it that offensive, they can always choose not to play for the NBA and work a regular job for much less than that, like most Americans.

[big dick]

el gallo: you do know that blacks commit a disproportionate amount of violent crimes in this country, right? the reason more black people end up on the wrong side of a gun is they are out there doing hoodrat shit. the most dangerous neighborhoods in this country are black neighborhoods. we all know this. nobody here wants to live in one. nobody here is going to walk through one at night. but these cops are tasked with trying to keep the poor people that do live in them safe, and it's a dangerous fucking job and I take their side over whichever gangbanger n-word they shot this week

Black lives matter, n-words lives don't.
And stand the fuck up and honor the flag and the men who died for this country.The U.S is a shit hole now but that doesn't take away from the fact that many good men fought and died for this country,show them some fucking respect.

[hongkonger]

el gallo: you do know that blacks commit a disproportionate amount of violent crimes in this country, right? the reason more black people end up on the wrong side of a gun is they are out there doing hoodrat shit. the most dangerous neighborhoods in this country are black neighborhoods. we all know this. nobody here wants to live in one. nobody here is going to walk through one at night. but these cops are tasked with trying to keep the poor people that do live in them safe, and it's a dangerous fucking job and I take their side over whichever gangbanger n-word they shot this week

Black lives matter, n-words lives don't.
And stand the fuck up and honor the flag and the men who died for this country.The U.S is a shit hole now but that doesn't take away from the fact that many good men fought and died for this country,show them some fucking respect.

Just because someone died for something doesn't make it good. People died for the swastika and the hammer and sickle too.

[MrTickle]

The strangest thing about this situation is apparently some people think patriotism is good.

Well, whether a culture (any culture) is actually good is a different question for a different day. But whether good or bad, if too many people of a culture despise themselves, then that culture is doomed.

I predict that the west, especially England, will continue to fade because of this self loathing, and cultures that where most people within it are patriotic (even if reality doesn't justify this) will take charge. I see this happening with China and the Muslim world today.

Whatever the faults of these cultures, not a lot of soul searching and self loathing. They are just going to claw themselves to the top and be proud of themselves for it.

This is quite off base in regards to England. Look at Brexit. We're much stronger with Europe and have so much more in common with them than the rest of the world but we insist on being our own little island like its 1922 and we own 1/4 of the world and rule 1/4 of the world's population. We don't. It isn't self-loathing which is bringing us down, it's blind patriotism which goes against the reality.

Patriotism is definitely a negative for the UK.

What makes you think English people suffer from self-loathing? Recent politics suggest quite the opposite.

[MrTickle]

Black lives matter, n-words lives don't.
And stand the fuck up and honor the flag and the men who died for this country.The U.S is a shit hole now but that doesn't take away from the fact that many good men fought and died for this country,show them some fucking respect.

Just because someone died for something doesn't make it good. People died for the swastika and the hammer and sickle too.

What's wrong with the hammer and sickle?

[MrTickle]

Given how much these players get paid, they can tolerate standing for the anthem even if they don't honestly believe in doing so.

Why do you keep bringing up the amount of money like it matters? The money only exists because you and I pay to watch it and consume media surrounding it. It's not some kind gesture by the NFL which should be needs to be graciously repaid. It's just the mechanism of capitalism. The dollar amount is insignificant.

If you believe that its a contract thing then it doesn't matter if they're volunteering for nothing or on a million dollars a game.

[hongkonger]

Just because someone died for something doesn't make it good. People died for the swastika and the hammer and sickle too.

What's wrong with the hammer and sickle?

Nothing it's just something I thought they wouldn't like.

[hongkonger]

Given how much these players get paid, they can tolerate standing for the anthem even if they don't honestly believe in doing so.

Why do you keep bringing up the amount of money like it matters? The money only exists because you and I pay to watch it and consume media surrounding it. It's not some kind gesture by the NFL which should be needs to be graciously repaid. It's just the mechanism of capitalism. The dollar amount is insignificant.

If you believe that its a contract thing then it doesn't matter if they're volunteering for nothing or on a million dollars a game.