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Thread: Meet Chris Wylie, the British liberal democrat who created Mintjewlips, Sidedish, and the rest of the Trumptards (Facebook data scandal)

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    Plutonium sonatine's Avatar
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    Facebook is guilty of being terribly naive, first and foremost.

    Every penny they made came from the same basic technologies that CA developed.

    The difference between CA and FB is that FB designed a new material that could be used to build a gun that could sneak past metal detectors, while CA bought that material from FB, used it to build fully automatic versions of the gun, snuck that gun onto every single flight on a specific airline, then used them to shoot the pilots and the engines in mid flight after shorting the airlines stock. Oh and then gave Lukoil/Putin a powerpoint on how to create their own.

    I'd comment on what type of person fails to make that distinction but at this point why bother.

     
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      varys: Mintjewdonk is this true?
    "Birds born in a cage think flying is an illness." - Alejandro Jodorowsky

    "America is not so much a nightmare as a non-dream. The American non-dream is precisely a move to wipe the dream out of existence. The dream is a spontaneous happening and therefore dangerous to a control system set up by the non-dreamers." -- William S. Burroughs

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    Quote Originally Posted by gimmick View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post

    Good logic.

    Let's also not prosecute criminals who break into homes with the doors unlocked, because those homeowners only have themselves to blame.

    I'm not arguing that it's smart to overshare on Facebook.

    I'm arguing that Facebook is abusing its users' trust as a result of its own greed.
    I think by your logic the real culprit in this burglary case isn't the criminal that broke in but the door maker. The door maker that made it really easy to leave your door unlocked and made it hard to find the lock or actually operate that mechanical behemoth.

    Obv we can't blame the homeowner because using doors is really really hard. Or the actual criminal that broke in, because he was compelled to do so by the door maker. Yea this makes perfect sense.
    But still the criminal must be given extra time considering the door was unlocked and he need not have broken in.
    Assuming anyone one involved is alive after the terrific semi-automatic gun battle that ensued.

    Also, small correction, Chris Wylie, British Columbian liberal democrat. atta boy Chris.
    unbounded
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    Plutonium sonatine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by limitles View Post

    Also, small correction, Chris Wylie, British Columbian liberal democrat. atta boy Chris.

    Ah, true, I guess so. I was keyed in on that ultra-rare UK visa I guess.
    "Birds born in a cage think flying is an illness." - Alejandro Jodorowsky

    "America is not so much a nightmare as a non-dream. The American non-dream is precisely a move to wipe the dream out of existence. The dream is a spontaneous happening and therefore dangerous to a control system set up by the non-dreamers." -- William S. Burroughs

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    today's excellent piece about cambridge analytica

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    Diamond hongkonger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrTickle View Post


    today's excellent piece about cambridge analytica
    Yep, so they're offering to entrap rivals. Yet another Republican dirty tricks machine. They've been doing this stuff since the Nixon days. This one was founded and run by Stephen Bannon, who was also head of Trump's campaign for a while and his chief strategist in the WH before he fell out of favour. I'm sure there was no connection or knowledge within the campaign though.



    It's illegal to employ foreigners in political campaigns and CA used fronts to hide the fact that they were working for Trump. And they've apparently broken a number of other laws. And it all leads back to Trump's chief cheerleader and right-hand man.

    IMPEACH TRUMP YESTERDAY
    HILLARY WON

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    Owner Dan Druff's Avatar
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    LOL at the defense of Facebook in this thread.

    If they weren't a politically left-leaning corporation, the same people making excuses for them would be calling for all kinds of penalties and blaming them huge for this situation.

    But it's so much easier to solely rest blame upon the Bannon Bogeyman, right?

    Facebook is not naive. They were not caught with their pants down. They were not unwitting dupes. They were not responsible actors whose innocent tool was used for evil.

    They've been engaging in obnoxious and intentional privacy violations for more than a decade, all in the name of profit.

    They have gotten away with this because they have done a good job at keeping their userbase ignorant as to what's been going on, especially through providing "privacy controls" which don't do nearly as much as most users think they do.

    Despite having an otherwise intuitive and straightforward interface, their privacy settings are complicated, difficult to navigate, and misleading. Do you think that was an accident? Do you think a decade of experience of being the world's largest social media site wasn't enough time for them to discover and deal with these issues?

    People have been bitching at Facebook for many years about their dismissive and intrusive practices, and they've intentionally ignored these valid complaints.

    Facebook was even aware that millions of users' info was in the process of being harvested here, but they knowingly allowed it when the excuse was simply "LOL this is for educational purposes".

    Amazing.

    The blame-the-victims mentality here is disturbing. These victims weren't a few idiots who overshared way too much on social media. We are talking about many millions of people whose valuable information was harvested without their knowledge, simply via the existing Facebook privacy holes which people have complained about for the past decade. Nothing was hacked, and nothing proprietary was stolen. Reread that last sentence. This entire privacy violation was committed using Facebook's existing and intended interface, and nothing has yet been changed.

    But oh yeah, let's just blame Bannon for this, and let's just cast Trump supporters as clueless dupes. Much easier narrative for many to swallow.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    LOL at the defense of Facebook in this thread.

    If they weren't a politically left-leaning corporation, the same people making excuses for them would be calling for all kinds of penalties and blaming them huge for this situation.

    But it's so much easier to solely rest blame upon the Bannon Bogeyman, right?

    Facebook is not naive. They were not caught with their pants down. They were not unwitting dupes. They were not responsible actors whose innocent tool was used for evil.

    They've been engaging in obnoxious and intentional privacy violations for more than a decade, all in the name of profit.

    They have gotten away with this because they have done a good job at keeping their userbase ignorant as to what's been going on, especially through providing "privacy controls" which don't do nearly as much as most users think they do.

    Despite having an otherwise intuitive and straightforward interface, their privacy settings are complicated, difficult to navigate, and misleading. Do you think that was an accident? Do you think a decade of experience of being the world's largest social media site wasn't enough time for them to discover and deal with these issues?

    People have been bitching at Facebook for many years about their dismissive and intrusive practices, and they've intentionally ignored these valid complaints.

    Facebook was even aware that millions of users' info was in the process of being harvested here, but they knowingly allowed it when the excuse was simply "LOL this is for educational purposes".

    Amazing.

    The blame-the-victims mentality here is disturbing. These victims weren't a few idiots who overshared way too much on social media. We are talking about many millions of people whose valuable information was harvested without their knowledge, simply via the existing Facebook privacy holes which people have complained about for the past decade. Nothing was hacked, and nothing proprietary was stolen. Reread that last sentence. This entire privacy violation was committed using Facebook's existing and intended interface, and nothing has yet been changed.
    But oh yeah, let's just blame Bannon for this, and let's just cast Trump supporters as clueless dupes. Much easier narrative for many to swallow.


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    Diamond hongkonger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    LOL at the defense of Facebook in this thread.

    If they weren't a politically left-leaning corporation, the same people making excuses for them would be calling for all kinds of penalties and blaming them huge for this situation.

    But it's so much easier to solely rest blame upon the Bannon Bogeyman, right?

    Facebook is not naive. They were not caught with their pants down. They were not unwitting dupes. They were not responsible actors whose innocent tool was used for evil.

    They've been engaging in obnoxious and intentional privacy violations for more than a decade, all in the name of profit.

    They have gotten away with this because they have done a good job at keeping their userbase ignorant as to what's been going on, especially through providing "privacy controls" which don't do nearly as much as most users think they do.

    Despite having an otherwise intuitive and straightforward interface, their privacy settings are complicated, difficult to navigate, and misleading. Do you think that was an accident? Do you think a decade of experience of being the world's largest social media site wasn't enough time for them to discover and deal with these issues?

    People have been bitching at Facebook for many years about their dismissive and intrusive practices, and they've intentionally ignored these valid complaints.

    Facebook was even aware that millions of users' info was in the process of being harvested here, but they knowingly allowed it when the excuse was simply "LOL this is for educational purposes".

    Amazing.

    The blame-the-victims mentality here is disturbing. These victims weren't a few idiots who overshared way too much on social media. We are talking about many millions of people whose valuable information was harvested without their knowledge, simply via the existing Facebook privacy holes which people have complained about for the past decade. Nothing was hacked, and nothing proprietary was stolen. Reread that last sentence. This entire privacy violation was committed using Facebook's existing and intended interface, and nothing has yet been changed.

    But oh yeah, let's just blame Bannon for this, and let's just cast Trump supporters as clueless dupes. Much easier narrative for many to swallow.
    I for one am not defending Facebook. I hate Facebook AND I think Bannon/Nix/CA are scumbags. As the great comedian Jackie Mason once said, "a lox on both their houses."
    HILLARY WON

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    Platinum gimmick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    LOL at the defense of Facebook in this thread.

    If they weren't a politically left-leaning corporation, the same people making excuses for them would be calling for all kinds of penalties and blaming them huge for this situation.

    But it's so much easier to solely rest blame upon the Bannon Bogeyman, right?

    Facebook is not naive. They were not caught with their pants down. They were not unwitting dupes. They were not responsible actors whose innocent tool was used for evil.

    They've been engaging in obnoxious and intentional privacy violations for more than a decade, all in the name of profit.

    They have gotten away with this because they have done a good job at keeping their userbase ignorant as to what's been going on, especially through providing "privacy controls" which don't do nearly as much as most users think they do.

    Despite having an otherwise intuitive and straightforward interface, their privacy settings are complicated, difficult to navigate, and misleading. Do you think that was an accident? Do you think a decade of experience of being the world's largest social media site wasn't enough time for them to discover and deal with these issues?

    People have been bitching at Facebook for many years about their dismissive and intrusive practices, and they've intentionally ignored these valid complaints.

    Facebook was even aware that millions of users' info was in the process of being harvested here, but they knowingly allowed it when the excuse was simply "LOL this is for educational purposes".

    Amazing.

    The blame-the-victims mentality here is disturbing. These victims weren't a few idiots who overshared way too much on social media. We are talking about many millions of people whose valuable information was harvested without their knowledge, simply via the existing Facebook privacy holes which people have complained about for the past decade. Nothing was hacked, and nothing proprietary was stolen. Reread that last sentence. This entire privacy violation was committed using Facebook's existing and intended interface, and nothing has yet been changed.

    But oh yeah, let's just blame Bannon for this, and let's just cast Trump supporters as clueless dupes. Much easier narrative for many to swallow.
    Solid projecting. Pretty much you're the only one that has said that FB's excuse was that it was for educational purposes. Academic purposes, more precisely research. It's a thing they do in science. Perfectly legal on FB's side. You can get anthrax from CDC for research with the right credentials. You can't get anthrax for educational purposes.

    There's really no need to pick a favorite here and then excuse everyone else. It's perfectly fine that CA broke the law, FB is a scummy greedy corporation and people are idiots. Stupidity for the most parts isn't a crime. Being scummy and greedy also not a crime.

     
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      MumblesBadly: But blaming FB allows Druff to distract attention from the real villians here, i.e. Cambridge Analytica

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    Druff, I will explain it to you.


    So, when you are using one of your stalker FB accounts to glean information on an old flame, or a internet troll, it's FB fault?

     
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      MumblesBadly: Boom!

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    Owner Dan Druff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gimmick View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    LOL at the defense of Facebook in this thread.

    If they weren't a politically left-leaning corporation, the same people making excuses for them would be calling for all kinds of penalties and blaming them huge for this situation.

    But it's so much easier to solely rest blame upon the Bannon Bogeyman, right?

    Facebook is not naive. They were not caught with their pants down. They were not unwitting dupes. They were not responsible actors whose innocent tool was used for evil.

    They've been engaging in obnoxious and intentional privacy violations for more than a decade, all in the name of profit.

    They have gotten away with this because they have done a good job at keeping their userbase ignorant as to what's been going on, especially through providing "privacy controls" which don't do nearly as much as most users think they do.

    Despite having an otherwise intuitive and straightforward interface, their privacy settings are complicated, difficult to navigate, and misleading. Do you think that was an accident? Do you think a decade of experience of being the world's largest social media site wasn't enough time for them to discover and deal with these issues?

    People have been bitching at Facebook for many years about their dismissive and intrusive practices, and they've intentionally ignored these valid complaints.

    Facebook was even aware that millions of users' info was in the process of being harvested here, but they knowingly allowed it when the excuse was simply "LOL this is for educational purposes".

    Amazing.

    The blame-the-victims mentality here is disturbing. These victims weren't a few idiots who overshared way too much on social media. We are talking about many millions of people whose valuable information was harvested without their knowledge, simply via the existing Facebook privacy holes which people have complained about for the past decade. Nothing was hacked, and nothing proprietary was stolen. Reread that last sentence. This entire privacy violation was committed using Facebook's existing and intended interface, and nothing has yet been changed.

    But oh yeah, let's just blame Bannon for this, and let's just cast Trump supporters as clueless dupes. Much easier narrative for many to swallow.
    Solid projecting. Pretty much you're the only one that has said that FB's excuse was that it was for educational purposes. Academic purposes, more precisely research. It's a thing they do in science. Perfectly legal on FB's side. You can get anthrax from CDC for research with the right credentials. You can't get anthrax for educational purposes.

    There's really no need to pick a favorite here and then excuse everyone else. It's perfectly fine that CA broke the law, FB is a scummy greedy corporation and people are idiots. Stupidity for the most parts isn't a crime. Being scummy and greedy also not a crime.
    LOL "research".

    It's Facebook's moral (and possibly legal) responsibility to separate claims of "research" from commercial data harvesting. In fact, this is one of those situations where the default should have been to instantly distrust and apply an extremely high standard for what constitutes "research", rather than just accepting a quick explanation and continuing to allow it. You know, like your anthrax example. I can't just stroll into the CDC and say, "Hey, I'd like some anthrax for research purposes. Ok, cool? Thanks."

    Glad we can at least agree that FB is a scummy, greedy corporation.

    Yes, many people are idiots, especially when it comes to matters such as online privacy, where in general everyone is still way underinformed and undereducated.

    But people of all political persuasions are idiots when it comes to stuff like this, and in this case, the main target was easily manipulated swing voters. Trump and his campaign were very smart in realizing they didn't need to preach to the choir, whereas Hillary oddly was mainly trying to appeal to big city liberals.

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    https://www.nytimes.com/2018/03/19/t...ex-stamos.html

    sorry about the paywall, but facebook's chief information security officer is bailing because fb is half stepping on their stance regarding disinformation campaigns..

    next stop for him, im guessing... congress.

    i dont know if zuck is legally exposed at this point but just finding out aint gonna be cheap.
    "Birds born in a cage think flying is an illness." - Alejandro Jodorowsky

    "America is not so much a nightmare as a non-dream. The American non-dream is precisely a move to wipe the dream out of existence. The dream is a spontaneous happening and therefore dangerous to a control system set up by the non-dreamers." -- William S. Burroughs

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    Owner Dan Druff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sonatine View Post
    https://www.nytimes.com/2018/03/19/t...ex-stamos.html

    sorry about the paywall, but facebook's chief information security officer is bailing because fb is half stepping on their stance regarding disinformation campaigns..

    next stop for him, im guessing... congress.

    i dont know if zuck is legally exposed at this point but just finding out aint gonna be cheap.
    Okay... sooooo.... starting to change your mind about Facebook's culpability in all of this?

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    Platinum gimmick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by gimmick View Post

    Solid projecting. Pretty much you're the only one that has said that FB's excuse was that it was for educational purposes. Academic purposes, more precisely research. It's a thing they do in science. Perfectly legal on FB's side. You can get anthrax from CDC for research with the right credentials. You can't get anthrax for educational purposes.

    There's really no need to pick a favorite here and then excuse everyone else. It's perfectly fine that CA broke the law, FB is a scummy greedy corporation and people are idiots. Stupidity for the most parts isn't a crime. Being scummy and greedy also not a crime.
    LOL "research".

    It's Facebook's moral (and possibly legal) responsibility to separate claims of "research" from commercial data harvesting. In fact, this is one of those situations where the default should have been to instantly distrust and apply an extremely high standard for what constitutes "research", rather than just accepting a quick explanation and continuing to allow it. You know, like your anthrax example. I can't just stroll into the CDC and say, "Hey, I'd like some anthrax for research purposes. Ok, cool? Thanks."

    Glad we can at least agree that FB is a scummy, greedy corporation.

    Yes, many people are idiots, especially when it comes to matters such as online privacy, where in general everyone is still way underinformed and undereducated.

    But people of all political persuasions are idiots when it comes to stuff like this, and in this case, the main target was easily manipulated swing voters. Trump and his campaign were very smart in realizing they didn't need to preach to the choir, whereas Hillary oddly was mainly trying to appeal to big city liberals.
    Kogan and his firm had the right credentials. That's why CA used him. There was nothing that distinguishes what Kogan was doing from data harvesting for research. Most of that was legal and he had the consent of the originals "seeds". Only grey area is the people in the friends lists.

    The blatantly illegal parts are soliciting Kogan to work as a front for CA's data harvesting operation and the point where the data is handed over to CA and any work derived from that.

    Obv you can say FB should protect peoples privacy better, but that's for the future. You can't blame them for anything that's legal now.

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    Plutonium sonatine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by sonatine View Post
    https://www.nytimes.com/2018/03/19/t...ex-stamos.html

    sorry about the paywall, but facebook's chief information security officer is bailing because fb is half stepping on their stance regarding disinformation campaigns..

    next stop for him, im guessing... congress.

    i dont know if zuck is legally exposed at this point but just finding out aint gonna be cheap.
    Okay... sooooo.... starting to change your mind about Facebook's culpability in all of this?

    im not sure i understand your point but im positive that you have no interest in understanding mine.

    that post is talking about culpability about hosting malicious content, and the previous post was saying that facebook put a tool on the market which CA leveraged to shred multiple democracies.

    are you so desperate to find fault in company that doesnt hold your values that youre willing to equivilize those two radically disparate realities?

    wouldnt it be less effort for you to just start a conservative social media site? you already own tydepoker.com so honestly you're half way there.

    make it happen cap'n.

     
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      The_Lurker: 100% no interest
    "Birds born in a cage think flying is an illness." - Alejandro Jodorowsky

    "America is not so much a nightmare as a non-dream. The American non-dream is precisely a move to wipe the dream out of existence. The dream is a spontaneous happening and therefore dangerous to a control system set up by the non-dreamers." -- William S. Burroughs

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    Owner Dan Druff's Avatar
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    The sad thing is that, other than the privacy violations and recent political biases, Facebook has done an excellent job in many areas.

    They are a massive social media network and have kept spam levels very low. I almost never get spam messages, and when I do, the accounts are deleted before I can even report them.

    Other than the privacy settings, the interface is clean and intuitive.

    They were the first social media site which wasn't a complete mess (lol Myspace), and they've done a great job staying relevant for the past decade.

    I remember in 2009, I ate in a Palo Alto restaurant which literally shared the small, strip mall building with Facebook headquarters. Pretty amazing to see how they've grown.

    But the problem is that the company largely grew through its usage of intrusive yet subtle privacy violations, so it became the norm for them.

    You'd sign onto Facebook for the first time, provide very little info, and all of a sudden you're inundated with friend suggestions of people you last talked to 20 years ago. You think to yourself, "Wow, creepy, how did it know this?", but you're too impressed and excited to care.

    Not surprising that we got to this point.

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    Plutonium sonatine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrTickle View Post


    today's excellent piece about cambridge analytica

    lol @ painting facebook with the same brush as a CEO calmly offering to compromise politicians with sex workers over drinks.
    "Birds born in a cage think flying is an illness." - Alejandro Jodorowsky

    "America is not so much a nightmare as a non-dream. The American non-dream is precisely a move to wipe the dream out of existence. The dream is a spontaneous happening and therefore dangerous to a control system set up by the non-dreamers." -- William S. Burroughs

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    There's that old saying; every empire starts with a little larceny.

    FB pushed the boundaries with their data modeling / advertising. I genuinely believe they faded a legal coinflip there and finally became too big to fail, or at least too big to sue.

    If I had to guess, I'd say their fantastic relationship with LE / intelligence agencies shielded them from a lot of raised legal eyebrows.
    "Birds born in a cage think flying is an illness." - Alejandro Jodorowsky

    "America is not so much a nightmare as a non-dream. The American non-dream is precisely a move to wipe the dream out of existence. The dream is a spontaneous happening and therefore dangerous to a control system set up by the non-dreamers." -- William S. Burroughs

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    Quote Originally Posted by sonatine View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by MrTickle View Post


    today's excellent piece about cambridge analytica

    lol @ painting facebook with the same brush as a CEO calmly offering to compromise politicians with sex workers over drinks.
    yeah Facebook is way worse

    ok I kid.
    HILLARY WON

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    Owner Dan Druff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sonatine View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post

    Okay... sooooo.... starting to change your mind about Facebook's culpability in all of this?

    im not sure i understand your point but im positive that you have no interest in understanding mine.

    that post is talking about culpability about hosting malicious content, and the previous post was saying that facebook put a tool on the market which CA leveraged to shred multiple democracies.

    are you so desperate to find fault in company that doesnt hold your values that youre willing to equivilize those two radically disparate realities?

    wouldnt it be less effort for you to just start a conservative social media site? you already own tydepoker.com so honestly you're half way there.

    make it happen cap'n.
    tydepoker.com is now the property of the Skatz network. I'm surprised you don't know this. We were engaged in complex, behind-the-scenes negotiations, and eventually they offered me a deal I could not refuse.

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