Traffic ticket in Alberta -- what is the consequence for not paying?

[peter mcneil]

Druff, was this right in Banff or as you enter it? Post a picture of the ticket. The town of banff is pedestrian heavy and the speed limit within town limits is always under 50km/h and often gets under 30km/h in playground and school zones. I really doubt this was any kind of scam but just standard town speed limits. Why not just pay the thing and accept responsibility?

I've spent a lifetime in that town and so has nearly everyone I know and this is the first time I've ever heard someone complain about a ticket scam out there.

[Dan Druff]

Druff, was this right in Banff or as you enter it? Post a picture of the ticket. The town of banff is pedestrian heavy and the speed limit within town limits is always under 50km/h and often gets under 30km/h in playground and school zones. I really doubt this was any kind of scam but just standard town speed limits. Why not just pay the thing and accept responsibility?

I've spent a lifetime in that town and so has nearly everyone I know and this is the first time I've ever heard someone complain about a ticket scam out there.

This was outside of the main part of town. There are just about zero pedestrians on this road. I know the part of Banff you're referring to which IS pedestrian heavy, but I drove very slowly over there.

The fact that they coned off areas to pull people over (and nailed a car 5 minutes after me). This wasn't just a cop seeing me speeding and pulling me over. This was a full fledged trap, with an artificially low speed limit.

Even if you want to say that the entire town is under 50 kph, they obviously recognized that this particular street is full of speeders (because the speed they set is incorrect for normal driving on it), and that's why they posted the cops there with the coned off areas.

[peter mcneil]

I'll admit that Alberta is full of speed limit changes like that in areas they can likely generate revenue. But it's still our responsibility to pay attention and follow the instructions. Pay the thing, be a grown up. It's your fault you got the ticket, nobody else's.

[Dan Druff]

Mountain Avenue is a long road which goes downhill, and you travel a long way without any traffic lights, intersections, or pedestrians crossing back and forth.

Just after the curve (which isn't nearly as sharp as it looks on the map), they hit you with the laser gun and pull you over.

I'm not saying people should be zooming down this street, but you actually have to ride the brakes to keep as low as 45 kph.

[Dan Druff]

I'll admit that Alberta is full of speed limit changes like that in areas they can likely generate revenue. But it's still our responsibility to pay attention and follow the instructions. Pay the thing, be a grown up. It's your fault you got the ticket, nobody else's.

That's exactly what the cities ripping people off want you to think.

"I should have paid attention, it's my fault!"

"Rules are rules!"

"Speeding is unsafe!"

I am a firm believer that all traffic tickets should be written for safety reasons, not revenue reasons.

Once revenue gets into it, you have situations where speed limits are artificially set to generate revenue, despite safe speeds of travel of most of those being ticketed.

It's a hidden tax -- but usually against unwitting tourists or travelers passing through.

Of course, this is not unique to Banff. The US is full of awful little towns which pull this crap and derive a very healthy revenue from it.

The only way I would ever pay a ticket like this is if I'm forced to -- if I'm literally out of reasonably options to avoid doing so.

[limitles]

All im saying is, after driving with you in vegas, i'm not fucking surprised one bit at this one.

For real. I'm still appreciative for the rides none the less, and you do have a sick car.

but you and I both know you weren't paying attention and that's why you were going 20 over.

who goes 20 over anyway. that's reckless endangerment in some places.


Best advice is pay the ticket. you should learn from this.

Didn't have my car on this trip. It was a rental SUV.

You seem to be misunderstanding what a speed trap is. Are you aware that many corrupt localities adjust the speed limit artificially low for purposes of revenue, and post cops there to generate this revenue from unsuspecting visitors?

That's what happened here.

This was not a case of unsafe driving. I was snared in a speed trap.

Fuck the Banff city government.

I probably will end up paying it if I can't find any way around it, but that's only because I want to return to Canuckland at some point, and don't want bullshit when they run my passport.

Fuck the Poleeece, is that what you're sayin cause that don't play well in courtrooms in Alberta or Antartica. Signs were constructed so you can view what the limits are. It's the same principle used in your child's school zone where they frown upon negligent drivers burning rubber during recess.
You have quite a history of being a leadfoot, so who are you trying to fool?


forgot to had full blown laughter

[peter mcneil]

Speed trap appears to be set in an area that starts to get more congested with streets and hotels, is that fair to say? That map makes it look like a perfectly sensible place to start controlling traffic speed. Unless it's a freeway that's a pretty standard speed for Canadian cities and Banff. You fucked up man, I know you lose rational thought when it comes to your money but maybe it's a good chance to show your son an example of taking responsibility for your actions. Dad fucked up so dad pays what he owes.

[limitles]

Speed trap appears to be set in an area that starts to get more congested with streets and hotels, is that fair to say? That map makes it look like a perfectly sensible place to start controlling traffic speed. Unless it's a freeway that's a pretty standard speed for Canadian cities and Banff. You fucked up man, I know you lose rational thought when it comes to your money but maybe it's a good chance to show your son an example of taking responsibility for your actions. Dad fucked up so dad pays what he owes.

Amen, and what the fuck was the hurry?

[Dan Druff]

Speed trap appears to be set in an area that starts to get more congested with streets and hotels, is that fair to say? Unless it's a freeway that's a pretty standard speed for Canadian cities and Banff. You fucked up man, I know you lose rational thought when it comes to your money but maybe it's a good chance to show your son an example of taking responsibility for your actions. Dad fucked up so dad pays what he owes.

Speed limit was 45 kph all the way down Mountain Avenue. They just pop people for it near the bottom because it's easier to hide there.

Been driving almost 30 years, and I know a bullshit speed trap when I see one.

Keep in mind that when I've gotten other tickets in the past, I've been annoyed, but I also know that I'm guilty and was knowingly speeding. So even if I try to get out of it in order to keep my insurance rates lower or whatever, I'm not pissed off about the ticket itself. If you speed, a certain % of the time you're going to get caught and have to pay money, and I realize that. I see it the same as taking a really awful beat in poker. Costs money, but it's inevitable if you choose to play a lot.

But the speed traps piss me off because those are legalized scams. As I said, they should never be writing tickets for revenue -- only safety. I realize that's a pipe dream, and that tickets are ingrained in most small city revenue models, but it's wrong and it still pisses me off.

[Dan Druff]

Speed trap appears to be set in an area that starts to get more congested with streets and hotels, is that fair to say? That map makes it look like a perfectly sensible place to start controlling traffic speed. Unless it's a freeway that's a pretty standard speed for Canadian cities and Banff. You fucked up man, I know you lose rational thought when it comes to your money but maybe it's a good chance to show your son an example of taking responsibility for your actions. Dad fucked up so dad pays what he owes.

Amen, and what the fuck was the hurry?

No hurry. Speed limit artificially set to be low.

You have to ride the brakes and not touch the gas in order to keep as low as 45 kph. Pay attention, les.

If you were in the car with me going 45 kph on that street, you would feel like you were unnecessarily crawling.

[peter mcneil]

So the speed limit didn't even change, it was 45km/h the entire way and you're pissed they picked a good spot to nab speeders? WTF druff.

I also think that's exactly what the speed limit should be in that area. You're getting into communities there Druff. Who cares if it's downhill and you have to ride the breaks.

[hongkonger]

Were you in a rental car, or your own?

If in a rental car, it's possible they will forward the ticket info to your rental car company and the company will then automatically charge the credit card you used on your reservation, and tack on a processing charge just for shits and giggles. This is what they do for the toll bridges in BC as tourists don't realize they're reading license plates as you go over the bridge and figure they can go over without paying online within 7 days which is what you're supposed to do if you don't have a transponder. What would have been $5 turns into $30. Happened to me.

Regarding points on your license, both the Mounties and the rental car company have your license info, but I'm not sure either would bother to report it.

Cmoney is right about it possibly being a hassle trying to re-enter Canada.

[Dan Druff]

So the speed limit didn't even change, it was 45km/h the entire way and you're pissed they picked a good spot to nab speeders? WTF druff.

Yes, I'm pissed because I just drove down the hill at a very reasonable speed. Didn't feel fast at all. Didn't even look at the speed limit because I didn't even think I could be speeding. Yes, I should have looked, but it was so egregiously set low that I really thought the 70 kph I was going was probably around the speed limit.

Anyway, I'm not a noob driver. You get an idea driving around what is a safe speed for certain road conditions. This road had no business being set at 45 kph. They knew this well, which is why they set up the trap after the curve, with cones to nail multiple speeders at once.

[peter mcneil]

Druff, you're in a residential area there. That speed limit is what it should be and that trap is there to control speeds. You arent on a highway, those streets are lined with houses. Here's a pic of the area druff received his ticket.

[Dan Druff]

Were you in a rental car, or your own?

If in a rental car, it's possible they will forward the ticket info to your rental car company and the company will then automatically charge the credit card you used on your reservation, and tack on a processing charge just for shits and giggles. This is what they do for the toll bridges in BC as tourists don't realize they're reading license plates as you go over the bridge and figure they can go over without paying online within 7 days which is what you're supposed to do if you don't have a transponder. What would have been $5 turns into $30. Happened to me.

Yes, it was a rental, but the company doesn't bill you for non-toll moving violations.

Rental car company only gets involved if the ticket is against the vehiicle -- such as unpaid tolls or parking tickets. In those cases, they bill your card like you said.

If it's a situation of being hit with an automated radar machine (one where no cop is involved, and it takes a picture of the plate), they will forward your info to the jurisdiction, but they will not charge you because that's between you and the jurisdiction.

Oddly, I was once nailed in an automated speed trap in Washington (a notorious one, which I later learned online), and the rental car company sent me a letter that they sent my info to the city in Washington to process the speeding violation. The rental car company also charged me a LOL $18 processing fee. I called and talked them out of the $18, but I was bracing for the eventual ticket from Washington. Never happened. Somehow it slipped through the cracks and the ticket never materialized.

[hongkonger]

Also there is a driving record concern.

That is, if my state has a reciprocity agreement with Alberta, then it will count as a point on my record.

Anyone know which states Alberta has an agreement with, if any?

No, no no, Alberta has no deals with any fucking state. Why would they? You're in a different country. Being an American is
not a plus.......not a minus either but let's just say you will fare better by disowning your country and taking up citizenship in Cuba

Also, we now have a rat a yank out for the good of the world hotline.
We get a Tim's gift card for identifying the location of any todgers, meaning you could be physically
removed from the 2018 WSOP final table by the Mounted Police.

Holiday

Not necessarily true limitles. There are some systems for information sharing on some administrative topics between US states and Canadian provinces, where it's up to each state or province if they want to join. Driver licensing is one of these systems. It enabled me to walk into ICBC with my Indiana driver's license and get a BC driver's license in minutes.

[peter mcneil]

Here is mountain Ave and middle springs road, right where druff got his ticket. Again, it's a residential area. That's just totally typical of what you'd expect to see for a speed limit in Canada. 70km/h is too much there.

[limitles]

Amen, and what the fuck was the hurry?

No hurry. Speed limit artificially set to be low.

You have to ride the brakes and not touch the gas in order to keep as low as 45 kph. Pay attention, les.

If you were in the car with me going 45 kph on that street, you would feel like you were unnecessarily crawling.

Yeah ok, the ultimate tourist trap. Every city I've lived in has this. Cops suck on donuts and write tickets. The cost of ignoring

the limits has persuaded me to obey the preferred speed, unless I'm drunk, where you better get the hell out of the way.

[Dan Druff]

Druff, you're in a residential area there. That speed limit is what it should be and that trap is there to control speeds. You arent on a highway, those streets are lined with houses. Here's a pic of the area druff received his ticket.

That's a very misleading picture, as it shows the cross street and little of Mountain Ave.

Besides, the speed limit is also 45 kph miles up the road on Mountain, which is NOT residential, and as you can see from my map, has no intersections.

Having residential intersections does not mean the major street to cross it needs a low speed limit.

The street I grew up on was 25 mph speed limit, but its cross street was (and still is) 45 mph.

Right now I live very close to a 50 mph speed limit street, even though the street I'm on is 25 mph.

There is no excuse to set a major street with little pedestrian traffic to 25 mph.

[peter mcneil]

Druff you've lost your mind. it's a residential area there with uncontrolled intersections with cross walks. In Canada, where you were visiting that is always the speed limit you are going to see. You may see 50km/h and in some cases as low as 30km/h. That speed limit is bang on accurate for the area and they have a speed trap set there to slow assholes down for safety. Pay the thing and stop being a pussy.