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Thread: New telemarketing scam: Answering "Yes" to "Can you hear me?" used to illegally sign people up for stuff

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    100% Organic MumblesBadly's Avatar
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    New telemarketing scam: Answering "Yes" to "Can you hear me?" used to illegally sign people up for stuff

    Whatever you do, don’t say yes when this chatbot asks, 'Can you hear me?'

    http://www.latimes.com/business/laza...324-story.html

    It’s the most cunning robocall scam I’ve encountered — and the fact that I’ve fallen for it more than once tells you how successful it can be.

    The phone rings. You pick it up and say “hello.” There’s a brief silence and then a woman’s voice says, “Oh, hi there!” She offers an embarrassed laugh. “I’m sorry, I was having a little trouble with my headset!”


    I’ve gotten this call a number of times in recent weeks, at home and at work, and each time I’ve been suckered by the lifelike opening to stay on the line longer than I normally would for a robocall or a telemarketing pitch. It’s only when I realize I’ve heard the exact same thing before that I realize I’m hearing a recording.

    This is a new and highly sophisticated racket known as the “can you hear me” scam, which involves tricking people into saying yes and using that affirmation to sign people up for stuff they didn’t order.

    ...
    Anyone here familiar with/bit by this scam?
    _____________________________________________
    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    I actually hope this [second impeachment] succeeds, because I want Trump put down politically like a sick, 14-year-old dog. ... I don't want him complicating the 2024 primary season. I just want him done.
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    Were Republicans cowardly or unethical not to go along with [convicting Trump in the second impeachment Senate trial]? No. The smart move was to reject it.

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    Owner Dan Druff's Avatar
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    I get a lot of these.

    Until I read the article, I didn't realize that I was specifically getting these type of calls. I knew it was some scam, and I had heard about the "yes" thing recently, but the calls described in this article are identical to the ones I've been receiving.

    They didn't get what they wanted out of me, though.

    Whenever I get these robocalls, I either hang up, or I keep saying obscene things and wait to see if there's a human monitoring it to hang up on me.

    So when it says something like, "So can I give you more information about a free cruise to the Bahamas?", I answer, "Suck my dick" or "Let me cum on your face", and then wait to see what happens.

    I did get the new breed of these calls. They have prerecorded voices asking for various common and semi-common first names, and then it calls you up and asks for you by your first name. (They can only do this when calling from a list where they associate your name with your number.)

    A few days ago, I got a call from a bogus caller ID in Los Angeles, asking, "Hi, is this Todd?"

    When I asked in return, "Who's calling?", it immediatey hung up on me.

     
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      MumblesBadly: Please record some of these calls and play them in a radio show!

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    Owner Dan Druff's Avatar
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    Anyway, while it's good advice to avoid saying "yes", clearly a "yes" recording of you is not a binding legal contract.

    I can't see this ever holding up under any kind of scrutiny. I'm not just talking about court. I'm talking about credit card companies and other arbiters which get involved when you claim a scam occurred. This is especially true now that the "yes" scam is widely known.

    I am guessing that they will not use your "yes" thing to answer any kind of legal or credit card challenge, but rather attempt to use it to scare gullible people away from complaining, especially perhaps the elderly.

    For example, your 85-year-old grandma gets scammed this way, she calls up questioning a charge on her credit card, and they play her a recording of her saying "yes", and insist that she agreed and there's nothing she could do. Some people will back down at that point, either believing they forgot they agreed, or thinking that they are screwed because of the recording.

    I imagine that if you challenge this in any way, you will always win.

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    Platinum BetCheckBet's Avatar
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    Is there any evidence people are getting screwed over by this? Druff is right, no way holds up in court and I don't see how they would bill you anyways.

    They also could get you to say yes many other ways besides can you hear me questions.

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    Platinum BetCheckBet's Avatar
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    In fact the one article linked doesn't prove anything


    http://komonews.com/news/consumer/lo...ar-me-scammers

    Doesn't say how they got his credit card. They also could have done the same thing without him saying yes...

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    Gold Charham's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MumblesBadly View Post
    Whatever you do, don’t say yes when this chatbot asks, 'Can you hear me?'

    http://www.latimes.com/business/laza...324-story.html

    It’s the most cunning robocall scam I’ve encountered — and the fact that I’ve fallen for it more than once tells you how successful it can be.

    The phone rings. You pick it up and say “hello.” There’s a brief silence and then a woman’s voice says, “Oh, hi there!” She offers an embarrassed laugh. “I’m sorry, I was having a little trouble with my headset!”


    I’ve gotten this call a number of times in recent weeks, at home and at work, and each time I’ve been suckered by the lifelike opening to stay on the line longer than I normally would for a robocall or a telemarketing pitch. It’s only when I realize I’ve heard the exact same thing before that I realize I’m hearing a recording.

    This is a new and highly sophisticated racket known as the “can you hear me” scam, which involves tricking people into saying yes and using that affirmation to sign people up for stuff they didn’t order.

    ...
    Anyone here familiar with/bit by this scam?
    This cunt called me a few weeks ago. I waited to get through to an operator and started yelling at the douchebag, called him a thief, and then started cursing, yelling as loud as I could (OBV noone was home with me). The dude started yelling back LOL. Victory. I hope, unless the fckers signed me up for something.

     
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      MumblesBadly: LOL!

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    King of Lost Wages LarryLaffer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post

    A few days ago, I got a call from a bogus caller ID in Los Angeles, asking, "Hi, is this Todd?"

    When I asked in return, "Who's calling?", it immediatey hung up on me.
    this kinda frightens me. Why did the robot hang up?
    "Winning is the most important thing in my life, after breathing. Breathing first, winning next."

    George Steinbrenner

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    Quote Originally Posted by LarryLaffer View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post

    A few days ago, I got a call from a bogus caller ID in Los Angeles, asking, "Hi, is this Todd?"

    When I asked in return, "Who's calling?", it immediatey hung up on me.
    this kinda frightens me. Why did the robot hang up?
    Robots can tell if you're Jewish or not.

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    Plutonium Brittney Griner's Clit's Avatar
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    It was probably a real person that could tell right away that a sale wasn't happening.

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    King of Lost Wages LarryLaffer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brittney Griner's Clit View Post
    It was probably a real person that could tell right away that a sale wasn't happening.
    ok so here's my point. why the fuck are they even bothering with robots then if they still have to pay someone to listen?
    "Winning is the most important thing in my life, after breathing. Breathing first, winning next."

    George Steinbrenner

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    Plutonium Brittney Griner's Clit's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LarryLaffer View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Brittney Griner's Clit View Post
    It was probably a real person that could tell right away that a sale wasn't happening.
    ok so here's my point. why the fuck are they even bothering with robots then if they still have to pay someone to listen?

    In my day they didn't use robots. Just zombies.

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    Ivanka called me as a robot on election day

    0/U loads set at 1

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    Play touch tones after telling the kids to hold up the phone to the TV. Then dial your 1900 # and profit.

    Probably doesn't work so well with so many cell phones..

    SFOed?

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    Owner Dan Druff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LarryLaffer View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post

    A few days ago, I got a call from a bogus caller ID in Los Angeles, asking, "Hi, is this Todd?"

    When I asked in return, "Who's calling?", it immediatey hung up on me.
    this kinda frightens me. Why did the robot hang up?
    It probably can recognize speech and hands up if the answer doesn't contain "yes"

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    100% Organic MumblesBadly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lewfather View Post
    Ivanka called me as a robot on election day

    0/U loads set at 1
    Name:  image.jpeg
Views: 578
Size:  83.0 KB

     
    Name:  image.jpeg
Views: 475
Size:  114.2 KB
    _____________________________________________
    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    I actually hope this [second impeachment] succeeds, because I want Trump put down politically like a sick, 14-year-old dog. ... I don't want him complicating the 2024 primary season. I just want him done.
    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    Were Republicans cowardly or unethical not to go along with [convicting Trump in the second impeachment Senate trial]? No. The smart move was to reject it.

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    Gold Charham's Avatar
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    Love this guy. He tried to get to the bottom of the spoofed numbers calling me 2 times a week selling either security alarm services or credit card bs. I sometimes wait to yell at the guy answering the phone but I have given up. Can any of our cyber sleuths comment on this article ? Krebbs tracked it down and it looks like lead generators. https://krebsonsecurity.com/2017/06/...-mad-get-busy/

     
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      sonatine: krebs = god

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    Owner Dan Druff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Charham View Post
    Love this guy. He tried to get to the bottom of the spoofed numbers calling me 2 times a week selling either security alarm services or credit card bs. I sometimes wait to yell at the guy answering the phone but I have given up. Can any of our cyber sleuths comment on this article ? Krebbs tracked it down and it looks like lead generators. https://krebsonsecurity.com/2017/06/...-mad-get-busy/
    Interesting article, BUT...

    That may be about to change. The FCC recently approved new rules that would let phone companies block robocallers from using numbers they aren’t supposed to be using.

    “If a robocaller decides to spoof another phone number — making it appear that they’re calling from a different line to hide their identity — phone providers would be able to block them if they use a number that clearly can’t exist because it hasn’t been assigned or that an existing subscriber has asked not to have spoofed,” reads a story at The Verge.
    Bullshit.

    There's no way to do this.

    Why do you think Caller ID spoofing exists? Because the phone company wants it to? Because they knowingly allow it?

    No. It's because caller ID is generated by the switching system of the caller -- not the receiver. And given the ability of cheap VOIP systems to place calls, it's very easy to get a system which will essentially complete its own calls and generate its own caller ID.

    So there's no way the phone company can tell the difference between a spoofed and real number.

    It's the equivalent of getting a knock on your door, and you asking, "Who is it?", and the knocker giving a fake name. If you don't know the person at the door, you have no way to know if the name they're giving is real or fake.

    The only way to put an end to caller ID spoofing is to change the way caller ID works. Rather than trusting the caller ID info being sent, phone companies would need to verify it in some way. This would require a whole new protocol for call completion, and I don't see such an expensive and disruptive undertaking being put forth simply to stop spoofed numbers.

    I actually wrote about this a few years ago: http://toddwitteles.net/todd-witteles/?p=1

    This article claims phone companies will deny calls from nonexistent/disconnected numbers, as well as those from "numbers where the owner asked not to be spoofed", but that second part makes no sense. The phone company can't tell a spoof from a legit caller ID, so how can it detect a spoof?

     
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      Charham: interesting, i posted your reply on his site, ill post any replies

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    King of Lost Wages LarryLaffer's Avatar
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    I think when the internet is involved, there is no way to stop these things.
    "Winning is the most important thing in my life, after breathing. Breathing first, winning next."

    George Steinbrenner

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    Diamond Hockey Guy's Avatar
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    One time I received a call & looked at the caller ID to find out I was calling myself. Needless to say I didn't want to talk to no fucking Canadian idiot & let it go to voicemail. I did not leave a message.

     
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      MumblesBadly: You must not have anything important to say to yourself.
    (•_•) ..
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hockey Guy
    I'd say good luck in the freeroll but I'm pretty sure you'll go on a bender to self-sabotage yourself & miss it completely or use it as the excuse of why you didn't cash.

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    Owner Dan Druff's Avatar
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    BUMP

    For whatever reason, a meme warning people about this old YES scam is going around on Facebook again. I got into a debate with Dan Goldman (former Pokerstars executive) about it, after he disagreed when I said it was a myth.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff
    This is a myth. A recording of you saying yes isn't legally binding.
    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Goldman
    Todd is correct that your verbal consent *probably* isn't binding, but your recorded consent is almost always accepted by CC companies as 'first proof' (i.e. you dispute a charge and that's what the CC company sends). Then you have to disprove their 'evidence.'

    This is far from a myth.
    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff
    It's not binding. And no CC company has ever ruled in favor of the scammers in a situation like this. This is more used to trick people (especially seniors) into believing they accepted and forgot about it, and that even if they don't believe it, they shouldn't bother to fight it because they'll lose.

    As I said, myth.
    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Goldman
    I had typed a different response, but I now realize that I no longer need to engage experts who aren't really experts. There is plenty of supporting data out there (I'll give you a lead: check the MN AG web site).

    https://www.ag.state.mn.us/Consumer/...nYouHearMe.asp
    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff
    Dan, again, you are oversimplifying it. I'm not denying that this scam exists. I'm stating that it doesn't work like you think it does.

    There is nothing legally binding about a recording of you on the phone saying "YES". It can be used as supporting evidence in the case of a legitimate dispute (for example, SiriusXM subscribers are required to say YES several times to the terms when they switch their plan), but never can it be used by scammers as legal justification to sign you up for unwanted products or services.

    The YES scam is used to trick the victim into believing they have no recourse -- or that they accepted the terms and simply don't remember. This is particularly effective against the elderly, as they are more likely to be tricked into believing that they agreed to something and simply forgot. Also, as I said, it's used to intimidate people out of reporting the matter to the law enforcement or credit card companies, fearing they will look foolish. In some cases, victims are even threatened that they'll be arrested for filing false police reports!

    Therefore, instead of explaining this semi-complex concept stated above, the easiest and safest advice given is to "hang up and don't say yes", because that prevents the gullible and elderly from getting into this mess in the first place.

    It's one of those things where the simple explanation is easier for the average person to digest (and it sounds a lot more ominous, thus making it go viral), so it's presented that way.

    Notice that even that Minnesota AG article you're talking about doesn't claim that any of these charges are legally binding.

    People like sharing this story because: 1) They feel helpful and 2) It makes them feel like they have power over scammers by thwarting their attempts to get them to say the magic scam-authorizing word. But as I said, it's a myth.

    But if I'm wrong, feel free to show me one case where a credit card company refused someone's chargeback simply because they were tricked into saying YES on a scam call.

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