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Thread: Ourgame Poker

  1. #1

    Ourgame Poker

    There's a new US-friendly poker site that opened up recently. Thing is, I'm not sure if they are legit or not. Here's a link to the 2+2 discussion:

    http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/28...eeded-1605345/

    2+2 started accepting banner advertisement for them < 2 weeks ago. And then they began editing their URL into user posts in the forum, including mine. I raised hell and had it removed when I found out the site is not what I thought it was.

    You see, there is a company called OurGame International that recently purchased the WPT. They have a Chinese online poker room. This new site, called Ourgame.Poker, is not the same company! We wrote a bit about it in the article below:

    http://professionalrakeback.com/who-is-ourgame-poker


    There are number of warning signs. I'm not convinced that they are a scam, but there is the potential that they are. I think anyone who is wanting to play there should be cautious and take a risk-averse approach (i.e. don't deposit anything you aren't readily willing to lose).



    I know how DD likes to look into these sorts of things. Dan, if you are interested in looking into these people further, I have some more information I can share with you via PM.

     
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      IamGreek: Its PFA Sir!!!!!!!!!!!!
      
      Crowe Diddly: ^^^ offset greek, who didn't realize DD meant Dan Druff in this case (I think) rep
    .

  2. #2
    Owner Dan Druff's Avatar
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    Great writeup.

    LOL @ this:

    Why will Ourgame Poker necessarily become your choice?

    Ourgame Poker is a major advance in the world of poker. Innovative software, most attractive special offers and the highest extent of service customizing ensure that you’ll get an ultimate pleasure of playing at our site.

    Immediately after making a deposit with an indication of the Bonus code, you will see six face-down cards from which you may choose one. At the chosen card you will see the prize you have won which will be immediately credited to your account.
    And that was supposedly written by a company based in London?



    As you pointed out, clearly they are lying about that. I agree with you that it's based in Asia somewhere. The bad English looks very Asian, and the Asian imagery on the site also points that it's based there.


    This whole thing looks very shady, and I wouldn't trust them for a second. In general, it's never a good idea to play on a site which lies from the get go.

    Also, as you mentioned in your article, they don't even understand US payment processing, as evidenced by their ignorance to Skrill and Neteller not being in the American markets.


    One question, though: Do you really have an affiliate link to them? I see at the bottom of your review (which, to be fair, seems honest and unbiased), you still give people the chance to sign up there. Are you getting a commission for this? If not, why give your readers an easy link to start playing on a possible scam site?

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    Great writeup.

    LOL @ this:

    Why will Ourgame Poker necessarily become your choice?

    Ourgame Poker is a major advance in the world of poker. Innovative software, most attractive special offers and the highest extent of service customizing ensure that you’ll get an ultimate pleasure of playing at our site.

    Immediately after making a deposit with an indication of the Bonus code, you will see six face-down cards from which you may choose one. At the chosen card you will see the prize you have won which will be immediately credited to your account.
    And that was supposedly written by a company based in London?



    As you pointed out, clearly they are lying about that. I agree with you that it's based in Asia somewhere. The bad English looks very Asian, and the Asian imagery on the site also points that it's based there.


    This whole thing looks very shady, and I wouldn't trust them for a second. In general, it's never a good idea to play on a site which lies from the get go.

    Also, as you mentioned in your article, they don't even understand US payment processing, as evidenced by their ignorance to Skrill and Neteller not being in the American markets.


    One question, though: Do you really have an affiliate link to them? I see at the bottom of your review (which, to be fair, seems honest and unbiased), you still give people the chance to sign up there. Are you getting a commission for this? If not, why give your readers an easy link to start playing on a possible scam site?
    In answer to your question, yes.

    Well, our general practice with new sites is to test them privately in house for a few months to see if we're comfortable offering them to other people. If we aren't comfortable with our own money on there (mainly mine and that of my horses) then we don't offer it to other people. However, I'm working 80-100 hours a week, getting married, have multiple travel plans etc.

    This new site gave me the perfect opportunity to do some testing. Firstly, we don't KNOW that it is a scam. In fact, tonight, someone on 2+2 posted that they got a cashout. Whether it's true or not we'll have to wait and see from others, but it could simply be that this company is ignorant of the US market and needs help. I'm not betting heavily on it being legit, but I could be wrong.

    Back to that opportunity. I wish to see if people will still go to a website if you give them a negative review. Back when Lock was being ridiculous I wanted to stick a Lock affiliate link our large anti-Lock pieces just to see if people would use them, regardless of how vitriolic our articles were. I always suspected that people would still go to the sites. In good conscience however, I could not do so. I knew Lock was a scam before the public was on board. The business model was just FUBAR. This Ourgame site however, is brand new and TBD on its scamminess. So, with an open and honest warning and a big red button of discouragement, I'm tracking the analytics of how many people click A or B. I think it will be a fun little experiment quite frankly. Any money we earn will be paltry I'm sure, assuming it is ever paid.

    Quite frankly, I'd rather know one way or the other if they are a scam. But I don't feel bad for anyone who plays on the site, if in fact it turns out to be a scam, with the type of "review" we gave them. Caveat Emptor...
    .

  4. #4
    Caveat Emptor on PFA? How quaint.

    Government knows best & light regulation. Get with the program.

  5. #5
    Owner Dan Druff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HowQuaint View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    Great writeup.

    LOL @ this:



    And that was supposedly written by a company based in London?



    As you pointed out, clearly they are lying about that. I agree with you that it's based in Asia somewhere. The bad English looks very Asian, and the Asian imagery on the site also points that it's based there.


    This whole thing looks very shady, and I wouldn't trust them for a second. In general, it's never a good idea to play on a site which lies from the get go.

    Also, as you mentioned in your article, they don't even understand US payment processing, as evidenced by their ignorance to Skrill and Neteller not being in the American markets.


    One question, though: Do you really have an affiliate link to them? I see at the bottom of your review (which, to be fair, seems honest and unbiased), you still give people the chance to sign up there. Are you getting a commission for this? If not, why give your readers an easy link to start playing on a possible scam site?
    In answer to your question, yes.

    Well, our general practice with new sites is to test them privately in house for a few months to see if we're comfortable offering them to other people. If we aren't comfortable with our own money on there (mainly mine and that of my horses) then we don't offer it to other people. However, I'm working 80-100 hours a week, getting married, have multiple travel plans etc.

    This new site gave me the perfect opportunity to do some testing. Firstly, we don't KNOW that it is a scam. In fact, tonight, someone on 2+2 posted that they got a cashout. Whether it's true or not we'll have to wait and see from others, but it could simply be that this company is ignorant of the US market and needs help. I'm not betting heavily on it being legit, but I could be wrong.

    Back to that opportunity. I wish to see if people will still go to a website if you give them a negative review. Back when Lock was being ridiculous I wanted to stick a Lock affiliate link our large anti-Lock pieces just to see if people would use them, regardless of how vitriolic our articles were. I always suspected that people would still go to the sites. In good conscience however, I could not do so. I knew Lock was a scam before the public was on board. The business model was just FUBAR. This Ourgame site however, is brand new and TBD on its scamminess. So, with an open and honest warning and a big red button of discouragement, I'm tracking the analytics of how many people click A or B. I think it will be a fun little experiment quite frankly. Any money we earn will be paltry I'm sure, assuming it is ever paid.

    Quite frankly, I'd rather know one way or the other if they are a scam. But I don't feel bad for anyone who plays on the site, if in fact it turns out to be a scam, with the type of "review" we gave them. Caveat Emptor...
    Sorry, but I just don't understand this.

    You're warning people that it might be a scam, but are also providing affiliate links to the site so you can also make a few bucks if people are dumb enough to sign up there anyway?

    Sorry, I just can't agree with this.

    I understand that affiliates like you have to walk a fine line between advertising and a responsibility to the community, but when you are already having serious doubts about a site, you shouldn't be directing anyone to play there, even with a warning. And you especially shouldn't be profiting from people who sign up despite the warnings.

    I would think that the responsible thing to do would be only offering affiliate deals for rooms you either trust or mostly trust, while refusing to provide links to any room where you have doubts (even if not yet proven).

    I ask you to reconsider. Your article was good, and your reasoning was sound. Don't ruin all of that by trying to squeeze out a few bucks from those who don't heed your warnings.

    BTW, you can still run these same "experiments" by pretending to provide links to these rooms, and then instead take the user to a page instructing them that the link wasn't serious, and that your company doesn't deal with rooms which appear shady. That would still give you the metrics you're looking for.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    Great writeup.

    LOL @ this:

    Why will Ourgame Poker necessarily become your choice?

    Ourgame Poker is a major advance in the world of poker. Innovative software, most attractive special offers and the highest extent of service customizing ensure that you’ll get an ultimate pleasure of playing at our site.

    Immediately after making a deposit with an indication of the Bonus code, you will see six face-down cards from which you may choose one. At the chosen card you will see the prize you have won which will be immediately credited to your account.
    And that was supposedly written by a company based in London?



    As you pointed out, clearly they are lying about that. I agree with you that it's based in Asia somewhere. The bad English looks very Asian, and the Asian imagery on the site also points that it's based there.


    This whole thing looks very shady, and I wouldn't trust them for a second. In general, it's never a good idea to play on a site which lies from the get go.

    Also, as you mentioned in your article, they don't even understand US payment processing, as evidenced by their ignorance to Skrill and Neteller not being in the American markets.


    One question, though: Do you really have an affiliate link to them? I see at the bottom of your review (which, to be fair, seems honest and unbiased), you still give people the chance to sign up there. Are you getting a commission for this? If not, why give your readers an easy link to start playing on a possible scam site?
    How Quaint is buying full flush balances as an affiliate at .40 on the dollar knowing the site doesn';t have money to pay back its players and he has priority cashouts. He is shadier then Melanie Weisner who at least sold for .75 haha In his defense he is getting married has travel plans someone has to finance this why not scam and roll some poker players they are easy targets after all.

  7. #7

  8. #8
    Owner Dan Druff's Avatar
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    Come on... do you really think we are that stupid?

    You claim that you provided affiliate links to a shady site to do a "social experiment" to see who would click to sign up despite your warnings.



    Now, why did we use an affiliate account to do our testing?:

    1) Without one, we can't track the clicks properly.
    2) We were actually hoping that we could meet the minimum payout threshold for affiliates, $50, to see if they would pay affiliates. This would have provided a (debateably valuable) data point for their legitimacy, insofar as actually seeing if they paid it out. Unfortunately, due to the fact that we were so good at discouraging people from signing up, we did not get that opportunity.
    3) We have much experience working with affiliate managers. One contacted us before 2+2 began advertising O.P. We were curious to see if that person, or someone else from their company, as they undoubtedly have our contact information since they reached out to us in the first place, would contact us regarding this "negative review." No such contact was ever made.
    4) Furthermore, we told the contact at O.P. about many of the flaws in their poker room that ultimately ended up in our negative review article. When they didn't understand some of them, we offered to be of assistance. Would they fly a representative of our company (me) out to their London offices to consult on their fledgling poker room? They were smashingly silent. We were hoping that we could light a fire under their asses with a negative article that ranked top 3 in Google (which we achieved). However, not a peep of contact was made.
    I have two answers to the above: Bull and shit.

    1) Yes you CAN easily track the clicks of a button without having it link outside of your site. You just need to check the server logs. It doesn't even require any programming knowledge. This is a horrible excuse. Besides, if you didn't know how to do it, I'm sure you could have consulted your web designer and asked him.

    2) You were "hoping to reach the payout threshold for affiliates" to be able to tell if they're shady or not? Huh? So basically you're saying that you wanted your site's visitors to be the financial guinea pigs, so you can see if they get cheated while earning you affiliate dollars. And if you never get your affiliate money, that means they're shady. Got it. Nice of you to put other people's money at risk to prove this.

    3 and 4) Again, horrible excuse. You say you put up an affiliate link simply to see if someone were to contact you about a negative review? Why not just cut out the affiliate part, e-mail them the negative review, and see if you get contacted? Again, this prevents people from being cheated as part of your "experiment".


    BOTTOM LINE: You wrote a (fair) horrible review about what appeared very much to be a scam site. Then you put affiliate links at the bottom because you just couldn't resist possibly making a few extra bucks from degenerates who didn't read the review or didn't heed your warnings, because making money is all you seem to care about. If players are going to get cheated at Ourgame Poker, you at least want to get your share.

    Sounds like the actions of a man who would "feature" another website on their front page which isn't paying people reliably for the past year, while putting in the site reviews that it's "safe" to play there.

    You know, I didn't have an issue with you prior to these actions of the past few months. In fact, I even helped you blow up the story of that deadbeat stakee by covering it on my radio show.

    But you're really not looking very good here. It's really starting to look like you have no problem earning dirty money by marketing known scammers.

  9. #9
    You are entitled to your opinion. But you are wrong.
    .

  10. #10
    Owner Dan Druff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HowQuaint View Post
    You are entitled to your opinion. But you are wrong.
    Okay, so how about telling me how and where I'm wrong?

    I'm listening.

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Druff View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by HowQuaint View Post
    You are entitled to your opinion. But you are wrong.
    Okay, so how about telling me how and where I'm wrong?

    I'm listening.
    I am wrong also. It would be great if Quaint explained why. Aside from Ourgame , Qaint is buying up balances on full flush at .40 cents on the dollar. As greedy as Quaint seems to be, I can't be convinced that he is doing this out of his good heart and being a good person. No way he would put substantial amounts of money at risk without turning it over at a profit. No one is getting paid on full flush except for some low balances and in drips and drabs much like with lock. Qaint mentions nothing of the slow cashouts or no cashouts on his affiliate sites and makes claims on his affiliate site that full flush is a great place to play. Qaint feels he is doing the players he is cashing out at 40 cents on the dollars a great favor and service while putting his own money at risk.(LOLOL).

    If qaint really felt he was in the right and everyone was wrong he would come onto the radio show and explain why. Pretty damning to not come on after all that. Its not like he is going to do further damage by revealing why he is buying at .40 on the dollar which is what I would expect his argument to be. Like the lock pros purpotrating a scam site so by staying give people better chance to get paid. LOLOL

    Come on to the next show Mr Qaint and explain to us how we are wrong and you are right. Thank You

  12. #12
    Ourgame Poker is of course a scam!

    No legally binding agreement + no operator + no license = scam! What else could it be?

    In this case it is even not necessary to mention the too good to be true promotions.

    I figured it out within 5 minutes, while Professional Cheat aka How Quaint - kahntrutahn need months to test it! LMAO

    More info: http://game-protect.com/ourgame-poker-scam/

  13. #13
    Owner Dan Druff's Avatar
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    Oh no! Ukranian authorities are coming after me!

    Sender: Akmas group B.V.
    E-commerce Park Vredenberg Z/N

    Receiver: GAME PROTECTER
    http://pokerfraudalert.com/
    For the record: Administration of website http://pokerfraudalert.com

    Complaint
    concerning content of the website

    Dear Administration of site http://pokerfraudalert.com/

    Company Akmas group B.V. is owner of poker-room “Ourgame poker” that works in sphere of gambling games.

    Your site, contents information, that discredit business reputation of “Ourgame poker” and business reputation of our company. According to your site our company wants to use trust of our clients to fraudulently receive profit.

    Such information can be found here: http://pokerfraudalert.com/forum/sho...-Ourgame-Poker

    Please notice, that information is not correspond to facts and has negative influence on business relations between” Ourgame poker”, clients and partners.

    In this regard, please, delete that discussion from forum, and all messages of users consider as gossip and slander against” Ourgame poker” with aim to spoil our business reputation for personal advantage.

    In case of ignore, we will have to involve Ukrainian Authorities with aim to solve that situation in Court.

    Respectfully,
    Company Akmas group B.V.


    -----------------------------------------------

    Ironic, though, that this thread was started by a scammer himself -- HowQuaint aka Jon Brown.

  14. #14
    Good Luck in Ukrainian court, Druff.

    BTW, well done Ourgame.Poker...bringing more attention to yourself on this site by sending that pathetically worded message to Druff.


    Name:  200.gif
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    Interestingly, I found this small article online that says "The brothers Ivanukh", Nikolay and Aleksander, are the founders of fakeOurgame and that they purposely made their Poker network logo "look Chinese" and chose the name Ourgame.poker to target unsuspecting Chinese players (who presumably had heard of the legit Ourgame).

    The article also claims that the site:

    - uses the old DohaPoker Network (and even photoshopped the DohaPoker licence to like like it belongs to Ourgame.Poker)
    - is filled with bots that will quickly beat players out of real $$$
    - had its owner Nikolay Ivanukh contact affiliates in person and threaten them in case they disclosed his personal info to the third parties
    - may put a trojan horse onto the computer of a player who chooses to download the software

    http://en.worldpokerdeals.com/blog/w...s-of-dohapoker


    Looks like the guy who posted this on worldpokerdeals.com was the one who posted this on twoplustwo and got a similar "message" as Druff:

    http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/sh...&postcount=242
    Last edited by Forum Wars; 10-08-2016 at 03:48 AM.

  15. #15
    Owner Dan Druff's Avatar
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    I love how these Ukranian idiots really think they are going to scare me with legal threats.

    They must fire out these boilerplate legal threats to any site exposing them, and hope people back down.

    They'd be better off lying and claiming they are American lawyers, rather than threatening someone with the Ukraine courts!

    Hilarious.

  16. #16
    Diamond Hockey Guy's Avatar
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    Druff, can you make me a mod before you go to jail for this or will I have to wait for Zod to take over?
    (•_•) ..
    ∫\ \___( •_•)
    _∫∫ _∫∫ɯ \ \

    Quote Originally Posted by Hockey Guy
    I'd say good luck in the freeroll but I'm pretty sure you'll go on a bender to self-sabotage yourself & miss it completely or use it as the excuse of why you didn't cash.

  17. #17
    E-commerce Park Vredenberg Z/N is in Curacao, but the company "Akmas group B.V." do not exist!

    Who is this GAME PROTECTER?

    Involve Ukrainian Authorities is a great joke! They even do not know that this "Ourgame poker" show exist...

  18. #18
    Druff, if you do time in the Ukraine, I hope you like cabbage.

  19. #19
    Owner Dan Druff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnCommode View Post
    Druff, if you do time in the Ukraine, I hope you like cabbage.
    Can't be any worse than the anchovies over mashed potatoes that they serve in the Bahamian refugee camps.

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