Why the "Do Not Call" list doesn't work, and you're getting more robocalls than ever. cc: Druff

https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifes...92a_story.html

Cliffs: The Do Not Call list doesn't do much to stop robocalls. This is because there's plenty of people willing to just break the law, and it's very hard to catch them. The DNC list doesn't actually block numbers from being called, telemarketers are just supposed to police themselves. And if somebody calls you and you're on the DNC list, you can file a complaint. But that's unlikely to do anything. Most robo-callers are using spoofed numbers, so you don't actually know who's calling you. But even if you did, all the FTC can do is slap them with a huge fine ($11,000 per unauthorized call). But if the robocaller doesn't have the means to pay... oh well. In 2009 the FTC dished out $330 million in penalties for companies that broke Do Not Call rules. But they only collected $19 million. The rest were smaller operations that just folded their operations, a new operation popped up doing the same thing.

There needs to be stricter penalties for calling somebody on the Do Not Call list repeatedly, including jail time. Not just 'fines', which do nothing.

i havent read the article because i dont need the liberal jew media to tell me what the bible already did, but if you really want to resolve this issue, you need to address the ability to spoof phone numbers.

as long as that exists, there can be no meaningful regulation.

we either need to eliminate that loophole or literally flatten every inch of india with the cumulative might of the developed worlds conventional weapons, and we need to do it at night when they are all napping off their evening rapes so as few as possible escape.

My wife and I are constantly getting numbers that have the same area code and exchange as our numbers (both are different) and the last 4 digits are close to ours. If you try to call them back, you get a regular person that's completely clueless their number is being used for robocalling. I'm sure there's not much that can be done because how do you trace that shit?

I just don't answer any phone call from a number I don't recognize.

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Originally Posted by sonatine

i havent read the article because i dont need the liberal jew media to tell me what the bible already did, but if you really want to resolve this issue, you need to address the ability to spoof phone numbers.

as long as that exists, there can be no meaningful regulation.

we either need to eliminate that loophole or literally flatten every inch of india with the cumulative might of the developed worlds conventional weapons, and we need to do it at night when they are all napping off their evening rapes so as few as possible escape.

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I am not sure why some regulation cant be made so that phone numbers are like IP addresses so there is some way to track it back to the source. If you had this, you could have "spam" filters as well that auto block the incoming calls. Basically, you cant have a number, or cant use that number to contact someone, without some verification that it is tied to a physical location.

It is getting super annoying and there seems to be a relatively easy fix to it all.

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Originally Posted by verminaard

I just don't answer any phone call from a number I don't recognize.

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:this

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Originally Posted by cmoney

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Originally Posted by sonatine

i havent read the article because i dont need the liberal jew media to tell me what the bible already did, but if you really want to resolve this issue, you need to address the ability to spoof phone numbers.

as long as that exists, there can be no meaningful regulation.

we either need to eliminate that loophole or literally flatten every inch of india with the cumulative might of the developed worlds conventional weapons, and we need to do it at night when they are all napping off their evening rapes so as few as possible escape.

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I am not sure why some regulation cant be made so that phone numbers are like IP addresses so there is some way to track it back to the source. If you had this, you could have "spam" filters as well that auto block the incoming calls. Basically, you cant have a number, or cant use that number to contact someone, without some verification that it is tied to a physical location.

It is getting super annoying and there seems to be a relatively easy fix to it all.

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if memory serves, this all become super exploitable around the time we broke away from pure copper infrastructure and started to deal with like, virtual IPX systems and so on, and no one wanted to deal with the issue then because it would have created huge headaches, but yeah i feel like enough is enough at this point, someone needs to sanity check this shit.

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Originally Posted by verminaard

I just don't answer any phone call from a number I don't recognize.

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This is not a solution if you do business on your cell phone.

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Originally Posted by The_Lurker

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Originally Posted by verminaard

I just don't answer any phone call from a number I don't recognize.

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This is not a solution if you do business on your cell phone.

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Yep, the article talked about what a problem it is for businesses that need their phone line open. I think eventually technology will be able to fix this, in the same way that Gmail has almost completely done away with email spam.

Some guy wrote about all of this a few years ago:

http://toddwitteles.net/todd-witteles/?p=1

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Originally Posted by PLOL

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Originally Posted by The_Lurker

This is not a solution if you do business on your cell phone.

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Yep, the article talked about what a problem it is for businesses that need their phone line open. I think eventually technology will be able to fix this, in the same way that Gmail has almost completely done away with email spam.

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Nah. Small businesses should still get solicited. Someone has to pay for my opulent meals that I am accustomed to eating after crushing quota

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Originally Posted by OSA

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Originally Posted by PLOL

Yep, the article talked about what a problem it is for businesses that need their phone line open. I think eventually technology will be able to fix this, in the same way that Gmail has almost completely done away with email spam.

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Nah. Small businesses should still get solicited. Someone has to pay for my opulent meals that I am accustomed to eating after crushing quota

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It's in reference to robo calls. If you read the article it talked about how the robocall industry actually hurt the more legitimate telemarketers because people don't trust unrecognized numbers anymore.

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Originally Posted by Dan Druff

Some guy wrote about all of this a few years ago:

http://toddwitteles.net/todd-witteles/?p=1

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That was a good read.

My Galaxy Note 8 has something called Premium Caller ID (might even be a Sprint thing). It displays when a call is potentially spam/robocall and displays a special incoming call screen saying just that. It isn't always accurate, one call I got was marked "MN Government" but it was a spoofed caller ID style call.

Seems like they're close, but it needs some tweaks. Also needs to be a way to trace the spoofed caller IDs back to a source, but I'm sure that isn't as easy as it sounds.

Caller ID was developed in the 1980s and can be easily spoofed because there is zero verification built into the protocol.

In the 1980s, all calls were completed via large, well-known telephone companies, so there was no concern about spoofing.

Later, it became possible to essentially set up your own little phone company and complete the call yourself -- especially with VOIP -- and suddenly the caller ID data wasn't trustworthy anymore. If you set up your own VOIP operation, you can choose what to send for caller ID.

Unfortunately, changing this would be a massive undertaking at this point, as it will break all of these smaller systems attempting to complete calls.

Believe it or not, Caller ID is provided by the calling phone company, not the receiver, and it's send as a 1200 baud signal (lol) between the first and second ring. Most cell providers will ignore the "first ring" and not actually complete the call being received until the caller ID signal comes through. But on many home phones, you still won't see caller ID until the second ring starts.

There is no verification to the data being sent. The receiving phone basically asks the calling phone, "Hey, what's your number?", and that's what is displayed.

Oh, and have you seen your phone say "unknown" sometimes instead of "private" when the caller ID is blocked? Unknown doesn't mean it's blocked -- it just means that nothing was sent. Private means that something was sent, but with a little flag saying, "Please don't display me."

This is important because when you think you're blocking your caller ID, you're really not. Some receiving phone systems choose to ignore that "don't display" flag, and your number gets displayed anyway.

In fact, I have that going on with my phone. If you call me with a private number, I can see it anyway.

Back in the '90s, they introduced a feature where you had to show your caller ID to get through. However, you could get around it by calling with an unknown number, as it would only blocked numbers marked private. I found that feature to be obnoxious, so I always just called unknown (there were ways to do this) and pushed right through it.

But yeah, all of this allow robocallers to break the law and get away with it. Plus many of them aren't even based in the US, so they LOL at FTC fines.

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Originally Posted by verminaard

I just don't answer any phone call from a number I don't recognize.

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A loud siren horn played next to phone receiver stops most from calling back.

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Originally Posted by OSA

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Originally Posted by PLOL

Yep, the article talked about what a problem it is for businesses that need their phone line open. I think eventually technology will be able to fix this, in the same way that Gmail has almost completely done away with email spam.

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Nah. Small businesses should still get solicited. Someone has to pay for my opulent meals that I am accustomed to eating after crushing quota

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finally a real reason to hate OSA

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Originally Posted by The_Lurker

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Originally Posted by OSA

Nah. Small businesses should still get solicited. Someone has to pay for my opulent meals that I am accustomed to eating after crushing quota

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finally a real reason to hate OSA

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THAT’S what it took?

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Originally Posted by splitthis

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Originally Posted by verminaard

I just don't answer any phone call from a number I don't recognize.

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A loud siren horn played next to phone receiver stops most from calling back.

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No it doesnt.

Yeah, most robocalls want you to press or say something to be connected to the fucks on the other end. It's all computer until then.

the call centers get a list of numbers. there are hundreds of people in the call center. it absolutely does not matter what you say or do to them, 2-4 days later your number pops up on someone elses computer screen and now youre talking to Padma who desperately wants you to know the IRS is about to press charges if you dont resolve this urgent matter.

the one thing i did that helped slightly was setting my voicemail message as a 'doot deet doot this number is no longer in service' recording. apparently some of them will remove numbers that are out of service.

but the same master list gets sold to a new call center in a month and its back to square one.

I was going to make a new thread, but I saw this one and decided to to use it because it is clearly still relevant - especially the part about closing the loophole or glassing India.

If you can't tell, I'm pretty fucking pissed and at my end - probably like the rest of you.

Just like most of you, I'm getting bombarded by numerous robocalls from spoofed numbers. Today had to be one of the worse days in the last few weeks or so, as I received 14 calls. 7 of them were before 10am and out of that, 2 of those were even before 8am.

I just upgraded my phone to a Samsung Galaxy S9. Now, before I did this, with my older Android phone, solving the Robo issue wasn't quite as bad (and I use that term loosely) because, using the phones built in functions, I could block not only specific phone numbers but I could also block prefixes (area codes etc). With my new phone, I can block specific phone numbers, but there are NO wildcards you can enter anymore. This is absolute BULLSHIT. Why the fuck would they do this?!

I do NOT want to download some shitty 3rd party app to block prefixes or anything else, but im not even sure if I have any other options at this point.

I have researched and researched some of the talked about apps out there and have been disappointed for one reason or the other.

To clarify, on my previous phone, I could enter whatever specific number or wildcard number I wanted, and it would simply block the number from even ringing. PERIOD, END OF STORY. Yes, it might still go to voicemail, but at least it would not ring or even display a notification that a particular number has called. The only way I would even know one of those numbers tried to call, was if I accessed my call log. After reviewing several apps in the store, the built in Android function still seemed like the best option because the 3rd party apps would often still ring for at least a split second and/or you would still get annoying notifications that some fucktard called you.

So, I guess my question is, is there another solution via using Android functions on stopping this or is there some HOF app that actually does the job im asking for?


I just cannot believe that in 2019 we are dealing with this scourge and nobody seems to have a real solution and/or congress hasn't gotten their head out of their ass to force phone companies to authenticate phone calls. I mean, are you fucking kidding me??

It's 2019 and spoofing phone numbers is LITERALLY childs play. A kind of a "case in point". My son was able to # spoof me a couple of days ago using a free app from the google store that made crank calls. I mean, I have to hand it to him; he tried this shit on me quite a while ago and I told him right away I knew it was a spoofed call and "if he wants to try and prank me, he needs to step up his game". So yeah, I guess he basically took me up on that and what he did the other day was...i gotta say...not bad - not bad son.

Anyway, not to go off on a tangtent or anything but can anyone make any recommendations to an actual good app that will maybe solve my problem?

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Originally Posted by Gordman

Anyway, not to go off on a tangtent or anything but can anyone make any recommendations to an actual good app that will maybe solve my problem?

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Not sure about Android, but iPhone now has a feature where you can disable rings from numbers that aren't in your contacts. It'll show up in missed calls, but you'll never hear it. Only frustrating part is when I order food or something and then I miss the delivery guy's call. So I just turn it off sporadically if I'm expecting an unknown number.

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Originally Posted by SPIT this

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Originally Posted by Gordman

Anyway, not to go off on a tangtent or anything but can anyone make any recommendations to an actual good app that will maybe solve my problem?

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Not sure about Android, but iPhone now has a feature where you can disable rings from numbers that aren't in your contacts. It'll show up in missed calls, but you'll never hear it. Only frustrating part is when I order food or something and then I miss the delivery guy's call. So I just turn it off sporadically if I'm expecting an unknown number.

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i have the iphone feature and verizon's spam id thing and i still have 5+ calls a day from spoofed numbers. all of them from indian call centers of course.

end of the day, the base protocol for VOIP needs to be patched against this and its unclear how one would do that without impacting essential functionality.

personally im just hoping either coronavirus or pakistan solves this issue once and for all.

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Originally Posted by sonatine

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Originally Posted by SPIT this

Not sure about Android, but iPhone now has a feature where you can disable rings from numbers that aren't in your contacts. It'll show up in missed calls, but you'll never hear it. Only frustrating part is when I order food or something and then I miss the delivery guy's call. So I just turn it off sporadically if I'm expecting an unknown number.

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i have the iphone feature and verizon's spam id thing and i still have 5+ calls a day from spoofed numbers. all of them from indian call centers of course.

end of the day, the base protocol for VOIP needs to be patched against this and its unclear how one would do that without impacting essential functionality.

personally im just hoping either coronavirus or pakistan solves this issue once and for all.

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I'm confused, if you turn on the iphone feature then you won't get a ring from a number unless they're in your contact list. They're spoofing numbers in your contact list? I've never seen that (though it'd be genius).

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Originally Posted by SPIT this

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Originally Posted by sonatine

i have the iphone feature and verizon's spam id thing and i still have 5+ calls a day from spoofed numbers. all of them from indian call centers of course.

end of the day, the base protocol for VOIP needs to be patched against this and its unclear how one would do that without impacting essential functionality.

personally im just hoping either coronavirus or pakistan solves this issue once and for all.

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I'm confused, if you turn on the iphone feature then you won't get a ring from a number unless they're in your contact list. They're spoofing numbers in your contact list? I've never seen that (though it'd be genius).

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so the iphone feature does turn off unknown contacts but it still lights up the phone and shows a splash screen saying i missed a call, which tbh i find just as irritating since i never have my phone on ring anyway and when i need to be ready to get a call from say a food delivery nerd who cant find my house, i have to go through hoops.

point being its a grossly inadequate solution when we have massive open source databases filled with reputation assessments on 95% of the numbers these street shitters use.

the VZ solution is a step in that direction but a tiny one.

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Originally Posted by SPIT this

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Originally Posted by sonatine

i have the iphone feature and verizon's spam id thing and i still have 5+ calls a day from spoofed numbers. all of them from indian call centers of course.

end of the day, the base protocol for VOIP needs to be patched against this and its unclear how one would do that without impacting essential functionality.

personally im just hoping either coronavirus or pakistan solves this issue once and for all.

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I'm confused, if you turn on the iphone feature then you won't get a ring from a number unless they're in your contact list. They're spoofing numbers in your contact list? I've never seen that (though it'd be genius).

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I'll 1 up that. I once got a call from myself.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rkcGm-pWwsQ

The "only accept calls from whitelisted numbers" thing has been available for awhile on jailbroken iPhones, and I chose not to use it because there's a lot more legit calls from non-contacts numbers than you'd expect.

For example, if a business needs to call you, it can be from any phone number (not necessarily their listed one).

Also, given that I have a kid, I don't want to block any calls which might be coming from Ben's school during the day and that can come from one of many numbers.

The solution to this whole problem isn't easy, without remaking the entire way caller ID is transmitted and received, which will break legacy systems. That's why it has persisted for so long.

BTW, if a mass-whitelisting starts occurring, spam callers will just start spoofing numbers of local businesses, schools, or utilities.

One possible idea how to prevent spam calls is to basically have a whitelist-and-answering-service combo, where non-whitelisted numbers will get forwarded to a human being who will then act as gatekeeper for the call. So if it's "Microsoft", "Dell", "The IRS", etc, the call will never come through, and if it's legit, the call will be transferred to the phone. The problem is that this will take a lot of manpower and would probably be too expensive for most people.

there is so much inexplicable pushback against patching VOIP that at this point i have to assume its a national security issue.