Last price:$78.73000 High:$79.72001
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Last price:$78.73000 High:$79.72001
I'm still a firm believer the only direction these can go is up.
**Other than a massive crash. Which will only happen due to some massive gov't intervention or massive hack/fraud.
Or a better encrypted currency coming along. There are a lot of ways in which this could crash down to pennies.Quote:
Originally Posted by simpdog
The massive government intervention will be, they will simply prohibit US business from accepting bitcoins. The Treasury has already said they do not recognize the currency as its not backed by a foreign government. This commenter in a recent article said it best:
Bitcoin has one major flaw. In order for money to be valuable, one must be able to exchange it for goods and services. If the US government perceives bitcoin as a threat to the USD, the US government will make it illegal for businesses to accept bitcoin as payment. That will make bitcoin virtually worthless - at least to Americans and anyone doing business in or with America. The government cannot do much about bitcoin itself but they can prevent businesses from accepting it as payment.
Bottom line is you have a glorified penny stock scheme. And like all penny stock schemes, when people start selling only a very few make any money, few break even, some lose money and the rest lose all their money.
Are you talking about the recent Bloomberg article where the treasury set guidelines for record keeping? Because I interpreted that very differently. They basically said that if if you're keeping proper records, paying taxes (when mining and converting BTC to cash), and not doing any black market shit, then you're all good. Go ahead and buy pizzas and web domains to your heart's content. Doesn't look like they have any interest whatsoever in cracking down on the currency itself.Quote:
Originally Posted by The_PHA
Dealers in Foreign ExchangeQuote:
Originally Posted by SrslySiriusAre you talking about the recent Bloomberg article where the treasury set guidelines for record keeping? Because I interpreted that very differently. They basically said that if if you're keeping proper records, paying taxes (when mining and converting BTC to cash), and not doing any black market shit, then you're all good. Go ahead and buy pizzas and web domains to your heart's content. Doesn't look like they have any interest whatsoever in cracking down on the currency itself.Quote:
Originally Posted by The_PHA
A person must exchange the currency of two or more countries to be considered a dealer in foreign exchange. Virtual currency does not meet the criteria to be considered "currency" under the BSA, because it is not legal tender. Therefore, a person who accepts real currency in exchange for virtual currency, or vice versa, is not a dealer in foreign exchange under FinCEN's regulations.
Since the currency is not exchangeable in the US, its not legal tender and therefore worthless. If you want to engage in an underground currency go ahead, I assume it has value by those that exchange it. People deal cocaine as well and get rich quick, that is black market currency as well.
I don't give a shit, but the US is not recognizing it, and therefore no reputable business will accept it. It's backdoor laundering. But knock yourself out dude. I really cannot believe how many people have fallen for a computer programmer from Japan. I'd love to get 100 random people in a room dealing bitcoins and do a background check on them.
That's a different argument altogether. I'm not disagreeing with you about its recognition by the US as a real currency or legal tender. I'm just referring to your point about massive government intervention. This seems to suggest otherwise:Quote:
Originally Posted by The_PHADealers in Foreign ExchangeQuote:
Originally Posted by SrslySirius
A person must exchange the currency of two or more countries to be considered a dealer in foreign exchange. Virtual currency does not meet the criteria to be considered "currency" under the BSA, because it is not legal tender. Therefore, a person who accepts real currency in exchange for virtual currency, or vice versa, is not a dealer in foreign exchange under FinCEN's regulations.
Since the currency is not exchangeable in the US, its not legal tender and therefore worthless. If you want to engage in an underground currency go ahead, I assume it has value by those that exchange it. People deal cocaine as well and get rich quick, that is black market currency as well.
I don't give a shit, but the US is not recognizing it, and therefore no reputable business will accept it. It's backdoor laundering. But knock yourself out dude. I really cannot believe how many people have fallen for a computer programmer from Japan. I'd love to get 100 random people in a room dealing bitcoins and do a background check on them.
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-0...eal-world.html
Do you not agree that the government seems apathetic about people exchanging bitcoins, as long as they're not laundering money or making illegal purchases? If they're giving people guidelines on how to report their income and all that, it seems to suggest that they have no intention of shutting this down.
Hate to keep berating you, but you are fucking obtuse, to steal a line from Shawshank.Quote:
Originally Posted by SrslySiriusThat's a different argument altogether. I'm not disagreeing with you about its recognition by the US as a real currency or legal tender. I'm just referring to your point about massive government intervention. This seems to suggest otherwise:Quote:
Originally Posted by The_PHA
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-0...eal-world.html
Do you not agree that the government seems apathetic about people exchanging bitcoins, as long as they're not laundering money or making illegal purchases? If they're giving people guidelines on how to report their income and all that, it seems to suggest that they have no intention of shutting this down.
There is no other reason for bitcoins to exist other than laundering or illegal purchases. Sure, you will see a front for someone selling a lawnmower using a bitcoin. Just like the Mob would open up a restaurant or a dry cleaner as a front.
Remember when everyone justified online poker, saying the government would never get involved, it was just too small? Or the best line: It is a game of skill, not gambling. In the end, what was the UIGEA based on primarily? Money Laundering and The Patriot Act. These laws are only becoming stronger.
Just call it what it is: an underground currency. Period. It cannot be legal because no government backs it, or will ever back it. And if you think the government is just going to sit by and let unsuspecting citizens like yourself be continually duped by a scheme, think again. They will eventually protect it's citizens, most of all because they need the tax revenue to stay in the US.
You're just repeating the same points, Bottomset. None of that is relevant to what I'm asking. Did you read the article or not? What do you make of it? Looks like a green light to me.
Instead of excusing yourself for resorting to personal attacks, you could just not do it. Maybe try relying on the strength of you arguments to get your point across.
Did you bother to read the cliff notes of the article? Or did you just rely on something a low level intern threw together? Try reading something other than a few bullet points thrown together.Quote:
Originally Posted by SrslySirius
Not trying to go ad hominem, no offense, but you really are a sap.
Last price:$79.96001 High:$79.96001
The_PHA is a troll. You shouldn't begin to take him seriously.Quote:
Originally Posted by SrslySirius
I'd just like to point out that thinking of the government as one thinking entity is a huge flaw. It is a bunch of factions, all pushing for their own agendas. Ask yourself who would dislike bitcoins? Who benefits from their demise? Then ask yourself how much they have in resources.
The thing about Bitcoins is you're going to have a lot of smart passionate people fighting for them. There is absolutely nothing wrong with bitcoins that isn't just as wrong with cash. It is basically cash for the internet, but it will enable a lot of businesses that weren't available beforehand. I mean, sure you can buy drugs with them, but once there are a ton of legitimate uses for them, it isn't going to be popular trying to regulate them out of the US.
One thing is for certain.. The US government is not like a big monolithic thing. You take things that have been outlawed, it is either protection for others business interests, or pandering to get elected. Bitcoins might become mainstream enough that they will stick around before something like this happens. I'm sure Visa/MC hate them.. but meh...
People just like to think of the government as this big creature, that is going to clamp down on bitcoins. No, it'll take lobbying etc etc.. but by the time it happens, it'll be too late IMO.
Is this where another dork offers me $2,000 for my social security number or something like that?Quote:
Originally Posted by donkdowndonediedThe_PHA is a troll. You shouldn't begin to take him seriously.Quote:
Originally Posted by SrslySirius
I'd just like to point out that thinking of the government as one thinking entity is a huge flaw. It is a bunch of factions, all pushing for their own agendas. Ask yourself who would dislike bitcoins? Who benefits from their demise? Then ask yourself how much they have in resources.
The thing about Bitcoins is you're going to have a lot of smart passionate people fighting for them. There is absolutely nothing wrong with bitcoins that isn't just as wrong with cash. It is basically cash for the internet, but it will enable a lot of businesses that weren't available beforehand. I mean, sure you can buy drugs with them, but once there are a ton of legitimate uses for them, it isn't going to be popular trying to regulate them out of the US.
One thing is for certain.. The US government is not like a big monolithic thing. You take things that have been outlawed, it is either protection for others business interests, or pandering to get elected. Bitcoins might become mainstream enough that they will stick around before something like this happens. I'm sure Visa/MC hate them.. but meh...
People just like to think of the government as this big creature, that is going to clamp down on bitcoins. No, it'll take lobbying etc etc.. but by the time it happens, it'll be too late IMO.
You have obviously have never taken an Economic course beyond Community College ( I went to a prestigious NE school, btw), if you had you would realize that bitcoins have no mainstream value, unless YOU own them which you probably do. Hope you like owning an underground black-market currency trading forbidden mainstream products. GOOD LUCK!
I never took any economics course in college. Thats more of a liberal arts requirement, I'd guess.Quote:
Originally Posted by The_PHAIs this where another dork offers me $2,000 for my social security number or something like that?Quote:
Originally Posted by donkdowndonedied
You have obviously have never taken an Economic course beyond Community College ( I went to a prestigious NE school, btw), if you had you would realize that bitcoins have no mainstream value, unless YOU own them which you probably do. Hope you like owning an underground black-market currency trading forbidden mainstream products. GOOD LUCK!
It is funny how people make these goofy statements.. Bitcoins have "no mainstream value". Bro, I can go sell my bitcoins pretty much instantly for cash. (Not cash in hand obv.. but.. cash) How can that not have any "mainstream value".
Having a rudimentary understanding crypto and stuff is going to get you a lot further in understanding bitcoins than any economics course. Just like that amiller guy. He sounds like he knows a lot about economics, but he didn't understand how you have to build demand for something like bitcoins. You can't just create something like bitcoins with a 'market cap', then expect people to adopt them. You distribute them to people who WANT to build services around them and thats what happened. Amiller didn't seem to get that, but I bet he knows a lot more about "economics" than me.
I wouldn't give you $2 for your SSN you lousy drunk. Your id couldn't be worth stealing ! Now fuck off !
You really are that fucking stupid? You really think a computer program that a guy from Japan made 4 years ago is really going to sustain itself?Quote:
Originally Posted by donkdowndonediedI never took any economics course in college. Thats more of a liberal arts requirement, I'd guess.Quote:
Originally Posted by The_PHA
It is funny how people make these goofy statements.. Bitcoins have "no mainstream value". Bro, I can go sell my bitcoins pretty much instantly for cash. (Not cash in hand obv.. but.. cash) How can that not have any "mainstream value".
Having a rudimentary understanding crypto and stuff is going to get you a lot further in understanding bitcoins than any economics course. Just like that amiller guy. He sounds like he knows a lot about economics, but he didn't understand how you have to build demand for something like bitcoins. You can't just create something like bitcoins with a 'market cap', then expect people to adopt them. You distribute them to people who WANT to build services around them and thats what happened. Amiller didn't seem to get that, but I bet he knows a lot more about "economics" than me.
I wouldn't give you $2 for your SSN you lousy drunk. Your id couldn't be worth stealing ! Now fuck off !
Enjoy dude. Good luck, I made my point here. In fact you made it for me
Last price:$83.20000 High:$84.39000
and when the inevitable happens it's going to come fast
Last price:$84.25094 High:$84.50000
Wow. The price is up 155% since this thread started a month ago. How many stocks can say that?Quote:
Originally Posted by chinamaniac
None outside of GBEN which is how you know this is all bullshit.Quote:
Originally Posted by DirtyBWow. The price is up 155% since this thread started a month ago. How many stocks can say that?Quote:
Originally Posted by chinamaniac