Aaaaanddd.....its goneQuote:
Originally Posted by Dan Druff
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NmFo-LKHGY0
Aaaaanddd.....its goneQuote:
Originally Posted by Dan Druff
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NmFo-LKHGY0
What's gone?
So are you basically saying that there have only been 10 P2P transfers at Lock in recent days/weeks? I think if you read Pino's post you'll get an idea of how some legit people may have been caught up in this "sting"... You have proof that 10 or so players have had withdrawals denied, not every single person on the site, which is what you're saying or at the least implying.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan DruffWhat do you mean "if I can prove"?Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve-O
Did you read the 2+2 thread that started this whole brouhaha?
Like 10 different people came forward, all of whom were longtime active Lock grinders, and everyone stated that they had their cashouts canceled for receiving transfers despite easily hitting playthrough many times over. A few even stated that they didn't receive any transfers at all at any time.
Either all of these longtime 2+2 members and high limit Lock players are lying, or Lock isn't honoring this supposed playthrough policy.
I'm not saying the policy is good, or the right thing to do, or that they are using it honorably and consistently -- these answers I don't know. I'm just saying you are overstating things as you are wont to do sometimes. Like I said, maybe pump the brakes every now and then.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve-OSo are you basically saying that there have only been 10 P2P transfers at Lock in recent days/weeks? I think if you read Pino's post you'll get an idea of how some legit people may have been caught up in this "sting"... You have proof that 10 or so players have had withdrawals denied, not every single person on the site, which is what you're saying or at the least implying.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Druff
I'm not saying the policy is good, or the right thing to do, or that they are using it honorably and consistently -- these answers I don't know. I'm just saying you are overstating things as you are wont to do sometimes. Like I said, maybe pump the brakes every now and then.
If this were really a "sting", they would have immediately have cleared the wrongly accused, especially after three weeks, and ESPECIALLY after the ensuing controversy is threatening their entire business.
The 10 or so people in that initial thread were active 2+2 posters, and not coincidentally, the ones making $10k (maximum) cashouts.
The vast majority of people with canceled Lock cashouts likely don't know about 2+2 or where they should go to make such a complaint, but are likely beating their heads against the wall arguing with Lock support via e-mail.
Lock's inaction after 3 weeks speaks a lot more than their actions when the problems originally occurred.
The fact that they refuse to explain their transfer/cashout policy just adds a lot more fuel to that fire.
I received the following tip from Inside Source #3:
If this Inside Source is correct, that actually makes sense.Quote:
Druff,
I've followed this Lock situation, and while I believe you to be correct with most of what you've been posting, you are probably wrong about one thing. Lock is broke, that you are right about, but it's not because of losing money in Cyprus banks. Maybe they lost money there too but I know nothing about it.
What I wanted to tell you is Lock spent most of the player money when they purchased a minority stake in Cake and rebranded it Revolution (meanwhile publicly claiming they acquired the entire business.) The majority of player funds were used for this purchase. They have been treading water since.
If they used most of the player funds a year ago, it explains why cashouts suddenly got so slow starting late 2012. (They likely lost money from May-November 2012, further eroding player funds.) The "treading water" part explains why they might be completely broke now. Perhaps they finally lost the last of what little player money they had left (such as in the Cyprus bank fiasco) and now they are resorting to desperate measures (segregation, cashout cancellations, etc) to stay afloat.
The above paragraph of mine is just speculation, but the source here is pretty good, and I'm starting to really believe that theory as being the major cause of Lock's money problems, rather than the Cyprus thing itself.
I agree that it was handled poorly. But I don't see how being an active 2+2 user means you are not guilty of wrongdoing? I believe StoxPoker and others were active 2+2 users. You are implying that ALL cashouts from transfers have been cancelled, I simply asked you for proof of that claim. You then pointed to 10 people who may or may not be involved in whatever investigation they are conducting. I like to deal in facts not speculation. If you have proof that this is rampant and inconsistent than I'd be more than happy to listen.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan DruffQuote:
Originally Posted by Steve-O
If this were really a "sting", they would have immediately have cleared the wrongly accused, especially after three weeks, and ESPECIALLY after the ensuing controversy is threatening their entire business.
The 10 or so people in that initial thread were active 2+2 posters, and not coincidentally, the ones making $10k (maximum) cashouts.
The vast majority of people with canceled Lock cashouts likely don't know about 2+2 or where they should go to make such a complaint, but are likely beating their heads against the wall arguing with Lock support via e-mail.
Lock's inaction after 3 weeks speaks a lot more than their actions when the problems originally occurred.
The fact that they refuse to explain their transfer/cashout policy just adds a lot more fuel to that fire.
Listen, Lock's cashout times are atrocious, their communication is worse, and they have a bad habit of indiscriminately changing policies midstream. I've publicly said that nobody should deposit on Lock until their issues are resolved (on G9OLT's forum no less). I think this is a pretty fair line I've taken for both the community and for Lock.
The LockPoker.com domain that Druff posted is registered in the city of Nicosia, Cyprus.
From wikipedia:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NicosiaQuote:
Nicosia is the financial and business heart of Cyprus. The city hosts the headquarters of all Cypriot banks namely Cyprus Popular Bank (also known as Laiki Bank), Bank of Cyprus, the Hellenic Bank. Further, the Central Bank of Cyprus is located in the Acropolis area of the Cypriot capital.
A number of international businesses base their Cypriot headquarters in Nicosia, such as the big four audit firms PWC, Deloitte, KPMG and Ernst & Young. International technology companies such as NCR and TSYS have their regional headquarters in Nicosia. The city is also home to local financial newspapers such as the Financial Mirror and Stockwatch.
It's funny that, besides all of the Cypriot banks being HQ'ed there, four of the biggest audit firms in the world are located there, yet they can't find any trusted third parties to verify their solvency.
I never said that all active 2+2 posters were salt-of-the-earth.Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve-OI agree that it was handled poorly. But I don't see how being an active 2+2 user means you are not guilty of wrongdoing? I believe StoxPoker and others were active 2+2 users. You are implying that ALL cashouts from transfers have been cancelled, I simply asked you for proof of that claim. You then pointed to 10 people who may or may not be involved in whatever investigation they are conducting. I like to deal in facts not speculation. If you have proof that this is rampant and inconsistent than I'd be more than happy to listen.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Druff
Listen, Lock's cashout times are atrocious, their communication is worse, and they have a bad habit of indiscriminately changing policies midstream. I've publicly said that nobody should deposit on Lock until their issues are resolved (on G9OLT's forum no less). I think this is a pretty fair line I've taken for both the community and for Lock.
However, when you have about ten different known, active high-limit players without any kind of prior association with one another, it's extremely hard to believe they are all in cahoots in some sort of Lock cashout scheme. Besides, how could they be? None of these people had affiliate accounts, so they had no way to cash out quickly.
Speculation and common-sense application of circumsantial evidence is key to making correct determinations in all areas of life. Nobody saw Scott Peterson kill his wife, nor was there any direct physical evidence linking him to the murder. However, he was convicted of the killing, and most observers felt it was the right verdict. Why? Because there was a mountain of circumstantial evidence against him, all of which added up to him being the murderer.
Same thing with Lock. There is a mountain of circumstantial evidence against them, all pointing to the site being broke.
And if this is all a huge misunderstanding, they only have themselves to blame by making the situation WORSE over the past three weeks by lying, deceiving, and poorly communicating.
In addition to all of the evidence against them, they are also ACTING like a shady company caught in wrongdoing.
The one thing that irks me about the Cyprus banking allegation - and I've talked about this with a few industry people recently since you brought it up Druff - is why didn't Lock just take the "easy way" out and blame everything on the banking meltdown there?
Seems to me it would be a helluva lot easier to just do that and not have everyone question their financial situation daily...
The shady stuff you've been uncovering lately makes me think there's definitely more to their downward spiral than just the possible Cyprus banking crisis.
Upton Sinclair famously wrote: "If a man's paycheck depends on his not understanding something, you can rely upon his not understanding it."Quote:
Originally Posted by DealAt this time G9OLT has yet to say anything but meaningless double speak on topics he doesn't know the answers to and he is total silence on straight forward questions about things that show that Lock is Shady.Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve-O
The least he could do is concede that they are making a huge mess out of whatever problems they are having and they have done a piss poor job of communicating whatever it is these problems are and are instead making stuff up to hide whatever it is that is going on.
This cannot be explained away by simple incompetence. Everything Lock is doing is explainable by the assumption that they don't have access to the player money.
Now, then. Steve-O writes for at least two sites, according to my personal research this week, that are owned or co-owned by G9OLT. Maybe more; I don't really care.
G9OLT has:
a) Accused everyone who has spoken out against Lock of having some sort of anti-Lock agenda.
b) Admitted that he is an affiliate for Lock, and that Lock's recovery from its present crisis would be financially beneficial to him.
In response:
I don't have an axe to grind against Lock; I've never played there, and I'd prefer that the few remaining US-facing sites be good, responsible ones. Lock simply is not, and I'm hard-pressed to find or name another site with as consistent and horrible a history towards its players.
So who is G9OLT? Well, that's where the "limited truth telling" comes in, meaning the omission of certain information. G9OLT is
So Gerry Poltorak is more than -just- a Lock affiliate, he's an affiliate manager (along with Shane) at Lock. I've checked with some affiliates who have verified communicating with both Shane and Gerry regarding Lock affiliate matters.
Both G9OLT's and Steve-O's shilling can thus be dismissed with the proverbial grain of salt. It is financially motivated shilling, as is almost always the case.
We can go into depth a lot about Lock Poker and their shady dealings but in reality they are a struggling and nearly broke company who over extended their means of spending and now are giving people the run around.
The half ass answers or non-answers to so many questions are a HUGE red flag.
I can tell you when I was playing on Pokerstars back in 2006-2010 that the times processors they worked with ran away with money the site always made good. Pokerstars might not have came out and publically said the processor ripped them off BUT they would always respond admitting that currently they were having issues and on several occasions they would credit accounts trying to cashout like 10% of the amount out of courtesy.
I don't expect Lock to give anyone a credit like Pokerstars has at times in the past BUT the point I'm making here is that Pokerstars always stayed in communication with people and made good. They also did this within a reasonable period of time compared to 6+ months that people are getting the run around about their Lock cashouts.
Just to restate the obvious that in this industry when rest of the world cashouts are taking several months to complete that is the tell all of big time financial problems for any online gambling company.
If things weren't going bad at Lock Poker and it was business as usual then why wouldn't Jennifer Larson personally make an official statement on this matter?
While Lock Poker is not Pokerstars or Full Tilt they can be compared somewhat in the way they are handling this current crisis. When Black Friday hit Pokerstars contacted people right away and started paying Americans like 10-14 days later. Pokerstars would always reply though it took a little longer because of the flood of email pouring in which is understandable.
So what did Full Tilt do after Black Friday?
Full Tilt was slow to contact people, didn't pay out in a few weeks like Pokerstars did, and then we find out they are practically broke.
Now to the point I'm getting at is Full Tilt Poker owners and spokesman went into lockdown mode (no pun) and refused to comment. We would hear some things from Red Pros but most of them had zero contact with the head honchos at Full Tilt Poker.
Jennifer Larson and all other big wigs up at Lock Poker are remaining silent to the public. This is a BAD sign. The reason why someone like Jennifer Larson is silent right now is because she has nothing positive to tell people. Jen knows the sky is falling over at Lock Poker and is just buying time praying that things turn around but it's not going to happen.
If things were not as bad as many people believe then Lock Poker would make official statements with REAL answers and get rid of the bullshit. We would hear the truth from someone important high up in the company (LOL Shane) but the people are told the same old thing because when you have nothing good to say you don't say anything at all.
ENOUGH IS ENOUGH! Lock don't want to admit they have made mistakes of bad money management just like Full Tilt and Ultimate Bet in the past. They know the community won't forgive them and some might seek legal action wherever possible. Lock continues to pay out a few people just to prove they aren't 100% leaving still hoping to hit that one outer on the river that things will turn around but the odds are highly unlikely it does.
I would urge haley to remove all the personal information she has posted on G9OLT. That is against Druff's policy here.
BTW, there is nothing new in that post as he's freely admitted all of that except his real name(really easy to find it anyways) but especially his pictures.
Quote:
Domain Name: JDBSERVICESNV.COM
Registrar: GANDI SAS
Whois Server: whois.gandi.net
Referral URL: http://www.gandi.net
Name Server: NS1.SLICEHOST.NET
Name Server: NS2.SLICEHOST.NET
Name Server: NS3.SLICEHOST.NET
Updated Date: 15-jul-2012
Creation Date: 30-jul-2009
Expiration Date: 30-jul-2013
nic-hdl: JS3733-GANDI
owner-name: JDB Services
organisation: JDB Services
person: JDB Services N.V.
address: "Dr. M.J. Hugenholtzweg z/n\r\nUTS Building"
zipcode: 1060
city: Willemstad
country: Cyprus
phone: +33.0686998163
Why has no one ever brought this up yet??? Either you use a bad service to look up this information or you ALTERED the information yourself. s i believe you use a good service i am shocked that no one has said a single word yet.
Quote:
Originally Posted by haleylh
Upton Sinclair famously wrote: "If a man's paycheck depends on his not understanding something, you can rely upon his not understanding it."
Now, then. Steve-O writes for at least two sites, according to my personal research this week, that are owned or co-owned by G9OLT. Maybe more; I don't really care.
1, but I do moderate his forum. Maybe you'd like me to list the other sites I write for: PokerEagles.com, RuffPoker.com, I do some work for Chris Grove, and I write at Tournament Poker Edge
G9OLT has:
a) Accused everyone who has spoken out against Lock of having some sort of anti-Lock agenda.
b) Admitted that he is an affiliate for Lock, and that Lock's recovery from its present crisis would be financially beneficial to him.
In response:
I don't have an axe to grind against Lock; I've never played there, and I'd prefer that the few remaining US-facing sites be good, responsible ones. Lock simply is not, and I'm hard-pressed to find or name another site with as consistent and horrible a history towards its players.
So who is G9OLT? Well, that's where the "limited truth telling" comes in, meaning the omission of certain information. G9OLT is
So Gerry Poltorak is more than -just- a Lock affiliate, he's an affiliate manager (along with Shane) at Lock. I've checked with some affiliates who have verified communicating with both Shane and Gerry regarding Lock affiliate matters.
Yes, we already established this, ThePino brought it up, and I never called him an affiliate as far as I can recall.
Both G9OLT's and Steve-O's shilling can thus be dismissed with the proverbial grain of salt. It is financially motivated shilling, as is almost always the case.
I have no financial interest in Lock Poker whatsoever. I have no affiliate or referral accounts there and everything I do with Gerry is separate from that. It is also not Gerry's livelihood, but he does get a check from Lock, so take that for whatever you want. I'll also add that ThePino, a very harsh Lock Critic spoke nicely about Gerry. To save her the trouble let me explain all of my dealings with Lock Poker:
I was given $300 by Lock Poker to try the site out prior to Black Friday and write a review for Gerry. I played a bit, wrote the review, and left the $400 or so dollars on the site, playing sporadically over the following months. Eventually I cashed out all but like $100 (through Gerry so I can't speak to their cashout issues) I still have some amount on the site but I rally don't know how much as I haven't logged-in for a couple months.
I also did a project for Gerry to interview and write some bios for the entire Lock Poker team a while back, I have no idea what they did with these.
The only contact I've ever had with any from Lock Poker since then (besides Gerry) was Eric Lynch when I reviewed his Winning Poker Tournaments book.
Since then I've advised people to be very cautious at all US poker sites, and more recently have criticized Lock Poker more and more, eventually saying nobody should deposit here until there withdrawal problems are sorted. Obviously I don't send Gerry much in the way of Lock Poker news
http://www.pokereagles.com/news/5397...g-concerns.php
http://www.pokereagles.com/news/5114...013-part-3.php
If that's shilling, then I guess I'm a shill
I'll decline that, but if Druff wants to excise them, no big deal. The only "personal information", as you describe it, is a head shot and the mention that he has a college degree. Both are being used to promote the business interests -- (a) he's a normal looking guy and (b) has a university degree -- and the profile itself is on Linked In, which is a business-themed social network.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockey Guy
I'd never put up things like home addresses, phone numbers or photos of family, but the stuff here is being used to promote business intent, and thus in my opinion is within the purview of examining Poltorak's profile. For what it's worth, most of the folks I've talked have said that Gerry is a decent sort, but he's clearly been acting in tune with the Sinclair quote I posted; he's omitted a key fact or two because it's in his personal interests to do so.
Fair enough, he most likely wouldn't have a problem with it anyways. I hate seeing people's personal stuff posted unless they post it themselves that's all.Quote:
Originally Posted by haleylhI'll decline that, but if Druff wants to excise them, no big deal. The only "personal information", as you describe it, is a head shot and the mention that he has a college degree. Both are being used to promote the business interests -- (a) he's a normal looking guy and (b) has a university degree -- and the profile itself is on Linked In, which is a business-themed social network.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockey Guy
I'd never put up things like home addresses, phone numbers or photos of family, but the stuff here is being used to promote business intent, and thus in my opinion is within the purview of examining Poltorak's profile. For what it's worth, most of the folks I've talked have said that Gerry is a decent sort, but he's clearly been acting in tune with the Sinclair quote I posted; he's omitted a key fact or two because it's in his personal interests to do so.
On a side note, you should call in to the radio program & do a segment with Druff.
Just saw this on Twitter: http://lockpoker.eu/news/ Only a few weeks late :facepalm3
A note to all online poker rooms, "Put Simply" should be in all your press releases... but now like Druff said, is it true...Quote:
Lock Poker Clarifies P2P Transfer Withdrawal Policy
Curacao May 9th, 2013
Through a detailed investigation over the past few weeks the Lock security team uncovered a large group of persons that were abusing the P2P transfer policy and creating a large network of mule accounts to move and withdraw funds without any play at all taking place.
To deal with this situation a policy change was put into place to clear out the backlog of withdrawals by accounts with little to no play and increase the speed of withdrawals for players taking actual winnings.
Lock has introduced a new cash-out policy for transferred funds which requires a player to accumulate at least 15% in GGR on the funds received via P2P transfer before these funds are cashed-out. Put simply, for every $100 of transferred funds to be withdrawn, $15 of rake or fees will need to be accumulated beforehand.
The policy change was put in place explicitly to put an end to money laundering via Lock's player transfers. Players withdrawing winnings are not affected.
Lock will continue to process withdrawals and work to reduce all withdrawal delays over the coming weeks.
A large amount of mis-information has been spread recently on various poker news sites and forum postings about player funds being lost in recent banking scandals; none of this is true.
Not just a few weeks late.
They're also avoiding most of the important topics.
And they're lying about the reason this all happened.
Other than that, it was a great press release.
Hi Dan,
Good work (as usual).
Some things to add though and to think of for further research or clarify before being called out for posting wrong info:
JDBSERVICES are most likely in Cyprus according to other infos posted and interlinking, however in the domain info it mentions Hugenholtzweg...which is in Curacao:
http://www.liveincuracao.com/index.php?s=hugenholtzweg
also as posted in city in the info you posted is Willemstad, so they most likely mixed it up with something else while entering the info.
As you may know, Curacao is politically related to Netherlands, something similar to Isle of Man and UK...more in Wikipedia.
CAKE NV is also in Willemstad, Curacao, as far as I know.
Interesting to note is also that there seem to be some other strange companies working at
Stasinou 1, Mitsi Building 1
In case they are only separate entities and not related to lock directly, then we can at least assume that this address is mostly used as an address for letterbox companies. See also:
http://scam-beware.blogspot.co.at/20...lets-talk.html
http://www.ripoffreport.com/r/nautel...nicosia-954664
http://funnyspamiget.blogspot.co.at/...ighty-man.html
Also interesting for further research might be this, 5 Domain(s) Use +33.0686998163 As Whois Phone, confirming the relation between Lock and JDB Services NV:
http://www.webboar.com/whois-phone/%2B33.0686998163
Edit: Also to add, regarding Gerry Poltorak, on PAL there was a long discussion with him already over a year ago, in position as affiliate manager.
http://www.pokeraffiliatelistings.co...rgeback-8.html
Cheers
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Druff
I think it is bullshit. One last hail Mary pass to the end zone to squeeze in some fresh suckers before they officially go busto.
Fuck Lock poker.