No mention of Steve Bullock or Joe Sestak dropping out? Not even a Trump tweet? Sad! We're down to 16 candidates, folks. What the fuck is Castro waiting for. Booker gonna drop out first at this rate.
No mention of Steve Bullock or Joe Sestak dropping out? Not even a Trump tweet? Sad! We're down to 16 candidates, folks. What the fuck is Castro waiting for. Booker gonna drop out first at this rate.
What? There isn’t an American citizen that doesn’t value education or health care.Quote:
Originally Posted by sonatine
We just happen to feel policing the world is more important.
Nothing angers me more about our country.Quote:
The CBO estimated that of the $2.4 trillion long-term price tag for the war, about $1.9 trillion of that would be spent on Iraq, or $6,300 per US citizen.
The noble dream is voiced by Tulsi. Which is strange cause the Truman Doctrine was a a Democrat invention. Right some wrongs.
I completely agree we won’t see a change in our lifetimes.
Well, it's been ~250 years.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Druff
They were slaves for ~100 years
Then they were broke, uneducated, had very few rights and treated like shit by most White people for the next ~80 years?
Then they started to get organized and demand to be treated equally during the civil rights movement 10 or 20 years before you were born.
And you think there is no institutional racism because things have never been better? It's only been a couple generations since the process began of trying to treat Black people equal. There's a long way to go, imo.
I saw this story today
Veterans' business uses profits to support education for Afghan girls
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/combat-...ls-2019-12-02/
The illiteracy rate is 85%. Educate the women and they will likely educate their children. An educated population is less likely to be radicalized.Quote:
The mission was to make sturdy military-themed flip flops and footwear and use the profits to support education for Afghan girls. They call the company Combat Flip Flops.
It’s seems a better idea than bombing the population into the Middle Ages and walking away. It sure as shit hasn’t worked for 40 years.
I have given up on most issues but the endless fruitless war still gets me fired up.
There is only so much tax payer money Sonatine. Most of the debate is fucking noise to my ears.
Holy shit duped_ .
https://youtu.be/G4qtOVQUivo
People rarely impress me and I have such a bias against anything military but these guys are heroes.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sanlmar
If that was the case, rockets wouldn't be fired into Israel on a regular basis or are you saying that no one wants to "educate" the Palestinians
We have a new TV leader. Yang actually had a decent flood of ads in November (tho nothing compared to Bloomberg/Steyer). I personally like Bloomberg, but this is a colossal waste of money.
Someone needed to take Bloomberg aside and tell him that it's too late to enter, even in a field as weak as this.
Times have changed. Everyone follows this shit a lot more closely than they used to, and there's just so much public discussion back and forth on both social media and cable news.
By late in the year before the election, most people have come close enough to making up their minds that they don't want to process some new entry into the race. This is why the "a new leader might spring up at any point" argument simply doesn't hold water.
It remains a race between the Big 4 (Biden, Warren, Sanders, Buttigieg), and honestly Biden is looking better than ever, because he's the only one with a realistic path to the nomination right now.
Slavery in this country was a shitty shitty thing but hopefully time will eventually heal those wounds. Bernie Sanders sure the hell wont speed up the process.Quote:
Originally Posted by duped_samaritanWell, it's been ~250 years.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Druff
They were slaves for ~100 years
Then they were broke, uneducated, had very few rights and treated like shit by most White people for the next ~80 years?
Then they started to get organized and demand to be treated equally during the civil rights movement 10 or 20 years before you were born.
And you think there is no institutional racism because things have never been better? It's only been a couple generations since the process began of trying to treat Black people equal. There's a long way to go, imo.
Just curious, do you only hold white people accountable for slavery in America or do you also hold the black slave owners from Africa accountable that sold their slaves to white people (you seem to have left those years of oppression off your list). The broke, uneducated with no rights goes back much further than 250 years.
I don't know much about the Atlantic Slave trade, although that seems like an interesting wiki-rabbit-hole, and at this point I really don't think it's about holding anyone 'accountable' for slavery since they are all dead.Quote:
Originally Posted by nightmarefishSlavery in this country was a shitty shitty thing but hopefully time will eventually heal those wounds. Bernie Sanders sure the hell wont speed up the process.Quote:
Originally Posted by duped_samaritan
Just curious, do you only hold white people accountable for slavery in America or do you also hold the black slave owners from Africa accountable that sold their slaves to white people (you seem to have left those years of oppression off your list). The broke, uneducated with no rights goes back much further than 250 years.
I know the broke, uneducated with no rights goes back pretty much forever. And we've probably made more progress in the last 50 years than ever? But I still think comments like Druffs are pretty gross. Focusing more on the 'SJWS' without ever really criticizing actual racism/sexism.
It's like he thinks the world is getting less racist/sexist/anti-lgbtq too fast.
Newest Democratic Poll
https://thehill.com/sites/default/files/dem-pref.jpg
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sanlmar
dismantling the cia and expecting diplomacy (without the cia's intelligence apparently) to get the resources we need to survive sounds about as noble as treating cancer with essential oils.
shout out to complaining about tax payer money being a precious thing when the reason it costs thousands of dollars to fix a broken arm is because we let an entire industry be created by lobbyists to make it cost as much as possible.
bernie wants to fix the things that are keeping this place from operating like a sane democracy. its the naked face of nobility. its throwing the money lenders out of the temple caliber nobility.
fuck outta here boomer.
I didn't say that the work to eliminate racism is done, but the way the left would have you believe, Trump's Presidency has been all about white supremacy and institutionalized racism.Quote:
Originally Posted by duped_samaritanWell, it's been ~250 years.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Druff
They were slaves for ~100 years
Then they were broke, uneducated, had very few rights and treated like shit by most White people for the next ~80 years?
Then they started to get organized and demand to be treated equally during the civil rights movement 10 or 20 years before you were born.
And you think there is no institutional racism because things have never been better? It's only been a couple generations since the process began of trying to treat Black people equal. There's a long way to go, imo.
Which it isn't at all, even if some idiot white supremacists suddenly feel more empowered to speak up.
Is there still racism in this country? Yes.
Is racism the only major factor contributing to the struggles of black men in America? No.
There is a legitimate cultural issue in the black community where a lot of destructive behavior occurs, which isn't the fault of racism. While the solution to this is incredibly complicated and not a matter of a simple policy change, a good start would be the removal of the bad apples from poor black neighborhoods. Remove the worst elements, and some of the not-so-good elements will often revert back to normal, once free from the influence from the worst offenders. I've even seen this occur in workplace environments (not related to black people, but in general).
I feel that's the most impactful solution to lifting impoverished black communities out of where they are today. Many are being terrorized by violent elements which are holding back progress, ruining schools, and brainwashing kids down the wrong path.
Unfortunately, this solution isn't popular at all with the left, who is all about keeping prison sentences short and rehabilitating every single human being. While that idealistic approach fails, the entire black community suffers. Democrats don't care that much, because they still get the black vote anyway.
I want you to post this on twitter and see the replies you get.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Druff
This is a ridiculous statement. Basically the same as saying "Yeah everything might not be so fair, but at least we aren't lynching you anymore!"
Druff, who do you think is the second most likely to get the nom? I could see an argument for all 3.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Druff
You're actually correct that a lot of the high healthcare costs in the US are because of lobbyists.Quote:
Originally Posted by sonatine
However, socialized medicine, including Bernie's plan, doesn't fix that. It just shifts the bill to the government and leaves Medicare in charge of rates. Guess what has been notoriously susceptible to corruption via lobbying? Yep, Medicare rates.
The US healthcare system's high cost is often erroneously blamed on "capitalism", but in reality it's not a free market system at all. Almost all doctors and healthcare providers are slaves to the negotiated rates of insurance companies, which in turn are largely based upon the government-set rates for Medicare. This leaves us with the unfair and unmotivating situation where the worst doctor in town gets paid the exact same amount of money for the exact same procedure as the best doctor in town. And that's a problem. There is little incentive to provide good care -- only to see as many patients as possible, do the most expensive stuff, and hire billing experts to creatively charge it in the most expensive way possible.
That's not free market whatsoever.
That's one of many things which needs to be fixed, and unfortunately even Bernie's plan doesn't address it.
this may seem counterintuitive but bernie getting in office would be more likely to set the goal of socialized medicine back than a joe biden-type winningQuote:
Originally Posted by sonatine
the midterms are always a vote against the current president. the more scared voters are, the bigger the turnout. if bernie was to win, the fear levels would be off the charts and the red wave would be the biggest we've ever seen. this is a candidate campaigning on raising your taxes, taking away your health insurance and letting the government handle that. that will go over well in swing and red districts.
Every wedding has one or two losers who don't know the Team Pete dance by heart. A+ by everyone else
Quote:
Originally Posted by sonatineQuote:
Originally Posted by Sanlmar
dismantling the cia and expecting diplomacy (without the cia's intelligence apparently) to get the resources we need to survive sounds about as noble as treating cancer with essential oils.
you're really going to town on these strawman arguments lately. it's just bizarre that, as a diehard liberal, tulsi's anti-war stance is the thing you're fixated on and seem to hate the most. it's also weird cause bernie and tulsi seem to be besties. the dnc hates tulsi for endorsing bernie in 2016.
please also understand that bernie is campaigning on raising your taxes and forcing medicare for all on everyone. just let the government run your healthcare.
how does that win in a general election again? tell me how someone who already has health insurance -- like everyone you know -- says yeah, sign me up for that?
Why did Tulsi endorse somebody as awful as Bernie? Shows poor judgement at the leastQuote:
Originally Posted by blakeQuote:
Originally Posted by sonatine
you're really going to town on these strawman arguments lately. it's just bizarre that, as a diehard liberal, tulsi's anti-war stance is the thing you're fixated on and seem to hate the most. it's also weird cause bernie and tulsi seem to be besties. the dnc hates tulsi for endorsing bernie in 2016.
please also understand that bernie is campaigning on raising your taxes and forcing medicare for all on everyone. just let the government run your healthcare.
how does that win in a general election again? tell me how someone who already has health insurance -- like everyone you know -- says yeah, sign me up for that?
Have you seen this video, Druff?Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan DruffYou're actually correct that a lot of the high healthcare costs in the US are because of lobbyists.Quote:
Originally Posted by sonatine
However, socialized medicine, including Bernie's plan, doesn't fix that. It just shifts the bill to the government and leaves Medicare in charge of rates. Guess what has been notoriously susceptible to corruption via lobbying? Yep, Medicare rates.
The US healthcare system's high cost is often erroneously blamed on "capitalism", but in reality it's not a free market system at all. Almost all doctors and healthcare providers are slaves to the negotiated rates of insurance companies, which in turn are largely based upon the government-set rates for Medicare. This leaves us with the unfair and unmotivating situation where the worst doctor in town gets paid the exact same amount of money for the exact same procedure as the best doctor in town. And that's a problem. There is little incentive to provide good care -- only to see as many patients as possible, do the most expensive stuff, and hire billing experts to creatively charge it in the most expensive way possible.
That's not free market whatsoever.
That's one of many things which needs to be fixed, and unfortunately even Bernie's plan doesn't address it.
You completely ignore how the American Medical Association successfully keeps the supply of new doctors artificially low with its lobbying of Congress to limit funding for medical schools and immigration by doctors trained in other countries, as well as ignoring anti-trust regulations regarding placement of newly graduated medical students in hospital residencies.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan DruffYou're actually correct that a lot of the high healthcare costs in the US are because of lobbyists.Quote:
Originally Posted by sonatine
However, socialized medicine, including Bernie's plan, doesn't fix that. It just shifts the bill to the government and leaves Medicare in charge of rates. Guess what has been notoriously susceptible to corruption via lobbying? Yep, Medicare rates.
The US healthcare system's high cost is often erroneously blamed on "capitalism", but in reality it's not a free market system at all. Almost all doctors and healthcare providers are slaves to the negotiated rates of insurance companies, which in turn are largely based upon the government-set rates for Medicare. This leaves us with the unfair and unmotivating situation where the worst doctor in town gets paid the exact same amount of money for the exact same procedure as the best doctor in town. And that's a problem. There is little incentive to provide good care -- only to see as many patients as possible, do the most expensive stuff, and hire billing experts to creatively charge it in the most expensive way possible.
That's not free market whatsoever.
That's one of many things which needs to be fixed, and unfortunately even Bernie's plan doesn't address it.
And that doesn’t even address how local medical boards in many metro areas effectively serve as gatekeepers for new doctors being able to enter the local market given how referrals are used to punish or reward those new doctors based on how they conduct their own billing and referral practices.
Overall, that oligarchic control over physician services contributes substantially to doctors in the US earning on average far more than doctors in other major developed countries.
But, yeah. Go ahead and blame the downstream participants in this thoroughly rigged healthcare system.
You think doctors make too much money? They go to school until they’re 30 years old and $500k in debt. They deserve everything they make.Quote:
Originally Posted by MumblesBadlyYou completely ignore how the American Medical Association successfully keeps the supply of new doctors artificially low with its lobbying of Congress to limit funding for medical schools and immigration by doctors trained in other countries, as well as ignoring anti-trust regulations regarding placement of newly graduated medical students in hospital residencies.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Druff
And that doesn’t even address how local medical boards in many metro areas effectively serve as gatekeepers for new doctors being able to enter the local market given how referrals are used to punish or reward those new doctors based on how they conduct their own billing and referral practices.
Overall, that oligarchic control over physician services contributes substantially to doctors in the US earning on average far more than doctors in other major developed countries.
But, yeah. Go ahead and blame the downstream participants in this thoroughly rigged healthcare system.
It means that progress is being made, and we are going in the right direction regarding racism in this country. Ask most on the American left, and they will insist we are going the other way.Quote:
Originally Posted by MrTickleI want you to post this on twitter and see the replies you get.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Druff
This is a ridiculous statement. Basically the same as saying "Yeah everything might not be so fair, but at least we aren't lynching you anymore!"
Tweet is gone.Quote:
Originally Posted by SPIT this
Bummer. I wanted to see this.
Have you seen THIS webpage, Tickle?Quote:
Originally Posted by MrTickle
https://www.nhs.uk/using-the-nhs/nhs...es-in-england/
18 weeks, y'all.Quote:
The maximum waiting time for non-urgent consultant-led treatments is 18 weeks from the day your appointment is booked through the NHS e-Referral Service, or when the hospital or service receives your referral letter.
Wanna see a specialist? If you book it today, you'll see them in April 2020.
Tight healthcare system. I can get into a specialist this week -- sometimes even same day -- if I call right now. Same deal with tests.
The US system needs reform, but LOL at the UK's NHS being held up as an example we should emulate.
Tulsi is running to be Bernie's VP.Quote:
Originally Posted by SPIT thisWhy did Tulsi endorse somebody as awful as Bernie? Shows poor judgement at the leastQuote:
Originally Posted by blake
Her (successful) attack on Kamala Harris was a backdoor favor to Bernie, and indeed knocked out one of his major opponents.
She would actually be a great VP pick for him, and there's a good chance that's where he'll go, but the problem is that I just don't see him getting the nomination.
Yes the NHS has been systematically destroyed by the Tory government we have had for the last 10 years now. Our NHS 15 years ago was something the emulate but now it’s been stripped down and sold off. It’s a disgrace.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan DruffHave you seen THIS webpage, Tickle?Quote:
Originally Posted by MrTickle
https://www.nhs.uk/using-the-nhs/nhs...es-in-england/
18 weeks, y'all.Quote:
The maximum waiting time for non-urgent consultant-led treatments is 18 weeks from the day your appointment is booked through the NHS e-Referral Service, or when the hospital or service receives your referral letter.
Wanna see a specialist? If you book it today, you'll see them in April 2020.
Tight healthcare system. I can get into a specialist this week -- sometimes even same day -- if I call right now. Same deal with tests.
The US system needs reform, but LOL at the UK's NHS being held up as an example we should emulate.
Actually, all of these points are legitimate, and reform is definitely needed regarding the shortage of doctors in the US. As I've said many times, many areas of our existing healthcare system needs reform, and this is one of them.Quote:
Originally Posted by MumblesBadlyYou completely ignore how the American Medical Association successfully keeps the supply of new doctors artificially low with its lobbying of Congress to limit funding for medical schools and immigration by doctors trained in other countries, as well as ignoring anti-trust regulations regarding placement of newly graduated medical students in hospital residencies.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Druff
And that doesn’t even address how local medical boards in many metro areas effectively serve as gatekeepers for new doctors being able to enter the local market given how referrals are used to punish or reward those new doctors based on how they conduct their own billing and referral practices.
Overall, that oligarchic control over physician services contributes substantially to doctors in the US earning on average far more than doctors in other major developed countries.
But, yeah. Go ahead and blame the downstream participants in this thoroughly rigged healthcare system.
However, this is NOT the reason doctors in the US earn more than their other first-world counterparts. Also, as nightmarefish pointed out, many doctors start out heavily in debt, and can't get their careers started until they're around 30 years old. They also spend a tremendous amount of time and effort in residency for very little pay -- something also overlooked and which is both unfair to young doctors AND dangerous for patients.
The reason the US doctors earn more is because of the antiquated, opaque, and piecemeal billing system which allows the same test/exam/procedure to be billed several different ways, and for the patient to have no visibility into what services he's buying (or their cost) until it's too late.
Lobbying allows artificially high Medicare rates to be set for certain tests and procedures, which then affects private insurance rates, which doctors then pick up on and look to steer you toward those tests and procedures. Then the loophole is eventually closed, and another one pops up, and it's an endless game of whack-a-mole.
I'm not blaming the people "downstream". I'm blaming lobbyists, politiicans, and healthcare providers.
Want a good example of this? The nuclear stress test is a somewhat harmful and often-ordered test ordered by cardiologists, simply because it's far more lucrative than its non-radioactive counterpart. This vast difference in compensation was a result of corrupt lobbying. In turn, many unethical cardiologists will tell patients they need a nuclear stress test, even when they don't really need it at all.
My mom was even an attempted victim of this scam. Her cardiologist asked her to take one of these, and she was suspicious. She then spoke up and said, "My son is a top cardiologist at Stanford. If you don't mind, I'm going to ask him for his opinion, as well." The doctor seemed nervous, and then later on in the day, he personally called her and said that he had been thinking about it, and decided she only needed the non-nuclear version. He then offered to schedule the test "any time, even today, just tell me when", and went into full asskiss mode. Basically the guy was in a panic because he knew my brother would tell her that she was being scammed, and he didn't want his reputation ruined. Indeed, when she told my brother about it, he said that a nuclear stress test was ridiculous given her circumstances.
That's Medicare lobbying at work. Lobbyists get the nuclear stress test reimbursement rate set artificially high, the insurance companies are then pressured to follow suit, and then doctors go out of their way to make sure their patients get that test, even if unnecessary.
This isn't capitalism. It's corruption. And it will get worse under Medicare For All.
Corruption is baked in with capitalism
Quote:
Originally Posted by blakeQuote:
Originally Posted by sonatine
you're really going to town on these strawman arguments lately. it's just bizarre that, as a diehard liberal, tulsi's anti-war stance is the thing you're fixated on and seem to hate the most. it's also weird cause bernie and tulsi seem to be besties. the dnc hates tulsi for endorsing bernie in 2016.
please also understand that bernie is campaigning on raising your taxes and forcing medicare for all on everyone. just let the government run your healthcare.
how does that win in a general election again? tell me how someone who already has health insurance -- like everyone you know -- says yeah, sign me up for that?
its not an anti-war stance, its an anti-intelligence stance. shes donald trump with tits and youre balls deep in her because you finally found a republican you dont have to be embarrassed to support.
blaming the cia for taking part in the cold war, neoconservative adventurism, and otherwise implementing policies dictated by sitting presidents exploitive, alarming, and nefarious.
fuck off my block with your cult of tulsi feelings.
gg Kamala
Quote:
Originally Posted by SPIT thisWhy did Tulsi endorse somebody as awful as Bernie? Shows poor judgement at the leastQuote:
Originally Posted by blake
Whoa!!! In both posts, you are blaming the healthcare industry’s lobbying of Medicare for essentially forcing doctors to abuse the billing system to artificially inflate their practice and income with unnecessary/expensive testing that private insurance companies are then forced to cover and pass the cost on to policyholders, and then turn around and force doctors to face supposedly draconian reimbursement rates in order to recover the cost of their med school debt.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan DruffActually, all of these points are legitimate, and reform is definitely needed regarding the shortage of doctors in the US. As I've said many times, many areas of our existing healthcare system needs reform, and this is one of them.Quote:
Originally Posted by MumblesBadly
However, this is NOT the reason doctors in the US earn more than their other first-world counterparts. Also, as nightmarefish pointed out, many doctors start out heavily in debt, and can't get their careers started until they're around 30 years old. They also spend a tremendous amount of time and effort in residency for very little pay -- something also overlooked and which is both unfair to young doctors AND dangerous for patients.
The reason the US doctors earn more is because of the antiquated, opaque, and piecemeal billing system which allows the same test/exam/procedure to be billed several different ways, and for the patient to have no visibility into what services he's buying (or their cost) until it's too late.
Lobbying allows artificially high Medicare rates to be set for certain tests and procedures, which then affects private insurance rates, which doctors then pick up on and look to steer you toward those tests and procedures. Then the loophole is eventually closed, and another one pops up, and it's an endless game of whack-a-mole.
I'm not blaming the people "downstream". I'm blaming lobbyists, politiicans, and healthcare providers.
Want a good example of this? The nuclear stress test is a somewhat harmful and often-ordered test ordered by cardiologists, simply because it's far more lucrative than its non-radioactive counterpart. This vast difference in compensation was a result of corrupt lobbying. In turn, many unethical cardiologists will tell patients they need a nuclear stress test, even when they don't really need it at all.
My mom was even an attempted victim of this scam. Her cardiologist asked her to take one of these, and she was suspicious. She then spoke up and said, "My son is a top cardiologist at Stanford. If you don't mind, I'm going to ask him for his opinion, as well." The doctor seemed nervous, and then later on in the day, he personally called her and said that he had been thinking about it, and decided she only needed the non-nuclear version. He then offered to schedule the test "any time, even today, just tell me when", and went into full asskiss mode. Basically the guy was in a panic because he knew my brother would tell her that she was being scammed, and he didn't want his reputation ruined. Indeed, when she told my brother about it, he said that a nuclear stress test was ridiculous given her circumstances.
That's Medicare lobbying at work. Lobbyists get the nuclear stress test reimbursement rate set artificially high, the insurance companies are then pressured to follow suit, and then doctors go out of their way to make sure their patients get that test, even if unnecessary.
This isn't capitalism. It's corruption. And it will get worse under Medicare For All.
Yet, how do you think that the health care industry is able to lobby Medicare to set high rates for certain medical testing??? They primarily use market prices of the few doctors who perform those procedures, which is artificially inflated by the medical community controlling the supply of doctors who are trained to perform/supervise those procedures.
And who controls how much Congress subsidizes med schools for prospective new doctors? The AMA with the same lobbying power it brings to bear on Medicare.
Really, Druff. You seem to be very selective in who you identify as the bad actors in this system. Somehow it’s the amorphous “Medicare”, when the primary agents of the questionable job Medicare does are the professionals who organize and lobby to get extremely favorable treatment by the government.
I blame muh Russia.Quote:
Originally Posted by duped_samaritan
Bullshit.Quote:
Originally Posted by MrTickle
Capitalism is what happens when you leave people alone.
Corruption is baked into political power.
i can now get rich on Hillary, Booker or Tulsi to win the Dem nom.
and im loving Bernie +500 on sportsbook.ag to win Iowa
Another Tulsi KO!Quote:
Originally Posted by duped_samaritan
The next debate likely to be 7 or 8 handed. The winnowing is in full force
If you believe that, I've got a bridge to sell youQuote:
Originally Posted by v12clBullshit.Quote:
Originally Posted by MrTickle
Capitalism is what happens when you leave people alone.
Corruption is baked into political power.