*** OFFICIAL 2020 Democratic Presidential Nomination Race Thread ***

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Originally Posted by Sanlmar

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Originally Posted by Dan Druff

Sanders is going to take New Hampshire because of its proximity and similarity to Vermont.

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In point of fact, NH is a bedroom community for Massachusetts. Those two are most similar.

The bulk of the population is at the Mass border living the tax free life and racking up the miles as they commute an hour or more to Boston and environs. Otherwise they serve the Mass residents looking to avoid sales tax.

Lotta little liberal colleges and kids who have found affordable housing, as well. Sanders is their binky.

Mass political radio just loves bashing Warren. I don’t listen too often but it’s a thing.

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That’s because Boston, with its history of old family/blue blood money, and options compensation-heavy tech companies, as well a strongly financial services industry, has a long history of having similar attitudes towards financial market regulation as Wall Streeters. They just doesn’t have as many financial markets operators as the Big Apple, so it usually flies under the public radar when people say “Wall Street” and “1%ers”.

https://zh-prod-1cc738ca-7d3b-4a72-b...color_orig.jpg

The End of Betomania

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/11/02/u...o-orourke.html

Even his dog knew Beto O'Rourke wouldn't become President.

Time to get rid of a lot more of these fuckers that are running for President that have no chance.

https://cms.qz.com/wp-content/upload...all&quality=75

I'd like to see him work on his brand and run again. He could slipstream in behind just about any moderate and be a white Obama.

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Originally Posted by sonatine

I'd like to see him work on his brand and run again. He could slipstream in behind just about any moderate and be a white Obama.

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Beto is a lightweight and an empty suit. He doesn't have Obama's smarts or savvy and has been out of his depth since announcing.

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Originally Posted by sonatine

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Originally Posted by diggydow

Today's new CNN / New Hampshire poll:



Going back on Nov 9 to continue volunteering.

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http://nymag.com/intelligencer/2019/...a-spoiler.html

a bit hysterical but it aint exactly wrong.

thoughts?

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This is extremely biased and aimed at proving the same wacky theories that have been thrown at Tulsi ever since she refused to bend the knee to Hillary Clinton in 2016.

The author claims Tulsi is "working closely" with the Hill TV and Sean Hannity. This is based on Tulsi giving them an interview. That's it. By that standard, Tulsi is also "working with" Joe Rogan, every single MSM network in the US, Bill Maher, etc. It's absolute bullshit.

That, and if you think "Hill TV" is Republican AT ALL (it's not - it's anti-establishment and progressive) then you've never seen it.

Tulsi's WSJ article is clearly an argument against Hillary and her proxies (Warren, Buttigieg, Kamala). Somehow the author of your article takes that to mean that "Gabbard is saying right now that any Democratic nominee is going to be Hillary Clinton." The author sincerely thinks that Tulsi would make that claim re: Bernie or Yang, or even Biden? It is so laughable and twisted, and blatantly dishonest.

That's what you get for doing what's right. You're smeared and branded as a lunatic who's MOST DEFINITELY going to run a SPOILER CAMPAIGN, because everyone knows Tulsi just LOVES TRUMP! Totally asinine. You should know that if the MSM, the MIC, and the rich are against you, then you're doing the right thing.

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Originally Posted by tony bagadonuts

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Originally Posted by sonatine

I'd like to see him work on his brand and run again. He could slipstream in behind just about any moderate and be a white Obama.

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Beto is a lightweight and an empty suit. He doesn't have Obama's smarts or savvy and has been out of his depth since announcing.

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This is probably accurate

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Originally Posted by thesidedish

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https://i.imgur.com/EBGJBHI.jpg

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Originally Posted by thesidedish

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Originally Posted by TheXFactor

The End of Betomania

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/11/02/u...o-orourke.html

Even his dog knew Beto O'Rourke wouldn't become President.

Time to get rid of a lot more of these fuckers that are running for President that have no chance.

https://cms.qz.com/wp-content/upload...all&quality=75

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i don't see how this guy can even look at himself in the mirror with all the compromising and dishonest drivel that comes out of his mouth,

Feel free to use these facts on the white women you know who want to vote for their mom:

Question:
- "So what's the problem with Warren?"

Answers:
- unlike Sanders/Gabbard, Warren "will not forgo big money donors (PACS) in general election"; as Bernie Sanders has said, "You cannot change a corrupt system by taking its money."

- has tried to claim Native American heritage when but fell so far below the standard threshold that she had to issue an apology for saying it.

- unelectable; a clear Hillary 2.0 (taking meetings with Hillary and being pushed by her people) who appeals only to a certain demographic (white, college-educated, mostly female); was also a big Hillary supporter in 2016, and later admitted it had been rigged; a few days later, after conferring w/ DNC heads (and Hillary) she came back and said she "misspoke"

- among all candidates, has among the lowest out-of-party approval ratings; (Tulsi's, Biden's, and Bernie's are the highest)

- very pro-Israel and Military Industrial Complex and hence receiving overwhelmingly warm MSM coverage; is also in the pocket of AIPAC

- She is claiming to run her 2020 presidential campaign as a grass roots, individual donor only sort of thing. One huge problem. She purposely over raised for her previous Senate campaign where she welcome all sorts of big corporate money and rolled those millions straight into the Presidential campaign.

- her new M4A bill is endorsed by CAP (Center for American Progress Fund), a centrist/establishment think tank that is pure swamp, and headed by the odious Hill-bot Neera Tanden: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mkk1ZNVeuQA

- https://youtu.be/ZZbJQx5fpcw - an in-depth video about why Bernie > Warren(she voted for Trump's giant military budgets, has accepted money from Raytheon (located in Massachusetts), and voted for Ben Carson to be head of Housing & Urban Development

More on Warren's (lack of) foreign policy:

Blaming Iran for the Iran deal falling apart, not wanting to defund Israel for its settlement policy, general support for Imperialism, not condemning Israel’s egregious bombing of schools fully (saying it's part of their right to defend themselves): https://jacobinmag.com/2019/05/eliza...foreign-policy

Start this video at 10:15 to understand the stance Gabbard (and General Matthis) have taken on Syria:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_c...&v=cYZh7Qi9gHo

All Tulsi is guilty of is being skeptical of the US Endless War Machine, and she is now being branded a "Russian Asset" and a traitor because of it.

Isn't she polling at 1%? Who gives a fuck. If she's a Russian asset, they're failing miserably at propping their girl up

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Originally Posted by SPIT this

Isn't she polling at 1%? Who gives a fuck. If she's a Russian asset, they're failing miserably at propping their girl up

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She's polling at 2-5% because of low name recognition and a smear campaign that's been against her since day 1. Anyone who actually watches a long form interview w/ her a long-form interview w/ her becomes a fan.

here's what i wish i could tell tulsi to her face:


when 80% of my exposure to you comes from you eviscerating mainstream left wing politicians / undermining the legitimate investigation into trump's criminal conduct on platforms like joe rogan and fox news, im not going to bother ignoring all that so i can chase down the fine print on your policies, im just going to look for a reasonably safe, reliable, stable, informed candidate.


bonus gripe: hillary trolled you and instead of diffusing the situation and deescalating, you acted like a fucking lunatic and started caps locking about war-queens and shit like she somehow ran the state department/dhs/cia/fbi and the entire military behind obama's back.

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Originally Posted by sonatine

here's what i wish i could tell tulsi to her face:


when 80% of my exposure to you comes from you eviscerating mainstream left wing politicians / undermining the legitimate investigation into trump's criminal conduct on platforms like joe rogan and fox news, im not going to bother ignoring all that so i can chase down the fine print on your policies, im just going to look for a reasonably safe, reliable, stable, informed candidate.


bonus gripe: hillary trolled you and instead of diffusing the situation and deescalating, you acted like a fucking lunatic and started caps locking about war-queens and shit like she somehow ran the state department/dhs/cia/fbi and the entire military behind obama's back.

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You understand that at this point in the election cycle we are in the primaries?

This is a competition not a coalition.

If competition is a bad word in a liberal context I didn’t mean to offend. Let’s de-escalate

Carry on

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Originally Posted by Sanlmar

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Originally Posted by sonatine

here's what i wish i could tell tulsi to her face:


when 80% of my exposure to you comes from you eviscerating mainstream left wing politicians / undermining the legitimate investigation into trump's criminal conduct on platforms like joe rogan and fox news, im not going to bother ignoring all that so i can chase down the fine print on your policies, im just going to look for a reasonably safe, reliable, stable, informed candidate.


bonus gripe: hillary trolled you and instead of diffusing the situation and deescalating, you acted like a fucking lunatic and started caps locking about war-queens and shit like she somehow ran the state department/dhs/cia/fbi and the entire military behind obama's back.

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You understand that at this point in the election cycle we are in the primaries?

This is a competition not a coalition.

If competition is a bad word in a liberal context I didn’t mean to offend. Let’s de-escalate

Carry on

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your point is unclear and no matter how i interpret this, it doesnt negate my point.

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Originally Posted by sonatine

here's what i wish i could tell tulsi to her face:


when 80% of my exposure to you comes from you eviscerating mainstream left wing politicians / undermining the legitimate investigation into trump's criminal conduct on platforms like joe rogan and fox news, im not going to bother ignoring all that so i can chase down the fine print on your policies, im just going to look for a reasonably safe, reliable, stable, informed candidate.


bonus gripe: hillary trolled you and instead of diffusing the situation and deescalating, you acted like a fucking lunatic and started caps locking about war-queens and shit like she somehow ran the state department/dhs/cia/fbi and the entire military behind obama's back.

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I can understand Tulsi having a particularly firey beef with Hillary Clinton for this simple reason — and relevant to her experience as a US military veteran who served in a war of choice that Hillary supported and most certainly resulted in friends she had in the service dying/coming back badly wounded: Hillary was 100% for using the US military might to try to change Afghanistan’s backwards culture to better treat their women, which is both supremely arrogant and totally foolish.

That’s why when Obama was deciding in early 2009 what to do about Afghanistan that Hillary sided with the generals’ request for a “surge” of troops, which was opposite the advice of the most knowledgable person about Afghanistan in the room in those meetings, the US’s long-serving special diplomat, Richard Armitage, as well as Joe Biden, probably the second most knowledge person in the room who didn’t the “American Exceptionalism” zeal of Clinton. And Obama’s decisions that followed, initially a half-surge, which was then ramped up to what the generals wanted, ended up with leading to another 1800-2000 deaths of US armed services personnel over there.

So, yeah. Hillary Clinton totally deserves the Twitter bitch slapping that Tulsi Gabbard dished back to her.

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Originally Posted by sonatine

here's what i wish i could tell tulsi to her face:


when 80% of my exposure to you comes from you eviscerating mainstream left wing politicians / undermining the legitimate investigation into trump's criminal conduct on platforms like joe rogan and fox news, im not going to bother ignoring all that so i can chase down the fine print on your policies, im just going to look for a reasonably safe, reliable, stable, informed candidate.


bonus gripe: hillary trolled you and instead of diffusing the situation and deescalating, you acted like a fucking lunatic and started caps locking about war-queens and shit like she somehow ran the state department/dhs/cia/fbi and the entire military behind obama's back.

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the reasons you don't like tulsi are just baffling to me

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Originally Posted by tony bagadonuts

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Originally Posted by sonatine

I'd like to see him work on his brand and run again. He could slipstream in behind just about any moderate and be a white Obama.

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Beto is a lightweight and an empty suit. He doesn't have Obama's smarts or savvy and has been out of his depth since announcing.

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Agree.

Obama was a great campaigner. Beto was only good at campaigning in Texas against a right-wing challenger, but not good at making himself stand out against other Democrats on a national stage.

He was also a freak and a weird dude, and did a good job suppressing that from coming out in his campaign against Cruz. I guess everyone was so busy focusing upon his populism and stark difference from Cruz that they didn't look at who and what Beto really was.

He was a guy who seemed weirder and more empty the more we learned about him. Old text files were found from the early 90s where he had written about a fantasy he had of running over random people and killing them. Yes, he was around 19-20 when he wrote that shit, but still, who would have fantasies about that and write about it? Everything you learned about the guy just made you feel something was "off" about him.

He was also constantly reinventing himself, with the final attempt involving becoming the "We're going to take your guns" guy, which just hurt Democrats as a whole with swing voters.

Here's an article from CNN which attempts to explain "why Beto O'Rourke fell so quickly", and it's kind of interesting to read, but like most things on CNN these days, it's poorly written and doesn't really explain what it claims it does. But here it is: https://www.cnn.com/2019/11/03/polit...led/index.html

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Originally Posted by sonatine

here's what i wish i could tell tulsi to her face:


when 80% of my exposure to you comes from you eviscerating mainstream left wing politicians / undermining the legitimate investigation into trump's criminal conduct on platforms like joe rogan and fox news, im not going to bother ignoring all that so i can chase down the fine print on your policies, im just going to look for a reasonably safe, reliable, stable, informed candidate.


bonus gripe: hillary trolled you and instead of diffusing the situation and deescalating, you acted like a fucking lunatic and started caps locking about war-queens and shit like she somehow ran the state department/dhs/cia/fbi and the entire military behind obama's back.

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Tulsi hasn't "eviscerated" any left-wing politician. Kamala Harris is pure establishment and backed by the Clinton machine, is not a progressive, and is not working to help you. All Tulsi did was tell the truth about Kamala - a competitor in a debate - and it broke her completely.

One of Tulsi's most popular tweets was "eviscerating" Donald Trump.

And Tulsi has been consistent on her opinion of the Trump investigation. She just voted for the impeachment inquiry to continue, if it reassures you. She has stated repeatedly that it should be narrowly-focused and NOT a media circus, since it creates more bipartisanship and ultimately harms the country. Tulsi's entire message has always been about unity and not talking down to anyone, ever. It's part of the reason she gets support from Independents and even Republicans.

The double-standard in claiming Tulsi is a "fucking lunatic" for taking on an accusation OF AN EXECUTABLE CRIME head-on and confronting her accuser directly is mind-boggling, and I do not understand how you can make this criticism in good faith.

Tulsi gets little exposure in the media precisely because she is fighting against the establishment, against corporate interests, and against the military industrial complex. If you aren't aware of the close relationship between the CIA/MIC/MSM and what they all do to protect each other, I am happy to discuss and provide evidence.

Its amazing to see your ownage in a thread. Its quite nostalgic and brings me back to the golden age of these forums.

Question. Do you agree with every stance Tulsi makes? Is there a talking point that you disagree on? If so, which?

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Originally Posted by diggydow

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Originally Posted by sonatine

here's what i wish i could tell tulsi to her face:


when 80% of my exposure to you comes from you eviscerating mainstream left wing politicians / undermining the legitimate investigation into trump's criminal conduct on platforms like joe rogan and fox news, im not going to bother ignoring all that so i can chase down the fine print on your policies, im just going to look for a reasonably safe, reliable, stable, informed candidate.


bonus gripe: hillary trolled you and instead of diffusing the situation and deescalating, you acted like a fucking lunatic and started caps locking about war-queens and shit like she somehow ran the state department/dhs/cia/fbi and the entire military behind obama's back.

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Tulsi hasn't "eviscerated" any left-wing politician. Kamala Harris is pure establishment and backed by the Clinton machine, is not a progressive, and is not working to help you. All Tulsi did was tell the truth about Kamala - a competitor in a debate - and it broke her completely.

One of Tulsi's most popular tweets was "eviscerating" Donald Trump.

And Tulsi has been consistent on her opinion of the Trump investigation. She just voted for the impeachment inquiry to continue, if it reassures you. She has stated repeatedly that it should be narrowly-focused and NOT a media circus, since it creates more bipartisanship and ultimately harms the country. Tulsi's entire message has always been about unity and not talking down to anyone, ever. It's part of the reason she gets support from Independents and even Republicans.

The double-standard in claiming Tulsi is a "fucking lunatic" for taking on an accusation OF AN EXECUTABLE CRIME head-on and confronting her accuser directly is mind-boggling, and I do not understand how you can make this criticism in good faith.

Tulsi gets little exposure in the media precisely because she is fighting against the establishment, against corporate interests, and against the military industrial complex. If you aren't aware of the close relationship between the CIA/MIC/MSM and what they all do to protect each other, I am happy to discuss and provide evidence.

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thing is, you are basically zero degrees removed from her message, so you get all these incredibly nuanced takes and see the entire spectrum of her campaign as she wishes it presented.

the rest of us are like 'wtf why is she on fox news and why did she stand up at the debates and say that pursuing charges against donald trump is partisan and divisive?'

so i get why youre frustrated but those of us who are just out here calling it like we see it, she's a hot republican with an antagonistic personality disorder, regardless of what her pamphlets say.

also this is absolutely batshit: "The double-standard in claiming Tulsi is a "fucking lunatic" for taking on an accusation OF AN EXECUTABLE CRIME head-on and confronting her accuser directly is mind-boggling, and I do not understand how you can make this criticism in good faith".

if your response to a baseless accusation is to escalate it, you arent presidential material.

also you can lecture me on the intelligence community when you get clearance.

hey remember that time that gabbard went to syria in 2017 to chill with assad and came back and said the anti-assad rebels were no different than ISIS?

that was wild af.

quick reminder that you perceive this comment as an accusation of an "executable offense":

CLINTON: They’re also going to do third party again. And I’m not making any predictions, but I think they’ve got their eye on somebody [Gabbard] who is currently in the Democratic primary and are grooming her to be the third-party candidate. She’s the favorite of the Russians, they have a bunch of sites and bots and other ways of supporting her so far. And that’s assuming [Green Party 2016 candidate] Jill Stein will give it up, which she might not, because she’s also a Russian asset.

tine, you're really not giving any substantive reasons for your dislike of her. you're just like, nah i can't be bothered, which is ok i guess? sidenote, she would be the most liberal president of all time by miles.

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Originally Posted by sonatine

quick reminder that you perceive this comment as an accusation of an "executable offense":

CLINTON: They’re also going to do third party again. And I’m not making any predictions, but I think they’ve got their eye on somebody [Gabbard] who is currently in the Democratic primary and are grooming her to be the third-party candidate. She’s the favorite of the Russians, they have a bunch of sites and bots and other ways of supporting her so far. And that’s assuming [Green Party 2016 candidate] Jill Stein will give it up, which she might not, because she’s also a Russian asset.

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it really is crazy that her beatdown of hillary, who called tulsi a russian asset, seems to be the tipping point for you. wtf is going on here

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Originally Posted by blake

tine, you're really not giving any substantive reasons for your dislike of her. you're just like, nah i can't be bothered, which is ok i guess? sidenote, she would be the most liberal president of all time by miles.

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she's also an alt-right conspiracy theorist who hangs out on tucker carlson's show and loOooOooOoOves the pm of india, so fuck a tulsi gabbard.

also im sure a lot of people polling at 1.2% would be the most liberal president of all time by miles.

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Originally Posted by sonatine

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Originally Posted by blake

tine, you're really not giving any substantive reasons for your dislike of her. you're just like, nah i can't be bothered, which is ok i guess? sidenote, she would be the most liberal president of all time by miles.

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she's also an alt-right conspiracy theorist who hangs out on tucker carlson's show and loOooOooOoOves the pm of india, so fuck a tulsi gabbard.

also im sure a lot of people polling at 1.2% would be the most liberal president of all time by miles.

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i'm throughly confused about what alt-right is i guess

tulsi wants to speak to the manager immediately, blake.

tine, do you realize that with his health, joe biden has a 10% chance of even being alive in november?

bernie sanders refers to himself as a democratic socialist and insists he's taking away your health care.

same with elizabeth warren (re healthcare), but oh yeah, she also called herself a native american for the first 68 years of her life, which is in no way reflective of someone with a personality disorder.


we might need you to get on board with an actual electable candidate

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Originally Posted by sonatine

tulsi wants to speak to the manager immediately, blake.

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Better than having the manager killed and then say it was a suicide.

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Originally Posted by blake

tine, do you realize that with his health, joe biden has a 10% chance of even being alive in november?

bernie sanders refers to himself as a democratic socialist and insists he's taking away your health care. same with elizabeth warren (re healthcare), but oh yeah, she also called herself a native american for the first 68 years of her life, which is in no way reflective of someone with a personality disorder.


we might need you to get on board with an actual electable candidate

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were you day drinking?

also this is your solution?

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can you remind me what wars clinton mongered exactly and if its not too much trouble, can you show me how her apparently vast network of proxies are working to destroy tulsi's reputation, and if not, help me understand how thats an alt-right conspiracy theory when bannon says it but not when tulsi does?

you remember bannon, right?

huge tulsi fan btw.

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Originally Posted by sonatine

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Originally Posted by blake

tine, do you realize that with his health, joe biden has a 10% chance of even being alive in november?

bernie sanders refers to himself as a democratic socialist and insists he's taking away your health care. same with elizabeth warren (re healthcare), but oh yeah, she also called herself a native american for the first 68 years of her life, which is in no way reflective of someone with a personality disorder.


we might need you to get on board with an actual electable candidate

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were you day drinking?

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i meant to say bernie wants to take away your health insurance in favor of medicare for all, which is deeply unpopular.

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Originally Posted by blake

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Originally Posted by sonatine

were you day drinking?

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i meant to say bernie wants to take away your health insurance in favor of medicare for all, which is deeply unpopular.

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tbh i havent been following this closely because my understanding is that any solution he implements will come on the heels of him curb stomping the insurance/medical middle men who lobbied to make price gouging systemic and ubiquitous.

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Originally Posted by sonatine

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Originally Posted by blake

tine, do you realize that with his health, joe biden has a 10% chance of even being alive in november?

bernie sanders refers to himself as a democratic socialist and insists he's taking away your health care. same with elizabeth warren (re healthcare), but oh yeah, she also called herself a native american for the first 68 years of her life, which is in no way reflective of someone with a personality disorder.


we might need you to get on board with an actual electable candidate

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were you day drinking?

also this is your solution?

Embedded Tweet

can you remind me what wars clinton mongered exactly and if its not too much trouble, can you show me how her apparently vast network of proxies are working to destroy tulsi's reputation, and if not, help me understand how thats an alt-right conspiracy theory when bannon says it but not when tulsi does?

you remember bannon, right?

huge tulsi fan btw.

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we've reached a point where tine has emerged as hillary's number one fan. i don't even blame tine. this is what trump has done to us. (of course, i would vote for hillary or literally any other person alive over trump in 2020.)

but hillary has a long history of never being against any war, ever. in her defense, every politician on both sides of the aisle are also in favor of every war, always.... but you're right, why question whether that is sound policy?

and i think a lot of tulsi's histrionics about hillary are an attempt to get attention, which is understandable. on the other hand, tulsi made serious enemies when she endorsed bernie. i remember howard dean talking on msnbc about how all of the democrat candidates running were fantastic except tulsi. this might have been before she even announced. they all hate her, tine.

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Originally Posted by sonatine

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Originally Posted by blake

i meant to say bernie wants to take away your health insurance in favor of medicare for all, which is deeply unpopular.

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tbh i havent been following this closely because my understanding is that any solution he implements will come on the heels of him curb stomping the insurance/medical middle men who lobbied to make price gouging systemic and ubiquitous.

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he wants to outlaw private insurance. now, maybe he's right and that's a good idea. i don't profess to be an expert. but i do know that such an idea sounds bad and scares the fuck out of me, as it does with most Americans.

bernie needs to go the more moderate (Tulsi-esque route), which is giving a public option but not making it mandatory

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Originally Posted by blake

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Originally Posted by sonatine

tbh i havent been following this closely because my understanding is that any solution he implements will come on the heels of him curb stomping the insurance/medical middle men who lobbied to make price gouging systemic and ubiquitous.

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he wants to outlaw private insurance. now, maybe he's right and that's a good idea. i don't profess to be an expert. but i do know that such an idea sounds bad and scares the fuck out of me, as it does with most Americans.

bernie needs to go the more moderate (Tulsi-esque route), which is giving a public option but not making it mandatory

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its hard for me to imagine bernie depriving people of health care when he's spent his entire adult life fighting to improve the quality of lower and middle class lives. he's barely a politician, he's an activist who allowed himself to be elected so he could do more good on a broader scale. so again i think the concerns that bernie is going to yank the rug out from people who cant afford their rug to begin with is unfounded and very much in line with the anti-left hysteria twitter narrative.