This is America we're talking about.Quote:
Originally Posted by limitles
This is America we're talking about.Quote:
Originally Posted by limitles
Floyd was pretty much in the police vehicle when Chauvin arrived. He opened the opposite door that the cops were trying to load him and pulls him out of the car. Why the fuck did he pull him out of the vehicle before kneeling on his neck?
Pulling him out of the police vehicle to me is very odd.
I have a distinct memory from the videos. Emergency responders arrive and Chauvin throws him on the stretcher like he's a piece of meat.
Guilty of brutality 100% not sure he intended to kill him though.
Whatever. That's all you have to say? Oh I'm guilty of fucking up a sentence. You got the drift didn't you? I got the drift of Druff's ridiculous take that political ideology is even mentioned in this thread.Quote:
Originally Posted by GrenadaRogerSay What? You think Druff's articulation is bad? Look to your first one my not so good man. You are using a double negative which confuses...take it from me, no one's opinion on anything is worth the work it take to unravel wording like that--not even opinions of the "PFA saint" Sonatine or his todey sidekick lol wow....Quote:
Originally Posted by limitles
(eliminating the double neg, you are saying you believe someone paid off could find the officer innocent, and also believe a mentally ill person would find him guilty)
Imagine if someone you knew died in the street while begging to breathe. But don't bother with that. You've got grammar on your mind
And I don't remember calling him out for his sentence structure ya dildo
This thread is an embarrassment. Some idiot who has potentially seen what there is to see proposes this was a drug overdose.
I somewhat but not completely agree.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Druff
It should be easier to get rid of poorly performing public servants. At the same time, I think it's important to have strong unions in both the public and private sector to protect workers--but only the ones doing their jobs and doing them well. I realize in practice this is hard to achieve, but the current situation where people depending on ideology either blindly support or blindly hate unions is not healthy for the middle class, which basically would not exist without unions plus the social safety net.
Also we can't completely eliminate the racial aspect. It exists and we have to deal with it honestly. What we don't have to do is let it cause a fight to the death between SJWs on one side and Confederate flag-wavers on the other. Fuck all of those people.
Same thing, this is way off topic. Unions, bad employees, what? People with the authority they have been granted cannot run amok. Forget the victim was a minority. Forget that he might have committed a non violent crime. Forget all the shitty racial history. This was a brutal act by a civil servant. Belonging to a police force should not offer him one ounce of protection from the law.Quote:
Originally Posted by Walter SobchakI somewhat but not completely agree.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Druff
It should be easier to get rid of poorly performing public servants. At the same time, I think it's important to have strong unions in both the public and private sector to protect workers--but only the ones doing their jobs and doing them well. I realize in practice this is hard to achieve, but the current situation where people depending on ideology either blindly support or blindly hate unions is not healthy for the middle class, which basically would not exist without unions plus the social safety net.
Also we can't completely eliminate the racial aspect. It exists and we have to deal with it honestly. What we don't have to do is let it cause a fight to the death between SJWs on one side and Confederate flag-wavers on the other. Fuck all of those people.
Everything Druff said was after the fact b.s.
I think you definition of brutality is way off. Take off the emotional glasses, he resisted arrest.Quote:
Originally Posted by Salty_Aus
Public labor unions are a disaster all around, and they run counter to the entire original concept of unions.Quote:
Originally Posted by Walter SobchakI somewhat but not completely agree.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Druff
It should be easier to get rid of poorly performing public servants. At the same time, I think it's important to have strong unions in both the public and private sector to protect workers--but only the ones doing their jobs and doing them well. I realize in practice this is hard to achieve, but the current situation where people depending on ideology either blindly support or blindly hate unions is not healthy for the middle class, which basically would not exist without unions plus the social safety net.
Also we can't completely eliminate the racial aspect. It exists and we have to deal with it honestly. What we don't have to do is let it cause a fight to the death between SJWs on one side and Confederate flag-wavers on the other. Fuck all of those people.
Unions were necessary at a point when greedy corporations were taking advantage of employees, with the theory being that corporations only exist for profit, and there needs to be a counter-entity to protect the interest of employees.
Since public jobs exist specifically to serve the public good, and the government is their employer, there is no profit motive. Therefore, there is no greedy corporation to fight against, and anything unfair to public employees can be addressed at the government level! Public unions exist specifically to place the interests of their employees over the public interest! Not good!
It is essential to provide sufficient means to discipline bad public employees, as "customers" of public institutions can't simply take their business elsewhere.
I got to see the flaws in public labor unions firsthand as a kid, as a public school student. There were some teachers who were incompetent, lazy, or downright abusive. Provided they had tenure, they were protected from any kind of meaningful discipline, unless they broke the law or stopped showing up for work. Even as a little kid, I understood this was wrong.
Police unions are the reason that Derek Chauvin had a badge on the day he killed George Floyd. They need to be abolished or weakened, along with the teachers' union, and all other public labor unions.
I'm sure you watch plenty of reality cop shows. You strike me as a wannabee cop.Quote:
Originally Posted by desertrunnerI think you definition of brutality is way off. Take off the emotional glasses, he resisted arrest.Quote:
Originally Posted by Salty_Aus
Have you ever seen the police arrest someone and virtually get them into the police vehicle. Then pull them out and kneel on their neck for 8 minutes.... even continued after he was unresponsive and likely not breathing.
I've seen people resisting as they're put into a police van or car before. If reinforcements arrive they don't pull them out and kneel on their neck, they assist in getting them in and close the door. I know this is how they're trained.
Anybody who justifies what he did was right is a fucking retard of the highest order.
I'm not saying its murder, but he definitely had an attitude and wanted to show him who was boss. Perhaps even show the new guys what a real policeman is.
Police brutality.... no doubt!
He definitely enjoyed preening as a tough guy for everyone who was watching/taking pics.Quote:
Originally Posted by Salty_AusI'm sure you watch plenty of reality cop shows. You strike me as a wannabee cop.Quote:
Originally Posted by desertrunner
Have you ever seen the police arrest someone and virtually get them into the police vehicle. Then pull them out and kneel on their neck for 8 minutes.... even continued after he was unresponsive and likely not breathing.
I've seen people resisting as they're put into a police van or car before. If reinforcements arrive they don't pull them out and kneel on their neck, they assist in getting them in and close the door. I know this is how they're trained.
Anybody who justifies what he did was right is a fucking retard of the highest order.
I'm not saying its murder, but he definitely had an attitude and wanted to show him who was boss. Perhaps even show the new guys what a real policeman is.
Police brutality.... no doubt!
The report I saw and the body cams will probably show (those cams will be interesting) is that they couldn’t get him into the car, he was already complaining that he couldn’t breathe. He was probably having a panic attack related to all the shit he was on. Since he was freaking out, high and in the street they put him on the ground so he wouldn’t do something crazy and get hit by a car etc etc. Up to the point where the dude kneels on his neck I don’t think the cops did anything wrong. The failure is when Floyd needed medical help they didn’t help him or even identify how much trouble the guy was clearly in. There were several pedestrians there telling the cops that Floyd was dying and they never reacted.Quote:
Originally Posted by Salty_AusI'm sure you watch plenty of reality cop shows. You strike me as a wannabee cop.Quote:
Originally Posted by desertrunner
Have you ever seen the police arrest someone and virtually get them into the police vehicle. Then pull them out and kneel on their neck for 8 minutes.... even continued after he was unresponsive and likely not breathing.
I've seen people resisting as they're put into a police van or car before. If reinforcements arrive they don't pull them out and kneel on their neck, they assist in getting them in and close the door. I know this is how they're trained.
Anybody who justifies what he did was right is a fucking retard of the highest order.
I'm not saying its murder, but he definitely had an attitude and wanted to show him who was boss. Perhaps even show the new guys what a real policeman is.
Police brutality.... no doubt!
this just in: Judge allowed 3rd degree murder (manslaughter) charge to be added...in short, justice is bowing to local political pressureQuote:
Originally Posted by GrenadaRogeri believe juries in most places would find as you claim--but who knows what the 12 members of that local community will decide?Quote:
Originally Posted by desertrunner
and intent does not need to be present for manslaughter -- so conviction on that charge is possible...
don't know the exact charges the police offices is facing
so now the trial will proceed, and as DR has stated, no intent will be proved so no first degree conviction; but a 3rd degree conviction will be rendered in hope that appeases the locals from rioting--it shows that justice is not absolute and uniform, but influenced by the values of the community
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/de...?ocid=msedgntp
where you can go trouble-free in the USA depends on what you are and if you are acceptable to who has local control
So you're saying there's no need for defense lawyers? Judges and prosecutors work for public interest. Both are hired by various levels of government. So defense lawyers exist specifically to place the interests of their clients over the public interest! Not good!Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan DruffPublic labor unions are a disaster all around, and they run counter to the entire original concept of unions.Quote:
Originally Posted by Walter Sobchak
Unions were necessary at a point when greedy corporations were taking advantage of employees, with the theory being that corporations only exist for profit, and there needs to be a counter-entity to protect the interest of employees.
Since public jobs exist specifically to serve the public good, and the government is their employer, there is no profit motive. Therefore, there is no greedy corporation to fight against, and anything unfair to public employees can be addressed at the government level! Public unions exist specifically to place the interests of their employees over the public interest! Not good!
Public labor unions exists because government and their employees/officials in a position of power are not infallible. You can disagree about them for other reasons, just not the one where public employees don't need representation.
Ha, I have some legit real LE training and not a “wannabe cop”. I guess you ran out of arguments and had to find a weak insult to use here.Quote:
Originally Posted by Salty_AusI'm sure you watch plenty of reality cop shows. You strike me as a wannabee cop.Quote:
Originally Posted by desertrunner
Correct, which is why black people need to be especially careful.Quote:
Originally Posted by GrenadaRogerthis just in: Judge allowed 3rd degree murder (manslaughter) charge to be added...in short, justice is bowing to local political pressureQuote:
Originally Posted by GrenadaRoger
so now the trial will proceed, and as DR has stated, no intent will be proved so no first degree conviction; but a 3rd degree conviction will be rendered in hope that appeases the locals from rioting--it shows that justice is not absolute and uniform, but influenced by the values of the community
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/de...?ocid=msedgntp
where you can go trouble-free in the USA depends on what you are and if you are acceptable to who has local control
I think this is an accurate assessment, the next question becomes, what is the punishment for the cop?Quote:
Originally Posted by nightmarefishThe report I saw and the body cams will probably show (those cams will be interesting) is that they couldn’t get him into the car, he was already complaining that he couldn’t breathe. He was probably having a panic attack related to all the shit he was on. Since he was freaking out, high and in the street they put him on the ground so he wouldn’t do something crazy and get hit by a car etc etc. Up to the point where the dude kneels on his neck I don’t think the cops did anything wrong. The failure is when Floyd needed medical help they didn’t help him or even identify how much trouble the guy was clearly in. There were several pedestrians there telling the cops that Floyd was dying and they never reacted.Quote:
Originally Posted by Salty_Aus
How much of the blame goes to the guy on a lethal dose of fentanyl for putting himself into the position?
How much leeway do we give cops to make mistakes dealing with unruly, drugged up people?
It's an impossible job, and this Chauvin guy was still bad at it.
If due progress wasn't a thing, I'd say losing your career, family, and being hated by everyone, plus 6-12 months in jail feels about right.
It wasn't murder, but it was very negligent, as is shooting fentanyl through your anus.
A quick note on the public safety unions. I’m most likely the only member here thats been a member of both legit fire and LE unions and will verify here they are still very much needed today. They are also very effective internally and necessary. The old idea of “they were needed back then, but not now” is really false. Both police and fire members are under attack from overhead management weekly.
It’s like hiring a lawyer today to defend you for a legal issue- stuff happens. Getting rid of unions today would be like saying- remove lawyers as they aren’t needed as much today, society is now following more of the rules. Or- Let remove most of the rules from the WSOP because most of today's players are following them now and we should be good. It’s the same in public safety, lots of internal rules, laws and policy are violated and good employees getting the screw. If you’re in California, the "Peace Officer Bill of Rights" and "Firefighter Bill of Rights" are in place for a reason and are used and exercised often because upper management and civil leaders choose to continue to break and not follow local, state and federal laws.
If someone has never been in a public safety union, they won’t fully understand. It’s like me being critical of the internal workings of the WSOP, but never played in it, but still think they should scrap the posted rules today because most poker players now are OK and those past rules are outdated and no longer needed. I would be wrong in thinking this.
Not all unions are bad. The corrupt ones are making the good unions look bad.
I get it now.Quote:
Originally Posted by nightmarefishThe report I saw and the body cams will probably show (those cams will be interesting) is that they couldn’t get him into the car, he was already complaining that he couldn’t breathe. He was probably having a panic attack related to all the shit he was on. Since he was freaking out, high and in the street they put him on the ground so he wouldn’t do something crazy and get hit by a car etc etc. Up to the point where the dude kneels on his neck I don’t think the cops did anything wrong. The failure is when Floyd needed medical help they didn’t help him or even identify how much trouble the guy was clearly in. There were several pedestrians there telling the cops that Floyd was dying and they never reacted.Quote:
Originally Posted by Salty_Aus
Chauvin dragged him out of the police vehicle, jumped on his back and kneeled on his kneck for 8 minutes, to render assistance.
Makes perfect sense.... if you're a brain dead retard.
Take it from a white boy who has been cuffed and thrown in the back of a few cop cars. They don't care what you say, you're going where ever they want.Quote:
Originally Posted by Salty_AusQuote:
Originally Posted by nightmarefish
I get it now.
Chauvin dragged him out of the police vehicle, jumped on his back and kneeled on his kneck for 8 minutes, to render assistance.
Makes perfect sense.... if you're a brain dead retard.
Nothing I saw video wise showed any trouble for a cop. No aggression. No swings, no death threats. There was no misbehaviour
Consider that this man was outnumbered and out gunned with his hands cuffed behind him.
What threat did he pose at any moment after being cuffed?
And who kneels on someones neck? Thank-you for your service.
Obviously.Quote:
Originally Posted by limitlesTake it from a white boy who has been cuffed and thrown in the back of a few cop cars. They don't care what you say, you're going where ever they want.Quote:
Originally Posted by Salty_Aus
Nothing I saw video wise showed any trouble for a cop. No aggression. No swings, no death threats. There was no misbehaviour
Consider that this man was outnumbered and out gunned with his hands cuffed behind him.
What threat did he pose at any moment after being cuffed?
And who kneels on someones neck? Thank-you for your service.
He was handcuffed and the cops were having minor issues getting the rear drivers side door closed.
Chauvin shows up and opens the opposite door and literally drags him across the back seat and immediately jumps on his back and kneels on his neck.
Any suggestion that Chauvin was rendering assistance is ludicrous. He's a bully with an attitude and he certainly contributed to his death.... murder probably not but he deserves to be seriously punished.
$27 million dollars for the Floyd family. No one wants to talk about the elephant in the room but George dying is probably the best thing that ever happen to most of them. I wonder how many were even close to him. He was a drug addict that moved away to Minnesota. Not the type of person that usually keeps great relationships with family members or stays in touch.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Texter
You need to use the right technique.
A large drugged man is tough to restain even when cuffed.
A lot of people don’t get this. People were talking about choke holds in the Eric Garner case as well. When a 350-400 man resists arrest you don’t have many options. George Floyd wasn’t quite as big but still a big dude, big enough that 3-4 cops couldn’t get him in the back of a cop car while handcuffed. In my younger days I used to bounce on the weekends and in my mind the safest, most effective way to get control of someone who was out of control was to always put them in a headlock. If you put a little squeeze on, they would usually chill the fuck out pretty quickly. It never once crossed my mind that a headlock was life threatening. Once again, the fuck up from the cops came from not helping when Floyd needed help.Quote:
Originally Posted by turdzillaQuote:
Originally Posted by Texter
You need to use the right technique.
A large drugged man is tough to restain even when cuffed.
You don't seem to get this. George Floyd was not putting up a fight prior to or after being handcuffed. He was also surrounded by armed officers.Quote:
Originally Posted by nightmarefishA lot of people don’t get this. People were talking about choke holds in the Eric Garner case as well. When a 350-400 man resists arrest you don’t have many options. George Floyd wasn’t quite as big but still a big dude, big enough that 3-4 cops couldn’t get him in the back of a cop car while handcuffed. In my younger days I used to bounce on the weekends and in my mind the safest, most effective way to get control of someone who was out of control was to always put them in a headlock. If you put a little squeeze on, they would usually chill the fuck out pretty quickly. It never once crossed my mind that a headlock was life threatening. Once again, the fuck up from the cops came from not helping when Floyd needed help.Quote:
Originally Posted by turdzilla
An ambulance crew would have no troubles transferring that man into their vehicle
Officer Chauvin, while kneeling on his neck says “get up and get in the car”, repeatedly.
Had your chokeholds resulted in a broken neck or death your opinions would be different.
Consider the word chokehold. It describes a way to stop a person from breathing.
The word chokehold is overused. Anytime an officer gets close to someone’s neck retards like you start calling it a chokehold, it’s ridiculous. Floyd had 3-4 cops on him which makes it hard as fuck to breathe, I don’t care who you are. If you don’t believe me, have 4 of your friends lay on you without being anywhere around your neck and try to get up, you will start breathing heavily almost instantly. Problem is, Floyd was panicking and having trouble breathing well before they got on top of him so shit compounded. Watch the tape ffs, he wouldn’t let them put him in the cop car so they put him on the ground, is that part even disputable? I’d be willing to bet Chauvin had used that same kneel 100s of times to keep someone on the ground with the suspects not ever having in medical reaction. I don’t know for sure, but it was probably something he learned In training or close to it.Quote:
Originally Posted by limitlesYou don't seem to get this. George Floyd was not putting up a fight prior to or after being handcuffed. He was also surrounded by armed officers.Quote:
Originally Posted by nightmarefish
An ambulance crew would have no troubles transferring that man into their vehicle
Officer Chauvin, while kneeling on his neck says “get up and get in the car”, repeatedly.
Had your chokeholds resulted in a broken neck or death your opinions would be different.
Consider the word chokehold. It describes a way to stop a person from breathing.
The cops did nothing wrong up to the point where they didn’t recognize Floyd was in trouble and give the man assistance.
You should actually watch the first part of the video where he physically resisted arrest. Open up your liberal mind and see the whole picture.Quote:
Originally Posted by limitles
George hard had drugs in his system, but the knee to his neck triggered cardiac arrest. Cardiac Arrest is different than a heart attack, it's basically a trigger to send the heart haywire. James Gandolfini is an example. Yeah he was terribly overweight and a huge drinker. But that is not what killed him. He was in Rome during an unprecedented heat wave. For whatever reason, even though hotel staff warned him it was too hot to go outside, he decided to take his son on an 8 hour walk to sightsee. It was 104 outside. They came back, went to dinner and he pounded down like 8 alcoholic drinks and friend prawns. Given he was terribly dehydrated and did not know it, he dropped dead. Cardiac Arrest.
While George may have died anyway, the knee on the neck was the trigger, just like Tony dying, his weight and alcohol did him no favors, but the dehydration was the cause of his cardiac arrest.
I know I am speaking above people here, but I dabbled in medical theory in college and I went to a great school so I know what I am talking about.
You were the one who first mentioned chokehold. The reason chokeholds are as effective as you said is the recipient os the hold cannot breathe.Quote:
Originally Posted by nightmarefishThe word chokehold is overused. Anytime an officer gets close to someone’s neck retards like you start calling it a chokehold, it’s ridiculous. Floyd had 3-4 cops on him which makes it hard as fuck to breathe, I don’t care who you are. If you don’t believe me, have 4 of your friends lay on you without being anywhere around your neck and try to get up, you will start breathing heavily almost instantly. Problem is, Floyd was panicking and having trouble breathing well before they got on top of him so shit compounded. Watch the tape ffs, he wouldn’t let them put him in the cop car so they put him on the ground, is that part even disputable? I’d be willing to bet Chauvin had used that same kneel 100s of times to keep someone on the ground with the suspects not ever having in medical reaction. I don’t know for sure, but it was probably something he learned In training or close to it.Quote:
Originally Posted by limitles
The cops did nothing wrong up to the point where they didn’t recognize Floyd was in trouble and give the man assistance.
Kneeling on someone’s neck is ridiculously cruel and unusual. Already handcuffed he might have just sat on him.
Shut up dessertrunner you’re a bigger idiot than this cement head.
You need to watch the footage again.Quote:
Originally Posted by nightmarefishThe word chokehold is overused. Anytime an officer gets close to someone’s neck retards like you start calling it a chokehold, it’s ridiculous. Floyd had 3-4 cops on him which makes it hard as fuck to breathe, I don’t care who you are. If you don’t believe me, have 4 of your friends lay on you without being anywhere around your neck and try to get up, you will start breathing heavily almost instantly. Problem is, Floyd was panicking and having trouble breathing well before they got on top of him so shit compounded. Watch the tape ffs, he wouldn’t let them put him in the cop car so they put him on the ground, is that part even disputable? I’d be willing to bet Chauvin had used that same kneel 100s of times to keep someone on the ground with the suspects not ever having in medical reaction. I don’t know for sure, but it was probably something he learned In training or close to it.Quote:
Originally Posted by limitles
The cops did nothing wrong up to the point where they didn’t recognize Floyd was in trouble and give the man assistance.
He was pretty much in the Police vehicle when Chauvin and his partner arrived. And Chauvin pulled him out of the opposite door to which he was being loaded. He was dragged from one side of the vehicle and came out the other door.... must have been in the vehicle at some point.
They had minor issues really. The two cops could have got him in the vehicle. When the two back-up cops arrived it should have been straightforward getting him loaded.
Quote:
Originally Posted by desertrunnerYou should actually watch the first part of the video where he physically resisted arrest. Open up your liberal mind and see the whole picture.Quote:
Originally Posted by limitles
So what if he was resisting?... shut the door and take him to the station.
george floyd is dead because he was being a trainwreck while being arrested. could easily happen to me in 5-10 years and i am not black, case closed
Please understand that all of the police training youve received while watching TV and the movies is not like real life. What you see on the nicely edited screen is not how it really works.Quote:
Originally Posted by Salty_AusQuote:
Originally Posted by desertrunner
So what if he was resisting?... shut the door and take him to the station.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QnLnR0XtLIMQuote:
Originally Posted by Salty_AusYou need to watch the footage again.Quote:
Originally Posted by nightmarefish
He was pretty much in the Police vehicle when Chauvin and his partner arrived. And Chauvin pulled him out of the opposite door to which he was being loaded. He was dragged from one side of the vehicle and came out the other door.... must have been in the vehicle at some point.
They had minor issues really. The two cops could have got him in the vehicle. When the two back-up cops arrived it should have been straightforward getting him loaded.
Here's the body camera. They tell him to get in the car and he won't. He says he can't breathe and is claustrophobic so they try to force him in and he freaks the fuck out. You're saying they still should have forced him in that little ass backseat when he was freaking out saying he couldn't breathe? Surely not, that's why they pulled him out and put him on the ground waiting for medical support.
That is very sad. Gun pointed almost immediately. He's having a panic attack.Quote:
Originally Posted by nightmarefishhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QnLnR0XtLIMQuote:
Originally Posted by Salty_Aus
Here's the body camera. They tell him to get in the car and he won't. He says he can't breathe and is claustrophobic so they try to force him in and he freaks the fuck out. You're saying they still should have forced him in that little ass backseat when he was freaking out saying he couldn't breathe? Surely not, that's why they pulled him out and put him on the ground waiting for medical support.
If you've never had panic attack you're lucky. He also knows at best he's going to jail for at least 8 hours on suspicion of a non violent crime.
Kneeling on the neck. You get away with it if you're a cop and the apprehended does not die.
No reason for it at all. Defending that is what defines you as an idiot
btw, what a coincidence that this poor bastard succumbed to "overdose" after having his neck keeled for several minutes. What are the odds? Overdose is recognized by a number physical conditions, none of which include begging to breathe. If you are overdosed on opiates you are out. You're not talking at all.
We mostly agree, kill yourself for lack of reading comprehension.Quote:
Originally Posted by limitlesThat is very sad. Gun pointed almost immediately. He's having a panic attack.Quote:
Originally Posted by nightmarefish
If you've never had panic attack you're lucky. He also knows at best he's going to jail for at least 8 hours on suspicion of a non violent crime.
Kneeling on the neck. You get away with it if you're a cop and the apprehended does not die.
No reason for it at all. Defending that is what defines you as an idiot
"Up to the point where the dude kneels on his neck I don’t think the cops did anything wrong."
The disagreement is, I believe the cop's actions were reasonable up to the point of him kneeling on his neck and then not helping him when he was in trouble. See previous post above you literal retard.
The difference is, your dipshit friend Salty thinks they should still have forced a panicking, high man that was claiming he couldn't breathe into the beck a cop car.
Salty "They had minor issues really. The two cops could have got him in the vehicle. When the two back-up cops arrived it should have been straightforward getting him loaded."
No, I disagree. The cops are not having a panic attack. They know full well that transporting that man in that car will not result in death. Once in the back seat, close door, case closed. He will not die from his fears.Quote:
Originally Posted by nightmarefishWe mostly agree, kill yourself for lack of reading comprehension.Quote:
Originally Posted by limitles
"Up to the point where the dude kneels on his neck I don’t think the cops did anything wrong."
The disagreement is, I believe the cop's actions were reasonable up to the point of him kneeling on his neck and then not helping him when he was in trouble. See previous post above you literal retard.
The difference is, your dipshit friend Salty thinks they should still have forced a panicking, high man that was claiming he couldn't breathe into the beck a cop car.
Salty "They had minor issues really. The two cops could have got him in the vehicle. When the two back-up cops arrived it should have been straightforward getting him loaded."
This was wildfire. Even when they decide on another form of transport the neck kneeling is bizarre, insane, cruel and criminal.
So you agree with Salty that if someone is having a panic attack, high on drugs, claiming to be claustrophobic and claiming they can’t breathe that cops should still force them into the back of a cop car? I’m saying if anyone is claiming they are having trouble breathing the cops should take it seriously. Think if they forced him back there and he did died in the cop car. All the reporting would be about how could the cops ignore a man saying he couldn’t breathe and force him into that tiny backseat.Quote:
Originally Posted by limitlesNo, I disagree. The cops are not having a panic attack. They know full well that transporting that man in that car will not result in death. Once in the back seat, close door, case closed. He will not die from his fears.Quote:
Originally Posted by nightmarefish
We mostly agree, kill yourself for lack of reading comprehension.
"Up to the point where the dude kneels on his neck I don’t think the cops did anything wrong."
The disagreement is, I believe the cop's actions were reasonable up to the point of him kneeling on his neck and then not helping him when he was in trouble. See previous post above you literal retard.
The difference is, your dipshit friend Salty thinks they should still have forced a panicking, high man that was claiming he couldn't breathe into the beck a cop car.
Salty "They had minor issues really. The two cops could have got him in the vehicle. When the two back-up cops arrived it should have been straightforward getting him loaded."
This was wildfire. Even if when they decide on another form of transport the neck kneeling is bizarre, insane, cruel and criminal.
I’m sure when they put him on the ground they didn’t think what they were doing would result in death either. Are you claiming they thought they might kill him but were like who cares? They were waiting for an ambulance to help him for ffs.
The lack of recognizing the man was in serious trouble is the biggest failure here by miles.
Yes. Panic attacks are very real for the suffering but they are not real. Once approached this man did nothing that I could see as aggressive towards law enforcement.Quote:
Originally Posted by nightmarefishSo you agree with Salty that if someone is having a panic attack, high on drugs, claiming to be claustrophobic and claiming they can’t breathe that cops should still force them into the back of a cop car? I’m saying if anyone is claiming they are having trouble breathing the cops should take it seriously. Think if they forced him back there and he did died in the cop car. All the reporting would be about how could the cops ignore a man saying he couldn’t breathe and force him into that tiny backseat.Quote:
Originally Posted by limitles
I’m sure when they put him on the ground they didn’t think what they were doing would result in death either. Are you claiming they thought they might kill him but were like who cares? They were waiting for an ambulance to help him for ffs.
The lack of recognizing the man was in serious trouble is the biggest failure here by miles.
You know what the back of a cop car is like. Add handcuffs. It's over. Why this man required full body weight/air supply restriction is the question. I don't know about you but when someone begs for anything I take it into consideration
The cops have no threat on their hands whatsoever. Nobody armed. Nothing. Only a suspicion of a crime.
Interestingly enough the gun is drawn very quickly. Have you been pulled over? I have and no guns have been drawn.
They were on top of him because he was freaking out and they were in the street, watch the end of the body camera footage. Once again, they obviously shouldn’t have stayed on him when he was in trouble, begging and saying he couldn’t breathe. You continue bringing this up when no one is arguing about that. I believe the weight of the 3-4 guys on him contributed to him not being able to breathe even more than the knee. When someone says they can’t breathe the answer isn’t to pile on them for 8 minutes. That’s why I say this is similar to Eric Garner in that all the attention is on the knee/chokehold ( I don’t think it was a real chokehold) but no one talks about several people laying on top of someone that can’t breathe.Quote:
Originally Posted by limitlesYes. Panic attacks are very real for the suffering but they are not real. Once approached this man did nothing that I could see as aggressive towards law enforcement.Quote:
Originally Posted by nightmarefish
You know what the back of a cop car is like. Add handcuffs. It's over. Why this man required full body weight/air supply restriction is the question. I don't know about you but when someone begs for anything I take it into consideration
The cops have no threat on their hands whatsoever. Nobody armed. Nothing. Only a suspicion of a crime.
Interestingly enough the gun is drawn very quickly. Have you been pulled over? I have and no guns have been drawn.
Freaking out is not an unknown to cops. That's almost a given. That's why they are there.Quote:
Originally Posted by nightmarefishThey were on top of him because he was freaking out and they were in the street, watch the end of the body camera footage. Once again, they obviously shouldn’t have stayed on him when he was in trouble, begging and saying he couldn’t breathe. You continue bringing this up when no one is arguing about that. I believe the weight of the 3-4 guys on him contributed to him not being able to breathe even more than the knee. When someone says they can’t breathe the answer isn’t to pile on them for 8 minutes. That’s why I say this is similar to Eric Garner in that all the attention is on the knee/chokehold ( I don’t think it was a real chokehold) but no one talks about several people laying on top of someone that can’t breathe.Quote:
Originally Posted by limitles
There is no justification for the neck kneel. A suspicion of a non violent crime results in death?
From minute one the guy is asking not to be shot
https://youtu.be/tRgcwT9X2J8
https://youtu.be/SI6UuwQtcUE?list=RDEMCTnJYs2gr-Tju_TJe8OoOA
The sad part of this site is the fact I would never ever react/encounter with such people.
You, the united states are a sad population, meaning the majority
https://youtu.be/gwwV0xE70Ks
https://youtu.be/UMfCUvIK3V8
Fucking hilarious how folks here are trying to justify that pulling him out of the vehicle had anything to do with his well-being.Quote:
Originally Posted by limitlesYes. Panic attacks are very real for the suffering but they are not real. Once approached this man did nothing that I could see as aggressive towards law enforcement.Quote:
Originally Posted by nightmarefish
You know what the back of a cop car is like. Add handcuffs. It's over. Why this man required full body weight/air supply restriction is the question. I don't know about you but when someone begs for anything I take it into consideration
The cops have no threat on their hands whatsoever. Nobody armed. Nothing. Only a suspicion of a crime.
Interestingly enough the gun is drawn very quickly. Have you been pulled over? I have and no guns have been drawn.
You pull a guy across the back seat and jump on his back and kneel on his neck because you want to help him.... into traffic on the road too.
Such compassionate, helpful coppers.