Confederate Flag controversy

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Originally Posted by Krypt

Can anyone here imagine a wealthy family with CLASS repping that obnoxious flag? The answer to that question is a resounding NO

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To be fair up until 2-3 years ago Ole Miss had "The Rebel" as the school mascot and that school is where all the 1%ers go in that state. It wasn't hard to see confederate flags or colors at an ole Miss game.

That said they did get ahead of the issue and changed the symbol to a bear or some shit.

The flag was designed as a symbol of racism:
http://mic.com/articles/121082/here-...ho-designed-it

golds gym got the worst of it

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Originally Posted by Tom

You can say slavery caused it, sure but it wasn't so much the slavery as much as the right to not allow the Union to tell them how to live.

The Union did not fight to free slaves but rather keep the Union together, slaves being set free was a biproduct.

So while you can say they did it to set slaves free it would be more accurate to say it was to force their will upon the South.

Not defending slavery at all, glad they lost of course but just trying to be more accurate.

Look at it this way, if the South said we like to eat our chunky soup with a spoon and the North said no you need to eat it with a fork. I very much doubt the North cared all that much about why they fought, more about using it as a reason to fight. The truth is the North had slaves too but because of failing industry after the war of independence they lost the taste for it because they didn't need it as much. The South got cotton gin and bang they still needed it.

Taking a moral high horse on an issue you once abused yourself simply because you don't need it anymore is a joke.

Didn't Bush want to free a bunch of people years ago, wasn't that a reason to go to war?

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Bush went to war because Iraq had WMDs (which they didn't have). It's ok if your civil war history is garbage, which it is, but the Iraq war was in your lifetime. Please consider taking your head out of your ass.

It is clear to me you missed my point, I know they didn't have WMD's. My point was Bush used an excuse to go to war to get what "he" wanted.
The Union used a real issue, yes but my point was any excuse and the South gave them one but could have easily have been over how to eat soup.

You will find most people outside of the USofA seem to recall history from around the world differently.

Did you know the US beat the English as well and Canada doesn't exist! Just ask a New Yorker who won in 1812.

SS is right, that flag of course wasn't even the official flag of the confederacy. It was designed by a white supremacist to perpetuate white supremacy, if not slavery.....it was reflown in SC in reaction to the civil rights movement in 1962......racism runs deep in the South.....have posted about this, the reps southern strategy changed white southerners from dems to reps.....taking that down won't change much but is a step in the right direction.....

I think Reno nailed it. ^
Boy, I must have missed what ever sparked this debate recently.
Has it really been that slow of a news week? There really is no issue.

For the record, Charleston is like one of the nicest cities ive ever been to in the South. Really beautiful homes, beaches, and tennis/golf resorts. The people were really friendly and I didnt see any outward racism towards black people where I was staying. We rented out a beach home for a month in the Isle of Palms resort. Would really advise people to check it out if youre looking for a chill spot.

The house was literally right on the beach:

http://i.imgur.com/JMqIVh5.jpg

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Originally Posted by Tom

It is the lie we have been fed, the war started because the lower States did not want the man in their business, period no matter what it was. As mentioned slavery was perhaps one of those things but not the main or only reason, sorry.

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Maybe Tom clarifies or amends this statement later in the thread. Regardless, the problem with his analysis is that it is incorrect. Slavery was absolutely THE reason the civil war occurred. Not emancipation certainly (a by-product of the war and the Union victory) but to keep slavery legal and therefore, in the minds of southerners, protect the southern slave-dependent economy.

Slavery dominated the national debate basically from the Louisiana Purchase forward until Lincoln's election in 1860. Lincoln was elected on Nov 6th and South Carolina voted to secede on Dec 20th, and it wasn't because they didn't want "the man" in their business. It was because the wrongfully believed Lincoln was an abolitionist who would destroy the south's way of life.

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Originally Posted by tony bagadonuts

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Originally Posted by Tom

It is the lie we have been fed, the war started because the lower States did not want the man in their business, period no matter what it was. As mentioned slavery was perhaps one of those things but not the main or only reason, sorry.

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Maybe Tom clarifies or amends this statement later in the thread. Regardless, the problem with his analysis is that it is incorrect. Slavery was absolutely THE reason the civil war occurred. Not emancipation certainly (a by-product of the war and the Union victory) but to keep slavery legal and therefore, in the minds of southerners, protect the southern slave-dependent economy.

Slavery dominated the national debate basically from the Louisiana Purchase forward until Lincoln's election in 1860. Lincoln was elected on Nov 6th and South Carolina voted to secede on Dec 20th, and it wasn't because they didn't want "the man" in their business. It was because the wrongfully believed Lincoln was an abolitionist who would destroy the south's way of life.

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poteto potato

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Originally Posted by tony bagadonuts

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Tom

It is the lie we have been fed, the war started because the lower States did not want the man in their business, period no matter what it was. As mentioned slavery was perhaps one of those things but not the main or only reason, sorry.

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Maybe Tom clarifies or amends this statement later in the thread. Regardless, the problem with his analysis is that it is incorrect. Slavery was absolutely THE reason the civil war occurred. Not emancipation certainly (a by-product of the war and the Union victory) but to keep slavery legal and therefore, in the minds of southerners, protect the southern slave-dependent economy.

Slavery dominated the national debate basically from the Louisiana Purchase forward until Lincoln's election in 1860. Lincoln was elected on Nov 6th and South Carolina voted to secede on Dec 20th, and it wasn't because they didn't want "the man" in their business. It was because the wrongfully believed Lincoln was an abolitionist who would destroy the south's way of life.

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My family fought under Sherman to keep the Union whole, not for human rights issues. I'm glad it all worked out because the argument had existed since the days of the Revolution and was a sticking point of the southern States to agree to the rebellion in the first place. Just to be clear, I don't see any reason for that flag to fly anywhere but in a museum.

so 9 people get basically executed at point blank range in a vicious rampage style shooting spree

and the hottest talking point and discussion in the news is about a stupid fucking flag

this country deserves to get invaded and/or bitchslapped

bunch of spineless. politically correct pussies with their heads up their asses

I am giving less and less of a fuck lately

just gonna grab a cocktail, my lawn-chair and a fat spleef....kick back, and watch the entire clusterfuck implode

the next 20 years or so should be awesome watching this previously great country crash and burn

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Originally Posted by Tyde

so 9 people get basically executed at point blank range in a vicious rampage style shooting spree

and the hottest talking point and discussion in the news is about a stupid fucking flag

this country deserves to get invaded and/or bitchslapped

bunch of spineless. politically correct pussies with their heads up their asses

I am giving less and less of a fuck lately

just gonna grab a cocktail, my lawn-chair and a fat spleef....kick back, and watch the entire clusterfuck implode

the next 20 years or so should be awesome watching this previously great country crash and burn

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This is all true and correct.

This idiotic confederate flag debate is the biggest red herring that I can remember. The right doesn't want to talk about guns and the left is all over shit like statues being spray painted.

Any 'heritage, not hate' argument has been dead for years, and anyone with a moderately functioning brain knows that people who fly it are either unapologetic racists or inbred white trash who don't know better.

I like Charleston but it's a comically racist city. Great fun though, partying in the downtown market area where slaves were bought/sold.

Should the Confederate Flag be banned? No, let people be racist assholes if they want to.
Should the Confederate Flag be banned from government buildings? Yes, dear god yes. Are you fucking insane?

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Originally Posted by Tom

The Union used a real issue, yes but my point was any excuse and the South gave them one but could have easily have been over how to eat soup.

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Indeed, countries often split on the issue of how to eat soup, which is JUST as important as whether human beings are human beings, or just property.

You know who thinks the war was about slaves? The slaves. Also, the slave owners. Also, those opposing slavery.


"They're trying to tell us how to live (with respect to slavery)!!!"

"They are trying to tell us what to do (on the issue of whether we can own dark skins as if they weren't even human and make them work for us for no pay, no rights, and we can pretty much do whatever we want with them)!"

https://www.google.com/search?q=kany...ed=0CAgQ_AUoAw