Female teacher gets 13 years in prison for having sex with 17-year-old male student

[Dan Druff]

There has long been a debate as to whether or not female teachers having sex with male students should receive the same penalty as male teachers who have sex with female students.

Up until about 20 years ago, you almost never heard about female teachers being arrested for having sex with male students. I'm sure it happened, but it probably wasn't taken seriously or pursued by law enforcement unless the boy was very young.

However, in the past 2 decades, we've seen numerous stories of female teachers arrested and charged for having sexual relationships with male teen students in their class. In most cases they tend to be white women under 35, and usually married. Which is weird. Actually the whole thing is weird.

Anyway, the case of 30-year-old Heather Hare is getting attention in the media because of her unusually harsh sentence.




Heather Hare taught high school in Arkansas. She met a 17-year-old boy in one of the classes she taught, gave him "one-on-one counseling sessions", and you can imagine where it went from there. The two of them had sex numerous times, estimated to be about 20-30, during the 2021-22 school year.

Unfortunately for Hare, she also had sex with the boy during a class trip to Washington DC, which got the feds involved, since it became a matter of crossing state lines to do so. Had she confined the sex to Arkansas, only local authorities would have dealt with it, and she would have likely received a lighter sentence.

Here's an article about her guilty plea from a local station in Arkansas: https://katv.com/news/nation-world/f...room-education

Here's the press release from the DOJ: https://www.justice.gov/usao-edar/pr...transportation

Because this is a federal offense, she will have to serve most of her sentence.


The question is... was this sentence too harsh?

My opinion is YES, it was far too harsh.

There are various reasons for this:

1) The age of consent in Arkansas is 16! The only reason this was illegal was because he was a student of hers, causing the age of consent to be 18 in such a situation.

2) As of the early 2010s, the CDC reported that the average age for male loss of virginity was 17.0 years. While it's true that there was a substantial age (30/17) and status (teacher/student) difference here, you can't really make the case that this was "rape", nor that the experience was likely to have traumatized the boy.

3) There is zero chance that any form of physical coercion occurred, as can happen when it's an adult male with a teen female. Some teen females have reported to have consented to sex with adult males because they were afraid of what would happen if they said no. Clearly this boy was not scared of physical consequences of saying no, and there's no indication that he was doing this out of fear of any other consequence.



I do think the teacher should get some jail time because she had sex with a student. But it shouldn't be 13 years. If she had sex with a random 17-year-old she met on the street, it would have been legal!

Opinions?

[FRANKRIZZO]

Looks like a meth head I remember Pamela Smart was hot back in the day

[gut]

WTF is "family consumer science"?

EDIT: googled and apparently the new name for Home Economics. They threw the word science in there since that doesn't mean anything anymore.

[Sloppy Joe]

Ban that lady from the classroom, otherwise who cares.

Aside from mickeycrimm everyone here is a red blooded male who had some teacher in their school they fantasized over. Would bet that she didn't fuck the quarterback and probably gave some dweeb the time of his life.

Provided she didn't stalk or mentally coerce this guy, we all know there's no victim here. Some guy who probably wasn't getting pussy had an experience that made him feel like king of the school.

[Orko]

ThAT'S AN OUTRAGEOUS SENTENCE! I have a funny feeling race may be the reason for the stiff sentence.
Discrimination against white people is the default in corporate and all branches of govt.
It's everywhere.

Embedded Tweet

https://twitter.com/AuronMacintyre/status/1788594607233638465

I wonder how the "kid" feels, I bet he feels like shit. The sentence will have a serious neg impact on the victim. A decade long guilt trip.

[Jayjami]

Opinions?

She should seek a job from the governor.

Sarah Huckabee Sanders appoints man who had sex with a minor to top state post

https://www.reddit.com/r/Arkansas/co...n_who_had_sex/

[Ryback_feed_me_more]

There has long been a debate as to whether or not female teachers having sex with male students should receive the same penalty as male teachers who have sex with female students.

Up until about 20 years ago, you almost never heard about female teachers being arrested for having sex with male students. I'm sure it happened, but it probably wasn't taken seriously or pursued by law enforcement unless the boy was very young.

However, in the past 2 decades, we've seen numerous stories of female teachers arrested and charged for having sexual relationships with male teen students in their class. In most cases they tend to be white women under 35, and usually married. Which is weird. Actually the whole thing is weird.

Anyway, the case of 30-year-old Heather Hare is getting attention in the media because of her unusually harsh sentence.




Heather Hare taught high school in Arkansas. She met a 17-year-old boy in one of the classes she taught, gave him "one-on-one counseling sessions", and you can imagine where it went from there. The two of them had sex numerous times, estimated to be about 20-30, during the 2021-22 school year.

Unfortunately for Hare, she also had sex with the boy during a class trip to Washington DC, which got the feds involved, since it became a matter of crossing state lines to do so. Had she confined the sex to Arkansas, only local authorities would have dealt with it, and she would have likely received a lighter sentence.

Here's an article about her guilty plea from a local station in Arkansas: https://katv.com/news/nation-world/f...room-education

Here's the press release from the DOJ: https://www.justice.gov/usao-edar/pr...transportation

Because this is a federal offense, she will have to serve most of her sentence.


The question is... was this sentence too harsh?

My opinion is YES, it was far too harsh.

There are various reasons for this:

1) The age of consent in Arkansas is 16! The only reason this was illegal was because he was a student of hers, causing the age of consent to be 18 in such a situation.

2) As of the early 2010s, the CDC reported that the average age for male loss of virginity was 17.0 years. While it's true that there was a substantial age (30/17) and status (teacher/student) difference here, you can't really make the case that this was "rape", nor that the experience was likely to have traumatized the boy.

3) There is zero chance that any form of physical coercion occurred, as can happen when it's an adult male with a teen female. Some teen females have reported to have consented to sex with adult males because they were afraid of what would happen if they said no. Clearly this boy was not scared of physical consequences of saying no, and there's no indication that he was doing this out of fear of any other consequence.



I do think the teacher should get some jail time because she had sex with a student. But it shouldn't be 13 years. If she had sex with a random 17-year-old she met on the street, it would have been legal!

Opinions?

Is it me or did we just miss it. I don’t recall any teachers were this hot when we were in school. Only teacher I thought was doable was my 9th grade math teacher for Algebra the rest were as old if not older then my parents.

[Dan Druff]

Yeah, all of my teachers were older. Male and female.

Of the females, maybe 2 of them were in their 30s, but none were hot. Like, okay for their age, but nothing which would attract the attention of a teen boy. I can safely say that I never once had a crush on a teacher.

[BetCheckBet]

Matt Gaetz much worse and gets off free cause he’s connected.

[BCR]

Yeah, all of my teachers were older. Male and female.

Of the females, maybe 2 of them were in their 30s, but none were hot. Like, okay for their age, but nothing which would attract the attention of a teen boy. I can safely say that I never once had a crush on a teacher.

Teaching was a much better profession when they actually could afford food and shelter on their salary. One of my closest friends and his wife always wanted to be teachers. He went straight from school to teaching in Vegas. He was winning awards for Clarke County by his second year. Kids who are now 40 still send him Facebook requests and thank yous and say he was their favorite teacher.

They could barely eat before they started having kids.

Once they had a few kids, he had to go get a job that pays well. A successful teacher has a skillset. Smart, communicates well, presents information well, is charismatic enough to hold the attention of their audience. All those skills translate very well into the private sector, and you have to make a choice of, at that time, making like $30k in your fifth year or immediately $150k in business. Pretty much all the good young teachers he started with eventually left. His wife mostly stayed at home and kept adding degrees until the kids were older teenagers, and went in directly at the college level, but still grossly underpaid given her education. His last kid has a year left in grad school and he’s thought about going back teaching to end his career just because he loved it. I doubt he will though because with the cost of everything, his kids are still to a degree financially reliant on him early in their careers.

Those are the type of teachers we had. Teachers who could have a home and not send their kids to a shit school and save a few $ for retirement. That doesn’t really exist much even in the good districts or private.

I think this phenomenon is like 3 fold. First it happened back when we were young and people were less litigious. More likely to get a high five from dad at 17 than make a thing of it. But there wasn’t as many hot teachers either, so it didn’t happen often. When it did, there wasn’t a digital trail for some prosecutor.


Second.

That there are a lot of hot young married teachers makes sense as they’re attractive enough to find husbands with a real job that can actually pay bills. A guy who may have been willing to run a few red flags as the girl was hot. That profession is only good as a secondary income, and barely that if you have to pay day care.

Third, it’s impossible to not notice the phenomenon of how slow young adults mature. I feel like 24 year olds are what we were at 14. Thirty year olds feel 20. Just very little practical social and real world experience growing up on devices.

I think if you put some kind of pretty and generally sheltered late 20s/early 30s girl in a class in a high school, they still on some level, feel a peer psychologically with their students.

When you made your post about NWP 20 years, I recalled that time and how I lurked for close to 2 years. It just felt too heavily skewed to kids from dorm rooms playing for me. I was married and felt at a much different stage of life in my early 30s. It wasn’t until you posted a lot, and there became a group of older posters nearing 30 that you could have a good conversation with did I join. I kind of felt like San with his discord sports betting groups. I found the kids smart, highly amusing, but I didn’t feel peers with kids a decade younger.

Now I meet kids in their early 30s and they all think they are 20.

Not all kids. I meet kids I think are great and impress the hell out of me and I wonder how they dodged the pitfalls of their time and became a far more mature young adult than I was. It’s generally really good parenting. Not just intact and smart parents, but ones smart enough to let them take some lumps growing up with the long game in mind.


They don’t often report the victim's name, but if you dig, it’s been kind of the same formula. Some hot white teacher marries a kind of nerdy guy with a good job, and then falls for a troubled or bad boy because they never went through that stage like many girls did by 18 and grew out of. Kids from bad backgrounds and they want to save them and then they are fucking them a month later. The kids are probably more streetwise than these sheltered teachers often. They wouldn’t be getting caught if the student didn’t eventually hang them out to dry to other teens and parents. At some point the kid faces repercussions from parents or whatever and gives them up. The teacher is in love because she’s mentally a child willing to flush her life like a teenage girl.

[BetCheckBet]

IMO biggest reason for this increase is social media/cellhphones. In the past teachers might have had thoughts but it was much harder to act on (impulse control not as much of an issue). Now you have all sorts of sketchy stuff with teachers staying in contact with students by social media. Secondly because they stay in touch this way it allows for a much easier paper-train for prosecution whereas in the past it would be harder to prove.

Its also amazing how many school boards don;t have clear policies on teachers follow students social media

[Dan Druff]

I liked both of the above posts.

BCR's reasons are very good for the increase in this. Yes, there are probably more young teachers now than there used to be, as well as ones who are doing it as a secondary income and married to a rich guy they're not really that into. And yes, a lot of 20s adults today are in a form of extended adolescence. I think you're right that these women feel they can relate to teens a lot better than young adults could back in the '80s and '90s. The "starting off wanting to help and it turns sexual" is probably exactly what happened here, and probably what happens in a lot of these cases. Unlike the male teachers who molest teens, I don't think it's purely sexual from the standpoint of the female teachers. I think the female teachers actually have some sort of emotional attachment to the boys they molest -- as strange as that sounds.

If you guys remember, the UB cheating may have started because of a female teacher having sex with a 16-year-old. Greg Pierson, who was a UB co-owner and in charge of site security, got the bad news that his wife was arrested for banging a 16-year-old student. Instead of filing for divorce and throwing her the fuck out, he stood by her and paid for her legal defense. The timing of the cheating on UB nearly exactly matched when Pierson had a need for legal funding.



Betcheckbet also brought up a great point. I hadn't thought of it, but the texting and social media era makes it FAR easier for teachers to groom teen students. Rather than having to find the time to be alone with them during school (and risk getting caught), the teachers can simply text the students, supposedly expressing "concern" for their well being. Then as the conversations get more comfortable, the sexual stuff can be worked in. Way way way easier to do it that way than having to get the student alone in the classroom during lunch or after school. Totally makes sense why we've seen an increase here.

I think the female teachers can also do this more easily than the male ones, without as much suspicion. When an adult male texts a teen girl, she is likely to be alarmed and concerned, even if the guy feigns helpfulness. But an adult female texting a teen boy doesn't create the same concern, and in fact the boy may be excited by it.



The shocking thing to me is that the women don't see the eventual end to all of these things. It's not like the dudes who are driven by some kind of extreme perversion to where they throw caution to the wind. You'd think the women would stop themselves before letting it get there, knowing what they have to lose. But they don't.

[Texter]

Teachers here make good money starting out, sons friend is getting paid over $80k and this will be his first year.

[hardeight]

I liked both of the above posts.

BCR's reasons are very good for the increase in this. Yes, there are probably more young teachers now than there used to be, as well as ones who are doing it as a secondary income and married to a rich guy they're not really that into. And yes, a lot of 20s adults today are in a form of extended adolescence. I think you're right that these women feel they can relate to teens a lot better than young adults could back in the '80s and '90s. The "starting off wanting to help and it turns sexual" is probably exactly what happened here, and probably what happens in a lot of these cases. Unlike the male teachers who molest teens, I don't think it's purely sexual from the standpoint of the female teachers. I think the female teachers actually have some sort of emotional attachment to the boys they molest -- as strange as that sounds.

If you guys remember, the UB cheating may have started because of a female teacher having sex with a 16-year-old. Greg Pierson, who was a UB co-owner and in charge of site security, got the bad news that his wife was arrested for banging a 16-year-old student. Instead of filing for divorce and throwing her the fuck out, he stood by her and paid for her legal defense. The timing of the cheating on UB nearly exactly matched when Pierson had a need for legal funding.



Betcheckbet also brought up a great point. I hadn't thought of it, but the texting and social media era makes it FAR easier for teachers to groom teen students. Rather than having to find the time to be alone with them during school (and risk getting caught), the teachers can simply text the students, supposedly expressing "concern" for their well being. Then as the conversations get more comfortable, the sexual stuff can be worked in. Way way way easier to do it that way than having to get the student alone in the classroom during lunch or after school. Totally makes sense why we've seen an increase here.

I think the female teachers can also do this more easily than the male ones, without as much suspicion. When an adult male texts a teen girl, she is likely to be alarmed and concerned, even if the guy feigns helpfulness. But an adult female texting a teen boy doesn't create the same concern, and in fact the boy may be excited by it.



The shocking thing to me is that the women don't see the eventual end to all of these things. It's not like the dudes who are driven by some kind of extreme perversion to where they throw caution to the wind. You'd think the women would stop themselves before letting it get there, knowing what they have to lose. But they don't.

if the pentaly for such actions was death? Do you think it would mostly stop?

[BCR]

Teachers here make good money starting out, sons friend is getting paid over $80k and this will be his first year.

That’s basically the top of the range in the whole country. First year teachers make $39k-$85k national, and I assume the $80k was super high cost of living states. I guess teachers should be flocking to Texas given it isn’t that expensive to live.Makes sense it’s growing, but Vegas was growing huge at that time and they didn’t pay shit.

I’ve never heard of a teacher starting that high unless they were a specialty teacher for special needs. That’s usually 20 year tenured scale salary. If he’s bilingual I can see that might get a desired gig in Texas.

[BetCheckBet]

I liked both of the above posts.


The shocking thing to me is that the women don't see the eventual end to all of these things. It's not like the dudes who are driven by some kind of extreme perversion to where they throw caution to the wind. You'd think the women would stop themselves before letting it get there, knowing what they have to lose. But they don't.

As a male working in the field I have zero shock about this. Males are absolutely paranoid about doing anything inappropriate which could result in sexual accusations. Hell I knew a psychologist who refused to call his clients by their first names just to assert proper boundaries. I wouldn't go that far but I'm sure as hell not hugging a client which the majority of female workers see nothing wrong with it. Women are just not viewed as predators and don't have the same boundary concerns that males do. That doesn;t mean that they offend at a higher rate but they certainly put themselves in riskier situations to offend without a doubt. When I worked with teenage girls I had a job that required me to transport clients 1-1. My supervisor said I should have an audio recorder in the car. While nothing bad happened I eventually decided to stop transporting them because it was too high of a risk for me. Ask women doing the same work and their concerns are much more for their own safety or being victimized. Women haven't been socialized as a whole to recognize how they can be perpetrators.

[BetCheckBet]

Last thing that I will say on the issue is that while there are definitely some serial predators out there... the majority of issues involving sexual stuff does not start with the person purposely targeting the victim. They tend to start with small boundary violations like working late alone with client, fantasizing about them, giving special treatment or attention, inappropriate personal disclosures (like complaining about spouse of family life), blurred personal and professional lines etc. which eventually lead to more serious stuff if not addressed.

[Orko]

Women predators are so exceedingly rare, there should def be a double standard as far as the law's concerned.
Has there ever been a women that molested kids like Epstein or that one weirdo fr Britain, Jimmy Saville.

I seriously doubt it, not even close.
It's not the same, dude's have a dif mentality than girls. There should def be a double standard.
That'll never happen but it should.

[Dan Druff]

Regarding why most of them are married, I have my theory on that, beyond what BCR already pointed out.

Young, attractive, single women have all the options in the world. They are constantly hit on by dudes wherever they go. If they go on a dating site, they get thousands of messages. They never have to feel lonely, if they don't want to. And if they want good sex, they can always find it.

Married women are a different story. They can't go on dating sites without risking being seen by one of her husband's friends or acquaintances. They can't just take off and go to bars or other singles spaces without facing a lot of questions and suspicion from their husband. And in some cases, they don't want to do this stuff anyway, and are just trying to tolerate whatever deficiencies exist in their marriage.

So these women are probably more susceptible to considering sex with teen boys, if they find the boys attractive and/or pleasant to be around.


There's an old theory proposed by one of those "pickup artist" types, stating that men can get the best quality women by targeting females who are either married or in a relationship. The theory states that you have to beat hundreds or thousands of other men when you're going after a single woman, but when going after a married/taken woman, you only have to be better than her current partner. Actually makes sense. Something like that might apply here.

[gut]

I also never had a hot teacher who was single, a couple married ones in high school that if they looked like that now around me I would be into, but at that age I was into same-age pussy.

Off the top of my head, I only remember 2 "Ms. ______" teachers ever. One was a high school drama teacher who did have rumors swirling cause she was very....touchy-feely compared to your average teacher. Nothing ever proven.

Other was my 2nd grade teacher who was deaf in one year, so she had to cover that day 1. I learned to never be in a hurry with a q-tip in your ear.

My high school did have a single male spanish teacher who was banging some junior my freshman year. He disappeared from teaching the next year, and she soon disappeared to "alternate" school.