Bitcoins are officially donkdown

[lvpkr1009]

For all intensive purposes, GOX is done regardless of what they do imo.. Ideally they get their shit together and die peacefully but I'm skeptical they will ever "recover".

I think you guys are really missing the boat here between gox problems vs bitcoin problems.

Yes it's a problem for bitcoin that their biggest exchange has lost all control of their bowels, but seriously, did full tilt shitting the bed make poker no longer a game? Gox can suck it but won't "kill" bitcoin by any stretch. Just like FT didn't kill poker.

Bitcoin can do a lot of cool shit and there is absolutely going to be a future for cryptography and better banking/exchange/escrow/law. It's only natural for their to be some major struggles along the way, It's still exceptionally early and clearly btc has a long way to go..

Here are some examples of practical blockchain applications that could be very useful (smartlaw/trusts in particular) -

http://voices.yahoo.com/bitcoin-20-e...ampaign=buffer

Great example.

FullTilt contributed to Black Friday.

Mt Gox will prolly contribute to Black Friday Deux

Full Tilt had cool software.

I guess Bitcoin does too.

Virtual currencies are here to stay, IMO. They just won't be as bublicious. Bitcoin the speculation is much different than Bitcoin for buying K Cups on OverStock.

I have to slightly disagree with you about virtual currencies being her to stay as a viable form of payment for goods and services or even poker. When I go to sleep and there's 100 bucks in my wallet I know when I wake up there will be 100 bucks in my wallet. I know there is ZERO chance that when I wake up I will have any less

[lvpkr1009]

Anyone willing to bet they dip below 100 at some point today....what a joke

Winner winner chicken dinner

Anyone want to bet by Monday you will be looking at 0.00 at Mt Gox

[Sanlmar]

Well, the hour draws nigh. We thought this would happen.

Gunning for $500. Big ugly candles.

2 day 15 min candles


This ain't just Gox. That's noise.

This is about people being under water after weeks of 750-850. Oh the pain.

[IamGreek]

Time to stick a fork in it. They are done

[BUBBLES]

Anyone want to bet by Monday you will be looking at 0.00 at Mt Gox

Do you take Paypal?

[Sanlmar]

$500 ish is my entry for bounce. Just a scalp. So I hope not.

[lvpkr1009]

Time to stick a fork in it. They are done

Is it too late to put Micon in my PFA 2014 death pool

[lvpkr1009]

Anyone want to bet by Monday you will be looking at 0.00 at Mt Gox

Do you take Paypal?

That depends...do you take bitcoin lol

I'm exaggerating a bit of course but I wouldn't be shocked in the least if it happened.

[Dan Druff]

This crash was super-easy to predict, which is why I mentioned it on radio on Sunday.

It was so clear that Gox was going to keep falling in price and highly likely keep stalling, and this was going to erode general public support for bitcoin everywhere else. And keep in mind that Gox hasn't been officially declared broke yet. When that happens, bitcoin will crash even more.

Bitstamp has lost 14-15% in just the last day.

It's not in freefall yet, but it's getting close to happening.

Gox was holding at 110 for a bit while those big buy orders sat there, but once that was breached, I knew a freefall was imminent.

[backdoorb]

Time to stick a fork in it. They are done

Is it too late to put Micon in my PFA 2014 death pool

While he most likely has a lot riding on this, I'm sure Micon took a head shot or two during the run-up.

[Dan Druff]

So I'm going to take a shot at a theory as to what happened to Gox. This is based upon nothing but the available scant evidence in front of us, as well as common sense and my imagination. So don't give me a hard time if this ends up being blatantly incorrect.

================================================== ==============================

In November, bitcoin was spiking up from $200 to $1250,, and the geniuses at MtGox decided they weren't happy just collecting transaction fees for the trades. They were bullish on the future of bitcoin, and decided to get in on the action by buying a lot of the coins themselves. They may have further theorized that doing this would keep propping up the price of bitcoin, thus increasing the return on their previous investment, as well as generating huge buzz for bitcoin itself. This would lead to higher volume trading and more transaction fees. It seemed like a can't-lose strategy to them.

Except bitcoin didn't keep rising past $1250. It crashed to around $600, and then stabilized in the $650-$800 range. In January, it stabilized around $800-$900.

This left Gox cash poor. They sunk nearly all of their cash into bitcoin purchases on the way up, so they were unable to process many cash payments to people selling coins. They were bitcoin-rich but very cash-poor. They didn't want to sell their immense bitcoin holdings at a 25-40% loss, so they held on, believing that the price would eventually spike again, thereby fixing this mess.

While waiting for that to happen, Gox stalled people attempting to get cash for their bitcoins. They figured they would process many of these cash transactions once bitcoin rose above $1250 again, and they could sell some of their bitcoin to pay these people.

They also hoped that, with enough time passing, they would collect enough in transaction fees to pay people. They processed withdrawals slowly -- basically what they could afford -- and waited for the next big bitcoin price spike. Withdrawals of bitcoin to other sites were allowed, because Gox was still bitcoin-rich.

Then transaction malleability happened. Something related to that, or perhaps another hack, allowed many of Gox's bitcoin to be pilfered. By the time they realized what was going on, they came to a terrible realization: Most of their bitcoin were now gone, and now they were in the unenviable position of being BOTH bitcoin-poor and cash-poor. Now they could no longer afford either to cash people out or allow transfers (withdrawals) of bitcoin from Gox, because neither the cash nor the bitcoin existed anymore.

Gox realized there was one and only one way out of this mess. By stopping withdrawals, they figured the price for bitcoin on their site would fall. It would essentially create an artificially-depressed, sheltered submarket for bitcoin. With the price low enough, they could afford to buy back a healthy number of the stolen coins -- enough to re-enable withdrawals and restore public confidence.

They decided to publicly blame this on transaction malleability, which in part was actually true, and stall until the price fell enough to where they could buy a sufficient number of bitcoin. Despite being cash poor, they planned to utilize the other exchanges to generate cash. Basically, they would buy bitcoin on Gox, secretly transfer them over to other exchanges, and sell them for a large profit. Then, they would take that profit and reinvest it into buying more cheap coins, again selling them. Rinse and repeat, until they had enough cash, and then enough bitcoin. At that point, they could enable withdrawals.

Unfortunately, this plan didn't work as well as expected. The price wasn't dropping as quickly as expected. They continued to stall and offer excuses, waiting for the magic moment when they have recovered enough cash and bitcoin, all at the expense of their own users who had trusted them.

Finally, through some market manipulation of their own, they triggered the major crash they were looking for. That's where we sit now -- Bitcoin at $100 on Gox, mid-500s elsewhere, and Gox feeling they are getting closer to their "recovery", at which point their downtime will be blamed on a variety of trumped up and exaggerated security issues.

[uthglitch]

This crash was super-easy to predict, which is why I mentioned it on radio on Sunday.

It was so clear that Gox was going to keep falling in price and highly likely keep stalling, and this was going to erode general public support for bitcoin everywhere else. And keep in mind that Gox hasn't been officially declared broke yet. When that happens, bitcoin will crash even more.

Bitstamp has lost 14-15% in just the last day.

It's not in freefall yet, but it's getting close to happening.

Gox was holding at 110 for a bit while those big buy orders sat there, but once that was breached, I knew a freefall was imminent.

Druff, You know what was even super easier to predict??? Was you just lying in wait for the crash. Creaming in your jew pants for the day that this may happen. With each and every day that passed and bitcoins continued to skyrocket. You became angrier and angrier. Your jealousy is two fold. 1) You couldn't stand to see Bryan make good money while you srtuggle with daily life. 2) You kick yourself for not getting in on the ground floor and missing out on your life one outer. Post after post you kept predicting that the crash was inevitable. Day after day your prayed that your epiphany would come to fruition. If you were involved with bitcoins from the beginning you would be bragging all day long about how much of a genius you were. How you are the super jew who knew all along that this was the one!!! But, you did not and could not pull the trigger. You missed out on millions. This crash would be meaningless because your jew ass would have cashed out long ago. You would have never made it to this point. Your jealousy is so transparent its funny. So pat yourself on the back and enjoy whatever there is to enjoy. YOU MADE NOTHING ON THIS AND THAT'S THE SHAME. Gloating over others misery is fitting to someone like you.

Good day sir. You get nothing.

And the part that we all know that hurts you the most????????--- Bryan is richer than you and that simply eats at your core.

[Dan Druff]

This crash was super-easy to predict, which is why I mentioned it on radio on Sunday.

It was so clear that Gox was going to keep falling in price and highly likely keep stalling, and this was going to erode general public support for bitcoin everywhere else. And keep in mind that Gox hasn't been officially declared broke yet. When that happens, bitcoin will crash even more.

Bitstamp has lost 14-15% in just the last day.

It's not in freefall yet, but it's getting close to happening.

Gox was holding at 110 for a bit while those big buy orders sat there, but once that was breached, I knew a freefall was imminent.

Druff, You know what was even super easier to predict??? Was you just lying in wait for the crash. Creaming in your jew pants for the day that this may happen. With each and every day that passed and bitcoins continued to skyrocket. You became angrier and angrier. Your jealousy is two fold. 1) You couldn't stand to see Bryan make good money while you srtuggle with daily life. 2) You kick yourself for not getting in on the ground floor and missing out on your life one outer. Post after post you kept predicting that the crash was inevitable. Day after day your prayed that your epiphany would come to fruition. If you were involved with bitcoins from the beginning you would be bragging all day long about how much of a genius you were. How you are the super jew who knew all along that this was the one!!! But, you did not and could not pull the trigger. You missed out on millions. This crash would be meaningless because your jew ass would have cashed out long ago. You would have never made it to this point. Your jealousy is so transparent its funny. So pat yourself on the back and enjoy whatever there is to enjoy. YOU MADE NOTHING ON THIS AND THAT'S THE SHAME. Gloating over others misery is fitting to someone like you.

Good day sir. You get nothing.

And the part that we all know that hurts you the most????????--- Bryan is richer than you and that simply eats at your core.

1) I already got my life one-outer in 1971, when I survived what was estimated to be a 95% chance of a miscarriage.

2) I did not miss out on millions, because even if I had hoarded bitcoin early, I would have let them go when they first rose to $250 and started to go down. I also wouldn't have loaded up on tens of thousands of bitcoin in the first place. Sure, if I could have seen the future, I would have invested everything when they were $5 and sold at $1250, but since none of us are psychic, that's not possible. Even the biggest bitcoin proponents in 2011 didn't claim that one day it would be worth $1250. That shocked everyone.

3) I don't care if Micon does or doesn't have money. If he does, great for him. If he doesn't, then I guess he missed out. Either way, unless he's doing something to harm me, I don't care how successful he is or isn't. Now, had DD made millions after I left, yes, I would have been pissed, because I was a huge part of that and sold for peanuts. However, I thumbed my nose at bitcoin even when Micon and I were still friends, so our lack of friendship now has nothing to do with me "missing out" on anything.

4) I said the entire time that I felt bitcoin had no long-term future, and would eventually crash. If there is any gloating going on, it's that my initial assessment is starting to look more correct. I am not rejoicing in anyone's misery. The people who sold or lost their bitcoin when it was $20 are just as miserable as the ones who bought in at $1250 on MtGox and never sold or transferred any off there.

[Dan Druff]

Also, how do I "struggle with daily life"?

I am one of the few poker pros who held onto his winnings.

So I don't see why you think I'm bitter about not investing something I never believed in, still don't believe in, and now seems to be crashing. It's not like I'm sitting here in the poor house and realizing I could have had millions.

[dapokerzombie]

I enjoy PFA and DD equally, both shows offer different entertainment. So my opinion doesnt come from any prior rift But your obsession with bitcoin failing is quite evident. Mt gox is not a main player on the market. They have scammed their customers and like LOCK funds gox bitcoins are unusable. The market IS NOT predictable unless you belong to one of these "flash mob" pro traders which sell you info on when the crash is going to happen. Can you make sum coin on the pumps and dump??? Sure, but it is not a predictable market.

With so much other positive news, like paypal, Winkdex and overstock looking towards bitcoin how can you deny the features of the coin? Crypto currencis are surely measurable needs moving to the future as credit card technology is ancient in comparable terms to the internet.

[bukowski72]

As Requested, I’m Ben Lawsky, Superintendent of the NY Dept of Financial Services, Here for an AMA on Bitcoin/Virtual Currency
http://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comment...endent_of_the/

IAmA full-time Bitcoin day-trader, blogger, and explainer. I was a pro TCG player. Here until Midnight EST. AMA!
http://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comment...r_blogger_and/

IamA Cryptocurrency Trader AMA!
http://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comment...cy_trader_ama/

[Sanlmar]

Suddenly, I'm not half the Bitcoin I used to be.
There's a shadow hanging over me.
Oh, I believe in yesterday

[DRK Star]

http://www.ustream.tv/channel/mtgox-protest

[Salty_Aus]

I'm going to stand by my thoughts.

Mt Gox is pulling a scam, they're either trying to recoup coins they've lost during this malleability issue, and make a substantial profit on top... or it's a long con and the malleability issue was exploited by Gox to steal peoples coins.

There is little to no real cash on Mt Gox and they are scooping up coins from those who are scared in a coordinated effort.

We had 24 hours of buyers hugely outnumbering sellers and the BTC price traded in a tight $10 band, this is simply ludicrous. Followed by the current mayhem for the next 24 hours.
I've noticed when real buys are effected on Mt Gox almost immediately a list of 0.0 orders quickly fill the gap seconds after trades. Whenever they make a buy this is happening. (the purpose of this is to keep the price low)
The orders that push the price down are mostly fake I believe and the real volume is perhaps 10%.

Gox will recover and honour all outstanding balances, then quietly slip away into nothingness and never again be a major player.
Everyone will get paid so nobody will complain.
Those who panicked will feel like idiots for liquidating their coins.... management make millions.

[chinamaniac]

This crash was super-easy to predict, which is why I mentioned it on radio on Sunday.

It was so clear that Gox was going to keep falling in price and highly likely keep stalling, and this was going to erode general public support for bitcoin everywhere else. And keep in mind that Gox hasn't been officially declared broke yet. When that happens, bitcoin will crash even more.

Bitstamp has lost 14-15% in just the last day.

It's not in freefall yet, but it's getting close to happening.

Gox was holding at 110 for a bit while those big buy orders sat there, but once that was breached, I knew a freefall was imminent.

It may be a short crash if this happens but possible it could rise because there will be more demand for coins elsewhere after this. Isnt that what happened when silk road went down