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Thread: ElevenGrover announces UB documentary, Ultimate Beat

  1. #1

    ElevenGrover announces UB documentary, Ultimate Beat



    From QJ, obv

    Scott Bell, better known as ElevenGrover on the poker forums, has been investigating and writing about the Ultimate Bet cheating scandal for many years. In this interview with QuadJacks, he announces that there is a film documentary in the works - "Ultimate Beat."

     
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      Belly Buster: title fix rep
    Last edited by Crowe Diddly; 06-28-2013 at 02:55 PM. Reason: title fix.

  2. #2
    Is there anything about the UB scandal we don't already know? I'm sure Haley some tidbits that will be revealed in her book, but unless she is working on this project (I didn't watch the clip) it seems like it's just going to be a rehashing of everything we already know. I hope he doesn't think that this is going to have an audience beyond serious poker players. Of course, I'll watch it
    I write things about poker at my Poker Blog and elsewhere on the Internets

  3. #3
    Hi Steve,

    My experience is that even the most interested folks have very little understanding of what happened in the UB situation. It is one of the chief reasons they got away with it and also what kept us digging. It is also why most of the participants stand to make even more going forward than they did in the past and that cannot stand.

    For instance, many believe brainwashdodo was some random customer service employee named Zoltan Rozsa who blackmailed the company by pulling accounts with high balances. It wasn't. There is a meme out there that the software was developed by a mysterious engineer not employed by the company. It wasn't. Our goal is to bring the story together in a tight format so the narrative the company wants to live as the official line doesn't actually succeed (right now it is).

    We did a good interview with Druff, much of it focusing on the Travis interviews and the reasons for why Travis showed up when and how he did. I will tease another bit from the film here. Travis revealed to me he can no longer provide information because he has signed a Non-Disclosure Agreement. That is somewhat odd to me, since usually you only sign those when you are given something in return. Of course, his lawyers supposedly took over Sebok's job of hunting for the real killers, so who knows?

    Scott

  4. #4
    Diamond Hockey Guy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve-O View Post
    Is there anything about the UB scandal we don't already know? I'm sure Haley some tidbits that will be revealed in her book, but unless she is working on this project (I didn't watch the clip) it seems like it's just going to be a rehashing of everything we already know. I hope he doesn't think that this is going to have an audience beyond serious poker players. Of course, I'll watch it
    I agree with this to a point but it will be good to get the information into an easier format to understand it all.

    You may have noticed from posting on forums that reading comprehension is surely lacking in a lot of folks online so this will probably be of some benefit to better understand what all went on to those who refuse to read it all in the blogs. If they do it right it will be very beneficial.

    I'll definitely watch it to make sure I didn't miss something.
    (•_•) ..
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  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by elevengrover View Post
    Hi Steve,

    My experience is that even the most interested folks have very little understanding of what happened in the UB situation. It is one of the chief reasons they got away with it and also what kept us digging. It is also why most of the participants stand to make even more going forward than they did in the past and that cannot stand.

    For instance, many believe brainwashdodo was some random customer service employee named Zoltan Rozsa who blackmailed the company by pulling accounts with high balances. It wasn't. There is a meme out there that the software was developed by a mysterious engineer not employed by the company. It wasn't. So, our effort is to bring the story together in a tight format so the narrative that the company wants to live as the official line doesn't actually succeed (right now it is).

    We did a good interview with Druff, much of it focusing on the Travis interviews and the reasons for why Travis showed up when and how he did. I will tease another bit from the film here. Travis revealed to me he can no longer provide information because he has signed a Non-Disclosure Agreement. That is somewhat odd to me, since usually you only sign those when you are given something in return. Of course, his lawyers supposedly took over Sebok's job of hunting for the real killers, so who knows?

    Scott
    Hey Scott, I appreciate the reply. So it seems you are not rehashing anything but will be providing new-information/a-different-take on the whole scandal? If this is the case, then I apologize for my rush to judgement on what the finished product will be. If you'd like to do an interview about it let me know I can get it out on PokerNewsBoy.com and my National Examiner.com page in the future (maybe near release time???).

    Feel free to PM me here if you're interested in the interview or want to get some exposure for the project.
    I write things about poker at my Poker Blog and elsewhere on the Internets

  6. #6
    Grover, if you don't mind a question or 2, I'm curious how much you got to talk to Brad Booth (if at all). Have you been following his whole deal lately? He has also made some rumblings about documentaries and stuff, wondering how much he might be involved in yours, if at all. Also, what's your general impression of the guy, and the story he has put forward over the years, up to and including calling out Hellmuth, getting 5K, then fading back into the background?

  7. #7
    Right, so the QJ hit was essentially to wrap up a long month in LV and to tease the project. I leave for home today (driving back to Colorado) and expect that we will have a formal announcement within the next week or so. At that point, I will be available and interested in discussing all the details of the project including Brad's involvement.

    I will say that I reached out to Booth last year after his DonkDown interview to gain his assistance with getting a set of Hand Histories. His current situation is obviously difficult and now knowing him as a friend, I hope he is able to get things turned around and pointed in the right direction. He can be a great asset to the game if he does, though it is going to involve a lot of difficult, personal work.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Steve-O View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by elevengrover View Post
    Hi Steve,

    My experience is that even the most interested folks have very little understanding of what happened in the UB situation. It is one of the chief reasons they got away with it and also what kept us digging. It is also why most of the participants stand to make even more going forward than they did in the past and that cannot stand.

    For instance, many believe brainwashdodo was some random customer service employee named Zoltan Rozsa who blackmailed the company by pulling accounts with high balances. It wasn't. There is a meme out there that the software was developed by a mysterious engineer not employed by the company. It wasn't. So, our effort is to bring the story together in a tight format so the narrative that the company wants to live as the official line doesn't actually succeed (right now it is).

    We did a good interview with Druff, much of it focusing on the Travis interviews and the reasons for why Travis showed up when and how he did. I will tease another bit from the film here. Travis revealed to me he can no longer provide information because he has signed a Non-Disclosure Agreement. That is somewhat odd to me, since usually you only sign those when you are given something in return. Of course, his lawyers supposedly took over Sebok's job of hunting for the real killers, so who knows?

    Scott
    Hey Scott, I appreciate the reply. So it seems you are not rehashing anything but will be providing new-information/a-different-take on the whole scandal? If this is the case, then I apologize for my rush to judgement on what the finished product will be. If you'd like to do an interview about it let me know I can get it out on PokerNewsBoy.com and my National Examiner.com page in the future (maybe near release time???).

    Feel free to PM me here if you're interested in the interview or want to get some exposure for the project.

    Hijack-

    When this site first opened, and I had just read a few of your posts, I was almost sure you were Elevengrover. I thought his name was Steve rather than Scott, and you both obviously write well and have an interest in UB, and scams. I think it was like two weeks before I realized you weren't eleven. I wasn't playing internet detective, I just kind of assumed it without clicking your links or anything. The writing felt similar and it had been awhile since I had read many of his posts on 2+2. It wasn't until I realized where you were from, and iirc Scott is from Colorado, that it actually dawned on me that you weren't one in the same. My early-onset Alzheimer's hijack of the day.

    Good luck on the project EG, and I look forward to seeing it.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve-O View Post
    Is there anything about the UB scandal we don't already know? I'm sure Haley some tidbits that will be revealed in her book, but unless she is working on this project (I didn't watch the clip) it seems like it's just going to be a rehashing of everything we already know. I hope he doesn't think that this is going to have an audience beyond serious poker players. Of course, I'll watch it
    Please don't mention me in connection with anything having to do with Mr. Bell. There is a high degree of enmity between us, and the chance that I would have anything to do with him is exactly equal to zero. I do note that he is wrong in some of his assertions made in this thread, and in due time the facts will speak for themselves.

    I do get a kick of out when threats made my Bell directed at others work their way to me, which they usually do in two or three steps, because he's quite often wrong in his assumptions of who's talking to me. As I Tweeted earlier today, my fave Bell quote from these (to date) is when he wrote:

    "It will almost be worth it if Haley ends in prison over the scheme..." -- K. Scott Bell, June, 2011

    This is my only comment on these matters.

     
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      nunbeater: this is my only comment on these matters should be banned because it is always a fucking lie

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by haleylh View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Steve-O View Post
    Is there anything about the UB scandal we don't already know? I'm sure Haley some tidbits that will be revealed in her book, but unless she is working on this project (I didn't watch the clip) it seems like it's just going to be a rehashing of everything we already know. I hope he doesn't think that this is going to have an audience beyond serious poker players. Of course, I'll watch it
    Please don't mention me in connection with anything having to do with Mr. Bell. There is a high degree of enmity between us, and the chance that I would have anything to do with him is exactly equal to zero. I do note that he is wrong in some of his assertions made in this thread, and in due time the facts will speak for themselves.

    I do get a kick of out when threats made my Bell directed at others work their way to me, which they usually do in two or three steps, because he's quite often wrong in his assumptions of who's talking to me. As I Tweeted earlier today, my fave Bell quote from these (to date) is when he wrote:

    "It will almost be worth it if Haley ends in prison over the scheme..." -- K. Scott Bell, June, 2011

    This is my only comment on these matters.
    for the record, I didn't connect you guys. I said "unless" you were working with them it would be a rehashing. Hopefully you didn't take it as me saying I heard you were working with them.

    I know there are two schools of thought on this issue but I hadn't realized the enmity ran that deep
    I write things about poker at my Poker Blog and elsewhere on the Internets

  11. #11
    Platinum Rollo Tomasi's Avatar
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    hopefully the truth will come out eventually because there are many reputations that could still get damaged over UB cheating their customers then not paying back fully when they got caught
    can someone please ask Joe Sebok when is getting the hand histories oh i forgot they were erased lol
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    Look Corrigan, you've been a sideshow clown around here from the jump
    It's tough to take you seriously when you've made your bones acting the fool.
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    Which one is he?

  12. #12
    Gold Bootsy Collins's Avatar
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    Question for elevengrover. Did you have any chance to interact with Phil Tom at the WSOP?

  13. #13
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    I will go on record that I like both Scott and Haley, and applaud them both for the work they have done to expose UB and the scumbags involved with it.

    I realize that they hate each other, and that's unfortunate, but I know that will likely never change.

    Yes, I did appear in the upcoming documentary, and the teaser Scott showed me looked really good.

    Haley and Scott both have my permission to use this site to promote any of their UB-related works, even if it's stuff being sold for-profit.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Bootsy Collins View Post
    Question for elevengrover. Did you have any chance to interact with Phil Tom at the WSOP?
    I did see him at Caesars one evening, but did not get an opportunity to chat. Though I was the guy who got the last player balance numbers for AP, the project will not feature much AP stuff. Dude seemed at peace, but I guess that was probably the cocktails.

  15. #15
    As for Haley, I've moved on. She is angry that I spent a fair amount of time showing how so much of her UB reporting was factually incorrect and poorly attributed over the last year. I recognize the name will come up from time to time as we move forward, but don't plan to litigate it further. I encourage folks to take in all information related to these scandals and draw their own conclusions.

  16. #16
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    More lies from Mr. Bell. The man long ago decided that the only way to attempt to derive profit from his own work was to slander me and my efforts, but my evidence pool is deeper and more accurate, and it stands on its own. You notice Bell utterly ignored the quote above, which comes from a made-up extortion plot he's accused me of participating in; such are the depths to which he's sunk. Actually, I welcome all competing efforts from legitimate sources, such as the new British book being planned about Black Friday.

  17. #17
    Just posted an interview with Scott: good stuff in it, including Brad Booth's role and some implications of stolen/hidden money after the super-user scandal

    http://pokernewsboy.com/online-poker...umentary/12856
    I write things about poker at my Poker Blog and elsewhere on the Internets

  18. #18
    Here is a teaser of UltimateBeat - too much to lose, a documentary in production about the insider fraud at UltimateBet. The project got off the ground in February and we have acquired gear and shot some good footage (click the graphics). I'm really excited and grateful for the folks who have agreed to participate so far and we still have some strong shoots left to do. Thanks again to Druff for a great interview.



    If you have an interesting story, anecdote or experience to tell about being cheated, any of the UB folks or the refund/PR effort, please visit our website and use the contact form or send an email to doubleheadpics@gmail.com

    Name:  kickstarter1.jpg
Views: 1224
Size:  21.1 KB

    We also need a relatively small amount of funds to complete the project and have set up a Kickstarter page that will run for the next 30 days. Crowdfunding the balance of the project is cool because the investigations were primarily a crowdsourcing effort.

  19. #19
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    More 2+2 funnies, subtitled "I should have known better":

    I tossed a couple of comments into the AP thread after my intentionally long absence over there, and Bell immediately started dissing my opinions. If I wrote the sun would rise in the east I do believe he'd try to debunk it.

    Anyhow, I shared the comment I earlier posted here about it being almost worth it if I went to prison for being involved in an extortion scheme -- a maliciously created figment of Bell's imagination -- and Bell declined to respond with any specifics regarding his accusation.

    Other posters wanted the derail stopped, and I kind of see that, so I wrote the following as a way to end it:

    . . .

    It seems quite clear now that Bell isn't going to address the libel, since he's posted in other threads but hasn't responded directly here.

    It was exactly libel, no doubt about it. E-mails are not protected communications, and sending such a statement to any third party constitutes publication. In my opinion, the maliciousness and accusation of my supposed criminal behavior to a third party likely raises it to the level of per se defamation, though my not having filed against him to date has had more to do with my perception that he has little worth suing for than anything else.

    Mods, feel free to move these posts into a separate thread. To the previous poster, we were discussing the possible effects on AP players when the derail was ignited by Bell repeating behavior he's done before, casting aspersions on anything I choose to write. This time I lowered the boom.

    For the record, I forwarded a large number of Bell's e-mails and social-network threats to an FBI agent on July 10, 2012, along with various statements and evidence connected to certain of Bell's claims made in these communications. I've subsequently become aware of yet another one made recently to a person of interest in the scandals with what I perceive as a threatening title, "Your gonna be a movie star."

    That is not, unfortunately, atypical.

    I will not publish these materials here, but I expect them to become part of the public record at some future date.

    . . .

    As I sort of expected, Noah deleted it within 15 minutes. I'd already e-mailed it to myself, just in case.

    I stand 100% behind the above and will defend it in any court of law, any date, any time.

  20. #20
    I won't be responding further to this other than to say it is a transparent effort to drag down our announcement. The communications to Carolyn Heick and Travis Makar will definitely figure in our film and efforts to defend their honor seem misguided at best.

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